NEW YORK (AP) -- New York state has the most segregated public schools in the nation, with many black and Latino students attending schools with virtually no white classmates, according to a report released Wednesday.

The report by the Civil Rights Project at the University of California at Los Angeles looks at enrollment trends from 1989 to 2010.

In New York City, the largest school system in the U.S. with 1.1 million pupils, the study notes that many of the charter schools created over the last dozen years are among the least diverse of all, with less than 1 percent white enrollment at 73 percent of charter schools.

"To create a whole new system that's even worse than what you've got really takes some effort," said Gary Orfield, co-director of the Civil Rights Project and an author of the report.

He and his fellow researchers say segregation has the effect of concentrating black and Latino students in schools with high ratios of poor students compared with the statewide average. Black and Latino students who attend schools that are integrated by race and income level perform significantly better than their peers in segregated schools, the authors note.

The study suggests that New York's segregation is largely due to housing patterns, because housing and school segregation are correlated, but that it could be mitigated through policies intended to promote diversity.

"In the 30 years I have been researching schools, New York state has consistently been one of the most segregated states in the nation - no Southern state comes close to New York," Orfield said.

Other states with highly segregated schools include Illinois, Michigan and California, according to the Civil Rights Project.

One way to measure segregation is the exposure of students to classmates from other racial groups. About half of New York state's public school students are white, but during the 2009-10 school year the average black student in New York went to a school where 17.7 percent of the students are white.

The corresponding number for Illinois was 18.8 percent, and for California it was 18.9 percent.

Orfield said the Civil Rights Project is preparing reports on several other states, including an in-depth look at California.

A report on nationwide trends in segregation is planned to coincide with the 60th anniversary of the U.S. Supreme Court's Brown vs. Board of Education ruling on May 17. The court ruled in that landmark case that establishing separate public schools for black and white students was unconstitutional.

The report released Wednesday noted that about half of New York state's public school students were from low-income families in 2010 but the typical black or Latino student attended a school where close to 70 percent of classmates were low-income. The typical white student went to a school where just 30 percent of classmates were low-income.

"For New York to have a favorable multiracial future both socially and economically, it is absolutely urgent that its leaders and citizens understand both the values of diversity and the harms of inequality," the study's authors say.

New York City Department of Education spokesman Devon Puglia did not address the findings of the report, but said, "We believe in diverse classrooms in which students interact and grow through personal relationships with those of different backgrounds." The district is roughly 40 percent Hispanic, 30 percent black, 15 percent white and 15 percent Asian.

State Education Commissioner John King called the findings troubling and added, "The department has supported over the years various initiatives aimed at improving school integration and school socioeconomic integration, but there's clearly a lot of work that needs to be done - not just in New York but around the country."

The report, which used U.S. Department of Education statistics, also noted increasing segregation in upstate cities including Buffalo, Rochester and Syracuse.

In the Syracuse metropolitan area, the report says, the number of black students increased by 4 percent between 1989 and 2010, but black isolation increased dramatically. In 1989 the typical black student went to a school that was one-third black, but in 2010 the typical black student went to a school that was nearly half black.

Pedro Noguera, a New York University education professor, said it's disturbing that policy makers have focused so little on racial integration in recent years.

"We've been talking about reforming schools in New York and elsewhere. This issue was never addressed," Noguera said.

He added, "When you concentrate the neediest kids together in under-resourced schools they tend not to do very well."

The UCLA report recommends that state and local education agencies develop policies aimed at reducing racial isolation and promoting diverse schools.

The report suggests voluntary desegregation programs in upstate cities like Rochester, where low-income populations are surrounded by more affluent communities.

In New York City, Orfield said, a system of unscreened "choice" schools would foster more diversity than the current New York City high school choice system, which sees entrance tests at top schools excluding most black and Latino students.

"If you just offer choice, the people with the best information will get into the best schools," he said.

Requel Russell-George, the mother of two students at Public School 169 in the Bronx, which has about 75 percent black and 19 percent Latino students, said she feels the school is "excellent" but she would like to see more diversity.

"I do feel that it would be great for our children and other children to be exposed to other cultures," Russell-George said. "You're more knowledgeable and things are not mysterious to you as you get older."




http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/U...6-12-18-45

interesting. I wonder how much demographics play a factor in this trend though. I am guilty as charged on this one. I am from NY and 2000 students in my high school and maybe 20 black kids total, most of which had 1 white parent.

sad part is that there were a good 7-9 other high schools in the area that could say the exact same thing

It's an interesting article but it's kind of sad they persist in the same failed idea that diversity of race is a goal and tool for positive change when it is in reality a worthless metric.

I've always said that if they were interested in "diversity" it should be socio-economic diversity, mix poor with rich, instead of trying to match colours.

Racial obsession obscures the underlying issues once again.

Thanks for posting though; I'm sure it will strike up some serious debate.

Historically, Chicago is very segregated city. Have been clear lines as to where you live. Blacks could never live in Mayor Daley's neighborhood Bridgeport and would not be safe walking thru there as well. Chinatown? Ukraine Village? "Polish Broadway",

It's like this in Pittsburgh as well. It's mostly because of demographics. The old steal mill towns along the Mon River mostly seen the people that could move away, move out which left mostly poor people and African Americans. The upper class white towns mostly have stayed upper class white towns. Washington, PA (about 25-30 miles south of Pittsburgh) is really interesting, Washington HS is kinda like a bulls eye w/ mostly an African American population, while Trinity HS surrounds Wash High and is mostly a rural/upper middle/upper class HS. The HS's themselves are located no more than a mile apart. Plenty of other schools share the same zip code but one is white and the other is African American.

(03-27-2014 10:42 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  It's an interesting article but it's kind of sad they persist in the same failed idea that diversity of race is a goal and tool for positive change when it is in reality a worthless metric.

My city buses students all over the place to make as close to a 50/50 split as possible. I don't think the North ever had to do that and the South is still required to do so. We had someone run for school board on ending busing and she won with almost 80% of the votes. When she got in office, it was determined that it would cost the city $millions in state and federal lawsuits for a slim chance of getting rid of the program so the idea was nixed. Our city is about 30 miles long and 2 miles wide and about 80% of the black population (and almost no whites) is concentrated in the lower 2 miles. This results in almost all of the students being bussed out of their neighborhoods being black while a handful of white students in the better part of town go downtown for magnet programs to keep the black schools in compliance, even though these white kids are essentially segregated within these black schools. The blacks hate it more than the whites. These black students that get bussed 30 miles across town get picked up as early as 5AM and don't get home until as late as 8PM and meanwhile there are schools they could walk to.

The solution is to impose cross district busing. Take half the inner city school kids and bus them to a suburban district and then select half the suburbanites and bus them into the inner city schools.

That would go a long way to achieve racial balance.

Then we can all stand together and sing "Kumbaya".


Note to Machievelli: This was sarcasm.

(03-27-2014 10:35 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  NEW YORK (AP) -- New York state has the most segregated public schools in the nation, with many black and Latino students attending schools with virtually no white classmates, according to a report released Wednesday.

The report by the Civil Rights Project at the University of California at Los Angeles looks at enrollment trends from 1989 to 2010.

In New York City, the largest school system in the U.S. with 1.1 million pupils, the study notes that many of the charter schools created over the last dozen years are among the least diverse of all, with less than 1 percent white enrollment at 73 percent of charter schools.

"To create a whole new system that's even worse than what you've got really takes some effort," said Gary Orfield, co-director of the Civil Rights Project and an author of the report.

He and his fellow researchers say segregation has the effect of concentrating black and Latino students in schools with high ratios of poor students compared with the statewide average. Black and Latino students who attend schools that are integrated by race and income level perform significantly better than their peers in segregated schools, the authors note.

The study suggests that New York's segregation is largely due to housing patterns, because housing and school segregation are correlated, but that it could be mitigated through policies intended to promote diversity.

"In the 30 years I have been researching schools, New York state has consistently been one of the most segregated states in the nation - no Southern state comes close to New York," Orfield said.

Other states with highly segregated schools include Illinois, Michigan and California, according to the Civil Rights Project.

One way to measure segregation is the exposure of students to classmates from other racial groups. About half of New York state's public school students are white, but during the 2009-10 school year the average black student in New York went to a school where 17.7 percent of the students are white.

The corresponding number for Illinois was 18.8 percent, and for California it was 18.9 percent.

Orfield said the Civil Rights Project is preparing reports on several other states, including an in-depth look at California.

A report on nationwide trends in segregation is planned to coincide with the 60th anniversary of the U.S. Supreme Court's Brown vs. Board of Education ruling on May 17. The court ruled in that landmark case that establishing separate public schools for black and white students was unconstitutional.

The report released Wednesday noted that about half of New York state's public school students were from low-income families in 2010 but the typical black or Latino student attended a school where close to 70 percent of classmates were low-income. The typical white student went to a school where just 30 percent of classmates were low-income.

"For New York to have a favorable multiracial future both socially and economically, it is absolutely urgent that its leaders and citizens understand both the values of diversity and the harms of inequality," the study's authors say.

New York City Department of Education spokesman Devon Puglia did not address the findings of the report, but said, "We believe in diverse classrooms in which students interact and grow through personal relationships with those of different backgrounds." The district is roughly 40 percent Hispanic, 30 percent black, 15 percent white and 15 percent Asian.

State Education Commissioner John King called the findings troubling and added, "The department has supported over the years various initiatives aimed at improving school integration and school socioeconomic integration, but there's clearly a lot of work that needs to be done - not just in New York but around the country."

The report, which used U.S. Department of Education statistics, also noted increasing segregation in upstate cities including Buffalo, Rochester and Syracuse.

In the Syracuse metropolitan area, the report says, the number of black students increased by 4 percent between 1989 and 2010, but black isolation increased dramatically. In 1989 the typical black student went to a school that was one-third black, but in 2010 the typical black student went to a school that was nearly half black.

Pedro Noguera, a New York University education professor, said it's disturbing that policy makers have focused so little on racial integration in recent years.

"We've been talking about reforming schools in New York and elsewhere. This issue was never addressed," Noguera said.

He added, "When you concentrate the neediest kids together in under-resourced schools they tend not to do very well."

The UCLA report recommends that state and local education agencies develop policies aimed at reducing racial isolation and promoting diverse schools.

The report suggests voluntary desegregation programs in upstate cities like Rochester, where low-income populations are surrounded by more affluent communities.

In New York City, Orfield said, a system of unscreened "choice" schools would foster more diversity than the current New York City high school choice system, which sees entrance tests at top schools excluding most black and Latino students.

"If you just offer choice, the people with the best information will get into the best schools," he said.

Requel Russell-George, the mother of two students at Public School 169 in the Bronx, which has about 75 percent black and 19 percent Latino students, said she feels the school is "excellent" but she would like to see more diversity.

"I do feel that it would be great for our children and other children to be exposed to other cultures," Russell-George said. "You're more knowledgeable and things are not mysterious to you as you get older."




http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/U...6-12-18-45

What were the other states?

(03-28-2014 07:53 AM)QuestionSocratic Wrote:  The solution is to impose cross district busing. Take half the inner city school kids and bus them to a suburban district and then select half the suburbanites and bus them into the inner city schools.

That would go a long way to achieve racial balance.

Then we can all stand together and sing "Kumbaya".


Note to Machievelli: This was sarcasm.

Glad you're being sarcastic. In the Pittsburgh area, it's far easier to merge schools. Clairton/TJ, Aliquippa/Hopewell, Sto Rox/Montour, Monessen/Belle Vernon, Washington/Trinity, Beaver Falls/Ambridge, Rochester/Freedom all pretty much first like a glove. Economic reason's are one reason why many of these mergers won't happen. The schools listed first are dying steal town's with minimal tax bases and poor educational results, and combining them w/ well off schools that have great educational results makes no sense for the schools listed second. Kinda sad because most of those schools share the same zip code.

(03-28-2014 07:49 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  This results in almost all of the students being bussed out of their neighborhoods being black while a handful of white students in the better part of town go downtown for magnet programs to keep the black schools in compliance, even though these white kids are essentially segregated within these black schools. The blacks hate it more than the whites. These black students that get bussed 30 miles across town get picked up as early as 5AM and don't get home until as late as 8PM and meanwhile there are schools they could walk to.

Same situation here. We were talking about it at work once when a coworker's kids were being rezoned due to a new school being built. He was complaining because instead of going to a school a mile away they had to go to one almost five miles away. Another coworker mentioned that where he grew up in the Upstate they were bused to a school almost 10 miles away. He said they could see the lights of another school on the next hill over while they waited for the bus at 5:30 AM, yet had to endure a two hour bus ride twice a day to get to and from school.

Are they segregated or just neighborhood schools that reflect their own demographics?

Now it may be more telling that neighborhoods up north actually do segregate themselves, but that's no fault of the education system.

(03-28-2014 04:17 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(03-28-2014 07:49 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  This results in almost all of the students being bussed out of their neighborhoods being black while a handful of white students in the better part of town go downtown for magnet programs to keep the black schools in compliance, even though these white kids are essentially segregated within these black schools. The blacks hate it more than the whites. These black students that get bussed 30 miles across town get picked up as early as 5AM and don't get home until as late as 8PM and meanwhile there are schools they could walk to.

Same situation here. We were talking about it at work once when a coworker's kids were being rezoned due to a new school being built. He was complaining because instead of going to a school a mile away they had to go to one almost five miles away. Another coworker mentioned that where he grew up in the Upstate they were bused to a school almost 10 miles away. He said they could see the lights of another school on the next hill over while they waited for the bus at 5:30 AM, yet had to endure a two hour bus ride twice a day to get to and from school.

Why do blacks hate it more than whites.

(03-28-2014 04:24 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(03-28-2014 04:17 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(03-28-2014 07:49 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  This results in almost all of the students being bussed out of their neighborhoods being black while a handful of white students in the better part of town go downtown for magnet programs to keep the black schools in compliance, even though these white kids are essentially segregated within these black schools. The blacks hate it more than the whites. These black students that get bussed 30 miles across town get picked up as early as 5AM and don't get home until as late as 8PM and meanwhile there are schools they could walk to.

Same situation here. We were talking about it at work once when a coworker's kids were being rezoned due to a new school being built. He was complaining because instead of going to a school a mile away they had to go to one almost five miles away. Another coworker mentioned that where he grew up in the Upstate they were bused to a school almost 10 miles away. He said they could see the lights of another school on the next hill over while they waited for the bus at 5:30 AM, yet had to endure a two hour bus ride twice a day to get to and from school.

Why do blacks hate it more than whites.

Without specifically asking anyone I would imagine it has a lot to do with inconvenience. It has been my experience that around here the black population utilizes the school bus system more than the white population. That means in some cases they have to get the kids up to get ready at 4:30 AM in order for them to go out to meet the bus on time. That also means that these kids aren't getting home until 5:30 PM or later, and forget about the problems caused if the kids are participating in something that requires remaining after school. I know when in the past I have worked as a volunteer coach at local high schools that my fellow coaches and I spent a lot of time acting like taxi drivers because the kids had no other way home.

Another problem I see is in this desire to achieve diversity that neighborhoods are split so that the kids don't get to go to school with the kids they are friends with and grew up with. When our local high school split a few years back the school district at least was able to use a realistic geographical barrier (in our case an interstate highway) as a boundary between the old and new school. That isn't always possible, and was only possible in this case because the racial makeup of both districts was close enough to satisfy some theoretical limit.

My ultra Liberal Uncle was a Principle in a school system in Morristown NJ. There were about 10 minority kids in the whole damn school It used to piss me off that he constantly bashed us in the South for being racists...yet his school was Lilly white. I guess you can't see the forest for the trees.

(03-28-2014 04:24 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(03-28-2014 04:17 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(03-28-2014 07:49 AM)EverRespect Wrote:  This results in almost all of the students being bussed out of their neighborhoods being black while a handful of white students in the better part of town go downtown for magnet programs to keep the black schools in compliance, even though these white kids are essentially segregated within these black schools. The blacks hate it more than the whites. These black students that get bussed 30 miles across town get picked up as early as 5AM and don't get home until as late as 8PM and meanwhile there are schools they could walk to.

Same situation here. We were talking about it at work once when a coworker's kids were being rezoned due to a new school being built. He was complaining because instead of going to a school a mile away they had to go to one almost five miles away. Another coworker mentioned that where he grew up in the Upstate they were bused to a school almost 10 miles away. He said they could see the lights of another school on the next hill over while they waited for the bus at 5:30 AM, yet had to endure a two hour bus ride twice a day to get to and from school.

Why do blacks hate it more than whites.

The black student is going to be the one to get bussed most of the time. That means they will go somewhere pretty far away from their neighborhood.

(03-28-2014 04:42 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  My ultra Liberal Uncle was a Principle in a school system in Morristown NJ. There were about 10 minority kids in the whole damn school It used to piss me off that he constantly bashed us in the South for being racists...yet his school was Lilly white. I guess you can't see the forest for the trees.

That happens a lot actually. Cary Academy and Cardinal Gibbons Raleigh are full of children who's yankee families are pretty liberal, but refuse to send their kids to a school with any type of minority population.

Happened in Canada also, but it was more toward the African or Haitian immigrants.

I graduated high school in a class of almost 1000 and we had maybe 50 minority kids. That was outside of Houston.

It's economic segregation not racial.

Welcome to the Main Street problems caused by applied liberal policies

When I worked in New York they were always discussing how racist the South was,
but turning right around and openly discuss school policies to keep whites and minorities
separate in their local schools.