The Conference of Private Universities and Military Academies (CPUMA)

If college conference Armageddon occurs and the ACC and Big 12 are gobbled up by the PAC, B1G and SEC, and the College Football Playoffs either requires the participates to either be conferences championship game winners or favor such teams to an extent it would be practically impossible to get into the CFP unless you win your conference championship, then the private schools could form an East/West conference with the Military Academies and have a very nice conference.

Northwestern, Stanford, USC, and Vanderbilt are not included because I presume these four would stay in the B1G, PAC and SEC, respectively, due to their being in the three dominant conferences and wanting to maintain their present conference rivalries.

EAST
Army
Boston College
Duke
Miami
Navy
Notre Dame
Syracuse
Wake Forrest

WEST
Air Force
Baylor
BYU
Rice
SMU
TCU
Tulane
Tulsa

Each school would play 2 teams from the other division, one home, the other away, so that Air Force could play Army and Navy every year and every school would have the same number of conference games. With 2 divisions or 4 divisions, each school would have 9 conference games and 3 out of conference games. If one school is not included, say Duke goes to the SEC with UNC, there would be 15 schools that could be divided into 3 divisions of 5, and each school would have 8 conference games and 4 OOC games.

Duke and Wake Forrest could be enticed with permanent OOC games with UNC, NCS and UVA. The same could happen with Baylor and TCU with Texas and Texas A&M.

Notre Dame would not be happy with 3 OOC games, even with yearly trips to New York and North Carolina, biannual trips to Boston, Maryland and Miami, and frequent trips to Texas. However, if there are 3 divisions of 5 and 4 OOC games, ND could keep its California presence with USC and Stanford, could alternate Michigan State and Purdue, and still schedule another marque matchup every year and have a true national schedule.

The OP was edited by adding the following:

The CPUMA could go to 20 by adding Pitt and Temple, both of which are officially "public-related" universities under Pennsylvania law, which means that they get public funds to subsidize PA citizens getting in state tuition but they are still privately run. That is good enough for me since ND would probably like to play both schools. The Citadel and VMI are added so the militaries could have their own division and so Army would have a decent chance to win some conference games until they build their program back up. The military schools are football only and the rest are full members. VMI would need immediate facility upgrades.

Each school plays every team in their division each year, their permanent rivals every year that are in their same horizontal row, and another game each year from each of the other three divisions. That means 10 conference games per year.

NORTH EAST-------SOUTH--------------WEST-----------MILITARY
Boston College-----Tulsa----------------TCU-------------Air Force
Syracuse------------Duke----------------SMU------------Army
Notre Dame---------Miami---------------BYU------------Navy
Pittsburg------------Tulane---------------Rice------------The Citadel
Temple--------------Wake Forrest-------Baylor----------VMI

This conference make up would hinge on ND joining and presupposes the major conferences have gone to 20 schools, the ACC and Big 12 are no more, it becoming impossible to set an independant schedule because all of the other schools play so many conference games, and the new rules practically require schools be conference champions to get into the playoffs.

To get ND to join this conference instead of the B1G, which ND does not want to do, they get very special treatment. With the exception of the schools that are their permanent cross division rivals, when ND plays their away conference games ND can schedule any such game in any accommodating facility within 250 miles of the other schools' campus. That means ND can play Syracuse in New York City and Baylor in Dallas. Additionally, 1/2 of the tickets would be sold to the general public, a lot of which would be Notre Dame fans. ND must travel to Miami, BYU and Navy, unless they voluntarily work out a deal, in order to get these schools to join the conference. ND also gets to keep their home TV rights, but the ND conference away games belong to the CPUMA.

In a Conference Realignment Armageddon the large public schools likely would be the most sought after, so the above may make since for the private schools and military academies. Consider it an option.

(01-12-2014 12:35 PM)Lurker Above Wrote:  The Conference of Private Universities and Military Academies (CPUMA)

If college conference Armageddon occurs and the ACC and Big 12 are gobbled up by the PAC, B1G and SEC, and the College Football Playoffs either requires the participates to either be conferences championship game winners or favor such teams to an extent it would be practically impossible to get into the CFP unless you win your conference championship, then the private schools could form an East/West conference with the Military Academies and have a very nice conference.

Northwestern, Stanford, USC, and Vanderbilt are not included because I presume these four would stay in the B1G, PAC and SEC, respectively, due to their being in the three dominant conferences and wanting to maintain their present conference rivalries.

EAST
Army
Boston College
Duke
Miami
Navy
Notre Dame
Syracuse
Wake Forrest

WEST
Air Force
Baylor
BYU
Rice
SMU
TCU
Tulane
Tulsa

Too perfect. That group could last 100 yrs.

Never happen!

Not that much different from the Magnolia League

Wikipedia Link

(01-12-2014 01:09 PM)Wolfman Wrote:  Not that much different from the Magnolia League

Wikipedia Link

Agreed. I was just going to post that's basically the Magnolia League with northern and western flanks.

The mention of this brings up interesting pondering though. A Magnolia League today I would guess would consist of TCU, SMU, Rice, Tulane, Vandy, Wake Forest, Duke, Miami, Tulsa and Baylor?

wait, why combine the private research universities and what are essentially federal public colleges?

Looks like a great league. Academics look good.

This is great ... if you're the head of PUMA and want the naming rights to a college conference without having to pay for them.

(01-12-2014 01:05 PM)Wilkie01 Wrote:  Never happen!

Should the concussion issues or academic and criminal scandals convince some of the private schools to drop football, I could see Duke, Wake Forest, Boston College, Syracuse, Vanderbilt, Tulane, Rice, SMU and Tulsa to pair for basketball. Maybe even Miami could be convinced.

I think that's more likely than forming a lesser conference even if the ACC gets raided. If they lose the ACC, they probably drop football entirely.

The Patriot league has Army and Navy for all but football.
AAC has Navy for football and would like to add Army for football.
Patriot has Lehigh,Lafayette,Bucknell,Boston University,american,Colgate,Holy Cross,Loyola

The flawed premise here is that the ACC will ever go away. That's not going to happen. Moreover, if anyone thinks Syracuse, Duke, ND, or Miami would not end up in a major conferences doesn't really understand them. Also, you left out Pitt. Wake Forest and Baylor also have enough private money to compete anywhere they desire.


Also, Duke is no longer a "magnolia league" school as envisioned by Vandy's president. Duke is a Northern School located in NC, not a Southern School located in NC.

(01-12-2014 08:23 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  The flawed premise here is that the ACC will ever go away. That's not going to happen. Moreover, if anyone thinks Syracuse, Duke, ND, or Miami would not end up in a major conferences doesn't really understand them. Also, you left out Pitt. Wake Forest and Baylor also have enough private money to compete anywhere they desire.


Also, Duke is no longer a "magnolia league" school as envisioned by Vandy's president. Duke is a Northern School located in NC, not a Southern School located in NC.

Pitt is a state-related school. The Commonwealth of Pennsylvania provides operating subsidies and classifies the school as such. Temple and Penn State have very similar arrangements.

(01-12-2014 08:23 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  The flawed premise here is that the ACC will ever go away. That's not going to happen. Moreover, if anyone thinks Syracuse, Duke, ND, or Miami would not end up in a major conferences doesn't really understand them. Also, you left out Pitt. Wake Forest and Baylor also have enough private money to compete anywhere they desire.


Also, Duke is no longer a "magnolia league" school as envisioned by Vandy's president. Duke is a Northern School located in NC, not a Southern School located in NC.

The ACC may go away.

These schools may like this league, as long as they are in the top division and play their rivals.

Have you been following Miami? $1.5 million cap for their Head Football Coach? This might be what Miami's President wants.

Never said Duke was "Southern" In fact, my idea includes Northern schools.

With Baylor's new stadium, the advent of stipends across all sports, and the prospect of being left behind this probably looks pretty good to them.

(01-12-2014 08:50 PM)brista21 Wrote:  

(01-12-2014 08:23 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  The flawed premise here is that the ACC will ever go away. That's not going to happen. Moreover, if anyone thinks Syracuse, Duke, ND, or Miami would not end up in a major conferences doesn't really understand them. Also, you left out Pitt. Wake Forest and Baylor also have enough private money to compete anywhere they desire.


Also, Duke is no longer a "magnolia league" school as envisioned by Vandy's president. Duke is a Northern School located in NC, not a Southern School located in NC.

Pitt is a state-related school. The Commonwealth of Pennsylvania provides operating subsidies and classifies the school as such. Temple and Penn State have very similar arrangements.

Wake and Duke in-state students also get State of NC tax breaks and other perks, but as to the degree that PA supports Pitts, it's not much.

(01-12-2014 12:35 PM)Lurker Above Wrote:  The Conference of Private Universities and Military Academies (CPUMA)

If college conference Armageddon occurs and the ACC and Big 12 are gobbled up by the PAC, B1G and SEC, and the College Football Playoffs either requires the participates to either be conferences championship game winners or favor such teams to an extent it would be practically impossible to get into the CFP unless you win your conference championship, then the private schools could form an East/West conference with the Military Academies and have a very nice conference.

Northwestern, Stanford, USC, and Vanderbilt are not included because I presume these four would stay in the B1G, PAC and SEC, respectively, due to their being in the three dominant conferences and wanting to maintain their present conference rivalries.

EAST
Army
Boston College
Duke
Miami
Navy
Notre Dame
Syracuse
Wake Forrest

WEST
Air Force
Baylor
BYU
Rice
SMU
TCU
Tulane
Tulsa

Each school would play 2 teams from the other division, one home, the other away, so that Air Force could play Army and Navy every year and every school would have the same number of conference games. With 2 divisions or 4 divisions, each school would have 9 conference games and 3 out of conference games. If one school is not included, say Duke goes to the SEC with UNC, there would be 15 schools that could be divided into 3 divisions of 5, and each school would have 8 conference games and 4 OOC games.

Duke and Wake Forrest could be enticed with permanent OOC games with UNC, NCS and UVA. The same could happen with Baylor and TCU with Texas and Texas A&M.

Notre Dame would not be happy with 3 OOC games, even with yearly trips to New York and North Carolina, biannual trips to Boston, Maryland and Miami, and frequent trips to Texas. However, if there are 3 divisions of 5 and 4 OOC games, ND could keep its California presence with USC and Stanford, could alternate Michigan State and Purdue, and still schedule another marque matchup every year and have a true national schedule.

Why would anyone in a current P5 conference want to do this?

(01-13-2014 10:53 AM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  

(01-12-2014 08:50 PM)brista21 Wrote:  

(01-12-2014 08:23 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  The flawed premise here is that the ACC will ever go away. That's not going to happen. Moreover, if anyone thinks Syracuse, Duke, ND, or Miami would not end up in a major conferences doesn't really understand them. Also, you left out Pitt. Wake Forest and Baylor also have enough private money to compete anywhere they desire.


Also, Duke is no longer a "magnolia league" school as envisioned by Vandy's president. Duke is a Northern School located in NC, not a Southern School located in NC.

Pitt is a state-related school. The Commonwealth of Pennsylvania provides operating subsidies and classifies the school as such. Temple and Penn State have very similar arrangements.

Wake and Duke in-state students also get State of NC tax breaks and other perks, but as to the degree that PA supports Pitts, it's not much.

~7.5% of its annual operational budget (or $134 million in general support last year). The state's annual appropriations don't even cover the total in-state tuition discounts that Pitt gives out to its Pennsylvania students. Pitt is operationally independent, except being beholden to constant threats of more cuts to its annual allocations.

Thinking the "ACC may go away" is pretty LMFAO hillarious.

(01-12-2014 02:28 PM)brista21 Wrote:  

(01-12-2014 01:09 PM)Wolfman Wrote:  Not that much different from the Magnolia League

Wikipedia Link

Agreed. I was just going to post that's basically the Magnolia League with northern and western flanks.

The mention of this brings up interesting pondering though. A Magnolia League today I would guess would consist of TCU, SMU, Rice, Tulane, Vandy, Wake Forest, Duke, Miami, Tulsa and Baylor?

That League would be good. I would watch those games!

Agree with Orangefan. IMO, nobody in a P5 Conference would want this. The OP make his bias' pretty clear in this thread:

1. As a Boston College alum/fan, I think I can comfortably say that BC would have no interest whatsoever in such a restructuring. BC is very happy in the ACC. Why in God's name would they elect to change conferences so they would have less exposure and make less money??

2. The OP reveals his or her's biases when USC, Vanderbilt, and Stanford are conveniently left out of the proposed league as they are members of the "dominant conferences" and, "why would they want to change conferences." The BiG, SEC, and PAC12 are included in the so-called "dominant conferences." Really?? And the ACC is not on that level? Especially with the BiG??? I think this past bowl season shattered that myth!!

3. It appears that the OP labors under some kind of myth that none of these private schools have the means or desire to compete in conference with the large universities. IMO, that is nonsense. I can only speak for Boston College, but I am sure that my Syracuse, Miami, ND colleagues would agree with me here on this point.

4. Boston College is a wealthy school. Not only has it had competitive football and BB programs (basketball, IMO, will get on track after the AD makes the needed changes at season's end), it also has an elite college hockey program. College hockey is an expensive sport and BC fielding teams in all three sports is something that most larger universities don't undertake. Boston College also sponsors more varsity sports (31, I think) than most other colleges or universities.

5. Boston College is successfully competing in a P5 Conference. IMO, it is pure idiocy to suggest that it would seek to go a different route. Again, I am sure most Syracuse, ND, Miami and other private school alums/fans would have the same views.

(01-13-2014 12:58 PM)Eagle78 Wrote:  Agree with Orangefan. IMO, nobody in a P5 Conference would want this. The OP make his bias' pretty clear in this thread:

1. As a Boston College alum/fan, I think I can comfortably say that BC would have no interest whatsoever in such a restructuring. BC is very happy in the ACC. Why in God's name would they elect to change conferences so they would have less exposure and make less money??

2. The OP reveals his or her's biases when USC, Vanderbilt, and Stanford are conveniently left out of the proposed league as they are members of the "dominant conferences" and, "why would they want to change conferences." The BiG, SEC, and PAC12 are included in the so-called "dominant conferences." Really?? And the ACC is not on that level? Especially with the BiG??? I think this past bowl season shattered that myth!!

3. It appears that the OP labors under some kind of myth that none of these private schools have the means or desire to compete in conference with the large universities. IMO, that is nonsense. I can only speak for Boston College, but I am sure that my Syracuse, Miami, ND colleagues would agree with me here on this point.

4. Boston College is a wealthy school. Not only has it had competitive football and BB programs (basketball, IMO, will get on track after the AD makes the needed changes at season's end), it also has an elite college hockey program. College hockey is an expensive sport and BC fielding teams in all three sports is something that most larger universities don't undertake. Boston College also sponsors more varsity sports (31, I think) than most other colleges or universities.

5. Boston College is successfully competing in a P5 Conference. IMO, it is pure idiocy to suggest that it would seek to go a different route. Again, I am sure most Syracuse, ND, Miami and other private school alums/fans would have the same views.

I am making an assumption here but I assume the premise by the OP was that schools like UNV, UVa and Ga Tech and maybe Kansas will end up in Big10 and SEC will grab maybe NC State and Va Teh - maybe West Virginia along with the Texoma 4 headed to Pac so at that point, would it make sense for these private schools to add schools or form an expanded Magnolia League. It is clearly understood that no P5 school is going to leave the P5 league to form another conference unless that P5 conference no longer exists.

(01-13-2014 11:43 AM)orangefan Wrote:  Why would anyone in a current P5 conference want to do this?

Because when schools start paying the players, and the free market system starts to set the "salaries" for the top players, some of the private academic schools will decide it no longer makes financial sense to battle with Texas A&M and Ohio State?