A few points about BK:

1) I hated how he left. Could have been much more upfront about it. Shouldn’t have lied to the players. I understand why he left—it is Notre Dame and you don’t turn a job like that down. That being said, I think he was on the verge of creating something special here had he stayed.
2) I cringe when I hear the comments about him leaving the cupboard bare. I think he recruited some spectacular guys here—the only issue was the question of him leaving. We lost some recruits in 2009 because they thought he was going to leave and then the 2010 class basically was wiped out because he did leave (BCJ did a great job salvaging that class):

Here are just some of the names who came in under his watch:
John Hughes, Adrien Robinson, Drew Frey, Alex Hoffman, Sam Griffen, Armon Binns, Sean Hooey, Evan Davis, Camerron Cheatum, Derek Wolfe, George Winn, Dan Giordano, Dominique Battle, JK Shaffer, Travis Kelce, Brandon Mills, DJ Woods , Isaiah Pead

Sounds good huh… well I am not done yet:
Reuben Johnson, Austin Bujnoch, Dan Sprague, Andre Cureton, Jordan Stepp, Chris Williams, Blake Annen, Maalik Bomar, Eric Lefeld, Brad Harrah, Cameron Beard and Solomon Tentman

3) Kelly had the knack for moving guys from one position and making them productive players at another. The well-known examples are Connor Barwin (DE to TE) and Mardy Gilyard (DB to WR). A couple others that are rarely mentioned are John Hughes (LB to DL) and Jacob Ramsey (LB to RB).
4) I followed recruiting pretty closely and recall a number of 4-star guys who were just waiting on whether BK was going to stay or go. Yeah, I get that BK was not the type of guy who was chasing guys down like BJ was but had he stayed, a lot of those names would have signed on in wake of the 2009 season.

Regarding MD:

Agree with those who say he was never invested here. I remember being on the road listening to a Dan Hoard interview with him before we played Ohio State in 2006. I know I am nitpicking and this sounds petty, but I specifically recalled him using the term “we” on a couple occasions in regards to Ohio State. When he said I remember throwing my hands in the air questioning his loyalties.

MD recruited very well while he was here. Despite his subsequent success at MSU, I question whether he would have been able to guide this program to 10+ wins. In 2007 we would have rolled with Grutza (another guy you can chalk up to BK) and the pro style offense and would not have had the same success. We also then would not have gotten or even looked at most of the guys I mentioned above.

(12-09-2013 04:14 PM)Cataclysmo Wrote:  This really was the perfect setting for Brian Kelly. What the hell happened at ND is beyond me.

I briefly mentioned it in my last post, but I agree. Notre Dame is the kind of job most men can not turn down. The money, the prestige, the media hype, etc. That being said, as noted in the classic Robert Frost poem, taking the road less traveled can make all the difference.

Paul Daugherty has wrote on a couple occasions that BK did something that outsiders rarely are able to do in this town-- he got the place wrapped around his finger in less than three years. I don't want to go down the Brian Thomas road again, but with the right AD, we could have quickly gotten the money to build whatever stadium where ever we wanted if BK was still here. The recruiting would have continued to pick up.

At Notre Dame Brian Kelly has to mind his "P+Q's". The traditionalists won't let him throw the ball around like he did here. Things he said that Cincinnati fans found pleasing and rallied around are things he cannot say at the school in South Bend. He even had to part ways with some of his former assistants (both before and afterwards) in favor of some national guys that they wanted in place.

That said, BK had ND in the National Title last year (and did it because he beat some really good teams). I think he has not found the QB to bring his system to its best, but next year they could be really good.

(12-09-2013 04:51 PM)bearcatmark Wrote:  That said, BK had ND in the National Title last year (and did it because he beat some really good teams). I think he has not found the QB to bring his system to its best, but next year they could be really good.

Which is so surprising to me. I mean, he made Ben Mauk, Dustin Grutza, Tony Pike, and Collaros look like bonafide all-americans. It just seems weird that he can't find someone at Notre freaking Dame to do the same. Don't get me wrong, Golsen was good and all, but not THAT good.

I was pretty mad in how BK left. The announcement coming around the fball dinner was bad. However, I find myelf rooting for him two huge reasons - 1) his continued success adds legitimacy to what he accomplished here and 2) he treated this school/team as a major program/univ.

Dantonio leaving never bothered me, since he did not want to be here, left no one to coach the bowl, and tampered with players once he left. For these reasons I rarely root for him. I am thankful for him bringing in some great recruits.

Lyle was someone I loved listening to. He was so passionate and motivated. He also treated this is a place where he could build a program. He recruited well, created amenities for the players, ie nutrition center- system / player's lounge. I will give him credit for turning down some major jobs after year two. However, the Lyle Jones Interview Tour 2012 really soured me

(12-09-2013 01:26 PM)thebearcat Wrote:  im very confused by this thread. i didnt expect to get any votes in top 25. we got some and im pretty happy about that. 9-3 with basically no good wins and 2 bad losses probably isnt top 25 worthy

Just thought it was interesting who was still voting for UC ( Stoops and Meyer ) and those who did not (Strong and O'Leary ).

I probably would not have voted for UC. If the vote is based on what you did and who you beat and not just being a fan, there are 25 teams more deserving IMO.

Do I think the team is one of the best 25 teams in the land? Yep. But they played an awful schedule, lost to 2 bad teams, and failed to beat the one ranked opponent they played. That wouldn't warrant a ranking from me for teams not named UC so I have to be consistent.

(12-09-2013 04:51 PM)bearcatmark Wrote:  That said, BK had ND in the National Title last year (and did it because he beat some really good teams). I think he has not found the QB to bring his system to its best, but next year they could be really good.

Keep in mind that Manti Te'o and that Defense (full of Weis recruits) had ALOT to do with that season. Te'o had an unbelievable season that had him in contention for the Heisman. The highest point total in a game they gave up all season was 26 points, and that was an OT game. All the rest of their games they gave up 17 pts or less. They gave up 6 pts or less in 5 games. I'd say not a whole lot of that had to do with Kelly.

(12-09-2013 06:52 PM)Cat-Man Wrote:  

(12-09-2013 04:51 PM)bearcatmark Wrote:  That said, BK had ND in the National Title last year (and did it because he beat some really good teams). I think he has not found the QB to bring his system to its best, but next year they could be really good.

Keep in mind that Manti Te'o and that Defense (full of Weis recruits) had ALOT to do with that season. Te'o had an unbelievable season that had him in contention for the Heisman. The highest point total in a game they gave up all season was 26 points, and that was an OT game. All the rest of their games they gave up 17 pts or less. They gave up 6 pts or less in 5 games. I'd say not a whole lot of that had to do with Kelly.

Their defense was good again this year playing a lot of young guys. I still think Kelly will get nd to the playoffs a few times.

LOL @ Rutgers

Guess dropping 52 on them wasn't enough to convince them to show us some love in the polls

(12-09-2013 06:40 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  I probably would not have voted for UC. If the vote is based on what you did and who you beat and not just being a fan, there are 25 teams more deserving IMO.

Do I think the team is one of the best 25 teams in the land? Yep. But they played an awful schedule, lost to 2 bad teams, and failed to beat the one ranked opponent they played. That wouldn't warrant a ranking from me for teams not named UC so I have to be consistent.

Nailed it Rath I suppose you hate UC as much as BK or MD.