The old AA.com has jumped on the 'EMU should move down' bandwagon.
http://www.mlive.com/opinion/ann-arbor/i...er_default

Weird how beating UM in baseball for 4 or 5 years in a row doesn't get a 'UM baseball should move down' editorial.

(12-02-2013 12:36 PM)masttg Wrote:  The old AA.com has jumped on the 'EMU should move down' bandwagon.
http://www.mlive.com/opinion/ann-arbor/i...er_default

Weird how beating UM in baseball for 4 or 5 years in a row doesn't get a 'UM baseball should move down' editorial.

This is a poorly researched editorial that completely fails to look at the big picture. This only supports the fact that the Ann Arbor News does not legitimately cover EMU (unless there is a tragic murder or some other event that will generate clicks and comments).

(12-02-2013 12:36 PM)masttg Wrote:  The old AA.com has jumped on the 'EMU should move down' bandwagon.
http://www.mlive.com/opinion/ann-arbor/i...er_default

Weird how beating UM in baseball for 4 or 5 years in a row doesn't get a 'UM baseball should move down' editorial.

Why that is a STUPID editorial.

It mentions 23% of 10.73M on FB or 2.5M as football costs.

EMU gets:

1). NETS > 1.0M per year in road game - home FB game guarantees. Not unusual for us to get say 1.5M / year from schools like PSU, Rutgers, etc.

2). EMU (and each MAC school, other than newbie, UMass) supposedly received between 8 -900K from the BCS (thanks! NIU) this year. For 2014 each MAC team could get the same amount through the college FB playoff payouts.

3). MAC is or has re-negotiated their contract with ESPN. I heard 1M / year / school in print. I'm not sure it is that high but still.

In short, these 3 revenue streams should equal the out-of-pocket costs for FB.

GLIAC probably gets 100K / team / school.

EITHER I or the Ann Arbor News are dead wrong.

IF my facts are right, the News is dead wrong. FB will pay for itself going forward.

If my facts are wrong, then the News can make their case.

Well, not to be a stick in the mud but... If EMU refuses to commit to being a real D-IA football program (and I mean real) they should consider moving to D-IAA or D-II. I'm no fan of the A2 Snews but I am also not a fan of my alma mater fielding a football team that continues to be an embarrassment not only in the MAC but also in the D-IA world. Maybe we lack the resources (both financially and facility) to be competitive. Maybe we lack a true sense of what it takes to be a competitive D-IA program. I don't know what the real answer is but I have always had the mindset of **** or get off the pot. At this point, I have to wonder if EMU could beat a Grand Valley State or a Saginaw Valley State.

We just fired our coach, Rob. If EMU wasn't serious about football, they would've kept English around.

Wow, that was a turd of an article. While I can't disagree with everything (our lack of competitiveness, attendance) the writer says, moving to D-II would be a signifcant blow to our more successful programs. The writer states that "84% of the athletic department is funded through the general fund," as an argument for moving down a division. I believe there was a study several years ago that showed that only a handful of programs do not use general fund dollars. While using tax payor dollars to fund athletic programs is an important argument for another day, using this logic is flawed.

(12-02-2013 01:06 PM)EagleSam Wrote:  We just fired our coach, Rob. If EMU wasn't serious about football, they would've kept English around.

Years of mediocrity say otherwise. He was fired because he behaved poorly. If he weren't fired his contract wasn't going to be renewed. Firing Ron English was not an indication that there is a real committment to winning at EMU.

My point is that EMU, and the other MAC schools, are now picking up big increases in revenues from BCS system (2012 and 2013)/College Football Playoffs 2014 and beyond + a supposed huge increase in rights fees from ESPN.

EMU now has the $ to be competitive thanks to the success of the MAC's good fortune.

The financial wellness of MAC FB programs has gotten much, much better in the last year or two.

(12-02-2013 01:08 PM)HuronRob Wrote:  

(12-02-2013 01:06 PM)EagleSam Wrote:  We just fired our coach, Rob. If EMU wasn't serious about football, they would've kept English around.

Years of mediocrity say otherwise. He was fired because he behaved poorly. If he weren't fired his contract wasn't going to be renewed. Firing Ron English was not an indication that there is a real committment to winning at EMU.

Then what would be an indication of "real commitment"? I'm curious.

Typical diatried from a news out let that thinks the state of Michigan revolves around UofM.

(12-02-2013 01:18 PM)EagleSam Wrote:  

(12-02-2013 01:08 PM)HuronRob Wrote:  

(12-02-2013 01:06 PM)EagleSam Wrote:  We just fired our coach, Rob. If EMU wasn't serious about football, they would've kept English around.

Years of mediocrity say otherwise. He was fired because he behaved poorly. If he weren't fired his contract wasn't going to be renewed. Firing Ron English was not an indication that there is a real committment to winning at EMU.

Then what would be an indication of "real commitment"? I'm curious.

How about hiring a successful lower level head football coach in the first place? Ron English had no head coaching experience. That's a start.

Do you know that one of our wins came against Howard? Do you know what Howard's record was this year? Howard finished the season 6-6. We beat Howard, a very mediocre D-IAA team, 34-24.

how do you explain our abyssmal record lo these many years? Just a string of bad luck?

(12-02-2013 01:33 PM)HuronRob Wrote:  

(12-02-2013 01:18 PM)EagleSam Wrote:  

(12-02-2013 01:08 PM)HuronRob Wrote:  

(12-02-2013 01:06 PM)EagleSam Wrote:  We just fired our coach, Rob. If EMU wasn't serious about football, they would've kept English around.

Years of mediocrity say otherwise. He was fired because he behaved poorly. If he weren't fired his contract wasn't going to be renewed. Firing Ron English was not an indication that there is a real committment to winning at EMU.

Then what would be an indication of "real commitment"? I'm curious.

how do you explain our abyssmal record lo these many years? Just a string of bad luck?

Why EMU and Kent (before 2012) had such bad fortune is hard to explain. Or Ohio until more recent years. Or even Buffalo before Turner Gill.

I have NO explanation.

Best I can say one day our day will come, but when who knows...

(12-02-2013 01:33 PM)HuronRob Wrote:  

(12-02-2013 01:18 PM)EagleSam Wrote:  

(12-02-2013 01:08 PM)HuronRob Wrote:  

(12-02-2013 01:06 PM)EagleSam Wrote:  We just fired our coach, Rob. If EMU wasn't serious about football, they would've kept English around.

Years of mediocrity say otherwise. He was fired because he behaved poorly. If he weren't fired his contract wasn't going to be renewed. Firing Ron English was not an indication that there is a real committment to winning at EMU.

Then what would be an indication of "real commitment"? I'm curious.

How about hiring a successful lower level head football coach in the first place? Ron English had no head coaching experience. That's a start.

Do you know that one of our wins came against Howard? Do you know what Howard's record was this year? Howard finished the season 6-6. We beat Howard, a very mediocre D-IAA team, 34-24.

how do you explain our abyssmal record lo these many years? Just a string of bad luck?

I don't disagree with your first paragraph at all. I'd hire Jim Collins today if I were Lyke. But I'm not.

Questioning results is one thing...questioning commitment is another. English was coach of the year two years ago. I had no problem with them giving him the final year of his contract to right the ship again. I would've fired him after the Army game, because it was evident then that it was all downhill from there.

I'm not happy with how the football team has performed, outside of one year (which was an anomaly). None of us are. But I won't say that our school and AD aren't committed to fielding a successful program. I'll let Lyke hire someone before I even begin to question her "commitment". But I'm right with you...hopefully it's someone with successful college coaching experience. I don't care what level.

(12-02-2013 01:49 PM)EagleSam Wrote:  

(12-02-2013 01:33 PM)HuronRob Wrote:  

(12-02-2013 01:18 PM)EagleSam Wrote:  

(12-02-2013 01:08 PM)HuronRob Wrote:  

(12-02-2013 01:06 PM)EagleSam Wrote:  We just fired our coach, Rob. If EMU wasn't serious about football, they would've kept English around.

Years of mediocrity say otherwise. He was fired because he behaved poorly. If he weren't fired his contract wasn't going to be renewed. Firing Ron English was not an indication that there is a real committment to winning at EMU.

Then what would be an indication of "real commitment"? I'm curious.

How about hiring a successful lower level head football coach in the first place? Ron English had no head coaching experience. That's a start.

Do you know that one of our wins came against Howard? Do you know what Howard's record was this year? Howard finished the season 6-6. We beat Howard, a very mediocre D-IAA team, 34-24.

how do you explain our abyssmal record lo these many years? Just a string of bad luck?

I don't disagree with your first paragraph at all. I'd hire Jim Collins today if I were Lyke. But I'm not.

Questioning results is one thing...questioning commitment is another. English was coach of the year two years ago. I had no problem with them giving him the final year of his contract to right the ship again. I would've fired him after the Army game, because it was evident then that it was all downhill from there.

I'm not happy with how the football team has performed, outside of one year (which was an anomaly). None of us are. But I won't say that our school and AD aren't committed to fielding a successful program. I'll let Lyke hire someone before I even begin to question her "commitment". But I'm right with you...hopefully it's someone with successful college coaching experience. I don't care what level.

Sam,

I'm not interested in arguing with you. This is an internet forum and, at the end of the day, doesn't mean jack. However, it has been asserted that past hiring practices were more interested in getting a coach of the correct racial profile than in hiring the best candidate for the job. That is what I am referring to when I mention that EMU has not been committed to fielding a D-IA football program. In addition, we have board of regent folk who think that Ron English should have been given more time, who also say that EMU will never be a good D-IA football program (Mr. Wilbanks). When you have those two things - hiring the right racial candidate and a person on the board of regents who backs that agenda - you are not committed to being a D-IA football program.

Finally, I am an alumnus. I am Green and White regardless of what happens. I do hope that Heather Lyke makes a good pick this time around. I'm not asking for a miracle. I'm asking for a good coach who can mold our football program into one of respect.

Rob

Fair enough. I wasn't arguing (or trying to argue) with you. Just talking about football. We are on the same wavelength by and large.

I hate that I can't argue with the article...how many embarrasing losing seasons does it take before enough is enough? I'm sure the MAC would love to toss us out and replace us with a team like Northern Iowa who fill up their stadium and is very competitive year in and year out. The attendance is the clincher for me, it is unacceptable at the DI level. The basketball program, while I think could be a sleeping giant at the MAC level, due to it's proximity to the fertile metro Detroit area, is dangerously close to having the same fate--due to lack of attendance.

It's stuff we all hate to hear but it is reality.

(12-02-2013 02:22 PM)Bob Wickersham Wrote:  I hate that I can't argue with the article...how many embarrasing losing seasons does it take before enough is enough? I'm sure the MAC would love to toss us out and replace us with a team like Northern Iowa who fill up their stadium and is very competitive year in and year out. The attendance is the clincher for me, it is unacceptable at the DI level. The basketball program, while I think could be a sleeping giant at the MAC level, due to it's proximity to the fertile metro Detroit area, is dangerously close to having the same fate--due to lack of attendance.

It's stuff we all hate to hear but it is reality.

BUT the reality is that one can't separate our FB from our entire athletic program.

We can not be D-II FB and D-I other sports.

Nor can we be FCS FB and say MAC in every other sport.

Would we have to drop FB and try to join the Horizon Conference?

Would we have to move down to D-II and does our hoops team have to play Walsh, Tiffin, Ohio Dominican, Malone, etc. (GLIAC).

Ditto our swimming, T&F, etc. etc.

EMU couldn't put enough outfield signs in Comerica Park to publicize EMU if we went D-II.

D-II is a grave yard for big universities.

P.S. Dr. Martin KNOWS the + effects of D-I athletics.

Here is something that I'm going to throw out there and lets see if anybody on this board can see what I see?


School Mens sports, Womens,Total sports, and Endowment(Millions)
Akron
8 10 18 $168
Ball State
6 12 18 $165
Bowling Green
6 11 17 $129
Buffalo
10 9 19 $512
Central Michigan
7 10 17 $81
Eastern Michigan
9 11 20 $50
Kent State
8 10 18 $109
Miami
7 10 17 $387
Northern Illinois
7 10 17 $51
Ohio
6 10 16 $408
Toledo
6 10 16 $310
Western Michigan
5 10 15 $207

(12-02-2013 05:34 PM)Ninkonpoopersnap Wrote:  Here is something that I'm going to throw out there and lets see if anybody on this board can see what I see?


School Mens Womens Total Endowment (Millions)
Akron 8 10 18 $168
Ball State 6 12 18 $165
Bowling Green 6 11 17 $129
Buffalo 10 9 19 $512
Central Michigan 7 10 17 $81
Eastern Michigan 9 11 20 $50
Kent State 8 10 18 $109
Miami 7 10 17 $387
Northern Illinois 7 10 17 $51
Ohio 6 10 16 $408
Toledo 6 10 16 $310
Western Michigan 5 10 15 $207

Wow... People lies, numbers don't lie..

Ninkonpoopersnap,

What are you reading into these numbers? It's tell me a short story..

(12-02-2013 05:48 PM)NUPudge Wrote:  

(12-02-2013 05:34 PM)Ninkonpoopersnap Wrote:  Here is something that I'm going to throw out there and lets see if anybody on this board can see what I see?


School Mens Womens Total Endowment (Millions)
Akron 8 10 18 $168
Ball State 6 12 18 $165
Bowling Green 6 11 17 $129
Buffalo 10 9 19 $512
Central Michigan 7 10 17 $81
Eastern Michigan 9 11 20 $50
Kent State 8 10 18 $109
Miami 7 10 17 $387
Northern Illinois 7 10 17 $51
Ohio 6 10 16 $408
Toledo 6 10 16 $310
Western Michigan 5 10 15 $207

Wow... People lies, numbers don't lie..

Ninkonpoopersnap,

What are you reading into these numbers? It's tell me a short story..

NUPudge:

It tells me one or two things (not analyzing the data above):

1). EMU has a reputation as a teacher's college. Teaching is not a profession to get rich. Public school teachers don't make six-figure gifts to their alma mater. It does take one or two Stephen Rosses (owner of the Miami Dolphins and UofM alum) to drop a nine-figure donation as he did for UofM. EMU would be happy with a few eight-figure donations.

2). IF EMU ever has an athletic success run like George Mason, Gonzaga, Butler, etc. (or Boise or NIU in FB) those $ will quickly multiple.

Bonus comment: Those data are now out-of-date. I believe EMU has completed a very successful fund raising campaign which will cause that 50M to go somewhere closer to 100M (I need help here. Anyone know better numbers?).