(02-06-2015 02:12 PM)Middle Ages Wrote: It's obviously his decision, but I don't like it. I wonder what job he got that wouldn't be there in December? Maybe there was more to it.
To answer someone's question- I suspect the reason the kids aren't on 5-year graduation plans anymore is because of the summer school every year. That's 12 hours that 20 years ago would have been in the 5th year. I doubt many of them are taking more than 12 to maybe 15 hours a semester. I would agree that red-shirting creates a risk that it didn't used to.
(02-06-2015 02:12 PM)Middle Ages Wrote: It's obviously his decision, but I don't like it. I wonder what job he got that wouldn't be there in December? Maybe there was more to it.
To answer someone's question- I suspect the reason the kids aren't on 5-year graduation plans anymore is because of the summer school every year. That's 12 hours that 20 years ago would have been in the 5th year. I doubt many of them are taking more than 12 to maybe 15 hours a semester. I would agree that red-shirting creates a risk that it didn't used to.
(02-06-2015 05:02 PM)mbrindley Wrote: I can't fault Nordstrom for leaving for a job that pays 6 figures. Seems it only validates Bailiff's recruiting pitch which is great for our future.
Joseph Duarte @Chronicle_Owls 3m3 minutes ago
Rice DE Brian Nordstrom will serve as a project engineer at a Houston oil and gas company; job pays six figures. “More than I expected."
I agree that this makes for a heckuva great recruiting pitch for any Rice Head Coach, especially football and basketball vs all other G5 offers, and most P5 offers even. Unless the kid is a dummy and only 'going to the NFL" like thousands of others every year do (yeah, right) and in which case, Rice wouldn't be recruiting them anyway due to poor grades.
But for the smart kids who can really play, this kind of info should be front and center in any recruiting discussions vs P5 schools (go to Alabama and graduate in five years to being a security guard if you don't make the NFL, or come to Rice and graduate in four to a six-figure a year starting salary. Your choice. Oh, by the way, Rice happens to be 3-0 all time in football games against those losers from Alabama, just though you'd want to know!
(02-06-2015 06:11 PM)greyowl72 Wrote: 90+% of our athletes are at Rice for the education and the job market. That's what we want as a University and what we want as an Athletic Department. Some of them (in football or the other "major" sports) will fit in a fifth year of sports.
They are at Rice to play ball too. It is rare for an all-conference player who does not have a serious injury and is not entering the draft to skip his last season.
(02-06-2015 10:46 AM)OldOwl Wrote: Excellent news about Nordstrom. Wish him all the success. I am confused. Do we want student athletes or jocks? At least he want not being kicked out because he was beating up on his girlfriend :). It is pretty sad if our depth is so poor that he cannot be replaced. Remember, Nordstrom just blossomed this year. No reason we cannot find someone to replace him just as good. If not, the whole football program is suspect.
(02-05-2015 11:17 PM)mrbig Wrote: I am with you in being much more worried about 2015 than I was this morning. Still talent on the d-line, but the talent has less experience and less depth without Nordstrom. Wonder if the person making him the job offer is a UT, LaTech, Marshall, or WKU alum.
Nordstrom "just developed this year" because this was the first year he was given an opportunity to see significant playing time.
I have been saying that DB philosophy would catch up. Great example here by Nordstrom. As a parent why would I encourage my kid to come back and play when you have no aspiration to go the NFL and you have been riding the pine for three years and you finally get a chance and prove yourself. Do it for the coaches, give up the annual salary for the same staff that did not play you all these years. It does not work that way. You get your education, you played well and take some good memories with you....you just move on.
Guy Billups is not coming back either and would not be surprised if D Brown does not come back.
(02-06-2015 06:11 PM)greyowl72 Wrote: 90+% of our athletes are at Rice for the education and the job market. That's what we want as a University and what we want as an Athletic Department. Some of them (in football or the other "major" sports) will fit in a fifth year of sports.
They are at Rice to play ball too. It is rare for an all-conference player who does not have a serious injury and is not entering the draft to skip his last season.
I agree totally. However, there will, inevitably, be times when the student-athlete faces a tough decision like Nordstrom did. Most of us completely understand why he chose to take the job opportunity. The UT, Alabama, etc boards might be a lot tougher on that type of decision. It seems that this board is more accepting because... Well, we're Rice.
(02-06-2015 10:46 AM)OldOwl Wrote: Excellent news about Nordstrom. Wish him all the success. I am confused. Do we want student athletes or jocks? At least he want not being kicked out because he was beating up on his girlfriend :). It is pretty sad if our depth is so poor that he cannot be replaced. Remember, Nordstrom just blossomed this year. No reason we cannot find someone to replace him just as good. If not, the whole football program is suspect.
(02-05-2015 11:17 PM)mrbig Wrote: I am with you in being much more worried about 2015 than I was this morning. Still talent on the d-line, but the talent has less experience and less depth without Nordstrom. Wonder if the person making him the job offer is a UT, LaTech, Marshall, or WKU alum.
Nordstrom "just developed this year" because this was the first year he was given an opportunity to see significant playing time.
I have been saying that DB philosophy would catch up. Great example here by Nordstrom. As a parent why would I encourage my kid to come back and play when you have no aspiration to go the NFL and you have been riding the pine for three years and you finally get a chance and prove yourself. Do it for the coaches, give up the annual salary for the same staff that did not play you all these years. It does not work that way. You get your education, you played well and take some good memories with you....you just move on.
Guy Billups is not coming back either and would not be surprised if D Brown does not come back.
He was a walk on who worked hard and developed into a good player. I don't see how getting a 6 figure job and leaving is any different than being on an nfl practice squad after going to the draft. Like someone said on here it's actually BETTER recruiting material for bailiff. Not to rag on billups but why try to prove your point with a guy who has fallen to 4th on the depth chart at QB... At least he is graduating with a free rice education.
i have no problem with players making decisions for their benefit and reasons, whether they are a 17 YO HS senior deciding on where he will play football or a 22 YO RS SR deciding to take a great job rather than come back for a another season.
as for riding the pine for three seasons, I refer everybody to the stats I posted earlier.
(This post was last modified: 02-08-2015 11:09 PM by OptimisticOwl.)
Don't try to pin this on Bailiff, geez. Nordstrom had better guys playing in front of him early in his career, he was originally an undersized walk-on, yet I saw him play plenty as a soph and he started as a junior. Like others have said, if anything, here's an example of DB doing a great job developing a walk on into an all conference type of player, and doing a good job of graduating his players and putting them in position to succeed on and off the field.
(02-08-2015 01:43 PM)Buho00 Wrote: Don't try to pin this on Bailiff, geez. Nordstrom had better guys playing in front of him early in his career, he was originally an undersized walk-on, yet I saw him play plenty as a soph and he started as a junior. Like others have said, if anything, here's an example of DB doing a great job developing a walk on into an all conference type of player, and doing a good job of graduating his players and putting them in position to succeed on and off the field.
Don't see how this can be a negative for DB. Sounds like he has a killer job offer (6 figs out of college with 50 dollar Oil ) and decided to take it.
Good for him and I wish him the absolute best going forward.
(02-08-2015 01:43 PM)Buho00 Wrote: Don't try to pin this on Bailiff, geez. Nordstrom had better guys playing in front of him early in his career, he was originally an undersized walk-on, yet I saw him play plenty as a soph and he started as a junior. Like others have said, if anything, here's an example of DB doing a great job developing a walk on into an all conference type of player, and doing a good job of graduating his players and putting them in position to succeed on andoff the field.
I agree. The underlined is the part that most of the "big" college coaches fall way short on. It is what makes Rice different than any other school, and I am happy with Bailiff's graduation successes. Patterson (of new EZF fame) comes to mind. Rice needs more of those, not less. Wish Nordstrom et. al. well.
Though I am very hard on Bailiff, this is a good thing for him to be doing. Getting their Rice degree and graduating to a successful starting job in a real career is fine by me. No complaints there. Thing Bailiff needs to keep up with is depth, depth, depth and consistently raising his development even higher than it is. After 8 years, that should not be the issue for him like when he started.
Besides, it opens up spots for new players to play, and that's one thing they want, right?
(02-06-2015 10:46 AM)OldOwl Wrote: Excellent news about Nordstrom. Wish him all the success. I am confused. Do we want student athletes or jocks? At least he want not being kicked out because he was beating up on his girlfriend :). It is pretty sad if our depth is so poor that he cannot be replaced. Remember, Nordstrom just blossomed this year. No reason we cannot find someone to replace him just as good. If not, the whole football program is suspect.
(02-05-2015 11:17 PM)mrbig Wrote: I am with you in being much more worried about 2015 than I was this morning. Still talent on the d-line, but the talent has less experience and less depth without Nordstrom. Wonder if the person making him the job offer is a UT, LaTech, Marshall, or WKU alum.
Nordstrom "just developed this year" because this was the first year he was given an opportunity to see significant playing time.
I have been saying that DB philosophy would catch up. Great example here by Nordstrom. As a parent why would I encourage my kid to come back and play when you have no aspiration to go the NFL and you have been riding the pine for three years and you finally get a chance and prove yourself. Do it for the coaches, give up the annual salary for the same staff that did not play you all these years. It does not work that way. You get your education, you played well and take some good memories with you....you just move on.
Guy Billups is not coming back either and would not be surprised if D Brown does not come back.
I'm not really sure I'm reading that statement as supportive or not for Bailiff, but make no mistake, redshirting is a GIFT to these football players....just ask any of them. Nordstrom had an amazing year: he also had many opportunities LAST year to be amazing, he was on the field ALOT. He happens to be an unusually smart guy, that is all. Honestly, he could play next year and this same job (or one just like it) would still be waiting for him. Also, if he has another year like 2014, he has a real chance at the NFL. But for whatever reason he has decided to forgo his eligibility and jump into the workforce. I have no doubt he will regret that decision very soon: for gosh sakes, he has the rest of his life to work!!! There will be an able bodied player stepping into his position and hopefully making the most of it, no doubt. Guy Billups is not coming back because he's not going to see the field. D Brown made his own mistakes, actually he'd be a fool not to come back. Rice athletes generally have more choices than your average athlete. Bailiff gives them every opportunity to succeed, and not just on the playing field.
(02-06-2015 10:46 AM)OldOwl Wrote: Excellent news about Nordstrom. Wish him all the success. I am confused. Do we want student athletes or jocks? At least he want not being kicked out because he was beating up on his girlfriend :). It is pretty sad if our depth is so poor that he cannot be replaced. Remember, Nordstrom just blossomed this year. No reason we cannot find someone to replace him just as good. If not, the whole football program is suspect.
(02-05-2015 11:17 PM)mrbig Wrote: I am with you in being much more worried about 2015 than I was this morning. Still talent on the d-line, but the talent has less experience and less depth without Nordstrom. Wonder if the person making him the job offer is a UT, LaTech, Marshall, or WKU alum.
Nordstrom "just developed this year" because this was the first year he was given an opportunity to see significant playing time.
I have been saying that DB philosophy would catch up. Great example here by Nordstrom. As a parent why would I encourage my kid to come back and play when you have no aspiration to go the NFL and you have been riding the pine for three years and you finally get a chance and prove yourself. Do it for the coaches, give up the annual salary for the same staff that did not play you all these years. It does not work that way. You get your education, you played well and take some good memories with you....you just move on.
Guy Billups is not coming back either and would not be surprised if D Brown does not come back.
I'm not really sure I'm reading that statement as supportive or not for Bailiff, but make no mistake, redshirting is a GIFT to these football players....just ask any of them. Nordstrom had an amazing year: he also had many opportunities LAST year to be amazing, he was on the field ALOT. He happens to be an unusually smart guy, that is all. Honestly, he could play next year and this same job (or one just like it) would still be waiting for him. Also, if he has another year like 2014, he has a real chance at the NFL. But for whatever reason he has decided to forgo his eligibility and jump into the workforce. I have no doubt he will regret that decision very soon: for gosh sakes, he has the rest of his life to work!!! There will be an able bodied player stepping into his position and hopefully making the most of it, no doubt. Guy Billups is not coming back because he's not going to see the field. D Brown made his own mistakes, actually he'd be a fool not to come back. Rice athletes generally have more choices than your average athlete. Bailiff gives them every opportunity to succeed, and not just on the playing field.
You lost me on Rice athletes having more choices than the average athlete. Don't see it. Besides the degree being good, I actually think that once they commit their choices are limited. What kid would have the guts to tell their parents that they're leaving Rice. You can leave Baylor, TCU, A&M but our athletes seem to have fewer choices.
I see it differently.
(02-08-2015 11:16 PM)SaintsOwl Wrote: You lost me on Rice athletes having more choices than the average athlete. Don't see it. Besides the degree being good, I actually think that once they commit their choices are limited. What kid would have the guts to tell their parents that they're leaving Rice. You can leave Baylor, TCU, A&M but our athletes seem to have fewer choices.
I see it differently.
This is a very strange statement considering how many basketball players have left the program in recent years.
(02-08-2015 11:16 PM)SaintsOwl Wrote: You lost me on Rice athletes having more choices than the average athlete. Don't see it. Besides the degree being good, I actually think that once they commit their choices are limited. What kid would have the guts to tell their parents that they're leaving Rice. You can leave Baylor, TCU, A&M but our athletes seem to have fewer choices.
I see it differently.
This is a very strange statement considering how many basketball players have left the program in recent years.
(02-06-2015 10:46 AM)OldOwl Wrote: Excellent news about Nordstrom. Wish him all the success. I am confused. Do we want student athletes or jocks? At least he want not being kicked out because he was beating up on his girlfriend :). It is pretty sad if our depth is so poor that he cannot be replaced. Remember, Nordstrom just blossomed this year. No reason we cannot find someone to replace him just as good. If not, the whole football program is suspect.
Nordstrom "just developed this year" because this was the first year he was given an opportunity to see significant playing time.
I have been saying that DB philosophy would catch up. Great example here by Nordstrom. As a parent why would I encourage my kid to come back and play when you have no aspiration to go the NFL and you have been riding the pine for three years and you finally get a chance and prove yourself. Do it for the coaches, give up the annual salary for the same staff that did not play you all these years. It does not work that way. You get your education, you played well and take some good memories with you....you just move on.
Guy Billups is not coming back either and would not be surprised if D Brown does not come back.
I'm not really sure I'm reading that statement as supportive or not for Bailiff, but make no mistake, redshirting is a GIFT to these football players....just ask any of them. Nordstrom had an amazing year: he also had many opportunities LAST year to be amazing, he was on the field ALOT. He happens to be an unusually smart guy, that is all. Honestly, he could play next year and this same job (or one just like it) would still be waiting for him. Also, if he has another year like 2014, he has a real chance at the NFL. But for whatever reason he has decided to forgo his eligibility and jump into the workforce. I have no doubt he will regret that decision very soon: for gosh sakes, he has the rest of his life to work!!! There will be an able bodied player stepping into his position and hopefully making the most of it, no doubt. Guy Billups is not coming back because he's not going to see the field. D Brown made his own mistakes, actually he'd be a fool not to come back. Rice athletes generally have more choices than your average athlete. Bailiff gives them every opportunity to succeed, and not just on the playing field.
You lost me on Rice athletes having more choices than the average athlete. Don't see it. Besides the degree being good, I actually think that once they commit their choices are limited. What kid would have the guts to tell their parents that they're leaving Rice. You can leave Baylor, TCU, A&M but our athletes seem to have fewer choices.
I see it differently.
Yes I believe you misread that. What I mean is Rice athletes have more choices post athletics than your average D1 athlete. Do I stay for my 5th year? Do I enter the work force at a high paying job? Do I try to pursue my sport professionally? Do I go to Med, Law or Business School? These are the choices I'm generally speaking of....tho the transfer choices are there also. An athlete trying to transfer from Rice to Enormous Public University has a much better shot than vice versa.
And...did you actually nonchalantly say, "besides the degree being good"???!!!! Wow.
) and decided to take it.
