Ok, then what is indicative of a talent dropoff then???

Forget about recruiting stars, nfl camps, etc.....just use your eyes of actual game play ---- not weight room workouts, and 40 times.

Over the last 6 years the talent has steadily declined. Not that there is still not talent but the quantity and depth of talent has most definitely declined.

If you want to disagree fine - but if it has not been a drop in talent then the old coaching staff was worse than I gave them credit for being. I know I am only 1 person, but IMO 5 straight years of .500 (7-5, 6-6) records does not scream a dearth of talent to me. Add to that I have watched a lot of those games and I did not see a great deal of talent out there unless we were playing a NEC type team and then not always --- and not like we use to dominate those types of teams.

Back to topic .... IMO ... Booker looks like a better "get" than Brown at this point. Booker has some speed and a nose for the ball .... Brown, not so much.

(04-16-2014 02:28 PM)Onyxduke7 Wrote:  Looks like we picked up another commitment today. The teammate of our last 2015 commit (Andre Booker) is another DL named Dexter Brown, from the same school. listed as 6'2'' and 313lbs.

https://rivals.yahoo.com/floridastate/fo...leges=show

When I watched Booker's tape I liked it but my first thought was "Man, I would sure like to have a guy the size of his counterpart at DT". I hope we can hold onto these guys.

(04-16-2014 06:32 PM)JMUTEKE Wrote:  Back to topic .... IMO ... Booker looks like a better "get" than Brown at this point. Booker has some speed and a nose for the ball .... Brown, not so much.

Who knows how the scheme will evolve by the time they play but if we're going to play a 3-4, you need a space eater like that.

(04-16-2014 06:51 PM)DoubleDDuke Wrote:  

(04-16-2014 06:32 PM)JMUTEKE Wrote:  Back to topic .... IMO ... Booker looks like a better "get" than Brown at this point. Booker has some speed and a nose for the ball .... Brown, not so much.

Who knows how the scheme will evolve by the time they play but if we're going to play a 3-4, you need a space eater like that.

This. 313 tends to take up space. Let the coaches work on him a bit. Size helps bigtime.

(04-15-2014 10:57 AM)All Dukes_All Day Wrote:  

(04-15-2014 10:51 AM)NYJMUSupporter Wrote:  Looks like another one of Vad Lee's teammates at Georgia Tech may be joining the Dukes. He was on campus for JMU's Student Appreciation Day. Seems like he could be a really nice pick up. I wonder how the GT coaching staff feels about Coach Withers lol

http://www.fromtherumbleseat.com/georgia...er-on-team

Interesting info in the comments. It appears that GT has issues somewhat often with athletes not finding the majors they want. Apparently GT is somewhat narrow with their academic major choices.

Why they win 7 games a year instead of 10 in the ACC with access to the talent in Georgia

Gotta say, on paper at least, withers and his staff are seemingly bringing in a higher caliber recruit than we have seen recently.

That means nothing of course until we see them play.

(04-16-2014 07:05 PM)Onyxduke7 Wrote:  

(04-16-2014 06:51 PM)DoubleDDuke Wrote:  

(04-16-2014 06:32 PM)JMUTEKE Wrote:  Back to topic .... IMO ... Booker looks like a better "get" than Brown at this point. Booker has some speed and a nose for the ball .... Brown, not so much.

Who knows how the scheme will evolve by the time they play but if we're going to play a 3-4, you need a space eater like that.

This. 313 tends to take up space. Let the coaches work on him a bit. Size helps bigtime.

No argument there. I watched the Booker highlights, but paid attention to Brown ... he was often out of place and nowhere near the play. We'll see how he develops.

Apparent 2015 Offer

Central Catholic ATH Graham Adomitis also picked up a JMU offer. That's his first.

https://twitter.com/WPIAL_Insider/status...6087302144

http://247sports.com/Player/Graham-Adomitis-33496

(04-15-2014 07:14 PM)Hotrod829 Wrote:  

(04-15-2014 06:08 PM)ShadyP Wrote:  

(04-15-2014 06:00 PM)Longhorn Wrote:  Moats and Mike Caussin are 2010.

I thought you understood how recruiting works they finished at JMU in 2010 -- which is POST 2008 which means they were recruited prior to 2008 (2005/2006). So all this really does is further make my point that since 2008 there has been a big drop in recruiting talent.

So since 2004 when we won a freaking national title you can add:
Moats and Caussin to Watford --- that is outstanding recruiting there.

Jordan Stanton , Andre coble , Michael birdsong , Daquan Scott , sage Harold , rob nittilo ( Mickey recruit ) , Andre smith , Khalid , gage Steele. And Mickey had to approve all the scholarships anyway so it didn't matter post or current. Can't knock the previous staffs recruiting.

Why can't we knock their recruiting? They have put together average teams at best for a long time. So many Mickey Matthews honks. MM was so narrrow-minded in his recruiting tactics with the world of college football changing around him. To name a few players, though great as they are and as proud of them as we are, does not mean you "can't knock" the recruiting.

(04-16-2014 08:24 PM)Duke Dawg Wrote:  Gotta say, on paper at least, withers and his staff are seemingly bringing in a higher caliber recruit than we have seen recently.

That means nothing of course until we see them play.

I think the football recruiting has without question improved markedly. The talent had dropped off the last five or six years, but I think we're bringing in the best talent that JMU has seen. It should translate to the field in the very near term.

(05-15-2014 01:32 PM)DukeDoggyDogg Wrote:  

(04-15-2014 07:14 PM)Hotrod829 Wrote:  

(04-15-2014 06:08 PM)ShadyP Wrote:  

(04-15-2014 06:00 PM)Longhorn Wrote:  Moats and Mike Caussin are 2010.

I thought you understood how recruiting works they finished at JMU in 2010 -- which is POST 2008 which means they were recruited prior to 2008 (2005/2006). So all this really does is further make my point that since 2008 there has been a big drop in recruiting talent.

So since 2004 when we won a freaking national title you can add:
Moats and Caussin to Watford --- that is outstanding recruiting there.

Jordan Stanton , Andre coble , Michael birdsong , Daquan Scott , sage Harold , rob nittilo ( Mickey recruit ) , Andre smith , Khalid , gage Steele. And Mickey had to approve all the scholarships anyway so it didn't matter post or current. Can't knock the previous staffs recruiting.

Why can't we knock their recruiting? They have put together average teams at best for a long time. So many Mickey Matthews honks. MM was so narrrow-minded in his recruiting tactics with the world of college football changing around him. To name a few players, though great as they are and as proud of them as we are, does not mean you "can't knock" the recruiting.

What if he recruited players he thought fit his system? What if certain coaches leaving had an direct impact on the on-field product? And lets not forget this is FCS FOOTBALL. The judgement of the on field product could have been the coaching transition, not the talent.

Withers first class is ok on paper, they have three to four years to prove this. I typically don't count FBS transfers unless they were part of a recruitment process with JMU before they signed FBS.

(05-15-2014 04:17 PM)Hotrod829 Wrote:  And lets not forget this is FCS FOOTBALL.

Seriously?

I guarantee you'll never see this "rationale" at NDSU.

For that matter, can you imagine the sh!tstorm if MM ever responded to a loss during postgame interviews with "And let's not forget this is FCS football"?

What a garbage excuse.

(05-15-2014 10:29 PM)bjk3047 Wrote:  

(05-15-2014 04:17 PM)Hotrod829 Wrote:  And lets not forget this is FCS FOOTBALL.

Seriously?

I guarantee you'll never see this "rationale" at NDSU.

For that matter, can you imagine the sh!tstorm if MM ever responded to a loss during postgame interviews with "And let's not forget this is FCS football"?

What a garbage excuse.

Of course they wouldn't say that in media. In FCS there are players we offer "partial" scholarships too. My only other offers were Shippensburg and a D3 school. Sometimes you have to develop talent.

(05-15-2014 11:28 PM)Hotrod829 Wrote:  Of course they wouldn't say that in media. In FCS there are players we offer "partial" scholarships too. My only other offers were Shippensburg and a D3 school. Sometimes you have to develop talent.

I don't even follow that response. Everyone in FCS is subject to the same rules. Level playing field. It makes zero sense to use the subdivision we play in as some sort of excuse.

I think what you're trying to tell me is that MM saw potential in you that many others didn't (right?). That's all well and good, but the point has continuously been a precipitous drop off in talent in the last five years, which would exclude you as an example.

Over the last several years, the results speak for themselves. MM made the personnel decisions, and the personnel on the field has not gotten it done. Simple as that. If you're telling me that developing talent is just as important or more important than recruiting, then I guess that's where MM failed. I don't think it particularly matters either way.

(05-16-2014 06:26 AM)bjk3047 Wrote:  

(05-15-2014 11:28 PM)Hotrod829 Wrote:  Of course they wouldn't say that in media. In FCS there are players we offer "partial" scholarships too. My only other offers were Shippensburg and a D3 school. Sometimes you have to develop talent.

I don't even follow that response. Everyone in FCS is subject to the same rules. Level playing field. It makes zero sense to use the subdivision we play in as some sort of excuse.

I think what you're trying to tell me is that MM saw potential in you that many others didn't (right?). That's all well and good, but the point has continuously been a precipitous drop off in talent in the last five years, which would exclude you as an example.

Over the last several years, the results speak for themselves. MM made the personnel decisions, and the personnel on the field has not gotten it done. Simple as that. If you're telling me that developing talent is just as important or more important than recruiting, then I guess that's where MM failed. I don't think it particularly matters either way.

I'll say this , Maine and NH would love to have our last five yrs of recruiting. And they still win games. It's hard when you don't have 60+ full schollies.

(05-16-2014 07:47 AM)Hotrod829 Wrote:  

(05-16-2014 06:26 AM)bjk3047 Wrote:  

(05-15-2014 11:28 PM)Hotrod829 Wrote:  Of course they wouldn't say that in media. In FCS there are players we offer "partial" scholarships too. My only other offers were Shippensburg and a D3 school. Sometimes you have to develop talent.

I don't even follow that response. Everyone in FCS is subject to the same rules. Level playing field. It makes zero sense to use the subdivision we play in as some sort of excuse.

I think what you're trying to tell me is that MM saw potential in you that many others didn't (right?). That's all well and good, but the point has continuously been a precipitous drop off in talent in the last five years, which would exclude you as an example.

Over the last several years, the results speak for themselves. MM made the personnel decisions, and the personnel on the field has not gotten it done. Simple as that. If you're telling me that developing talent is just as important or more important than recruiting, then I guess that's where MM failed. I don't think it particularly matters either way.

I'll say this , Maine and NH would love to have our last five yrs of recruiting. And they still win games. It's hard when you don't have 60+ full schollies.

That's probably the most damning statement about Mathews & his coaching staff that's been posted on this board.

(04-15-2014 08:31 AM)Longhorn Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 10:10 PM)jmutoml757 Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 10:00 PM)JMUDukes1750 Wrote:  Per Stoss, we got our first commit for the 2015 class

http://sports.yahoo.com/jamesmadison/foo...ker-158601

http://www.hudl.com/athlete/635503/highlights/77094385

He is not going to win any footraces, but we aren't recruiting him for his 40 time. dude wreaks havoc, held by jersey grab on every play. Likes to hit people.

I don't know if I'd agree about his timed speed...a 4.79 for a 255# DL is pretty solid. Heck...that's faster than that prep WR (who posted a 4.84) we supposedly just offered.

Agreed. Someone insinuating a 4.79 for a HS DT listed at 255 wasn't good is downright silly. Stanton's 40 time listed by NFLDraftScout is 4.94. And he's listed at 262.
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsp...&genpos=DT
A legit 4.79 40 for a HS kid listed at 255 would be outstanding. Course a lot of those HS 40s seem to lose a couple tenths once they set foot on campus....

If a D lineman is running 40 yards things aren't going well at all.

(05-16-2014 07:50 AM)HyperDuke Wrote:  

(05-16-2014 07:47 AM)Hotrod829 Wrote:  

(05-16-2014 06:26 AM)bjk3047 Wrote:  

(05-15-2014 11:28 PM)Hotrod829 Wrote:  Of course they wouldn't say that in media. In FCS there are players we offer "partial" scholarships too. My only other offers were Shippensburg and a D3 school. Sometimes you have to develop talent.

I don't even follow that response. Everyone in FCS is subject to the same rules. Level playing field. It makes zero sense to use the subdivision we play in as some sort of excuse.

I think what you're trying to tell me is that MM saw potential in you that many others didn't (right?). That's all well and good, but the point has continuously been a precipitous drop off in talent in the last five years, which would exclude you as an example.

Over the last several years, the results speak for themselves. MM made the personnel decisions, and the personnel on the field has not gotten it done. Simple as that. If you're telling me that developing talent is just as important or more important than recruiting, then I guess that's where MM failed. I don't think it particularly matters either way.

I'll say this , Maine and NH would love to have our last five yrs of recruiting. And they still win games. It's hard when you don't have 60+ full schollies.

That's probably the most damning statement about Mathews & his coaching staff that's been posted on this board.

I was thinking the exact same thing, you beat me to the keyboard.