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Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
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CintiFan Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 12:23 AM)He1nousOne Wrote:  Just some more food for thought. I suppose some of you could be thinking that we wont be having divisions thus geography doesn't matter. If you are like myself though then you are of the mindset that we will be having more divisions not less and geography will matter more than ever before.

So, for the Big Ten that means taking only one Western program and one Eastern leaves you with a western division of Nebraska, Iowa, Minnesota and Kansas if we go four divisions at 16. That is why you wont see the Big Ten taking one East and one West despite how nicely a division such as Penn State, Virginia Tech, Rutgers and Maryland looks.

First, I think it'd be Nebraska, Iowa, Illiniois and Kansas in the west. In the east, Rutgers, Maryland, and Penn St. need a fourth, but who? OSU without Michigan? VT or UVA would fit quite nicely along side a Kansas addition to the west.

To your point, though, except for football, divisions don't really matter that much. Think of wrestling, track, baseball, basketball, hockey or any other sport - the Conference can hold a championship meet or tournament and every team (or almost every team) can participate. It may still make sense to have divisions for such sports for any number of reasons, such as to make scheduling easier, promote rivalries and have regular season divisional champs named.

For football, divisions matter because that's the ticket to the conference championship or semi-finals, but they don't really matter much for scheduling purposes. It's relatively easy for the football team to fly anywhere in the conference, so football divisions could be based on historic football power, for example, rather than geography in order to promote competitive balance. There could be different divisions for football than other sports. In a 16 team conference, for example, we could have two 8 team divisions for most sports, with each 8 team division further dividing into two 4 team divisions based on competitive balance for football.

I don't see geography as being a limiting factor in expansion, although I admit there could be some odd looking divisions resulting from it.
02-06-2014 01:15 AM
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JRsec Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 12:23 AM)He1nousOne Wrote:  Just some more food for thought. I suppose some of you could be thinking that we wont be having divisions thus geography doesn't matter. If you are like myself though then you are of the mindset that we will be having more divisions not less and geography will matter more than ever before.

So, for the Big Ten that means taking only one Western program and one Eastern leaves you with a western division of Nebraska, Iowa, Minnesota and Kansas if we go four divisions at 16. That is why you wont see the Big Ten taking one East and one West despite how nicely a division such as Penn State, Virginia Tech, Rutgers and Maryland looks.

That's fine, but which side of the Big 10 needs two the most, East or West? And which side adds the most value, East or West?
02-06-2014 03:39 AM
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JRsec Offline
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Post: #23
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 01:15 AM)CintiFan Wrote:  
(02-06-2014 12:23 AM)He1nousOne Wrote:  Just some more food for thought. I suppose some of you could be thinking that we wont be having divisions thus geography doesn't matter. If you are like myself though then you are of the mindset that we will be having more divisions not less and geography will matter more than ever before.

So, for the Big Ten that means taking only one Western program and one Eastern leaves you with a western division of Nebraska, Iowa, Minnesota and Kansas if we go four divisions at 16. That is why you wont see the Big Ten taking one East and one West despite how nicely a division such as Penn State, Virginia Tech, Rutgers and Maryland looks.

First, I think it'd be Nebraska, Iowa, Illiniois and Kansas in the west. In the east, Rutgers, Maryland, and Penn St. need a fourth, but who? OSU without Michigan? VT or UVA would fit quite nicely along side a Kansas addition to the west.

To your point, though, except for football, divisions don't really matter that much. Think of wrestling, track, baseball, basketball, hockey or any other sport - the Conference can hold a championship meet or tournament and every team (or almost every team) can participate. It may still make sense to have divisions for such sports for any number of reasons, such as to make scheduling easier, promote rivalries and have regular season divisional champs named.

For football, divisions matter because that's the ticket to the conference championship or semi-finals, but they don't really matter much for scheduling purposes. It's relatively easy for the football team to fly anywhere in the conference, so football divisions could be based on historic football power, for example, rather than geography in order to promote competitive balance. There could be different divisions for football than other sports. In a 16 team conference, for example, we could have two 8 team divisions for most sports, with each 8 team division further dividing into two 4 team divisions based on competitive balance for football.

I don't see geography as being a limiting factor in expansion, although I admit there could be some odd looking divisions resulting from it.

Good points. But in Basketball there need only be two divisions. You play everyone in your own division twice (home and away) and everyone in the other division only once (alternating half home and away annually). That's 22 conference games. The same would be true for women's basketball. In baseball and softball you would have 7 divisional 3 game series on the weekends and would play the teams in the other division 2 games mid week alternating home and away annually for a total of 37 conference games. Remember in baseball rain outs and games canceled due to inclement weather are not made up. So annually you would be looking at around 34 games a year or a touch fewer.

All of those sports would still have conference tournaments as you suggested. Simply match up one divisions top team against the other divisions bottom team and so on and so forth down the order of finish and have your tournaments.
(This post was last modified: 02-06-2014 03:55 AM by JRsec.)
02-06-2014 03:48 AM
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XLance Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-05-2014 08:42 PM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-05-2014 08:33 PM)XLance Wrote:  
(02-04-2014 11:18 PM)jhawkmvp Wrote:  If the ACC and B12 make it to the end of their GoR somehow, keep a close eye on ND and Texas starting their own conference. They will go to the schools they want (mostly from the ACC/B12) and show them the money. The networks will offer the moon for a conference with the ND & UT brands as well as their most valuable friends. Plus, they would be undisputed kings of that conference. They can get rid of the flaws that the current ACC and B12 have with deadweight and duplicated markets. It could be tailor made for TV unlike the rest of the conferences who have varying degrees of duplication or weak sisters.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_vWxElAmHc

Lipstick on a pig.

Lipstick? Maybe.....but this was just a discussion piece in response to the above post.

This shows this arrogance of Texas, but offers insight.
1. Texas thinks it can become a basketball power.
2. Texas wants to ride Kansas' coattails.
3. could go independent if they wanted
4. could start their own conference with Notre Dame (twenty peers and divide into conferences later, a door Notre Dame later shut when they joined the ACC).
5. Aren't going west.
02-06-2014 08:30 AM
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JRsec Offline
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Post: #25
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 08:30 AM)XLance Wrote:  
(02-05-2014 08:42 PM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-05-2014 08:33 PM)XLance Wrote:  
(02-04-2014 11:18 PM)jhawkmvp Wrote:  If the ACC and B12 make it to the end of their GoR somehow, keep a close eye on ND and Texas starting their own conference. They will go to the schools they want (mostly from the ACC/B12) and show them the money. The networks will offer the moon for a conference with the ND & UT brands as well as their most valuable friends. Plus, they would be undisputed kings of that conference. They can get rid of the flaws that the current ACC and B12 have with deadweight and duplicated markets. It could be tailor made for TV unlike the rest of the conferences who have varying degrees of duplication or weak sisters.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_vWxElAmHc

Lipstick on a pig.

Lipstick? Maybe.....but this was just a discussion piece in response to the above post.

This shows this arrogance of Texas, but offers insight.
1. Texas thinks it can become a basketball power.
2. Texas wants to ride Kansas' coattails.
3. could go independent if they wanted
4. could start their own conference with Notre Dame (twenty peers and divide into conferences later, a door Notre Dame later shut when they joined the ACC).
5. Aren't going west.

The pig is the Big 12, the lipstick is the Longhorn's delusion. They are going to wind up either in the ACC or SEC because that is what ESPN will pay for. Who they bring with them and how many is another matter entirely. But I do think it is a fair assumption that for the ACC to land them fully buddies will tag along. It would be a good time to push N.D. for full inclusion as well, although it might take a breakaway to get them to agree to it.

There is one thing I am certain about. The economic inequities can't remain between conferences if we are to settle realignment. There is only so much that can be done for the PAC. But the ACC could be solidified and brought to parity fairly easily. The Big 12 sticks out as the ugliest duckling. Their academics are disparate, their wealth is disparate, their geography is disparate, their footprint is unmarketable, their two powers are fading slowly, and the have nots are clinging to whatever keeps them afloat. There are two distinct peer groups in the Big 12. Kansas, Texas and Oklahoma form one. Kansas State, Iowa State, Texas Tech, and Oklahoma State form another. Baylor is closer to the second group than the first but doesn't quite fit either. T.C.U. is an entirely different animal as is West Virginia. I wouldn't call the ACC cohesive but you guys look like a family photo of smurfs compared to the Big 12.

And as an aside for those who think Texas will choose the PAC or Big 10 over either the SEC or ACC I would say this. If Texas alienates ESPN to move to either the PAC or Big 10 they are through ever competing for national attention again. ESPN is the best PR in the business. Without the PR the Texas program doesn't recover to the levels of old. In the PAC they won't even control Texas for much longer athletically. In the Big 10 they would not only have difficulty keeping up with the Aggies but would alienate many in their own fan base as well as ESPN. A move by the Horns anywhere other than the ACC or SEC will spell their irrelevance as a football power. Cut off from their PR, traveling too far for their middle class fans to follow, playing teams that don't mean anything to Texans, and alienating part of their recruiting base will make such a decision the biggest failure in Texas history.
(This post was last modified: 02-06-2014 08:58 AM by JRsec.)
02-06-2014 08:51 AM
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XLance Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 08:51 AM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-06-2014 08:30 AM)XLance Wrote:  
(02-05-2014 08:42 PM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-05-2014 08:33 PM)XLance Wrote:  
(02-04-2014 11:18 PM)jhawkmvp Wrote:  If the ACC and B12 make it to the end of their GoR somehow, keep a close eye on ND and Texas starting their own conference. They will go to the schools they want (mostly from the ACC/B12) and show them the money. The networks will offer the moon for a conference with the ND & UT brands as well as their most valuable friends. Plus, they would be undisputed kings of that conference. They can get rid of the flaws that the current ACC and B12 have with deadweight and duplicated markets. It could be tailor made for TV unlike the rest of the conferences who have varying degrees of duplication or weak sisters.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_vWxElAmHc

Lipstick on a pig.

Lipstick? Maybe.....but this was just a discussion piece in response to the above post.

This shows this arrogance of Texas, but offers insight.
1. Texas thinks it can become a basketball power.
2. Texas wants to ride Kansas' coattails.
3. could go independent if they wanted
4. could start their own conference with Notre Dame (twenty peers and divide into conferences later, a door Notre Dame later shut when they joined the ACC).
5. Aren't going west.

The pig is the Big 12, the lipstick is the Longhorn's delusion. They are going to wind up either in the ACC or SEC because that is what ESPN will pay for. Who they bring with them and how many is another matter entirely. But I do think it is a fair assumption that for the ACC to land them fully buddies will tag along. It would be a good time to push N.D. for full inclusion as well, although it might take a breakaway to get them to agree to it.

There is one thing I am certain about. The economic inequities can't remain between conferences if we are to settle realignment. There is only so much that can be done for the PAC. But the ACC could be solidified and brought to parity fairly easily. The Big 12 sticks out as the ugliest duckling. Their academics are disparate, their wealth is disparate, their geography is disparate, their footprint is unmarketable, their two powers are fading slowly, and the have nots are clinging to whatever keeps them afloat. There are two distinct peer groups in the Big 12. Kansas, Texas and Oklahoma form one. Kansas State, Iowa State, Texas Tech, and Oklahoma State form another. Baylor is closer to the second group than the first but doesn't quite fit either. T.C.U. is an entirely different animal as is West Virginia. I wouldn't call the ACC cohesive but you guys look like a family photo of smurfs compared to the Big 12.

And as an aside for those who think Texas will choose the PAC or Big 10 over either the SEC or ACC I would say this. If Texas alienates ESPN to move to either the PAC or Big 10 they are through ever competing for national attention again. ESPN is the best PR in the business. Without the PR the Texas program doesn't recover to the levels of old. In the PAC they won't even control Texas for much longer athletically. In the Big 10 they would not only have difficulty keeping up with the Aggies but would alienate many in their own fan base as well as ESPN. A move by the Horns anywhere other than the ACC or SEC will spell their irrelevance as a football power. Cut off from their PR, traveling too far for their middle class fans to follow, playing teams that don't mean anything to Texans, and alienating part of their recruiting base will make such a decision the biggest failure in Texas history.

I concur.
02-06-2014 09:48 AM
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XLance Offline
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RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
Texas and Kansas are a package deal?
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/college...edia-deal/
02-06-2014 09:54 AM
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TerryD Offline
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RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-05-2014 10:02 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  If I am the TV God...

I want ND in the Big10, even though it won't happen.

I want Texas playing Alabama, LSU, and Florida.

I want Kansas playing basketball in the Big10.

I want Florida State and Clemson in the SEC.

I want Oklahoma in the Big10 playing Nebraska and Iowa.

The rest can fall where they may if I, Lord TV, and his army of TV daemons ESPN and Fox, get what I want.


Thank God that ND to the Big Ten will not happen.

If I were the TV God, I would want Alabama in the ACC.

I would then want all other conferences disbanded and every other school made a football independent who has to negotiate its own TV deal. :)
02-06-2014 11:22 AM
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HeartOfDixie Offline
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Post: #29
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 11:22 AM)TerryD Wrote:  
(02-05-2014 10:02 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  If I am the TV God...

I want ND in the Big10, even though it won't happen.

I want Texas playing Alabama, LSU, and Florida.

I want Kansas playing basketball in the Big10.

I want Florida State and Clemson in the SEC.

I want Oklahoma in the Big10 playing Nebraska and Iowa.

The rest can fall where they may if I, Lord TV, and his army of TV daemons ESPN and Fox, get what I want.


Thank God that ND to the Big Ten will not happen.

If I were the TV God, I would want Alabama in the ACC.

I would then want all other conferences disbanded and every other school made a football independent who has to negotiate its own TV deal. :)

You've sort of peaked my interests, why would you want Alabama in the ACC?
02-06-2014 11:33 AM
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SeaBlue Offline
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Post: #30
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 11:33 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  You've sort of peaked my interests, why would you want Alabama in the ACC?

Perhaps Mardi Gras started early this year?
02-06-2014 01:35 PM
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JRsec Offline
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Post: #31
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 09:54 AM)XLance Wrote:  Texas and Kansas are a package deal?
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/college...edia-deal/

Interesting read. All the more reason the ACC and SEC should work together to parse the Big 12. That is the second best football product out there and arguably competitive in basketball, and a presence in baseball. Those are, or could be, the money sports with the most live stream potential. Moving the ACC and SEC to 18 or even 20 each through the division would leave our two conferences atop the Football pinnacle, easily the broadest and strongest in basketball, and the owner of 4/5 ths of the best college baseball. We can develop our own networks for now and encourage ESPN to bundle them. Should streaming become the norm then we could simply act as one entity for the selling of rights but maintain our two conferences.

Such a strategy would make our product the most valuable for each of the three money sports.
02-06-2014 01:46 PM
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SeaBlue Offline
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RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 08:51 AM)JRsec Wrote:  And as an aside for those who think Texas will choose the PAC or Big 10 over either the SEC or ACC I would say this. If Texas alienates ESPN to move to either the PAC or Big 10 they are through ever competing for national attention again.

How long is "ever"?

You've heard of "Michigan State" of the Big Ten right? They're from the Rust Belt, they're a little sister, and they were quite bad for a long time.

If they can do it, Texas can do it times ten.
02-06-2014 01:49 PM
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SeaBlue Offline
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Post: #33
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 01:46 PM)JRsec Wrote:  All the more reason the ACC and SEC should work together to parse the Big 12.

Are we just a little bit scared of the Big Ten here? Is this an SEC board? Oh, wait...
02-06-2014 01:54 PM
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JRsec Offline
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Post: #34
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 01:49 PM)SeaBlue Wrote:  
(02-06-2014 08:51 AM)JRsec Wrote:  And as an aside for those who think Texas will choose the PAC or Big 10 over either the SEC or ACC I would say this. If Texas alienates ESPN to move to either the PAC or Big 10 they are through ever competing for national attention again.

How long is "ever"?

You've heard of "Michigan State" of the Big Ten right? They're from the Rust Belt, they're a little sister, and they were quite bad for a long time.

If they can do it, Texas can do it times ten.

Sell it somewhere else Sea Blue. Michigan State grew within its geographical center (roughly). Texas would be forced to grow as an outlier and while alienating itself from most Texans in the process. A&M, Baylor, and Texas Tech would all benefit at the Horns expense. I still look at a Nebraska team that is but a mere shadow of itself now that it is cut off from both its Texas recruiting base and its California recruiting base and Nebraska is much much less of a geographical outlier than Texas.
(This post was last modified: 02-06-2014 01:55 PM by JRsec.)
02-06-2014 01:54 PM
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JRsec Offline
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Post: #35
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 01:54 PM)SeaBlue Wrote:  
(02-06-2014 01:46 PM)JRsec Wrote:  All the more reason the ACC and SEC should work together to parse the Big 12.

Are we just a little bit scared of the Big Ten here? Is this an SEC board? Oh, wait...

There is nothing to fear in the Big Ten. There is only product to be obtained. There are a certain number of football and basketball products available more or less to realignment. The conference or conferences that find ways to lock up that product will emerge in the superior market position. We are speaking here of cartels, not of athletic conferences, which might or might not remain separate. Also this was said in response to the article referenced by XLance as it pertains to the future of streaming vs cable. Try reading instead of trolling. You are always welcome here, but go with the flow of discussion. These quick posts seem more to be attempts to provoke rather than discuss.

It is after all quite apparent that the SEC and Big 10 are vying for market supremacy. If cable is eclipsed by streaming we will be vying for product supremacy. Texas A&M, Nebraska, Penn State, Syracuse, Florida State, and to lesser extents South Carolina, Virginia Tech, Arkansas (at the time and perhaps again) and Miami have been the product added that is worthwhile in the new paradigm.

Missouri, Rutgers, Maryland, Pitt, W.V.U., Colorado, Utah, and Boston College are all market adds and may not be as valuable in the future if they don't develop their product.

T.C.U. was not even a market add and has very little streaming appeal.

Louisville was a sports product add and whether they sustain themselves as such will determine what category to place them in.

There is little doubt that Texas, Oklahoma, and Kansas are big products.
Iowa State, Oklahoma State, Baylor, West Virginia, Kansas State and Texas Tech all offer some product but intermittently. T.C.U. I believe is out of their depth.

The PAC and Big 10 could be valuable to one another as a cartel, just as the ACC and SEC could be valuable to one another as such. The battlefield for product therefore would be the Big 12, not the ACC.

Why buy that which you don't have to purchase as long as you can partner with it for the leverage you seek?

Are you up to speed with the discussion now?
02-06-2014 02:11 PM
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TerryD Offline
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Post: #36
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 11:33 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  
(02-06-2014 11:22 AM)TerryD Wrote:  
(02-05-2014 10:02 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  If I am the TV God...

I want ND in the Big10, even though it won't happen.

I want Texas playing Alabama, LSU, and Florida.

I want Kansas playing basketball in the Big10.

I want Florida State and Clemson in the SEC.

I want Oklahoma in the Big10 playing Nebraska and Iowa.

The rest can fall where they may if I, Lord TV, and his army of TV daemons ESPN and Fox, get what I want.


Thank God that ND to the Big Ten will not happen.

If I were the TV God, I would want Alabama in the ACC.

I would then want all other conferences disbanded and every other school made a football independent who has to negotiate its own TV deal. :)

You've sort of peaked my interests, why would you want Alabama in the ACC?


Just because you wanted ND in the Big Ten.

I figured turnabout was fair play, so I wanted to put Alabama likewise into a conference it has no desire to be in and one clearly against its best interests......
02-06-2014 02:20 PM
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HeartOfDixie Offline
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Post: #37
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 02:20 PM)TerryD Wrote:  
(02-06-2014 11:33 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  
(02-06-2014 11:22 AM)TerryD Wrote:  
(02-05-2014 10:02 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  If I am the TV God...

I want ND in the Big10, even though it won't happen.

I want Texas playing Alabama, LSU, and Florida.

I want Kansas playing basketball in the Big10.

I want Florida State and Clemson in the SEC.

I want Oklahoma in the Big10 playing Nebraska and Iowa.

The rest can fall where they may if I, Lord TV, and his army of TV daemons ESPN and Fox, get what I want.


Thank God that ND to the Big Ten will not happen.

If I were the TV God, I would want Alabama in the ACC.

I would then want all other conferences disbanded and every other school made a football independent who has to negotiate its own TV deal. :)

You've sort of peaked my interests, why would you want Alabama in the ACC?


Just because you wanted ND in the Big Ten.

I figured turnabout was fair play, so I wanted to put Alabama likewise into a conference it has no desire to be in and one clearly against its best interests......

You do understand the premise of the thread, no?
02-06-2014 02:20 PM
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HeartOfDixie Offline
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Post: #38
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 01:54 PM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-06-2014 01:49 PM)SeaBlue Wrote:  
(02-06-2014 08:51 AM)JRsec Wrote:  And as an aside for those who think Texas will choose the PAC or Big 10 over either the SEC or ACC I would say this. If Texas alienates ESPN to move to either the PAC or Big 10 they are through ever competing for national attention again.

How long is "ever"?

You've heard of "Michigan State" of the Big Ten right? They're from the Rust Belt, they're a little sister, and they were quite bad for a long time.

If they can do it, Texas can do it times ten.

Sell it somewhere else Sea Blue. Michigan State grew within its geographical center (roughly). Texas would be forced to grow as an outlier and while alienating itself from most Texans in the process. A&M, Baylor, and Texas Tech would all benefit at the Horns expense. I still look at a Nebraska team that is but a mere shadow of itself now that it is cut off from both its Texas recruiting base and its California recruiting base and Nebraska is much much less of a geographical outlier than Texas.

I think it can be said quite accurately that much of Michigan State's gain has been at their big brother's expense.

Still, it isn't as if anything is wrong with that; That's how it works.
02-06-2014 02:22 PM
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Post: #39
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 01:49 PM)SeaBlue Wrote:  
(02-06-2014 08:51 AM)JRsec Wrote:  And as an aside for those who think Texas will choose the PAC or Big 10 over either the SEC or ACC I would say this. If Texas alienates ESPN to move to either the PAC or Big 10 they are through ever competing for national attention again.

How long is "ever"?

You've heard of "Michigan State" of the Big Ten right? They're from the Rust Belt, they're a little sister, and they were quite bad for a long time.

If they can do it, Texas can do it times ten.

Now, Michigan State aside let's address the Texas issue more fully. I lived in Texas when the Houston Space Flight Center was just coming into being as a known entity. It wasn't that long after WWII and it was long before San Antonio had a river walk. Texas is unique among American states. It is a Republic, and in the 50's most Texans we knew thought of themselves more as being Texan first and American second and that was after WWII when I think more Texans began to see themselves as American first and Texan second. They weren't against the U.S. in anyway, but before television really took hold all most Texans knew was Texas. Texas politics affected their lives, not so much national politics. A culture extending back literally to the Alamo and extending through the second World War instilled in them a state pride so fierce that the last thing on the television at night before you went to bed and the test pattern appeared on the screen was "The Yellow Rose of Texas" and "The National Anthem".

The University of Texas is an extension of that culture, not the author of it. Texas A&M has tremendous support in Texas from average fans of many of their schools. Not because they love A&M but because A&M represents Texas boys going up against what is perceived as the best football conference in America (rightly or wrongly). While A&M's star is on the rise, they shouldn't confuse Texans rooting for Texas boys with actual fans of A&M. Fortunately for television purposes it doesn't matter why the Texans are watching, as much as it matters that they simply watch.

If Texas leaves for the PAC or Big 10 the interest will not be the same. Texans want the University of Texas to be about the State and more importantly they want them to play as locally as possible. The University of Texas has ties to the PAC in research, but that won't matter to the average Texan. The University of Texas has much in common with the Big 10 academically, but that won't matter to the average Texan. Texas has already raised the ire of its people. The older ones were mad when they lost Arkansas as an annual game. Many more than they let on are mad that they now have lost A&M as an annual game. There would be outright revolt if they lost Oklahoma (more on that in a bit). What most Texans want is to see the Horns play Arkansas, Oklahoma, Baylor, Texas Tech and A&M. Whether they play Houston, S.M.U., T.C.U., or Rice is not as important although they like those games sprinkled in as well. If Texas goes to the PAC they take two opponents that Texans will care about with them (Texas Tech and Oklahoma being the most important). It will be more difficult for Texas to schedule Baylor, or T.C.U., or A&M (if resumed). Almost half of their games will be played outside of Texas and 2/3rds of those at great distance. If they go to the Big 10 and take Oklahoma with them only 1 game will be played annually where they can go to watch it. The thought of Texas in the Big 10 is abhorrent to the average Texan. A&M would become the team in Texas by default and the others would benefit as well. If Texas went to the Big 10 with Kansas and not with Oklahoma the anger would be even more intense. Texans are interested in all things pertaining to their state. They might, since the moon shot, now see themselves as Americans first, Texans second, but many still see themselves as Southern somewhere after the first two. Austin and De Loss Dodds know this. That is why they finally rejected the PAC.

Oklahoma is a horse of a different color. Oklahoma was just a territory during the Civil War and while many see themselves as Southern I would say most see themselves as Midwestern if not Western. The Dust Bowl cemented families in California and Oklahoma together. Oklahoma has to be the most successful college football program ever from a small state and they are nudging that title outright. They could easily do well in the PAC, unlike their rivals in Texas. But, Oklahoma knows that as a program they are a parasite and I mean that in a great way. As a top national brand they recruit heavily outside of Oklahoma. They are as viable as any program in Dallas and do very well in California. It's just that they are so tied to Dallas I just don't see them cutting the cord with Texas now that they are in the same conference. If they did I would see them in the PAC before they would go to the Big 10. Oklahomans like Texans still see themselves as more Southern than Northern and they like playing most of their schedule near home. In the end I just don't think Colorado does it for them like Texas and Nebraska, while it would be great, is just not enough to attract them North contrary to the wishes of most of their fan base. They would fear having Oklahoma State move to the SEC or PAC and draw better in one of those conferences than the Sooners could sustain while playing in the Big 10. And while I can see the appeal for most Big 10 folks to go annually to Florida for a game against the Seminoles and make a vacation out of it, I doubt that the Big 10 outside of Iowa, Nebraska and/or Kansas would travel well to Norman.

Understand that none of this even considers ESPN's wishes. Where would Texas do them the most good? If it attracted N.D. to ever join the ACC in full then they are more valuable there than in the Big 10 or PAC especially since ESPN owns much less of the rights to either of those entities. If the ACC needs a reason for economic parity then Texas again is more valuable in the ACC, along with close partners to give them a home flavor to their schedule and to appease the Texans back home. If ESPN is just looking for helmet games to max out the content then Texas is far more valuable in the SEC. I think there are many compelling reasons to place Texas in the ACC, but only two to place them in the SEC. In the SEC Texas can be reunited with Texas A&M, Arkansas, Missouri (not that big), and bring Oklahoma with them, and perhaps some more. The second reason is the content.

So SeaBlue I'm not ragging on the Big 10 (which I grew up with), I'm simply stating the truth about the situation.

ADDENDUM: For those who don't think that ESPN can hold Texas think about this. ESPN owes Texas 15 million dollars a year until the end of June 2031. I just don't see Texas, or any school were they to be in Texas's shoes, bypassing that for a move that would be risky at best, and unpopular no matter what.
(This post was last modified: 02-06-2014 11:03 PM by JRsec.)
02-06-2014 03:24 PM
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SeaBlue Offline
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Post: #40
RE: Realignment From an "It's Just Business" Perspective
(02-06-2014 01:54 PM)JRsec Wrote:  Sell it somewhere else Sea Blue.

I come here in peace to offer alternative paths of logic and truth.

Texas can be Texas wherever they want to be. That they could not be in the Big Ten is just message board back seat driving.

The risk they have with the Big Ten is if they are not successful, the plausible deniability factor is way down compared with the SEC.

What they can do is go to the ACC, or as suggested, form another conference where they can be half in, half out. As with Notre Dame they then can have the best of both worlds (and never have a chance to see their name towards the bottom of conference standings).
02-06-2014 03:27 PM
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