we have seen a lot in the past of conference realignment being driven by schools seeking conferences that they have a more cultural fit with. (syracuse to the acc, colorado to the pac, maryland to the b10)

im just wondering how byu baylor & tcu fit into this. all 3 are religiously affiliated schools with tremendous football history. i think you can make a case that throw BYU in with maybe smu in the b12 and we could see the b12 develop a religious-private school core similar to the ACCs private school core that might make the conference more attractive for BYU however.....

looking up BYU alumni & recruiting stats i noticed that despite the national reach that BYU has, they dont do as well in texas as one might expect.

so heres the hard question to ask...

would tcu/baylor/smu see BYU as an academic peer because they are a religiously affiliated school or would the issue of BYUs mormon affiliation make these schools even more distant than a regular private school/land grant

BYU in line to replace TAMU ahead of TCU. BYU's demands regarding TV rights caused the B12 to move on to TCU. If the B12 ever goes back to 12, BYU would be the obvious choice, along with Cincinnati.

just saying - and I dont mean to derail...

B12's current academic privates... aren't very academic... byu/smu are far ahead of tcu/bu

b12 does need to expand. i think going west is the best fit for them. BYU works, in theory. that opens up CSU/USU/Wyoming/etc if they wanted.

I don't see the big 12 adding another texas school. IF texas and ou ever left the big 12, than the pack of smu, tcu, baylor and byu would form a nice league. Throw in tulsa, rice and tulane, that's a good 7 team base of private school's to mix with whoever else is left out, i.e. houston, memphis, ucf, usf, colorado state, ok state, kan state…which makes a nice 14 team league.

BYU has been on the B12 radar since the beginig of the conference with some scenarios having BYU and Air Force as #s 11 & 12 before Texas politics forced them to take the two Texas teams the conference didn't want.

to take this thread on a new course.....

disregarding the b12 for a second (lets just say they got conference raided)

how well would a conference work if its consisting of BYU, smu, tcu, & baylor work?

maybe throw in colorado state houston or the privates rice & tulane.

given the state of texas's historical attitudes towards religion & religious tolerance would a BYU have an issue being in a texas geographically, religious culturally, based conference?

If you look up articles from the early 90's BYU was mentioned as a replacement for Arkansas in the SWC, but not as seriously as Tulane (who was actually a vote shy from being invited). BYU was also on the Pac 10's map with Colorado, more so than Utah.

*Don't forget BYU and New Mexico were considered for the original Big XII or Big XIV. So I think being a strong athletic program overrides the affiliation in most cases besides the Pac 12.

(12-03-2013 11:49 AM)esayem Wrote:  BYU was also on the Pac 10's map with Colorado, more so than Utah.

Sorry, but this is absolutely incorrect. BYU was never considered for the PAC because of religious affiliation, even though it clearly has a higher profile and fan following than the Utes. Fans maybe, but the PAC AD's & Presidents are simply never going to vote in a religiously affiliated program because of restricted research. That is why these hypotheticals of a Baylor to the PAC in a revised "Texoma package" are purely ridiculous.

(12-03-2013 02:18 PM)LSUtah Wrote:  

(12-03-2013 11:49 AM)esayem Wrote:  BYU was also on the Pac 10's map with Colorado, more so than Utah.

Sorry, but this is absolutely incorrect. BYU was never considered for the PAC because of religious affiliation, even though it clearly has a higher profile and fan following than the Utes. Fans maybe, but the PAC AD's & Presidents are simply never going to vote in a religiously affiliated program because of restricted research. That is why these hypotheticals of a Baylor to the PAC in a revised "Texoma package" are purely ridiculous.

I suppose it's theoretically possible now, because the current rules require only a 75% majority for an invitation, so someone could get an invitation with 3 schools voting no.

But to suggest that BYU was a possibility for the Pac before Scott became commissioner is silly, because the Pac at that time required a unanimous vote to issue an invitation to join the league.

(12-03-2013 10:59 AM)john01992 Wrote:  we have seen a lot in the past of conference realignment being driven by schools seeking conferences that they have a more cultural fit with. (syracuse to the acc, colorado to the pac, maryland to the b10)

im just wondering how byu baylor & tcu fit into this. all 3 are religiously affiliated schools with tremendous football history. i think you can make a case that throw BYU in with maybe smu in the b12 and we could see the b12 develop a religious-private school core similar to the ACCs private school core that might make the conference more attractive for BYU however.....

looking up BYU alumni & recruiting stats i noticed that despite the national reach that BYU has, they dont do as well in texas as one might expect.

so heres the hard question to ask...

would tcu/baylor/smu see BYU as an academic peer because they are a religiously affiliated school or would the issue of BYUs mormon affiliation make these schools even more distant than a regular private school/land grant

For me, its not religious affiliation but discrimination that I use to characterize the schools.

TCU doesn't discriminate in its non-theological hiring. Baylor and BYU do.

Baylor, Biola, Pepperdine, BYU, Oral Roberts, Bob Jones, Liberty, and Regent are peers.

TCU is a peer of Wake Forest, Notre Dame, etc.

As a member of a group ineligible to fully participate in non-theological life at Baylor or BYU, I'm obviously not going to feel that they are respected members of the academic or athletic community.

A school that bans Gays and non-Mormons from the vast majority (or all) of its non-theological hiring will never be a member of the PAC-12. So BYU is out.

As far as the Big XII goes, they already have 1 discriminatory school (Baylor), but they were admitted in a different era. I think that if BYU were seriously up for entry, that the LGBT groups at KU, and more especially UT would get very vocal.

(12-03-2013 11:49 AM)esayem Wrote:  If you look up articles from the early 90's BYU was mentioned as a replacement for Arkansas in the SWC, but not as seriously as Tulane (who was actually a vote shy from being invited). BYU was also on the Pac 10's map with Colorado, more so than Utah.

*Don't forget BYU and New Mexico were considered for the original Big XII or Big XIV. So I think being a strong athletic program overrides the affiliation in most cases besides the Pac 12.

Can you show where BYU was EVER on the Pac-12's map?

(12-03-2013 02:54 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  Can you show where BYU was EVER on the Pac-12's map?

http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.c...ug=1089051

From Seattle Times, 1990: "Colorado, Utah and Brigham Young were considered possible Pac-10 additions, although it's unlikely the league would take both Utah and BYU because their TV markets are almost identical."

Interesting the article predicts Utah having an easier chance about 20 years in the future.