Hello There, Guest! (LoginRegister)

Post Reply 
GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
Author Message
Jugnaut Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 6,875
Joined: Mar 2004
Reputation: 482
I Root For: UCF
Location: Florida
Post: #641
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
My two cents...I think it was a good call on the targeting. Do I think the UH player meant to hurt the UCF player or that it was egregious? No. But I do think it was what the rule was trying to prevent. A dangerous hit on vulnerable player. I don't think the UH player is a punk or acted with malice, he was trying to stop a great catch. He did what he had to make play. I think the fact that it is a new rule is the reason for the controversy. When time has gone by and there is some consistency on calling the foul, I think the controversies will settle down. I can see both sides of the issue, but still think it was the correct call, especially after hearing the coordinating official explain on TV why it was correct.
11-09-2013 11:15 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
The Original Timmy Chan Offline
Bad Mammy Jammy
*

Posts: 3,609
Joined: Feb 2004
Reputation: 45
I Root For: my wife
Location: Scott St at OST
Post: #642
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
Bambu, that is helmet to helmet. UCF guy led with crown of helmet.

UH player today led with shoulder. His helmet hit the shoulder of the UCF player first. He had turned his back to the UCF player to avoid leading with helmet.

Unfortunate that UCF player was hurt, and I hope he recovers quickly. But there was no targeting by the UH player if you read the rule.
11-09-2013 11:15 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
CougarMikeUH Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 335
Joined: Jun 2010
Reputation: 3
I Root For: Houston
Location: Houston
Post: #643
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
(11-09-2013 11:14 PM)North Carolina Knights Wrote:  
(11-09-2013 11:08 PM)CougarMikeUH Wrote:  
(11-09-2013 11:05 PM)CougarMikeUH Wrote:  The blow back for throwing a flag and being wrong is less than not throwing the flag on an injury play.

He led with the shoulder, the guy was coming downward and his helmet slid up...you know...as gravity brought the guy downward.

Bad call, how was it targeting? Beyond me...beyond the commentators.....the only one who thought it was correct was that blithering idiot of a fossil they tried to roll out and explain it.

Same logic as the Magic bullet that killed Kennedy.

Watch the play, your guy had time to stop, reverse his direction and launch upwards to a defenseless receiver. If he hit with his shoulder, the UCF WR would not have been down for 15 minutes, had his ace ask cut off, taken out on a stretcher and taken to a hospital.

Read your own description, he turned so he wouldn't kill the guy. He was trying to hit him in his chest. He didn't lead with his head for the kill shot....if he had done that, they would have needed a bag not a stretcher.
11-09-2013 11:19 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
North Carolina Knights Offline
Water Engineer
*

Posts: 51
Joined: Sep 2013
Reputation: 3
I Root For: UCF
Location:
Post: #644
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
(11-09-2013 11:19 PM)CougarMikeUH Wrote:  
(11-09-2013 11:14 PM)North Carolina Knights Wrote:  
(11-09-2013 11:08 PM)CougarMikeUH Wrote:  
(11-09-2013 11:05 PM)CougarMikeUH Wrote:  The blow back for throwing a flag and being wrong is less than not throwing the flag on an injury play.

He led with the shoulder, the guy was coming downward and his helmet slid up...you know...as gravity brought the guy downward.

Bad call, how was it targeting? Beyond me...beyond the commentators.....the only one who thought it was correct was that blithering idiot of a fossil they tried to roll out and explain it.

Same logic as the Magic bullet that killed Kennedy.

Watch the play, your guy had time to stop, reverse his direction and launch upwards to a defenseless receiver. If he hit with his shoulder, the UCF WR would not have been down for 15 minutes, had his ace ask cut off, taken out on a stretcher and taken to a hospital.

Read your own description, he turned so he wouldn't kill the guy. He was trying to hit him in his chest. He didn't lead with his head for the kill shot....if he had done that, they would have needed a bag not a stretcher.

Intent means nothing, the facts are the facts. The UCF receiver is 40 pounds bigger than the Houston DB, he hits him with his shoulder and nothing happens. It was a cheap shot and everyone but UL and UH fans Agree.
11-09-2013 11:22 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
CougarMikeUH Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 335
Joined: Jun 2010
Reputation: 3
I Root For: Houston
Location: Houston
Post: #645
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
Look at the targeting call just now on the Fresno state game...that guy stayed in and he clearly hit the guys head. Lol just reinforces that this rule is total BS and needs to be changed.
11-09-2013 11:22 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
canewton Offline
All American
*

Posts: 3,682
Joined: Nov 2008
Reputation: 59
I Root For: Houston
Location: Dallas, Texas
Post: #646
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
(11-09-2013 11:22 PM)North Carolina Knights Wrote:  
(11-09-2013 11:19 PM)CougarMikeUH Wrote:  
(11-09-2013 11:14 PM)North Carolina Knights Wrote:  
(11-09-2013 11:08 PM)CougarMikeUH Wrote:  
(11-09-2013 11:05 PM)CougarMikeUH Wrote:  The blow back for throwing a flag and being wrong is less than not throwing the flag on an injury play.

He led with the shoulder, the guy was coming downward and his helmet slid up...you know...as gravity brought the guy downward.

Bad call, how was it targeting? Beyond me...beyond the commentators.....the only one who thought it was correct was that blithering idiot of a fossil they tried to roll out and explain it.

Same logic as the Magic bullet that killed Kennedy.

Watch the play, your guy had time to stop, reverse his direction and launch upwards to a defenseless receiver. If he hit with his shoulder, the UCF WR would not have been down for 15 minutes, had his ace ask cut off, taken out on a stretcher and taken to a hospital.

Read your own description, he turned so he wouldn't kill the guy. He was trying to hit him in his chest. He didn't lead with his head for the kill shot....if he had done that, they would have needed a bag not a stretcher.

Intent means nothing, the facts are the facts. The UCF receiver is 40 pounds bigger than the Houston DB, he hits him with his shoulder and nothing happens. It was a cheap shot and everyone but UL and UH fans Agree.

Not a cheap shot.
11-09-2013 11:26 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Brian Reading Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 810
Joined: Jan 2009
Reputation: 28
I Root For: Houston
Location: Houston
Post: #647
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
(11-09-2013 11:22 PM)North Carolina Knights Wrote:  
(11-09-2013 11:19 PM)CougarMikeUH Wrote:  
(11-09-2013 11:14 PM)North Carolina Knights Wrote:  
(11-09-2013 11:08 PM)CougarMikeUH Wrote:  
(11-09-2013 11:05 PM)CougarMikeUH Wrote:  The blow back for throwing a flag and being wrong is less than not throwing the flag on an injury play.

He led with the shoulder, the guy was coming downward and his helmet slid up...you know...as gravity brought the guy downward.

Bad call, how was it targeting? Beyond me...beyond the commentators.....the only one who thought it was correct was that blithering idiot of a fossil they tried to roll out and explain it.

Same logic as the Magic bullet that killed Kennedy.

Watch the play, your guy had time to stop, reverse his direction and launch upwards to a defenseless receiver. If he hit with his shoulder, the UCF WR would not have been down for 15 minutes, had his ace ask cut off, taken out on a stretcher and taken to a hospital.

Read your own description, he turned so he wouldn't kill the guy. He was trying to hit him in his chest. He didn't lead with his head for the kill shot....if he had done that, they would have needed a bag not a stretcher.

It was a cheap shot and everyone but UL and UH fans Agree.

Wrong. Commentators called it BS too.
11-09-2013 11:32 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
The Original Timmy Chan Offline
Bad Mammy Jammy
*

Posts: 3,609
Joined: Feb 2004
Reputation: 45
I Root For: my wife
Location: Scott St at OST
Post: #648
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
Rule 9-1-3: Targeting and initiating contact with the crown of the helmet. No player shall target and initiate contact against an opponent with the crown (top) of his helmet. When in question, it is a foul.

Rule 9-1-4: Targeting and initiating contact to head or neck area of a defenseless player. No player shall target and initiate contact to the head or neck area of a defenseless opponent with the helmet, forearm, fist, elbow or shoulder. When in question, it is a foul.

Only part of these two rules where I can possibly see them upholding targeting is "when in question it is a foul." I still don't see how it could be in question since initial contact was not to the head or neck area, but the receivers shoulder.
11-09-2013 11:33 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Bambu Offline
Starving Artist
*

Posts: 3,197
Joined: Apr 2004
Reputation: 97
I Root For: Memphis
Location: Soulsville,U.S.A.
Post: #649
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
(11-09-2013 11:15 PM)The Original Timmy Chan Wrote:  Bambu, that is helmet to helmet. UCF guy led with crown of helmet.

UH player today led with shoulder. His helmet hit the shoulder of the UCF player first. He had turned his back to the UCF player to avoid leading with helmet.

Unfortunate that UCF player was hurt, and I hope he recovers quickly. But there was no targeting by the UH player if you read the rule.

I agree that your kid led with the shoulder(and I think it was a good hit). But I'm not up on the "targeting" rules.
11-09-2013 11:37 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
UofLgrad07 Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 2,070
Joined: Aug 2011
Reputation: 238
I Root For: Louisville
Location:
Post: #650
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
(11-09-2013 11:01 PM)North Carolina Knights Wrote:  I hope Houston fans are not upset on the targeting call. That was the pure definition of the rule

Per the NCAA football rulebook:

9.1.3. No player shall target and initiate contact against an opponent with the crown (top) of his helmet.

9.1.4. No player shall target and initiate contact to the head or neck area of a defenseless opponent with the helmet, forearm, hand, fist, elbow or shoulder.


Per the rules, targeting should only be flagged when a player either (a) uses the top of his helmet or (b) initiates contact with the head or neck region of a defenseless opponent.

If you re-watch the play, the Houston defender turned the front of his body away from Perriman and initiated contact with his shoulder (rule 9.1.3. would therefore not apply). Additionally, contact was initiated in the chest region, not the head or neck. Secondary contact between Perriman's facemask and the helmet of the Houston defender did occur, but the rule explicitly states that targeting only applies to when contact is initiated (i.e. secondary contact doesn't matter).

The hit as violent and did result in an unfortunate injury, but on the flip side, it was not targeting and should not have been flagged as such by the officials. The fact that a player was hurt on the play is why the flag was thrown. You have to remember refs are reviewed on how they call games and since the NCAA has put a special emphasis on targeting penalties this year, the refs are much more likely to throw bogus flags than not. This isn't the first bonus targeting call flagged this year and it probably won't be the last as long as the refs are being instructed to throw flags for anything even remotely resembling targeting.


(11-09-2013 11:04 PM)UCFKnights Wrote:  So he threw it to be safe, but when reviewed agreed it was a targeting penalty. How again is that a bad call?

That is not actually how the penalty works. From the NCAA rulebook:

"Penalty - 15 yards. For dead-ball fouls, 15 yards from the succeeding spot. Automatic first down for fouls by Team B if not in conflict with other rules. For fouls in the first half: Disqualification for the remainder of the game. For fouls in the second half: Disqualification for the remainder of the game and the first half of the next game. If the foul occurs in the second half of the last game of the season, players with remaining eligibility shall serve the suspension during the first game of the following season. The disqualification is subject to review by Instant Replay."


In other words, the only thing the replay booth can review is the player-disqualification portion of the penalty. The point of initial contact and use of the crown of the helmet are reviewable; however, the targeting action itself is not actually reviewable. So even if the disqualification is reversed, the 15-yard penalty remains.
(This post was last modified: 11-09-2013 11:45 PM by UofLgrad07.)
11-09-2013 11:39 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
CougarRed Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 11,450
Joined: Feb 2006
Reputation: 429
I Root For: Houston
Location:
Post: #651
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
(11-09-2013 11:08 PM)Bambu Wrote:  Did you Houston fans think that was a clean hit at the end of the UCF at Memphis game? Helmet to helmet?



UCF has gotten very fortunate on targeting calls (or noncalls) this year. That hit on the Memphis returner was much worse than what happened tonight.

These fortunate calls have had an impact on 2 UCF conference wins.

Fortunately, in both cases the teams on the wrong of the calls overcame the adversity and had a chance to win. That's why I am so proud of my Coogs tonight.
11-09-2013 11:40 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Bambu Offline
Starving Artist
*

Posts: 3,197
Joined: Apr 2004
Reputation: 97
I Root For: Memphis
Location: Soulsville,U.S.A.
Post: #652
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
(11-09-2013 11:40 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  
(11-09-2013 11:08 PM)Bambu Wrote:  Did you Houston fans think that was a clean hit at the end of the UCF at Memphis game? Helmet to helmet?



UCF has gotten very fortunate on targeting calls (or noncalls) this year. That hit on the Memphis returner was much worse than what happened tonight.

These fortunate calls have had an impact on 2 UCF conference wins.

Fortunately, in both cases the teams on the wrong of the calls overcame the adversity and had a chance to win. That's why I am so proud of my Coogs tonight.

also of interest, the kid who makes the hit jumps offsides before the kick05-stirthepot
11-09-2013 11:46 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
North Carolina Knights Offline
Water Engineer
*

Posts: 51
Joined: Sep 2013
Reputation: 3
I Root For: UCF
Location:
Post: #653
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
The mere fact that the ejection stood after the replay shows I am right, case closed.
11-09-2013 11:58 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Brian Reading Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 810
Joined: Jan 2009
Reputation: 28
I Root For: Houston
Location: Houston
Post: #654
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
(11-09-2013 11:58 PM)North Carolina Knights Wrote:  The mere fact that the ejection stood after the replay shows I am right, case closed.

03-lmfao The mere fact that you cannot fathom how regardless of what was seen on replay would have no outcome on the call shows us that you are stubborn, and a poor winner.
11-10-2013 12:00 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ElectricCoogaloo Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 769
Joined: May 2013
Reputation: 8
I Root For: Houston
Location: The Dance Floor
Post: #655
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
(11-09-2013 11:58 PM)North Carolina Knights Wrote:  The mere fact that the ejection stood after the replay shows I am right, case closed.

LOL
11-10-2013 12:00 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
canewton Offline
All American
*

Posts: 3,682
Joined: Nov 2008
Reputation: 59
I Root For: Houston
Location: Dallas, Texas
Post: #656
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
(11-09-2013 11:58 PM)North Carolina Knights Wrote:  The mere fact that the ejection stood after the replay shows I am right, case closed.

You nailed it. We got a winner over here.
11-10-2013 12:01 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Metacog Drivel Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 488
Joined: Nov 2010
Reputation: 15
I Root For: UCF
Location:
Post: #657
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
Wow, you UH fans are mad....real mad.
11-10-2013 12:09 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Brian Reading Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 810
Joined: Jan 2009
Reputation: 28
I Root For: Houston
Location: Houston
Post: #658
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
(11-10-2013 12:09 AM)Metacog Drivel Wrote:  Wow, you UH fans are mad....real mad.

Huh? I don't think all of the congrats threads are indicative of being a sore loser. I also don't think you need to make your fan base continue with this "you mad?" approach.
(This post was last modified: 11-10-2013 12:12 AM by Brian Reading.)
11-10-2013 12:11 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
GeminiCoog Offline
You'll Never Walk Alone
*

Posts: 8,840
Joined: Sep 2010
Reputation: 688
I Root For: Houston, Notre Dame
Location: Dayton, Texas, USA
Post: #659
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
(11-10-2013 12:11 AM)Brian Reading Wrote:  
(11-10-2013 12:09 AM)Metacog Drivel Wrote:  Wow, you UH fans are mad....real mad.

Huh? I don't think all of the congrats threads are indicative of being a sore loser. I also don't think you need to make your fan base continue with this "you mad?" approach.

Yeah, I'm not mad at all. I'm proud of our Coogs tonight. Wish we could've gotten that touchdown at the end, but coulda shoulda woulda-ing doesn't win games. Bottom line is we were in a position to win the game. It was a good game by both teams. UCF just had one more big play than we did. To them, I say as I always do when a team beats the Scarlet and White, congratulations. We'll get ya next time.
(This post was last modified: 11-10-2013 12:15 AM by GeminiCoog.)
11-10-2013 12:14 AM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
knighthead1 Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 2,028
Joined: Oct 2010
Reputation: 56
I Root For: UCF
Location:
Post: #660
RE: GT: Houston 14-19 UCF Final
UCF 4-0 7-1
Louisville 4-1 8-1
Cincinnati 4-1 7-2
Houston 4-1 7-2
Rutgers 2-2 5-3
Southern Methodist 2-2 3-5
South Florida 2-2 2-6
Memphis 0-4 2-6
Connecticut 0-4 0-8
Temple 0-5 1-8
11-10-2013 12:23 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)


Copyright © 2002-2024 Collegiate Sports Nation Bulletin Board System (CSNbbs), All Rights Reserved.
CSNbbs is an independent fan site and is in no way affiliated to the NCAA or any of the schools and conferences it represents.
This site monetizes links. FTC Disclosure.
We allow third-party companies to serve ads and/or collect certain anonymous information when you visit our web site. These companies may use non-personally identifiable information (e.g., click stream information, browser type, time and date, subject of advertisements clicked or scrolled over) during your visits to this and other Web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services likely to be of greater interest to you. These companies typically use a cookie or third party web beacon to collect this information. To learn more about this behavioral advertising practice or to opt-out of this type of advertising, you can visit http://www.networkadvertising.org.
Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2024 MyBB Group.