(03-26-2014 02:40 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:38 PM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  I wouldn't be surprised if CUSA approaches both UMass and Delaware for full membership.

Delaware?

CUSA already approached Delaware in its last expansion go round...and they said they weren't interested in moving up. Do some research on UDelaware and you'll see why they are wanted...starting with their $1 billion endowment.

(03-26-2014 02:41 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:38 PM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  I wouldn't be surprised if CUSA approaches both UMass and Delaware for full membership.

An eastern division of Charlotte, Delaware, UMass, Old Dominion, Marshall, WKU, FAU and FIU

A western division of MTSU, UAB, Southern Miss, La Tech, North Texas, UTSA, Rice and UTEP

UMass and Delaware would be the type of institutions CUSA would want, offer more east coast exposure, and more markets.

But it stretches their geography. I think if they expand, they will stay between Huntington, Norfolk, Miami and El Paso.

Isn't conference re-alignment about stretching your geography?

Not sure what UMass is going to do but it's great for the MAC, whether or not they're interested in adding any schools at this point. Thing is, if the MAC was to lose a school, say, Ohio to the AAC or something like that, we wouldn't have enough schools for a championship game anymore. It might be better to go to 14 if there was somebody besides JMU that was ready.

(03-26-2014 02:38 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:20 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:16 PM)bullet Wrote:  So no James Madison to the MAC. If that was in the pipeline, they would have kept UMass.

What makes you say that? I strongly doubt that just adding JMU would make UMass want to move their basketball team to the MAC.

They aren't going to add James Madison to get to 13 again.
If they had a #14, they would have let UMass keep a partial.

Not if they wanted 14 for all sports.

If they had a new addition coming in, they would want UMass to bring in their non-football sports to even things up.

(03-26-2014 02:42 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  Not sure what UMass is going to do but it's great for the MAC, whether or not they're interested in adding any schools at this point. Thing is, if the MAC was to lose a school, say, Ohio to the AAC or something like that, we wouldn't have enough schools for a championship game anymore. It might be better to go to 14 if there was somebody besides JMU that was ready.

Missouri State?

(03-26-2014 02:43 PM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:42 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  Not sure what UMass is going to do but it's great for the MAC, whether or not they're interested in adding any schools at this point. Thing is, if the MAC was to lose a school, say, Ohio to the AAC or something like that, we wouldn't have enough schools for a championship game anymore. It might be better to go to 14 if there was somebody besides JMU that was ready.

Missouri State?

There are several good options out of the MVFC. The MAC will be fine.

(03-26-2014 02:35 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  The decision to bring UMass in for football was made at a time when Temple was in the MAC and was expected to remain. So the MAC could reasonably look forward to a period of 14 teams in football. Once Temple bailed out, having a 13th team seemed less attractive. Especially once the MAC realized that there really wasn't any other good-option for #14.

If the decision was made two or three years ago, why did they only offer full membership in the past month - or did you miss that part of the announcement?

(03-26-2014 02:35 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:31 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  Again, if they were happy at 12, why did they just try to add UMass to get to 13 in all sports?

I think people are misinterpreting this move. UMass' contract with the MAC states that the MAC has the right to invite UMass for all sports whenever they so choose, and if UMass declines then they have 2 years to find a new home.

To me, that says that the MAC was trying to add UMass and another to get to 14, and UMass said no so now they have to leave.

This is a sign that the MAC is actively trying to expand.

The decision to bring UMass in for football was made at a time when Temple was in the MAC and was expected to remain. So the MAC could reasonably look forward to a period of 14 teams in football. Once Temple bailed out, having a 13th team seemed less attractive. Especially once the MAC realized that there really wasn't any other good-option for #14.

Once again, because you're just not getting this. The MAC just invited UMass to join for all sports last month. This move has absolutely nothing to do with Temple.

If having a 13th team is less attractive, then why did they just this last month invite UMass to make it 13 for all their sports?

It only makes sense if they have another addition in the works.

(03-26-2014 02:42 PM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:41 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:38 PM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  I wouldn't be surprised if CUSA approaches both UMass and Delaware for full membership.

An eastern division of Charlotte, Delaware, UMass, Old Dominion, Marshall, WKU, FAU and FIU

A western division of MTSU, UAB, Southern Miss, La Tech, North Texas, UTSA, Rice and UTEP

UMass and Delaware would be the type of institutions CUSA would want, offer more east coast exposure, and more markets.

But it stretches their geography. I think if they expand, they will stay between Huntington, Norfolk, Miami and El Paso.

Isn't conference re-alignment about stretching your geography?

Not anymore than necessary. CUSA already is probably the most spread conference. They have opportunities for infill. Southwest Louisiana, Arkansas, Georgia, Central Texas.

(03-26-2014 02:43 PM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:42 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  Not sure what UMass is going to do but it's great for the MAC, whether or not they're interested in adding any schools at this point. Thing is, if the MAC was to lose a school, say, Ohio to the AAC or something like that, we wouldn't have enough schools for a championship game anymore. It might be better to go to 14 if there was somebody besides JMU that was ready.

Missouri State?

Missouri/Massachusetts are pretty much a wash population wise, but a Virginia/Missouri combo would be a nice get for the MAC if they went direction.

(03-26-2014 02:42 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:38 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:20 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:16 PM)bullet Wrote:  So no James Madison to the MAC. If that was in the pipeline, they would have kept UMass.

What makes you say that? I strongly doubt that just adding JMU would make UMass want to move their basketball team to the MAC.

They aren't going to add James Madison to get to 13 again.
If they had a #14, they would have let UMass keep a partial.

Not if they wanted 14 for all sports.

If they had a new addition coming in, they would want UMass to bring in their non-football sports to even things up.

That was NEVER going to happen. Simply a power play to get UMass football out of the MAC and out of a clumsy 13 team arrangement.

(03-26-2014 02:45 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:35 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:31 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  Again, if they were happy at 12, why did they just try to add UMass to get to 13 in all sports?

I think people are misinterpreting this move. UMass' contract with the MAC states that the MAC has the right to invite UMass for all sports whenever they so choose, and if UMass declines then they have 2 years to find a new home.

To me, that says that the MAC was trying to add UMass and another to get to 14, and UMass said no so now they have to leave.

This is a sign that the MAC is actively trying to expand.

The decision to bring UMass in for football was made at a time when Temple was in the MAC and was expected to remain. So the MAC could reasonably look forward to a period of 14 teams in football. Once Temple bailed out, having a 13th team seemed less attractive. Especially once the MAC realized that there really wasn't any other good-option for #14.

Once again, because you're just not getting this. The MAC just invited UMass to join for all sports last month. This move has absolutely nothing to do with Temple.

If having a 13th team is less attractive, then why did they just this last month invite UMass to make it 13 for all their sports?

It only makes sense if they have another addition in the works.

Maybe the MAC has been re-negotiating its television package and discovered a month ago UMass football does zero for the deal and the MAC can get the same dollars at 12 as 12/13 but UMass all-sports would improve the dollars.

(03-26-2014 02:45 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:35 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:31 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  Again, if they were happy at 12, why did they just try to add UMass to get to 13 in all sports?

I think people are misinterpreting this move. UMass' contract with the MAC states that the MAC has the right to invite UMass for all sports whenever they so choose, and if UMass declines then they have 2 years to find a new home.

To me, that says that the MAC was trying to add UMass and another to get to 14, and UMass said no so now they have to leave.

This is a sign that the MAC is actively trying to expand.

The decision to bring UMass in for football was made at a time when Temple was in the MAC and was expected to remain. So the MAC could reasonably look forward to a period of 14 teams in football. Once Temple bailed out, having a 13th team seemed less attractive. Especially once the MAC realized that there really wasn't any other good-option for #14.

Once again, because you're just not getting this. The MAC just invited UMass to join for all sports last month. This move has absolutely nothing to do with Temple.

If having a 13th team is less attractive, then why did they just this last month invite UMass to make it 13 for all their sports?

It only makes sense if they have another addition in the works.

I would say you have it backwards. It only makes sense to have UMass as football member #13 if they are also a full member. Otherwise you are better off at 12.

(03-26-2014 02:45 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  Once again, because you're just not getting this. The MAC just invited UMass to join for all sports last month. This move has absolutely nothing to do with Temple.

If having a 13th team is less attractive, then why did they just this last month invite UMass to make it 13 for all their sports?

It only makes sense if they have another addition in the works.

One possibility is they extended the invitation knowing that UMass would decline the offer, which would effectively have allowed them to expel Umass without formally expelling them.

(03-26-2014 02:50 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:42 PM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:41 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:38 PM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  I wouldn't be surprised if CUSA approaches both UMass and Delaware for full membership.

An eastern division of Charlotte, Delaware, UMass, Old Dominion, Marshall, WKU, FAU and FIU

A western division of MTSU, UAB, Southern Miss, La Tech, North Texas, UTSA, Rice and UTEP

UMass and Delaware would be the type of institutions CUSA would want, offer more east coast exposure, and more markets.

But it stretches their geography. I think if they expand, they will stay between Huntington, Norfolk, Miami and El Paso.

Isn't conference re-alignment about stretching your geography?

Not anymore than necessary. CUSA already is probably the most spread conference. They have opportunities for infill. Southwest Louisiana, Arkansas, Georgia, Central Texas.

But you see those divisions....its not necessarily about stretching as much as it is time zones. And moving to 16 would make sense if its adding markets, reducing cross over games, and extending your brand. It also offers protection from further raids.

(03-26-2014 02:45 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:35 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:31 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  Again, if they were happy at 12, why did they just try to add UMass to get to 13 in all sports?

I think people are misinterpreting this move. UMass' contract with the MAC states that the MAC has the right to invite UMass for all sports whenever they so choose, and if UMass declines then they have 2 years to find a new home.

To me, that says that the MAC was trying to add UMass and another to get to 14, and UMass said no so now they have to leave.

This is a sign that the MAC is actively trying to expand.

The decision to bring UMass in for football was made at a time when Temple was in the MAC and was expected to remain. So the MAC could reasonably look forward to a period of 14 teams in football. Once Temple bailed out, having a 13th team seemed less attractive. Especially once the MAC realized that there really wasn't any other good-option for #14.

Once again, because you're just not getting this. The MAC just invited UMass to join for all sports last month. This move has absolutely nothing to do with Temple.

If having a 13th team is less attractive, then why did they just this last month invite UMass to make it 13 for all their sports?

It only makes sense if they have another addition in the works.

How exactly was it worded? I believe that the MAC couldn't make UMass leave unless we offered them full membership, and then they had 2 years after that if they turned it down. So if the MAC wanted to get to 12 they'd have to offer full membership to UMass. I might be reading that wrong of course.

So UMass values the A-10 over the MAC. I can't really blame them basketball wise.

I bet they make a strong push for the American.

(03-26-2014 02:52 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:45 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:35 PM)Native Georgian Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:31 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  Again, if they were happy at 12, why did they just try to add UMass to get to 13 in all sports?

I think people are misinterpreting this move. UMass' contract with the MAC states that the MAC has the right to invite UMass for all sports whenever they so choose, and if UMass declines then they have 2 years to find a new home.

To me, that says that the MAC was trying to add UMass and another to get to 14, and UMass said no so now they have to leave.

This is a sign that the MAC is actively trying to expand.

The decision to bring UMass in for football was made at a time when Temple was in the MAC and was expected to remain. So the MAC could reasonably look forward to a period of 14 teams in football. Once Temple bailed out, having a 13th team seemed less attractive. Especially once the MAC realized that there really wasn't any other good-option for #14.

Once again, because you're just not getting this. The MAC just invited UMass to join for all sports last month. This move has absolutely nothing to do with Temple.

If having a 13th team is less attractive, then why did they just this last month invite UMass to make it 13 for all their sports?

It only makes sense if they have another addition in the works.

I would say you have it backwards. It only makes sense to have UMass as football member #13 if they are also a full member. Otherwise you are better off at 12.

Agree...they are better off with 12...there was no reason to have UMass football on board.

(03-26-2014 02:53 PM)LostInSpace Wrote:  

(03-26-2014 02:45 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  Once again, because you're just not getting this. The MAC just invited UMass to join for all sports last month. This move has absolutely nothing to do with Temple.

If having a 13th team is less attractive, then why did they just this last month invite UMass to make it 13 for all their sports?

It only makes sense if they have another addition in the works.

One possibility is they extended the invitation knowing that UMass would decline the offer, which would effectively have allowed them to expel Umass without formally expelling them.

That's how I read it. Though I don't see it as meaning the MAC doesn't want to go past 12 schools. They probably just want schools for all sports.

(03-26-2014 02:45 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  Once again, because you're just not getting this. The MAC just invited UMass to join for all sports last month.

In accordance with the MAC-UMass football affiliate agreement.

Quote: If having a 13th team is less attractive, then why did they just this last month invite UMass to make it 13 for all their sports?

Because the MAC-UMAss deal said that if the MAC wanted to end the football-only arrangement, they had to offer UMass full membership.

Quote:It only makes sense if they have another addition in the works.

No, JMU-to-MAC only made sense for the MAC if UMass and JMU were joining as full members. I'm not saying JMU was on deck for #14, swap out whoever for JMU.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/54481290/Final...Conference

What's Temple got to do with it? It's spelled out in the agreement. If Temple leaves MAC football, the MAC can kick UMass football out. However, if they do, they must provide UMass with an offer of full membership.

Which is what just happened.