(12-03-2013 11:26 AM)mlb Wrote:  

(12-03-2013 11:23 AM)Crewdogz Wrote:  Oh yeah... how about tO$U scheduling that spring game down here? @sses

What about it? Ohio Stadium was unavailable and they had to go somewhere. UC could go schedule their spring game in Columbus since Nippert is unavailable the next 2 years. It sucks but Ohio State is the big dog... UC just has to fight its own battles and most of all the fans and alumni need to SUPPORT the school 100%. Unfortunately UC gets support from less than 25% of its alumni, IMO.

MLB;

i don't disagree that the alums and students should support UC at levels far greater than they are now, but realistically, fan support, imo, doesn't have a whole lot to do with the P5 membership. You look at the B12 where Tech and Baylor got in on the coat tails of local TX pols, Va. Tech was shoe horned into the ACC over Syracuse because of lobbying efforts by the VA Governor, as well as the clear signal that Maryland and Rutgers invites to the B10 send related to TV markets as a driving force for membership, Pitt/Cuse's shift to the ACC where they play football in cavernous but empty facilities and it shows that fan/student/alumni support, in the grand scheme of things, means very little. is it a positive when a school is getting considered? Sure, but it's surely not so heavily weighted that it would disqualify an applicant if they bring the right TV demographics or fill in whatever other boxes are being evaluated. IMHO, the lack of political patronage is what hurts UC the most when it comes to gaining momentum towards P5 membership.

What actually turned me off to Ohio State, a school that I rooted for as a child due to family ties along with UC, was a campus visit. I had been there many times for sporting events but the arrogance on the academic side was too much for me. It was like Miami University times ten in terms of snobbery towards other schools. I still follow them the same way I follow college sports in general but I have not rooted for them or purchased a single Buckeye item after my visit up there. Ohio needs some fairness in their statewide higher education system. Great schools like Cincinnati, Miami, and Ohio University get the shaft because Columbus continues to feed the monster that is Ohio State. Forget what political party they represent, we need a governor with ties to UC and the local Cincinnati community. I can't believe it, but I miss Bob Taft.

(12-03-2013 11:36 AM)eroc Wrote:  MLB;

i don't disagree that the alums and students should support UC at levels far greater than they are now, but realistically, fan support, imo, doesn't have a whole lot to do with the P5 membership. You look at the B12 where Tech and Baylor got in on the coat tails of local TX pols, Va. Tech was shoe horned into the ACC over Syracuse because of lobbying efforts by the VA Governor, as well as the clear signal that Maryland and Rutgers invites to the B10 send related to TV markets as a driving force for membership, Pitt/Cuse's shift to the ACC where they play football in cavernous but empty facilities and it shows that fan/student/alumni support, in the grand scheme of things, means very little. is it a positive when a school is getting considered? Sure, but it's surely not so heavily weighted that it would disqualify an applicant if they bring the right TV demographics or fill in whatever other boxes are being evaluated.

You are talking about schools that have been in the Big 12/SWC/Big 8 for decades. The same reason Purdue and Northwestern are in the Big 10. Oh, btw, since you bring up Tech, do you know what their average attendance is (just short of 60K)? VA Tech averages twice that of UC.

Market potential and fan support are all of the realignment talk.

(12-03-2013 11:42 AM)mlb Wrote:  

(12-03-2013 11:36 AM)eroc Wrote:  MLB;

i don't disagree that the alums and students should support UC at levels far greater than they are now, but realistically, fan support, imo, doesn't have a whole lot to do with the P5 membership. You look at the B12 where Tech and Baylor got in on the coat tails of local TX pols, Va. Tech was shoe horned into the ACC over Syracuse because of lobbying efforts by the VA Governor, as well as the clear signal that Maryland and Rutgers invites to the B10 send related to TV markets as a driving force for membership, Pitt/Cuse's shift to the ACC where they play football in cavernous but empty facilities and it shows that fan/student/alumni support, in the grand scheme of things, means very little. is it a positive when a school is getting considered? Sure, but it's surely not so heavily weighted that it would disqualify an applicant if they bring the right TV demographics or fill in whatever other boxes are being evaluated.

You are talking about schools that have been in the Big 12/SWC/Big 8 for decades. The same reason Purdue and Northwestern are in the Big 10. Oh, btw, since you bring up Tech, do you know what their average attendance is (just short of 60K)? VA Tech averages twice that of UC.

Market potential and fan support are all of the realignment talk.

Yes, Tech's fan support and market potential are why they got into the ACC. Those were the deciding factors over why they beat out Syracuse for the ACC bid. i apologize for the interruption. Please carry on with your streaming train of crazy.

(12-03-2013 12:00 PM)eroc Wrote:  Yes, Tech's fan support and market potential are why they got into the ACC. Those were the deciding factors over why they beat out Syracuse for the ACC bid. i apologize for the interruption. Please carry on with your streaming train of crazy.

Actually, I was discussing Texas Tech, no Va. Tech. I was also referring to them being in the same conference with Texas, Baylor, OU, OSU, etc., for decades. They weren't going anywhere unless their conference died.

As far as crazy, I'd like to know what I've said that is crazy.

Obviously politics got involved in the ACC expansion that allowed UC into the Big East, but it was not the University of Virginia themselves that pushed for VPI, it was the Virginia legislature. If UC wants to get the state legislature to push for that, good luck. Unfortunately UC has very little pull to force that. If UC was as valuable as we all want them to be then they would have been invited to the ACC or Big 12 already. Unfortunately UC isn't... while UC may be the most valuable asset to the AAC, it isn't enough to keep the money the same or better in either the ACC or Big 12. It is what it is... and until a money solution is found (or the Big 12 is forced to go to 12) UC is stuck, and it has zero to do with the Big 10.

For what it's worth I root for all Ohio teams except OSUCao$u (a Ohio state university @ Columbus) and Eggsaver U.

The Ohio University @ Athens (daughter is Alum), KSU, UT, MU, etc. except when they play UC.

I fondly remember being on a cruise when OSU was playing FL for NC. There was a big TV setup in a lounge. OSUC (Ohio State U @ Columbus) scored first and the OSUC Nuts were blowing. I told them I have to go to dinner but by the time I get back FL will be blowing you out. I got back and all the OSUC loud mouths were gone. LMAO.

This was posted on the AAC Board:

Quote:TV contract

According to SportsMediaWatch.com,

Between 10-16 million people have tuned into Baylor, TCU, Tech and Texas games this year. TCU is low at 10 million. Texas is high at 16 million. The 4-school average is 14M.

Compare

UCF 6.8M
UConn 6.8M
Navy 4.9M
SMU 3.4M
Temple 3.3M
USF 2.6M
Houston 2.6M
Cincy 2.6M

The Big 12 schools average about 3.5x the viewers that we do.

Yet they get paid 10x the money.

I think we'll have a good case to make for more $$$ whenever ESPN "looks in" or 5 years from now when we start to renegotiate.

I didn't realize just how bad it was this year (the schedule killed the ratings, IMO). It also shows how well the B12 schools draw compared to AAC. I know that this is apples vs oranges due to the power 5 label, but UC tied for last in the conference really hurts. This week should pull UC up significantly, but still not good overall.

http://csnbbs.com/thread-665171.html

Love Tymann's signature: "I'm wearing a UC shirt because I went to school there; you're wearing an Ohio State shirt because you went to Walmart."

Casey Anthony lives the dream

(12-03-2013 12:54 PM)mlb Wrote:  This was posted on the AAC Board:

Quote:TV contract

According to SportsMediaWatch.com,

Between 10-16 million people have tuned into Baylor, TCU, Tech and Texas games this year. TCU is low at 10 million. Texas is high at 16 million. The 4-school average is 14M.

Compare

UCF 6.8M
UConn 6.8M
Navy 4.9M
SMU 3.4M
Temple 3.3M
USF 2.6M
Houston 2.6M
Cincy 2.6M

The Big 12 schools average about 3.5x the viewers that we do.

Yet they get paid 10x the money.

I think we'll have a good case to make for more $$$ whenever ESPN "looks in" or 5 years from now when we start to renegotiate.

I didn't realize just how bad it was this year (the schedule killed the ratings, IMO). It also shows how well the B12 schools draw compared to AAC. I know that this is apples vs oranges due to the power 5 label, but UC tied for last in the conference really hurts. This week should pull UC up significantly, but still not good overall.

http://csnbbs.com/thread-665171.html

Much of that is about matchups, how well your opponent is playing etc.
UCF has Penn State and S. Carolina OOC, we had Purdue and Illinois.
Next year we get Hurricanes and Ohio State OOC. We did not draw UCF this year. Thursday night....I think the ratings will be pretty strong.

Playing your national games on ESPNU and ESPN News does not help. Nobody watches those networks. If you browse through the listings each week nobody draws a decent rating on those networks-- including P5 schools with good fan support.

More than matchups, much of that is the difference between playing in primetime on network TV and playing at noon on ESPN3.com.

(12-03-2013 01:08 PM)Bruce Monnin Wrote:  More than matchups, much of that is the difference between playing in primetime on network TV and playing at noon on ESPN3.com.

Yep that is true. Looks at UConn's #s this season, above UC.
Most of that is probably from the primetime Michigan game.
That was an ABC 8PM game.

(12-03-2013 12:42 PM)mlb Wrote:  [quote='eroc' pid='10116011' dateline='1386090006']
Yes, Tech's fan support and market potential are why they got into the ACC. Those were the deciding factors over why they beat out Syracuse for the ACC bid. i apologize for the interruption. Please carry on with your streaming train of crazy.

Quote:Actually, I was discussing Texas Tech, no Va. Tech. I was also referring to them being in the same conference with Texas, Baylor, OU, OSU, etc., for decades. They weren't going anywhere unless their conference died.

Sure, let's talk about Tech and the conference that they shared with OU/OSU for a grand total of six years or so (from 1915 - 1919/1925 respectively). i actually don't have anything to add about that set of relationships so i'll wait for your reply.

i will talk about TTech/Baylor/TX/TAMU vs. Rice/Houston/SMU/TCU, or the political haves vs. the political have nots. The political haves had power players in the state legislature and government in TX and were able to tether TX and TAMUs exit from the SWC to the B12 to Baylor and TTech's membership in the B12. This had nothing to do with markets for TV, fan support, loyalty/relationships or any of that. This a pure political power play and in the end Rice/Houston, SMU/TCU got left in the dust despite relationships that were 20 + years long.

Quote:As far as crazy, I'd like to know what I've said that is crazy.

Quote:ECU gets great fan support in a terrible market. UC is the exact opposite with the same outcome... terrible fan support in a good market. If UC got the support it should then you can damn well know that UC would be in a major conference. Instead the fans and alumni of UC continue this little brother crap and whine while not supporting the school.

Fan support means less and less in regards to realignment. TV markets are the answer. Look at what UC is doing. it's not adding that many more seats, but it is adding luxury boxes which, assuming they sell out, will be the bigger driver of revenue. if it was about getting significantly more butts in the seats, wouldn't they have sought out a solution that went in that direction?

Quote:Obviously politics got involved in the ACC expansion that allowed UC into the Big East, but it was not the University of Virginia themselves that pushed for VPI, it was the Virginia legislature. If UC wants to get the state legislature to push for that, good luck. Unfortunately UC has very little pull to force that. If UC was as valuable as we all want them to be then they would have been invited to the ACC or Big 12 already. Unfortunately UC isn't... while UC may be the most valuable asset to the AAC, it isn't enough to keep the money the same or better in either the ACC or Big 12. It is what it is... and until a money solution is found (or the Big 12 is forced to go to 12) UC is stuck, and it has zero to do with the Big 10.

The source i read stated that it was the Governor but whether it was the Governor or the legislature, their was significant political support that got the outcomes V.Tech wanted. But that's not the biggest take away:

Quote:but it was not the University of Virginia themselves that pushed for VPI,

UVA supported this move and you can rest assured that without UVAs support Tech stays in the B.East and therein lies the difference. Even if UC met every single requirement that the B10 would ask of a candidate, the $uckeyes would never support it, as stated by one E. Gordon Gee, whom i think would know a little something about the $uckeyes. i won't go so far as to say that they would attempt to politically subvert Cincinnati's candidacy but i actually take that back and i'm going to say that they would actively try and subvert Cincy's application should the Bearcats ever be considered....

(12-03-2013 01:20 PM)eroc Wrote:  Sure, let's talk about Tech and the conference that they shared OU/OSU for a grand total of six years or so (from 1915 - 1919/1925 respectively). i actually don't have anything to add about that set of relationships so i'll wait for your reply.

i will talk about TTech/Baylor/TX/TAMU vs. Rice/Houston/SMU/TCU, or the political haves vs. the political have nots. The political haves had power players in the state legislature and government in TX and were able to tether TX and TAMUs exit from the SWC to the B12 to Baylor and TTech's membership in the B12. This had nothing to do with markets for TV, fan support, loyalty/relationships or any of that. This a pure political power play and in the end Rice/Houston, SMU/TCU got left in the dust despite relationships that were 20 + years long.

Texas Tech was in the SWC from 1956 until the Big 12 came along, then moved on thanks to the political spectrum. Who cares? They had also outgrown every one of those other schools that didn't come along with them based on attendance... which probably means they had more political pull in the state thanks to their large fan base. I don't understand your point here... Tech was still the smartest move at the time based on the way TV was going in the mid 1990s.

Quote:Fan support means less and less in regards to realignment. TV markets are the answer. Look at what UC is doing. it's not adding that many more seats, but it is adding luxury boxes which, assuming they sell out, will be the bigger driver of revenue. if it was about getting significantly more butts in the seats, wouldn't they have sought out a solution that went in that direction?

UC is doing everything right... but they are still doing this while not selling out Nippert for every game. That being said, I'm not sure why you are arguing here. All of this goes back to people saying that OSU was trying to hurt UC while I said UC attendance is what hurts UC. There is zero evidence that OSU has done a thing to UC outside of the Big 10.

Quote:The source i read stated that it was the Governor but whether it was the Governor or the legislature, their was significant political support that got the outcomes V.Tech wanted. But that's not the biggest take away:

Quote:but it was not the University of Virginia themselves that pushed for VPI,

UVA supported this move and you can rest assured that without UVAs support Tech stays in the B.East and therein lies the difference. Even if UC met every single requirement that the B10 would ask of a candidate, the $uckeyes would never support it, as stated by one E. Gordon Gee, whom i think would know a little something about the $uckeyes. i won't go so far as to say that they would attempt to politically subvert Cincinnati's candidacy but i actually take that back and i'm going to say that they would actively try and subvert Cincy's application should the Bearcats ever be considered....

Ok... great. I've already stated several times throughout this threat "outside of the Big 10." We all know that not only would OSU not accept UC in the Big 10, their major donors and their fan base wouldn't either. Let's be honest, the money that would be added to the conference TV contract from UC is basically nil. They are already on basic cable in Cincinnati. The Big 10 added Rutgers and Maryland to get onto basic cable in those markets. Will it work? I'm sure it will in DC, not positive on NYC yet. I suspect it will in time, however. Those were potentially HUGE money additions to the Big 10. UC never had a shot to be truly considered by the Big 10. OSU didn't have to state it... neither did Penn State regarding Pitt. Neither brings money to the table. Rutgers and Maryland, for as awful as their sports are, are in the right geographic locations. This is not an Ohio State vs UC deal, which you obviously want to paint.

(12-03-2013 01:07 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Playing your national games on ESPNU and ESPN News does not help. Nobody watches those networks. If you browse through the listings each week nobody draws a decent rating on those networks-- including P5 schools with good fan support.

We've been on ESPN1/2 four times, though. I wonder what those specific ratings are?

Let me make this clear to some of you whom obviously think I'm some sort of traitor.

I'm a UCATS member.
I used to be a season ticket holder for football, had to give them up this season for personal reasons. I hope to be back in a year or two.
This season I will have attended 2 football games, my lowest since before I was a student at UC. I will attend at least 1 basketball game again, as I have every year since before I was a student.

I have not been to an Ohio State game since 2006. The only OSU game that I see myself attending will be next year when UC goes to Ohio Stadium and I take a company ticket. I will be decked out in UC gear and rooting on UC even though I know I'm going to be abused by their fanbase full of a-holes. In the mean time, my co-workers will defend me (I'm bringing one of them with me on Thursday night) and tell their fans to act with some class, just as the last time I went with him (an Ohio State vs Miami of Ohio game in which their fans abused Miami fans even though they were coming in to lose by 5 TDs). No, I wasn't wearing Miami gear, but he was sticking up for the Miami fans because he gets as pissed off at the Walmart OSU fans as the rest of us.

I give zero money to Ohio State, and every OSU garment I own was given to me by family. As I said before, I have a fair amount of OSU grads in my family as well.

Oh... and I'm wear a red UC football jersey at work today, and I'll be wearing UC gear every day this week to support MY SCHOOL.

Just because I'm not a homer about UC doesn't mean I'm not just as big of a fan of UC as anyone else. I've given a LOT of money over the years to UC, followed them to bowl games, away football games, away basketball games, and NCAA tournament games (I've never done any of that for any other school). I kept 4 season tickets when I only had 2 people to go to every game because I always used the extra 2 to try and recruit new fans to the program. I brought along an OSU graduate to the Papa John's.com Bowl to try and keep getting out the word on how good UC football is.

Don't sit here and act like those of us who root for OSU when not playing UC are hurting the program, because as long as we are doing our part for UC we aren't. If you want to complain about those whom do not attend any games or donate to the school but instead root for OSU then fine. Don't attack me or Banter because our childhood allegiances die hard. I am forever a part of UC and will always root for UC and attend their events. I will never root for another school over UC.

(12-03-2013 01:45 PM)mlb Wrote:  Let me make this clear to some of you whom obviously think I'm some sort of traitor.

I'm a UCATS member.
I used to be a season ticket holder for football, had to give them up this season for personal reasons. I hope to be back in a year or two.
This season I will have attended 2 football games, my lowest since before I was a student at UC. I will attend at least 1 basketball game again, as I have every year since before I was a student.

I have not been to an Ohio State game since 2006. The only OSU game that I see myself attending will be next year when UC goes to Ohio Stadium and I take a company ticket. I will be decked out in UC gear and rooting on UC even though I know I'm going to be abused by their fanbase full of a-holes. In the mean time, my co-workers will defend me (I'm bringing one of them with me on Thursday night) and tell their fans to act with some class, just as the last time I went with him (an Ohio State vs Miami of Ohio game in which their fans abused Miami fans even though they were coming in to lose by 5 TDs). No, I wasn't wearing Miami gear, but he was sticking up for the Miami fans because he gets as pissed off at the Walmart OSU fans as the rest of us.

I give zero money to Ohio State, and every OSU garment I own was given to me by family. As I said before, I have a fair amount of OSU grads in my family as well.

Oh... and I'm wear a red UC football jersey at work today, and I'll be wearing UC gear every day this week to support MY SCHOOL.

Just because I'm not a homer about UC doesn't mean I'm not just as big of a fan of UC as anyone else. I've given a LOT of money over the years to UC, followed them to bowl games, away football games, away basketball games, and NCAA tournament games (I've never done any of that for any other school). I kept 4 season tickets when I only had 2 people to go to every game because I always used the extra 2 to try and recruit new fans to the program. I brought along an OSU graduate to the Papa John's.com Bowl to try and keep getting out the word on how good UC football is.

Don't sit here and act like those of us who root for OSU when not playing UC are hurting the program, because as long as we are doing our part for UC we aren't. If you want to complain about those whom do not attend any games or donate to the school but instead root for OSU then fine. Don't attack me or Banter because our childhood allegiances die hard. I am forever a part of UC and will always root for UC and attend their events. I will never root for another school over UC.

That is what trash bags are for.

(12-03-2013 01:49 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  That is what trash bags are for.

(12-03-2013 01:53 PM)mlb Wrote:  

(12-03-2013 01:49 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  That is what trash bags are for.