(04-14-2014 12:07 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 12:03 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 12:00 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(04-13-2014 11:51 PM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(04-13-2014 11:25 PM)john01992 Wrote:  like I said ==> if you want the answers that badly PM me. I am not getting any more in depth on the subject in a public forum.

So I see transparency about the details of compensation for everyone but you cant say publicly if your brothers company lets all employees know what their co-workers make..

Guess its not that simple...

I already said plenty of times that i will answer it in PM. if you are too much of a whiny ***** to make a PM then stop complaining on here that I am not discussing it here.

No... Because you complaining here about saying "Yes they all know" or "no they don't" shows what a sham your whole argument about transparency is..

I have asked for no identifying information about the company, your brother, or the salaries involved...

how about a "some do & some don't" response?

I asked if *THE COMPANY* publishes the information. I'm not particularly interested in what goes on at the water cooler.

OMG! So I learned that John's "Experience" with an engineering group involved people "NOT GETTING PAID AT ALL"..... Hence the "Yes or No" answer..

Crap John even your "real world" experience is not real....

To sum up.. You tried to demean my opinion of whats good for an engineering group and you have zero experience working with Engineers..

Damn...

I had it just chalked up to his inexperience in an office. I didn't figure he was just making the whole thing up.

(04-14-2014 12:34 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  OMG! So I learned that John's "Experience" with an engineering group involved people "NOT GETTING PAID AT ALL"..... Hence the "Yes or No" answer..

Crap John even your "real world" experience is not real....

To sum up.. You tried to demean my opinion of whats good for an engineering group and you have zero experience working with Engineers..

if you think aerospace doesn't count as engineering then you are even dumber than I thought. if you think receiving a stipend doesn't count as getting paid then I really don't know what to say. obviously you lack reading comprehension.

(04-14-2014 12:37 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  Damn...

I had it just chalked up to his inexperience in an office. I didn't figure he was just making the whole thing up.

only thing that is getting made up is bulls talking points.

It's blatantly obvious that John has no experience in the world of professional work environments. Salaries and compensation ARE NOT discussed - period, for many reasons. More often, I'm sure, it has to do with older vs younger workers than it does man vs woman, white vs black, etc. Hell, my brother-in-law and I work for the same company - and he and I don't know what the other makes. We play golf together all the time and socialize regularly. We've never asked one another "what do you make?" I guess I'll just wait for Jonnie's law to come into effect and I'll look it up on the company intranet.

I guess Burger King workers may discuss their hourly pay with one aonther, but not in professional settings.

John, go to your first real professional job and ask one of the 20 year guys what they make. Watch him tell you to p!ss off.

(04-14-2014 01:04 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 12:34 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  OMG! So I learned that John's "Experience" with an engineering group involved people "NOT GETTING PAID AT ALL"..... Hence the "Yes or No" answer..

Crap John even your "real world" experience is not real....

To sum up.. You tried to demean my opinion of whats good for an engineering group and you have zero experience working with Engineers..

if you think aerospace doesn't count as engineering then you are even dumber than I thought. if you think receiving a stipend doesn't count as getting paid then I really don't know what to say. obviously you lack reading comprehension.

I'm calling bullsh!t. On the whole thing.

(04-14-2014 01:04 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 12:34 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  OMG! So I learned that John's "Experience" with an engineering group involved people "NOT GETTING PAID AT ALL"..... Hence the "Yes or No" answer..

Crap John even your "real world" experience is not real....

To sum up.. You tried to demean my opinion of whats good for an engineering group and you have zero experience working with Engineers..

if you think aerospace doesn't count as engineering then you are even dumber than I thought. if you think receiving a stipend doesn't count as getting paid then I really don't know what to say. obviously you lack reading comprehension.

I think working with unpaid people on a college campus does not count as "working with an engineering group".... I never questioned the project, just your ability to know how the heck a working professional Engineers with real life concerns function.

I've worked on those types of projects in college (VLSI) and now I work as a professional.

It is night and day!

we should give every woman in america serial raises of an arbitrary amount until the bogus statistic goes away. in many places, women will make 5 times what men do for the precise same job, but at least this discomforting lie won't trouble us any longer.

(04-14-2014 07:50 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 01:04 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 12:34 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  OMG! So I learned that John's "Experience" with an engineering group involved people "NOT GETTING PAID AT ALL"..... Hence the "Yes or No" answer..

Crap John even your "real world" experience is not real....

To sum up.. You tried to demean my opinion of whats good for an engineering group and you have zero experience working with Engineers..

if you think aerospace doesn't count as engineering then you are even dumber than I thought. if you think receiving a stipend doesn't count as getting paid then I really don't know what to say. obviously you lack reading comprehension.

I think working with unpaid people on a college campus does not count as "working with an engineering group".... I never questioned the project, just your ability to know how the heck a working professional Engineers with real life concerns function.

I've worked on those types of projects in college (VLSI) and now I work as a professional.

It is night and day!

differences in perspective I guess. all i said was office ==> never once did I say company. trust me when I say that I have seen plenty of animosity in a college setting. Only it revolves arounds giving proper credit for research paper contributions, who has a security clearance, and PhD candidate-advisor relationships not pay. trade offs I guess.

(04-14-2014 08:19 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 07:50 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 01:04 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 12:34 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  OMG! So I learned that John's "Experience" with an engineering group involved people "NOT GETTING PAID AT ALL"..... Hence the "Yes or No" answer..

Crap John even your "real world" experience is not real....

To sum up.. You tried to demean my opinion of whats good for an engineering group and you have zero experience working with Engineers..

if you think aerospace doesn't count as engineering then you are even dumber than I thought. if you think receiving a stipend doesn't count as getting paid then I really don't know what to say. obviously you lack reading comprehension.

I think working with unpaid people on a college campus does not count as "working with an engineering group".... I never questioned the project, just your ability to know how the heck a working professional Engineers with real life concerns function.

I've worked on those types of projects in college (VLSI) and now I work as a professional.

It is night and day!

differences in perspective I guess.

Yes on one side is someone who was an engineering student on those projects for several years and then a professional engineer for 14 years.... On the other is someone who was an admin assistant to his brothers team of college students...

Quote:trust me when I say that I have seen plenty of animosity in a college setting.

And? There is animosity in my kids third grade class... That does not mean the kids have one damn clue what real life is like.

Quote:Only it revolves arounds giving proper credit for research paper contributions, who has a security clearance, and PhD candidate-advisor relationships not pay. trade offs I guess.

If you think those things are the same as pay you're dead wrong. I've seen people fight over both at the professional level.

(04-14-2014 08:38 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 08:19 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 07:50 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 01:04 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 12:34 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  OMG! So I learned that John's "Experience" with an engineering group involved people "NOT GETTING PAID AT ALL"..... Hence the "Yes or No" answer..

Crap John even your "real world" experience is not real....

To sum up.. You tried to demean my opinion of whats good for an engineering group and you have zero experience working with Engineers..

if you think aerospace doesn't count as engineering then you are even dumber than I thought. if you think receiving a stipend doesn't count as getting paid then I really don't know what to say. obviously you lack reading comprehension.

I think working with unpaid people on a college campus does not count as "working with an engineering group".... I never questioned the project, just your ability to know how the heck a working professional Engineers with real life concerns function.

I've worked on those types of projects in college (VLSI) and now I work as a professional.

It is night and day!

differences in perspective I guess.

Yes on one side is someone who was an engineering student on those projects for several years and then a professional engineer for 14 years.... On the other is someone who was an admin assistant to his brothers team of college students...

Quote:trust me when I say that I have seen plenty of animosity in a college setting.

And? There is animosity in my kids third grade class... That does not mean the kids have one damn clue what real life is like.

Quote:Only it revolves arounds giving proper credit for research paper contributions, who has a security clearance, and PhD candidate-advisor relationships not pay. trade offs I guess.

If you think those things are the same as pay you're dead wrong. I've seen people fight over both at the professional level.

I have seen people quit over that **** dude. give me a f***ing break if you honestly believe that an advisor pushing back a candidates defense date or someone getting pissed that they weren't given proper credit in a paper does not cause major issues.

with or without companies recording the information there are plenty of other ways for people to get a general idea of where they stand as compared to their coworkers $$$ wise. That is why this argument has always been a joke.

I thought it was your brother's company, not your brother's college work project.

Anyways, just let it go, nobody cares.

(04-14-2014 08:46 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 08:38 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  If you think those things are the same as pay you're dead wrong. I've seen people fight over both at the professional level.

I have seen people quit over that **** dude. give me a f***ing break if you honestly believe that an advisor pushing back a candidates defense date or someone getting pissed that they weren't given proper credit in a paper does not cause major issues.

Stop setting up straw men. I never said it was not important or that it had issues. I said it was not the same as pay in a professional work space. Grow up already.

There are many reasons people quit things but two things are not the same merely because its something a person would quit over.

Quote:with or without companies recording the information there are plenty of other ways for people to get a general idea of where they stand as compared to their coworkers $$$ wise. That is why this argument has always been a joke.

I have *NO* clue what my co-workers make nor do I care. And aside from USACE I have never been in a workplace where trying to "figure" out what your coworkers make *ever* ends well.

You have *ZERO* professional life experience. Your a coming from the perspective of a friggen college student who *LITERALLY* has no professional work experience and you're talking to someone that has done everything in your work background plus 15 years in the real world.

I'm done with this. Explaining the real world to a college kid who does nto want to listen is like teaching Mechanics to a cocker spaniel.

(04-14-2014 09:05 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 08:46 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 08:38 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  If you think those things are the same as pay you're dead wrong. I've seen people fight over both at the professional level.

I have seen people quit over that **** dude. give me a f***ing break if you honestly believe that an advisor pushing back a candidates defense date or someone getting pissed that they weren't given proper credit in a paper does not cause major issues.

Stop setting up straw men. I never said it was not important or that it had issues. I said it was not the same as pay in a professional work space. Grow up already.

There are many reasons people quit things but two things are not the same merely because its something a person would quit over.

Quote:with or without companies recording the information there are plenty of other ways for people to get a general idea of where they stand as compared to their coworkers $$$ wise. That is why this argument has always been a joke.

I have *NO* clue what my co-workers make nor do I care. And aside from USACE I have never been in a workplace where trying to "figure" out what your coworkers make *ever* ends well.

You have *ZERO* professional life experience. Your a coming from the perspective of a friggen college student who *LITERALLY* has no professional work experience and you're talking to someone that has done everything in your work background plus 15 years in the real world.

I'm done with this. Explaining the real world to a college kid who does nto want to listen is like teaching Mechanics to a cocker spaniel.

well I am done talking to an idiot who time & time again jumps to conclusions. you honestly think I believe that in most white collar work environments everyone knows everyones earnings???? point to where i said exactly that.........

all i have said is making the information available isn't as big of a deal as you are making it out to be. if someone was interested enough they could figure it out.

look at dixie ==> his position on the issue is literally "I am against it because it works & is effective"

(04-14-2014 10:01 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 09:05 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 08:46 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 08:38 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  If you think those things are the same as pay you're dead wrong. I've seen people fight over both at the professional level.

I have seen people quit over that **** dude. give me a f***ing break if you honestly believe that an advisor pushing back a candidates defense date or someone getting pissed that they weren't given proper credit in a paper does not cause major issues.

Stop setting up straw men. I never said it was not important or that it had issues. I said it was not the same as pay in a professional work space. Grow up already.

There are many reasons people quit things but two things are not the same merely because its something a person would quit over.

Quote:with or without companies recording the information there are plenty of other ways for people to get a general idea of where they stand as compared to their coworkers $$$ wise. That is why this argument has always been a joke.

I have *NO* clue what my co-workers make nor do I care. And aside from USACE I have never been in a workplace where trying to "figure" out what your coworkers make *ever* ends well.

You have *ZERO* professional life experience. Your a coming from the perspective of a friggen college student who *LITERALLY* has no professional work experience and you're talking to someone that has done everything in your work background plus 15 years in the real world.

I'm done with this. Explaining the real world to a college kid who does nto want to listen is like teaching Mechanics to a cocker spaniel.

well I am done talking to an idiot who time & time again jumps to conclusions. you honestly think I believe that in most white collar work environments everyone knows everyones earnings???? point to where i said exactly that.........

all i have said is making the information available isn't as big of a deal as you are making it out to be. if someone was interested enough they could figure it out.

look at dixie ==> his position on the issue is literally "I am against it because it works & is effective"

No it isn't.

(04-14-2014 10:03 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  

No it isn't.

Watching John try pretend he understands the adult world is like watching a kid bike into a tree. Both amusing and horrifying at the same time.

(04-14-2014 10:29 AM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(04-14-2014 10:03 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  

No it isn't.

Watching John try pretend he understands the adult world is like watching a kid bike into a tree. Both amusing and horrifying at the same time.