When the guy is moved from a 3-star to a 2-star after he goes to a MAC school, that tells you all you need to know about the accuracy of star rankings.

All of you would be whistling a different tune if these verbal commits were on your schools board. To say that recruiting doesn't matter, well that's absurd on its face.

I recall when Toledo had really good teams. Good enough to lose a coach to Illinois. Every one was gushing over the 8 or 9 3 star recruits they brought in not so long ago.

I also wasn't even trying to make this about who actually signs. I really was impressed that the bulk of these kids are still with Western after the year we had. And I do realize that there is a month and a half left before signing day, blah blah blah...

(12-23-2013 10:30 AM)broncojohnny Wrote:  All of you would be whistling a different tune if these verbal commits were on your schools board. To say that recruiting doesn't matter, well that's absurd on its face.

I recall when Toledo had really good teams. Good enough to lose a coach to Illinois. Every one was gushing over the 8 or 9 3 star recruits they brought in not so long ago.

I also wasn't even trying to make this about who actually signs. I really was impressed that the bulk of these kids are still with Western after the year we had. And I do realize that there is a month and a half left before signing day, blah blah blah...

I'll be one to admit, PJ Fleck can recruit, it's obvious. He's one of the main reasons NIU got players Perez Ashford and Martel Moore.

However, many NIU fans and probably other MAC fans that their teams have had recent runs of success will say is that it is all about evaluation of your system and player development.

The list goes on and on of NIU guys overlooked that went on to illustrious careers. Considering two-star recruits have won the last 3 Vern Smith awards, a walk on won the one before that, and an overlooked Lefevour won the one before that, it goes to show.

Not to mention Eric Fisher, Khalil Mack, Larry English, etc.

Toledo has been touting their classes forever, and that's got them a bunch of MAC west runner-up spots.

I don't think BG had many highly regarded recruits either, but they run a good system for their players.

The two best defensive players in the conference this year each had very few offers (Mack only had 1) same for Lynch.

Would I be glad NIU was getting a bajillion 3 star recruits, yeah. But I'd also hope those guys were WRs and defensive backs. I'd rather recruit an overlooked dual threat QB that fits the system but give him excellent skill players.

As for lineman, I'd want exactly what NIU has recruited forever, guys that get spurned by the BigTen and late bloomers.

Recruiting is more of an art than a science, yet sites try and make it a science.

(12-23-2013 10:30 AM)broncojohnny Wrote:  All of you would be whistling a different tune if these verbal commits were on your schools board. To say that recruiting doesn't matter, well that's absurd on its face.

I recall when Toledo had really good teams. Good enough to lose a coach to Illinois. Every one was gushing over the 8 or 9 3 star recruits they brought in not so long ago.

I also wasn't even trying to make this about who actually signs. I really was impressed that the bulk of these kids are still with Western after the year we had. And I do realize that there is a month and a half left before signing day, blah blah blah...

Please point us to a poster who said recruiting doesn't matter. It's obvious it does. A lot.

It's recruiting ratings that don't matter because they have no proven meaning or credibility. People too often confuse the two, too.

(12-23-2013 10:43 AM)HuskieJWN Wrote:  

(12-23-2013 10:30 AM)broncojohnny Wrote:  All of you would be whistling a different tune if these verbal commits were on your schools board. To say that recruiting doesn't matter, well that's absurd on its face.

I recall when Toledo had really good teams. Good enough to lose a coach to Illinois. Every one was gushing over the 8 or 9 3 star recruits they brought in not so long ago.

I also wasn't even trying to make this about who actually signs. I really was impressed that the bulk of these kids are still with Western after the year we had. And I do realize that there is a month and a half left before signing day, blah blah blah...

I'll be one to admit, PJ Fleck can recruit, it's obvious. He's one of the main reasons NIU got players Perez Ashford and Martel Moore.

However, many NIU fans and probably other MAC fans that their teams have had recent runs of success will say is that it is all about evaluation of your system and player development.

The list goes on and on of NIU guys overlooked that went on to illustrious careers. Considering two-star recruits have won the last 3 Vern Smith awards, a walk on won the one before that, and an overlooked Lefevour won the one before that, it goes to show.

Not to mention Eric Fisher, Khalil Mack, Larry English, etc.

Toledo has been touting their classes forever, and that's got them a bunch of MAC west runner-up spots.

I don't think BG had many highly regarded recruits either, but they run a good system for their players.

The two best defensive players in the conference this year each had very few offers (Mack only had 1) same for Lynch.

Would I be glad NIU was getting a bajillion 3 star recruits, yeah. But I'd also hope those guys were WRs and defensive backs. I'd rather recruit an overlooked dual threat QB that fits the system but give him excellent skill players.

As for lineman, I'd want exactly what NIU has recruited forever, guys that get spurned by the BigTen and late bloomers.

Recruiting is more of an art than a science, yet sites try and make it a science.

Well, recruiting is a science, but it's one we don't understand very well. The sites try to act like we understand it better than we do.

(12-23-2013 10:30 AM)broncojohnny Wrote:  All of you would be whistling a different tune if these verbal commits were on your schools board. To say that recruiting doesn't matter, well that's absurd on its face.

I recall when Toledo had really good teams. Good enough to lose a coach to Illinois. Every one was gushing over the 8 or 9 3 star recruits they brought in not so long ago.

I also wasn't even trying to make this about who actually signs. I really was impressed that the bulk of these kids are still with Western after the year we had. And I do realize that there is a month and a half left before signing day, blah blah blah...

We'd be excited we got the verbal commits, though it doesn't mean that much when the BCS teams start trying to steal them before signing day. Still appears to be a good job by Fleck and I'm not surprised that he's good at recruiting.

Stars don't really matter...it's the offers that concern me. There are 4*s with no BCS offers, and there are 3*s with 20 BCS offers. Give me the 3* player 100 times out of 100. And recruiting does matter, yeah diamonds can be found in the rough, but they are very rare. Sustained high quality recruits will insure a competitive program through the inevitable coaching changes(such is life in the MAC).

(12-23-2013 10:43 AM)HuskieJWN Wrote:  

(12-23-2013 10:30 AM)broncojohnny Wrote:  All of you would be whistling a different tune if these verbal commits were on your schools board. To say that recruiting doesn't matter, well that's absurd on its face.

I recall when Toledo had really good teams. Good enough to lose a coach to Illinois. Every one was gushing over the 8 or 9 3 star recruits they brought in not so long ago.

I also wasn't even trying to make this about who actually signs. I really was impressed that the bulk of these kids are still with Western after the year we had. And I do realize that there is a month and a half left before signing day, blah blah blah...

I'll be one to admit, PJ Fleck can recruit, it's obvious. He's one of the main reasons NIU got players Perez Ashford and Martel Moore.

However, many NIU fans and probably other MAC fans that their teams have had recent runs of success will say is that it is all about evaluation of your system and player development.

The list goes on and on of NIU guys overlooked that went on to illustrious careers. Considering two-star recruits have won the last 3 Vern Smith awards, a walk on won the one before that, and an overlooked Lefevour won the one before that, it goes to show.

Not to mention Eric Fisher, Khalil Mack, Larry English, etc.

Toledo has been touting their classes forever, and that's got them a bunch of MAC west runner-up spots.

I don't think BG had many highly regarded recruits either, but they run a good system for their players.

The two best defensive players in the conference this year each had very few offers (Mack only had 1) same for Lynch.

Would I be glad NIU was getting a bajillion 3 star recruits, yeah. But I'd also hope those guys were WRs and defensive backs. I'd rather recruit an overlooked dual threat QB that fits the system but give him excellent skill players.

As for lineman, I'd want exactly what NIU has recruited forever, guys that get spurned by the BigTen and late bloomers.

Recruiting is more of an art than a science, yet sites try and make it a science.

Ummm...that's 3rd place in the MAC West the last couple years thankyouverymuch! But to be honest, with the classes we've had I do believe that if Pete Lembo were our coach with his staff, we would be making a better link between recruiting and results.

(12-18-2013 01:26 PM)RecoveringHillbilly Wrote:  Rivals is usually the least reliable, and often miss commits. Trust others

It truly depends on which school you follow and whether or not you have actual local people updating the affiliate sites, and who follow the program.

For Western Michigan, Rivals.com (Bronco Blitz) will be the most accurate as far as up to date commitments.

For Central Michigan, either Rivals.com (Chippewa Country) or Scout.com (Chippewas Insider) will be the most reliable and up to date.

For UMass, 247sports.com (Maroon Musket) will be the most reliable.

The list goes on...

I wouldn't rely on ESPN.com for any MAC schools.

(12-24-2013 02:13 AM)Campbell4President Wrote:  

(12-23-2013 10:43 AM)HuskieJWN Wrote:  

(12-23-2013 10:30 AM)broncojohnny Wrote:  All of you would be whistling a different tune if these verbal commits were on your schools board. To say that recruiting doesn't matter, well that's absurd on its face.

I recall when Toledo had really good teams. Good enough to lose a coach to Illinois. Every one was gushing over the 8 or 9 3 star recruits they brought in not so long ago.

I also wasn't even trying to make this about who actually signs. I really was impressed that the bulk of these kids are still with Western after the year we had. And I do realize that there is a month and a half left before signing day, blah blah blah...

I'll be one to admit, PJ Fleck can recruit, it's obvious. He's one of the main reasons NIU got players Perez Ashford and Martel Moore.

However, many NIU fans and probably other MAC fans that their teams have had recent runs of success will say is that it is all about evaluation of your system and player development.

The list goes on and on of NIU guys overlooked that went on to illustrious careers. Considering two-star recruits have won the last 3 Vern Smith awards, a walk on won the one before that, and an overlooked Lefevour won the one before that, it goes to show.

Not to mention Eric Fisher, Khalil Mack, Larry English, etc.

Toledo has been touting their classes forever, and that's got them a bunch of MAC west runner-up spots.

I don't think BG had many highly regarded recruits either, but they run a good system for their players.

The two best defensive players in the conference this year each had very few offers (Mack only had 1) same for Lynch.

Would I be glad NIU was getting a bajillion 3 star recruits, yeah. But I'd also hope those guys were WRs and defensive backs. I'd rather recruit an overlooked dual threat QB that fits the system but give him excellent skill players.

As for lineman, I'd want exactly what NIU has recruited forever, guys that get spurned by the BigTen and late bloomers.

Recruiting is more of an art than a science, yet sites try and make it a science.

Ummm...that's 3rd place in the MAC West the last couple years thankyouverymuch! But to be honest, with the classes we've had I do believe that if Pete Lembo were our coach with his staff, we would be making a better link between recruiting and results.

With a little bit better QB you might have been winning too. It doesn't take much, not a lot of difference between NIU, Ball State and Toledo lately.