Any division that divides Tobacco Road 3-1 is not going to happen. Nobody at Wake is complaining about not facing VT every year regardless of how close they are. At best, the Hokies are fifth on our list of desirable opponents behind UNC, NC State, Duke, and Clemson.

(12-17-2013 09:27 AM)WakeForestRanger Wrote:  Any division that divides Tobacco Road 3-1 is not going to happen. Nobody at Wake is complaining about not facing VT every year regardless of how close they are. At best, the Hokies are fifth on our list of desirable opponents behind UNC, NC State, Duke, and Clemson.

I understand that perspective. You could swap State for Louisville and have

North: BC, Cuse, Pitt, Miami, VPI, NCSU, Wake

South: Louisville, UVa, UNC, Duke, Clemson, GT, FSU.

Protected matchups would keep the Textile Bowl, ensure Wake played UNC each year, FSU vs. Miami, UVa vs. VPI, give Cuse a game in Georgia each year and let Duke and BC, two smallish private schools in large metro areas, match up each year.

Wake --- UNC
NCSU --- Clemson
VPI --- UVa
Miami --- FSU
BC--- Duke
Pitt --- Louisville
Cuse --- GT

State would get UNC instead of us, and we would get Duke in that set up. But that would be ok and would actually be a better set up than what we have currently.

Trading Clemson for VT is pretty much a wash.
Trading FSU for Miami is a big plus. (Private school that is currently closer to our level of competition.)
Trading Louisville for Pitt is also a plus from our perspective. While we've only played one game total between the two of them, Pennsylvania is more important to Wake than Kentucky is.

I guess Heather Dinich isn't too up to date. In her December 13th ESPN ACC blog:
Tristan in Jacksonville, Florida writes: Is there any talk on division realignment when Louisville joins the conference?? I believe either Clemson, FSU, or Louisville should go to the coastal because until Miami gets better (which they will be, if they keep recruiting well) the coastal makes the ACC look very bad.

HD: No, Tristan, you can expect a fully-loaded Atlantic Division. ACC fans have been asking about division realignment for years now, and I've never been given any indication from the ACC that they're seriously considering it. That's not to say it won't ever happen, but as of right now, the ACC points to the "competitive balance" the current system has produced.

If we expect the ACC to radically change the divisions, then we are over-thinking how the ACC thinks... Honestly, when has the ACC done anything that was of an "shock-and-awe" nature? Outside of adding Syracuse and Pitt at the 23rd hour and adding Notre Dame for all-sports except FB, the ACC is as Plain Jane as they come. The ACC loves tradition and will try to keep the most rivalries as possible if they realign divisions. In other words, I wouldn't expect them to go "over-board".

Here's what I expect: UVA will have a new crossover opponent since it seems that they do not want to play Louisville annually. I expect Louisville to go to the Atlantic and become VT's crossover partner, while UVA and BC will become new crossover partners. I expect Pitt to stay in the Coastal because they seemed right at home there.

Therefore, IMO I believe the division will look like this:

ATLANTIC..........COASTAL
Florida State.......Miami
Clemson.............Georgia Tech
NC State.............North Carolina
Wake Forest........Duke
Louisville..............Virginia Tech
Boston College.....Virginia
Syracuse..............PITT

Now, if UVA does not want BC as their crossover opponent, then we could see more shifting. However, the key to all of this is how will FSU, Miami, Clemson and GT be divided since a North-South alignment will not do for the Virginia schools and GT in the Atlantic will not please Miami. Would FSU want to sacrifice its Clemson game for GT? I don't think they would. This is why I think the ACC will stay "basic" in realigning its divisions.

Georgia Tech (don't know if recently) has expressed some interest in swapping divisions with BC.

The problem is many for the ACC...

1). The conference really needs a north/south identity so fans can travel regionally. This has worked very well for the SEC. Divisions like "coastal" and "legends" do not mean anything to a college football fan...please just give us something that makes freakin' sense!
2). Balance of power would be south heavy (FSU, Clemson, Miami) initially. Folks need to remember not long ago that the SEC east was much stronger than the SEC west. With the north anchored by Louisville, Va Tech and PITT it will change over time. Stop trying to put Miami in the north with Syracuse. That's just absurd, unless you are trying to cripple the program forever.
3). Political forces trying to keep the tobacco road schools together. Really? For the compelling matchups every football season? The decision to not add West Virginia when you look at a map appears to be a significant misstep in hindsight.

Ultimately the ACC just needs to bite the bullet and create a north/south structure. Not easy, but it won't be artificially crafted to fit short term issues.

(12-17-2013 04:48 PM)LSUtah Wrote:  The problem is many for the ACC...

1). The conference really needs a north/south identity so fans can travel regionally. This has worked very well for the SEC. Divisions like "coastal" and "legends" do not mean anything to a college football fan...please just give us something that makes freakin' sense!
2). Balance of power would be south heavy (FSU, Clemson, Miami) initially. Folks need to remember not long ago that the SEC east was much stronger than the SEC west. With the north anchored by Louisville, Va Tech and PITT it will change over time. Stop trying to put Miami in the north with Syracuse. That's just absurd, unless you are trying to cripple the program forever.
3). Political forces trying to keep the tobacco road schools together. Really? For the compelling matchups every football season? The decision to not add West Virginia when you look at a map appears to be a significant misstep in hindsight.

Ultimately the ACC just needs to bite the bullet and create a north/south structure. Not easy, but it won't be artificially crafted to fit short term issues.

It's not too late to add WVU, they probably would take that invite quick...

Bring in WVU and ND as a full member then split the divisions north and south.

North
Boston College
Syracuse
Pitt
Notre Dame
Louisville
WVU
Virginia Tech
Virginia

South
Miami
FSU
Clemson
Georgia Tech
UNC
Wake Forest
Duke
NC State

It doesn't get any simpler than that with the N/S setup. The cross over games could be ND/GT, UofL/FSU, BC/UM, WVU/CU, UVa/UNC, Pitt/NCST, Cuse/WF. Again doesn't get any simpler than this, but only if Notre Dame signs on and voting WVU in to complete the North division. If not then it will look pretty much like it does now maybe with a little tweaking here and there on who plays who.

Just notice I left out Virginia Tech and Duke,but you get the picture for they would be the other cross over VT/Duke with my other suggestion in the above thread.

(12-17-2013 06:33 PM)BigOwensboroCard Wrote:  Bring in WVU and ND as a full member then split the divisions north and south.

North
Boston College
Syracuse
Pitt
Notre Dame
Louisville
WVU
Virginia Tech
Virginia

South
Miami
FSU
Clemson
Georgia Tech
UNC
Wake Forest
Duke
NC State

It doesn't get any simpler than that with the N/S setup. The cross over games could be ND/GT, UofL/FSU, BC/UM, WVU/CU, UVa/UNC, Pitt/NCST, Cuse/WF. Again doesn't get any simpler than this, but only if Notre Dame signs on and voting WVU in to complete the North division. If not then it will look pretty much like it does now maybe with a little tweaking here and there on who plays who.

That assumes we will ever join which isn't likely in my/our lifetime.

With thatinfo IMO .
The ACC should invite UConn and Cincy and just stop at 16.5.

Given a choice between the SEC and ACC, WVU would choose the SEC. But for the time being, WVU isn't going anywhere. Life is good in the B12.

(12-17-2013 06:55 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 06:33 PM)BigOwensboroCard Wrote:  Bring in WVU and ND as a full member then split the divisions north and south.

North
Boston College
Syracuse
Pitt
Notre Dame
Louisville
WVU
Virginia Tech
Virginia

South
Miami
FSU
Clemson
Georgia Tech
UNC
Wake Forest
Duke
NC State

It doesn't get any simpler than that with the N/S setup. The cross over games could be ND/GT, UofL/FSU, BC/UM, WVU/CU, UVa/UNC, Pitt/NCST, Cuse/WF. Again doesn't get any simpler than this, but only if Notre Dame signs on and voting WVU in to complete the North division. If not then it will look pretty much like it does now maybe with a little tweaking here and there on who plays who.

That assumes we will ever join which isn't likely in my/our lifetime.

With thatinfo IMO .
The ACC should invite UConn and Cincy and just stop at 16.5.

What is the source of the obsession over getting UConn into the ACC?

(12-17-2013 10:13 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 06:55 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 06:33 PM)BigOwensboroCard Wrote:  Bring in WVU and ND as a full member then split the divisions north and south.

North
Boston College
Syracuse
Pitt
Notre Dame
Louisville
WVU
Virginia Tech
Virginia

South
Miami
FSU
Clemson
Georgia Tech
UNC
Wake Forest
Duke
NC State

It doesn't get any simpler than that with the N/S setup. The cross over games could be ND/GT, UofL/FSU, BC/UM, WVU/CU, UVa/UNC, Pitt/NCST, Cuse/WF. Again doesn't get any simpler than this, but only if Notre Dame signs on and voting WVU in to complete the North division. If not then it will look pretty much like it does now maybe with a little tweaking here and there on who plays who.

That assumes we will ever join which isn't likely in my/our lifetime.

With thatinfo IMO .
The ACC should invite UConn and Cincy and just stop at 16.5.

What is the source of the obsession over getting UConn into the ACC?

I like UConn and think they belong in the ACC(IMO). Now if I had to choose who I would want as a "partner" it would be Cincy because of midwest roots.

The reason I mentioned both of them was to make it an even 16 for football.

(12-17-2013 11:21 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 10:13 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 06:55 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 06:33 PM)BigOwensboroCard Wrote:  Bring in WVU and ND as a full member then split the divisions north and south.

North
Boston College
Syracuse
Pitt
Notre Dame
Louisville
WVU
Virginia Tech
Virginia

South
Miami
FSU
Clemson
Georgia Tech
UNC
Wake Forest
Duke
NC State

It doesn't get any simpler than that with the N/S setup. The cross over games could be ND/GT, UofL/FSU, BC/UM, WVU/CU, UVa/UNC, Pitt/NCST, Cuse/WF. Again doesn't get any simpler than this, but only if Notre Dame signs on and voting WVU in to complete the North division. If not then it will look pretty much like it does now maybe with a little tweaking here and there on who plays who.

That assumes we will ever join which isn't likely in my/our lifetime.

With thatinfo IMO .
The ACC should invite UConn and Cincy and just stop at 16.5.

What is the source of the obsession over getting UConn into the ACC?

I like UConn and think they belong in the ACC(IMO). Now if I had to choose who I would want as a "partner" it would be Cincy because of midwest roots.

The reason I mentioned both of them was to make it an even 16 for football.

The real remaining ACC teams, UNC, Duke, NC State, Clemson, Wake, UVa, and to a lesser degree, Georgia Tech and Florida State, largely want nothing to do with the creeping mediocrity of the dissimilar Big East detritus that has become backfill for the conference. UVa does not belong in a division with Pitt, Syracuse, Louisville, Boston College or the rest of the Metro/Big East castaways. Sending VPISU and Wake to the North is the only logical solution that prevents the taint of Big East while minimizing travel. You can send State to the North and put Louisville in the South if you had too. The point being, Pitt, Louisville, Syracuse, BC, VPISU and Miami are qualitatively inferior in every respect to Duke, Carolina, and UVa and the new ACC sucks compared to the 9 team league that existed in 2002.

(12-18-2013 12:36 AM)Hoodoyoubelongto Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 11:21 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 10:13 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 06:55 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 06:33 PM)BigOwensboroCard Wrote:  Bring in WVU and ND as a full member then split the divisions north and south.

North
Boston College
Syracuse
Pitt
Notre Dame
Louisville
WVU
Virginia Tech
Virginia

South
Miami
FSU
Clemson
Georgia Tech
UNC
Wake Forest
Duke
NC State

It doesn't get any simpler than that with the N/S setup. The cross over games could be ND/GT, UofL/FSU, BC/UM, WVU/CU, UVa/UNC, Pitt/NCST, Cuse/WF. Again doesn't get any simpler than this, but only if Notre Dame signs on and voting WVU in to complete the North division. If not then it will look pretty much like it does now maybe with a little tweaking here and there on who plays who.

That assumes we will ever join which isn't likely in my/our lifetime.

With thatinfo IMO .
The ACC should invite UConn and Cincy and just stop at 16.5.

What is the source of the obsession over getting UConn into the ACC?

I like UConn and think they belong in the ACC(IMO). Now if I had to choose who I would want as a "partner" it would be Cincy because of midwest roots.

The reason I mentioned both of them was to make it an even 16 for football.

The real remaining ACC teams, UNC, Duke, NC State, Clemson, Wake, UVa, and to a lesser degree, Georgia Tech and Florida State, largely want nothing to do with the creeping mediocrity of the dissimilar Big East detritus that has become backfill for the conference. UVa does not belong in a division with Pitt, Syracuse, Louisville, Boston College or the rest of the Metro/Big East castaways. Sending VPISU and Wake to the North is the only logical solution that prevents the taint of Big East while minimizing travel. You can send State to the North and put Louisville in the South if you had too. The point being, Pitt, Louisville, Syracuse, BC, VPISU and Miami are qualitatively inferior in every respect to Duke, Carolina, and UVa and the new ACC sucks compared to the 9 team league that existed in 2002.

Exactly what is Virginia good at? At least Duke and UNC are very good at basketball, Duke is pretty good this year in football and UNC is pretty good. But its hard for me to figure out how you think that UVA is superior to any other school in the Acc. Every other school in the ACC is decent to good at one of the revenue sports. So who would Virginia be superior to since they are not good at any of the revenue sports?

(12-18-2013 12:36 AM)Hoodoyoubelongto Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 11:21 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 10:13 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 06:55 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 06:33 PM)BigOwensboroCard Wrote:  Bring in WVU and ND as a full member then split the divisions north and south.

North
Boston College
Syracuse
Pitt
Notre Dame
Louisville
WVU
Virginia Tech
Virginia

South
Miami
FSU
Clemson
Georgia Tech
UNC
Wake Forest
Duke
NC State

It doesn't get any simpler than that with the N/S setup. The cross over games could be ND/GT, UofL/FSU, BC/UM, WVU/CU, UVa/UNC, Pitt/NCST, Cuse/WF. Again doesn't get any simpler than this, but only if Notre Dame signs on and voting WVU in to complete the North division. If not then it will look pretty much like it does now maybe with a little tweaking here and there on who plays who.

That assumes we will ever join which isn't likely in my/our lifetime.

With thatinfo IMO .
The ACC should invite UConn and Cincy and just stop at 16.5.

What is the source of the obsession over getting UConn into the ACC?

I like UConn and think they belong in the ACC(IMO). Now if I had to choose who I would want as a "partner" it would be Cincy because of midwest roots.

The reason I mentioned both of them was to make it an even 16 for football.

The real remaining ACC teams, UNC, Duke, NC State, Clemson, Wake, UVa, and to a lesser degree, Georgia Tech and Florida State, largely want nothing to do with the creeping mediocrity of the dissimilar Big East detritus that has become backfill for the conference. UVa does not belong in a division with Pitt, Syracuse, Louisville, Boston College or the rest of the Metro/Big East castaways. Sending VPISU and Wake to the North is the only logical solution that prevents the taint of Big East while minimizing travel. You can send State to the North and put Louisville in the South if you had too. The point being, Pitt, Louisville, Syracuse, BC, VPISU and Miami are qualitatively inferior in every respect to Duke, Carolina, and UVa and the new ACC sucks compared to the 9 team league that existed in 2002.

I needed a chuckle.

(12-18-2013 12:36 AM)Hoodoyoubelongto Wrote:  The real remaining ACC teams, UNC, Duke, NC State, Clemson, Wake, UVa, and to a lesser degree, Georgia Tech and Florida State, largely want nothing to do with the creeping mediocrity of the dissimilar Big East detritus that has become backfill for the conference. UVa does not belong in a division with Pitt, Syracuse, Louisville, Boston College or the rest of the Metro/Big East castaways. Sending VPISU and Wake to the North is the only logical solution that prevents the taint of Big East while minimizing travel. You can send State to the North and put Louisville in the South if you had too. The point being, Pitt, Louisville, Syracuse, BC, VPISU and Miami are qualitatively inferior in every respect to Duke, Carolina, and UVa and the new ACC sucks compared to the 9 team league that existed in 2002.

Clemson doesn't want to have yearly games against UVA/UNC/Duke. They are typically horrible teams who don't travel, and in UVA and Duke's case their fans don't show up at home either.

(12-18-2013 12:59 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(12-18-2013 12:36 AM)Hoodoyoubelongto Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 11:21 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 10:13 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  

(12-17-2013 06:55 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  That assumes we will ever join which isn't likely in my/our lifetime.

With thatinfo IMO .
The ACC should invite UConn and Cincy and just stop at 16.5.

What is the source of the obsession over getting UConn into the ACC?

I like UConn and think they belong in the ACC(IMO). Now if I had to choose who I would want as a "partner" it would be Cincy because of midwest roots.

The reason I mentioned both of them was to make it an even 16 for football.

The real remaining ACC teams, UNC, Duke, NC State, Clemson, Wake, UVa, and to a lesser degree, Georgia Tech and Florida State, largely want nothing to do with the creeping mediocrity of the dissimilar Big East detritus that has become backfill for the conference. UVa does not belong in a division with Pitt, Syracuse, Louisville, Boston College or the rest of the Metro/Big East castaways. Sending VPISU and Wake to the North is the only logical solution that prevents the taint of Big East while minimizing travel. You can send State to the North and put Louisville in the South if you had too. The point being, Pitt, Louisville, Syracuse, BC, VPISU and Miami are qualitatively inferior in every respect to Duke, Carolina, and UVa and the new ACC sucks compared to the 9 team league that existed in 2002.

Exactly what is Virginia good at? At least Duke and UNC are very good at basketball, Duke is pretty good this year in football and UNC is pretty good. But its hard for me to figure out how you think that UVA is superior to any other school in the Acc. Every other school in the ACC is decent to good at one of the revenue sports. So who would Virginia be superior to since they are not good at any of the revenue sports?

The ACC has been trying to figure that out since 1954.