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Topkat Offline
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Post: #1
Big 10 Revenue
I've been trying to pin down a total that Big 10 schools pull down in addition to their Tier 1 media deal.

In addition to the Tier 1 deal, I know the BTN chips in 7M+ per school.

Here is a link to an article stating Ohio State gets another 10M per year for radio and advertising rights (http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/...DD3TJ.html) that do not come from the conference.

Maybe Big 10 people know, is there any other revenue stream, other than tickets, boosters and merchandise that Big 10 schools get?
03-02-2014 03:56 PM
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john01992 Offline
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RE: Big 10 Revenue
osu actually gets 11 mill a year from img not 10 mill
(This post was last modified: 03-02-2014 03:59 PM by john01992.)
03-02-2014 03:59 PM
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RE: Big 10 Revenue
(03-02-2014 03:56 PM)Topkat Wrote:  I've been trying to pin down a total that Big 10 schools pull down in addition to their Tier 1 media deal.

In addition to the Tier 1 deal, I know the BTN chips in 7M+ per school.

Here is a link to an article stating Ohio State gets another 10M per year for radio and advertising rights (http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/...DD3TJ.html) that do not come from the conference.

Maybe Big 10 people know, is there any other revenue stream, other than tickets, boosters and merchandise that Big 10 schools get?

This article has a good discussion of Big 10 revenues:

http://www.omaha.com/article/20140209/NEWS/140208719
03-02-2014 07:11 PM
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RE: Big 10 Revenue
Big 10 gets $100 million average/year on their Tier I, $24/year on their Fox ccg contract and $12/year on their CBS basketball contract. All those expire in 2016-7.
03-02-2014 07:49 PM
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prp Offline
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RE: Big 10 Revenue
The bowl contracts should guarantee the conference about $60-70 million per year, and even more if they place a team in the playoff.
03-02-2014 08:08 PM
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Topkat Offline
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RE: Big 10 Revenue
Thanks bullett, I see the article projected a $30-35M per school Tier 1 contract in 2017 (I know its only a guess).

But in the case of Ohio State, if the Big 10 gets a 30-35M (per school) Tier 1 deal, add to that 7M (BTN) + Bowls + Championship Series + NCAA Credits = Money from the Big 10.

An additional 11M (for radio and advertising) + tickets + merchandise (all this varies by Big 10 school) and the widening of the money gap starts to really kick in. I would also look for the BTN to try and kick up its monthly cable fee to get closer to the SEC number when renewal time comes.
03-02-2014 08:15 PM
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john01992 Offline
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RE: Big 10 Revenue
(03-02-2014 08:15 PM)Topkat Wrote:  Thanks bullett, I see the article projected a $30-35M per school Tier 1 contract in 2017 (I know its only a guess).

But in the case of Ohio State, if the Big 10 gets a 30-35M (per school) Tier 1 deal, add to that 7M (BTN) + Bowls + Championship Series + NCAA Credits = Money from the Big 10.

An additional 11M (for radio and advertising) + tickets + merchandise (all this varies by Big 10 school) and the widening of the money gap starts to really kick in. I would also look for the BTN to try and kick up its monthly cable fee to get closer to the SEC number when renewal time comes.

yeah a UMD admin was interviewed and said the disparity in revenue projections between the acc & b10 was baffling and ultimately was part of the reason they had to leave the acc
03-02-2014 10:51 PM
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RE: Big 10 Revenue
(03-02-2014 10:51 PM)john01992 Wrote:  
(03-02-2014 08:15 PM)Topkat Wrote:  Thanks bullett, I see the article projected a $30-35M per school Tier 1 contract in 2017 (I know its only a guess).

But in the case of Ohio State, if the Big 10 gets a 30-35M (per school) Tier 1 deal, add to that 7M (BTN) + Bowls + Championship Series + NCAA Credits = Money from the Big 10.

An additional 11M (for radio and advertising) + tickets + merchandise (all this varies by Big 10 school) and the widening of the money gap starts to really kick in. I would also look for the BTN to try and kick up its monthly cable fee to get closer to the SEC number when renewal time comes.

yeah a UMD admin was interviewed and said the disparity in revenue projections between the acc & b10 was baffling and ultimately was part of the reason they had to leave the acc
Darn... all this time I thought Maryland was too competitive for the ACC...
03-03-2014 12:29 AM
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RE: Big 10 Revenue
And yet 4 Big 10 teams don't even have permanent lights on their football stadiums (they rent temporary lights if they ever have to play at night).
03-03-2014 06:28 AM
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Re: RE: Big 10 Revenue
(03-03-2014 06:28 AM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  And yet 4 Big 10 teams don't even have permanent lights on their football stadiums (they rent temporary lights if they ever have to play at night).

Not usually much need when you don't play night games in November. Big Ten teams don't usually play night games.

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03-03-2014 07:01 AM
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RE: Big 10 Revenue
(03-03-2014 07:01 AM)DexterDevil Wrote:  
(03-03-2014 06:28 AM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  And yet 4 Big 10 teams don't even have permanent lights on their football stadiums (they rent temporary lights if they ever have to play at night).

Not usually much need when you don't play night games in November. Big Ten teams don't usually play night games.

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That used to be the case, but that has changed the past couple seasons. B10 schools realized that the late night games were great for exposure. More to the point, B10 schools were upset that other teams were getting all the exposure and they were stuck playing nooners and a 3:30 game.

Ohio State played more than half of their games under the lights last night. Michigan and Wisconsin also had a ton of late night games. That used to never happen.
03-03-2014 08:44 AM
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RE: Big 10 Revenue
(03-02-2014 08:15 PM)Topkat Wrote:  Thanks bullett, I see the article projected a $30-35M per school Tier 1 contract in 2017 (I know its only a guess).

But in the case of Ohio State, if the Big 10 gets a 30-35M (per school) Tier 1 deal, add to that 7M (BTN) + Bowls + Championship Series + NCAA Credits = Money from the Big 10.

An additional 11M (for radio and advertising) + tickets + merchandise (all this varies by Big 10 school) and the widening of the money gap starts to really kick in. I would also look for the BTN to try and kick up its monthly cable fee to get closer to the SEC number when renewal time comes.

According to a report done by Rutgers and reported on today, that $35.5 million includes ALL Conference/NCAA distributions and that figure will be reached in the year 2022.

That is the same year Rutgers is projecting to reach solvency. They actually are projecting the school will have to pump about 1/4 BILLION $ into the athletic department to keep it afloat between now and then.

Great move for Rutgers going to the Big Ten but it is going to be a long while before they dig themselves out of their financial mess.


http://www.nj.com/education/2014/03/rutg...bsidy.html


excerpt:



Quote:The report says Rutgers received $21.4 million last year from "other" sources, including ticket sales, donations, sponsorships and licensing income. By 2022, that estimate will climb to nearly $47 million, according to the report.

Likewise, "conference/NCAA distributions," which includes money produced by projected TV contracts, will increase, from $25 million in 2021 to $35.5 million the next year, when Rutgers begins to receive an equal share of conference revenue.
03-05-2014 07:56 PM
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RE: Big 10 Revenue
05-bump
03-06-2014 01:31 PM
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Dasville Offline
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RE: Big 10 Revenue
Yep! That is what I thought. As soon as a realistic figure is uncovered all the B1G folks scatter.
03-06-2014 03:42 PM
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Re: RE: Big 10 Revenue
(03-02-2014 08:15 PM)Topkat Wrote:  Thanks bullett, I see the article projected a $30-35M per school Tier 1 contract in 2017 (I know its only a guess).

But in the case of Ohio State, if the Big 10 gets a 30-35M (per school) Tier 1 deal, add to that 7M (BTN) + Bowls + Championship Series + NCAA Credits = Money from the Big 10.

An additional 11M (for radio and advertising) + tickets + merchandise (all this varies by Big 10 school) and the widening of the money gap starts to really kick in. I would also look for the BTN to try and kick up its monthly cable fee to get closer to the SEC number when renewal time comes.

The B1G might distribute $30 - $35 million in total revenue after their new contracts are signed. They will not get that amount of money for their tier 1 contract. First of all, they are only selling half or less the inventory than the other conferences. I'll personally be surprised if they get $20 million for their tier 1 rights. If they get that, TV is saying they are twice as valuable as the B12 and the PAC 12 based on recent contracts. The B1G uses other tier 2 rights for their network.

No broadcaster will lose money to own the B1G's tier 1 rights. My personal guess would be they will double their current take on tier 1. That would be around $14 -$15 million per school, per year. Plus the bumps in other broadcast revenues will put them in the $25 million range for broadcast revenues per school. That is a 25% increase over the B12 and PAC 12 numbers. Add in the NCAA credits and bowl revenues and that is where you get the $30 - $35 million annual number.

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03-07-2014 06:46 AM
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RE: Big 10 Revenue
(03-07-2014 06:46 AM)Shannon Panther Wrote:  
(03-02-2014 08:15 PM)Topkat Wrote:  Thanks bullett, I see the article projected a $30-35M per school Tier 1 contract in 2017 (I know its only a guess).

But in the case of Ohio State, if the Big 10 gets a 30-35M (per school) Tier 1 deal, add to that 7M (BTN) + Bowls + Championship Series + NCAA Credits = Money from the Big 10.

An additional 11M (for radio and advertising) + tickets + merchandise (all this varies by Big 10 school) and the widening of the money gap starts to really kick in. I would also look for the BTN to try and kick up its monthly cable fee to get closer to the SEC number when renewal time comes.

The B1G might distribute $30 - $35 million in total revenue after their new contracts are signed. They will not get that amount of money for their tier 1 contract. First of all, they are only selling half or less the inventory than the other conferences. I'll personally be surprised if they get $20 million for their tier 1 rights. If they get that, TV is saying they are twice as valuable as the B12 and the PAC 12 based on recent contracts. The B1G uses other tier 2 rights for their network.

No broadcaster will lose money to own the B1G's tier 1 rights. My personal guess would be they will double their current take on tier 1. That would be around $14 -$15 million per school, per year. Plus the bumps in other broadcast revenues will put them in the $25 million range for broadcast revenues per school. That is a 25% increase over the B12 and PAC 12 numbers. Add in the NCAA credits and bowl revenues and that is where you get the $30 - $35 million annual number.

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The B1G is distributing $26.5 million per school this year. The new playoff/bowl system will be worth about $8 million per school more than the current system, so that gets them to just about $35 million right there.

Factor in the bump from the new media deal that they will sign and by 2017 they will be approaching $40 million per school. That will be ahead of everyone, including the SEC, and way ahead of the ACC. Those are the spoils of being smart and not selling everything to ESPN like the latter two conferences did.
(This post was last modified: 03-07-2014 07:38 AM by quo vadis.)
03-07-2014 07:37 AM
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RE: Big 10 Revenue
http://www.suntimes.com/sports/telander/...-kids.html

excerpt:


Quote:Delany has been remarkably astute in finding the cracks and gaping holes in our country’s terrain of entertainment desire. He brought in bucketloads of cash to the Big Ten through TV and bowl rights, the creation of the Big Ten Network and, yes, the expansion of the league from 10 teams when he came in to the 14 it now will be.

Will the name change to Big Fourteen?

Delany snorts. “Big Ten is a brand. Some things aren’t literal.’’

All fine, one supposes.

But during this wild ride to success, there has been little new done for football players. And Delany, who played basketball at North Carolina, is aware of this.

“I don’t know how I’d feel if I were an athlete today,’’ he said. “Everybody’s sensitive to the points being made [by Colter]. But it’s uncharted territory. It reminds me of 1968 — a lot of traditions that are a hundred years old are being challenged.’’

They are. And the colleges brought this on themselves. Seasons that can be 15 games long, coaches making more than their NFL counterparts, players still limited to the barter concept of play-for-a-scholarship — all of it has made conditions ripe for player revolt.

Delany often says he is all about “choice’’ for the athletes. “If you don’t want to be in school, don’t be in school,’’ is his simple answer. He believes in the free market. You ask him about the crazy paychecks for coaches, and he fires back, “What about it?’’

Then he’ll explain how the Big Ten doesn’t have anti-trust exemption. “Unions and management have antitrust exemption, the NFL does, so does major-league baseball. We have Title IX and other constraints.

“One time we tried to control not only the number of coaches but the amount of money they could make, and it ended up costing us, I think, $55 million in antitrust settlements.’’

No salary caps, no nothing. It’s the Wild West in big-time football, or as Delany sees it, 1968, the year when the Vietnam War was dividing the nation, when Martin Luther King and Robert Kennedy were assassinated, when the Rascals’ song, “People Got to Be Free’’ and the 5th Dimension’s “Stoned Soul Picnic’’ were hits.

Delany is a libertarian. That is, he believes things will be fine if people work hard and seize the opportunities before them.

Yet he doesn’t like the individualism he sees in games.

“I have no sympathy for Johnny Manziel,’’ he said. “I have none.’’

Manziel was Texas A&M’s quarterback who wanted to profit from his signature and likeness. “I don’t believe Johnny Manziel is Texas A&M. I don’t think Kain Colter is Northwestern. I believe there are plenty of kids who would play [at either school].’’

Delany believes athletes should get more representation, better health insurance and a “lifetime trust’’ for education purposes. But he doesn’t believe the athletes bring anything to the schools compared to what the schools give back.

“I believe people will come to the Ohio State-Michigan game even if you could take kids out of the student body [to play]. They’re going to come to that game. I believe that. Same for the Duke-Carolina basketball game. I don’t put that much value in an 18-, 19-year-old kid as being the guy who made Northwestern a good team. In my heart, I believe you can plug players in.’’

Systems beat kids.

We’ll see.


Is the B1G "system" more powerful than the schools they add. Got to remember, they didn't open the TV contract with the addition of Nebraska. Whatever figure they end up getting, if there is a bump at all, is with the addition of Nebraska, Maryland and Rutgers combined, plus the current market. Role the dice the B1G is, and if the players Unionize, they won't be able to drop to Division 3 to avoid the situation.

People may very well come to the Ohio St-Michigan game with students pulled from the stands, thing is.....tickets better be cheap and people aren't paying $ for that extra TV channel. Hell, they may not even watch it on free TV.
(This post was last modified: 03-07-2014 04:30 PM by Dasville.)
03-07-2014 03:58 PM
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RE: Big 10 Revenue
(03-07-2014 07:37 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(03-07-2014 06:46 AM)Shannon Panther Wrote:  
(03-02-2014 08:15 PM)Topkat Wrote:  Thanks bullett, I see the article projected a $30-35M per school Tier 1 contract in 2017 (I know its only a guess).

But in the case of Ohio State, if the Big 10 gets a 30-35M (per school) Tier 1 deal, add to that 7M (BTN) + Bowls + Championship Series + NCAA Credits = Money from the Big 10.

An additional 11M (for radio and advertising) + tickets + merchandise (all this varies by Big 10 school) and the widening of the money gap starts to really kick in. I would also look for the BTN to try and kick up its monthly cable fee to get closer to the SEC number when renewal time comes.

The B1G might distribute $30 - $35 million in total revenue after their new contracts are signed. They will not get that amount of money for their tier 1 contract. First of all, they are only selling half or less the inventory than the other conferences. I'll personally be surprised if they get $20 million for their tier 1 rights. If they get that, TV is saying they are twice as valuable as the B12 and the PAC 12 based on recent contracts. The B1G uses other tier 2 rights for their network.

No broadcaster will lose money to own the B1G's tier 1 rights. My personal guess would be they will double their current take on tier 1. That would be around $14 -$15 million per school, per year. Plus the bumps in other broadcast revenues will put them in the $25 million range for broadcast revenues per school. That is a 25% increase over the B12 and PAC 12 numbers. Add in the NCAA credits and bowl revenues and that is where you get the $30 - $35 million annual number.

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The B1G is distributing $26.5 million per school this year. The new playoff/bowl system will be worth about $8 million per school more than the current system, so that gets them to just about $35 million right there.

Factor in the bump from the new media deal that they will sign and by 2017 they will be approaching $40 million per school. That will be ahead of everyone, including the SEC, and way ahead of the ACC. Those are the spoils of being smart and not selling everything to ESPN like the latter two conferences did.

Quo, the bump for the B10 for the Sugar Bowl and Playoff is about $6.35 million. They get $40 million for the Sugar Bowl, and $55 million for the playoff. That's $95 million divided by 15 or $6.35 million so they are closer to $33.5 million than $35 million.

The ACC only gets about $82.5 million and when that's divided by 15 you get $5.5 million. The ACC is projected to distribute about $23.5 this year. So for 2015 the ACC would only be at $29 million, plus whatever the ACC gets for adding Louisville, (half million?) = $29.5. In 2016 the ACC gets $2 million more if there is no network, and the ACC has a look in in 2017. So in 2017 the ACC would be at $31.5 per school minimum, perhaps as high as $33. The B10 might be at $40 million by then and $40 to $33 million means the ACC is at 82.5% of the B10 which is reasonable.

The main issue though is that a $7 million conference distribution per team differential is chump change when you look at the revenues of the B10's top 4-5 teams. Ohio State, Penn State, Michigan, Wisconsin, Iowa. For Ohio State and Michigan, the extra $7 million represents about 5% of their annual revenues.

$7 million a year seems like a great deal more but if your overall revenues are already well above $100 million, it's not that much in the scheme of things.

Most NCAA competitions is within a conference so you need to dominate your conference and that takes money. It takes less money to dominate the ACC than it does to dominate the B10 or SEC.

It takes about $90 million a year to be competitive in the B10, and it takes about $115 million or more to dominate football and be competitive in the other sports. FSU and Clemson can do that in the ACC for $95 million and $75 million. My point being that costs in the ACC to dominate and be competitive are about 12% to 15% less than in the B10 or SEC.

To me it's akin to the cost of living and real estate. The best home in an equal subdivision in Boston, SF, and Raleigh with the same square footage and amenities might be $3 million in Boston, $4.5 million in SF, and $2 million in Raleigh. Cost of competition is driving by multiple schools competition with each other and you have that in the B10 and SEC so Ohio State, Michigan, Wisky and Penn State drive the cost up with their huge revenue generating stadiums. Bama, Auburn, Tennessee, LSU, and Florida do the same in the SEC. The ACC doesn't have that level of competition because no one in really pushing Clemson and FSU. If two of VT, UVa, UNC, or Miami could really push CU and FSU, then the cost of competition in the ACC would go up.

Hey, I think this would make a good dissertation topic.
03-07-2014 08:26 PM
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Big 10 Revenue
This lays out the argument well that schools with a more powerful basketball legacy (ACC) are less likely to want to move into conferences with more overall football powers--they would have little, to no incentive. The logic is that they will always be in the hunt for basketball championships and can be respectable in football where most revenue is generated. As highlighted money alone is not a real driver as most universities are not focused on pure profit motivation.

The strong football teams in conferences with a more powerful basketball team focus get the advantage in reverse, their path to get a shot at football championships is pretty consistent every year and they don't really have to put too many resources into basketball; I think this fits Notre Dame most notably, and is a decent strategy as things stand today.


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03-07-2014 09:48 PM
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