I'm not calling anyone a liar. I'm saying that Hadsell was cleared of the harassment allegations and the he proved she deleted texts.

So hadsell is guilty and has to prove he is innocent and you guys can come on here and say whatever you want about him. But someone defends the guy and I get bashed for it?

I would love to see one of you guys fire a woman and then have her make false claims of sexual harassment against you and then see how you and people that support you feel.

Amazing.

Exactly where were you "bashed?" Unless you are Hadsel, no one said a word against you. Actually it was you calling others "bible thumper." Now, why would you choose that particular phrasing? Sounds like you are accusing us of holding Hadsel to a moral standard but since you argue he committed no moral offense, it's a bit difficult to follow your reasoning.

Point is, as H2Oville tried mightedly to point out to you, Dude's gone. No erasing that history. We can debate truth of the accusations till doomsday and nothing will change. Opinions of his behavior, pro or con can only be changed by him, not by people on a message board.

The question was posed, what did the new coach do or NOT do that resulted in what most feel was a team not meeting their potential. More interesting to me, what exactly do you think Hadsel would have done differently?

(11-03-2013 04:34 PM)eastisbest Wrote:  Exactly where were you "bashed?" Unless you are Hadsel, no one said a word against you. Actually it was you calling others "bible thumper." Now, why would you choose that particular phrasing? Sounds like you are accusing us of holding Hadsel to a moral standard but since you argue he committed no moral offense, it's a bit difficult to follow your reasoning.

Point is, as H2Oville tried mightedly to point out to you, Dude's gone. No erasing that history. We can debate truth of the accusations till doomsday and nothing will change. Opinions of his behavior, pro or con can only be changed by him, not by people on a message board.

The question was posed, what did the new coach do or NOT do that resulted in what most feel was a team not meeting their potential. More interesting to me, what exactly do you think Hadsel would have done differently?

Linh eliminated cross training. This is a big part of building strength and endurance when racing. The schedule was awful. We didn't have any races to compare where the team was at physically during training. The workouts were way to easy.Not at all what Hadsell had the team used to. Probably would have been better to keep Ari on for awhile.He could have learned a lot from her as well, but he wanted to bring his asst. from Uncg in, understandable, but I think we would have had a different outcome this week if he had adapted some of Hadsells training in with his laid back southern coaching style.The team got soft pure and simple,lost there edge.Linh coached them like a division 3 team. His coaching style may have worked at UNCG but not here. Coach Linh welcome to the "Big Show".Good Luck at Regionals................I would like to add on the flip side I know I am being very critical of Linhs' coaching ability based on my disappointment over our loss. I do however believe the university is extremely happy with their choice of head coach for a non rev sport.

(11-03-2013 03:47 PM)utxctrack Wrote:  I'm not calling anyone a liar. I'm saying that Hadsell was cleared of the harassment allegations and the he proved she deleted texts.

So hadsell is guilty and has to prove he is innocent and you guys can come on here and say whatever you want about him. But someone defends the guy and I get bashed for it?

I would love to see one of you guys fire a woman and then have her make false claims of sexual harassment against you and then see how you and people that support you feel.

Amazing.

When you say "had Kertesz not lied" in one post and "I'm not calling anyone a liar" in another your credibility suffers, doncha think?

Thanks Mac. You have expressed these concerns throughout the season and it looks as though you were pretty accurate. I wanted Ari to stay as well. Her "Rocket" experience as well as jer AA credentials would have maintained some continuity and expertise we really needed. Hope Linh is open minded about change and I hope he's a great recruiter. We need the intensity back. BTW! did I see Ari (or Ali) at Savage last week?

(11-03-2013 06:09 PM)H2Oville Rocket Wrote:  Thanks Mac. You have expressed these concerns throughout the season and it looks as though you were pretty accurate. I wanted Ari to stay as well. Her "Rocket" experience as well as jer AA credentials would have maintained some continuity and expertise we really needed. Hope Linh is open minded about change and I hope he's a great recruiter. We need the intensity back. BTW! did I see Ari (or Ali) at Savage last week?

Yep one or the other....both are still in Toledo.Ali is getting her masters and works for the University.She designed the murals in Grogan and now Savage. Ari is working as a lab technician, using her biology undergrad and still running. Planning on continuing med school in the winter.
As far as Linh I hope so to.

I was saying that he has proof she deleted texts. She said in the blade she didn't. That's what I'm saying. And if he was harassing her then why no lawsuit?

I don't know enough about the training to know why they are not good. If he cut out a lot of their training then that would be cause for concern based on lack of results. In not hadsell but I am a fan and a friend of his. I wouldn't want to be him after all this.

Coach drank a lot. He cussed a lot. He dated shook a long time ago. He crossed the lines and put himself in this position. I think he already understands and admits to that.

(11-03-2013 06:58 PM)utxctrack Wrote:  I was saying that he has proof she deleted texts. She said in the blade she didn't. That's what I'm saying. And if he was harassing her then why no lawsuit?

I don't know enough about the training to know why they are not good. If he cut out a lot of their training then that would be cause for concern based on lack of results. In not hadsell but I am a fan and a friend of his. I wouldn't want to be him after all this.

Coach drank a lot. He cussed a lot. He dated shook a long time ago. He crossed the lines and put himself in this position. I think he already understands and admits to that.

You're not doing your friend any favors by re-hashing his indiscretions and by taking the tone that you've taken on this board.

Maybe you're right.

(11-03-2013 12:11 PM)T-Town Wrote:  

(11-03-2013 10:59 AM)eastisbest Wrote:  Not if they're reading the Bible when apparently they should be drinking the kool-aid.

Just as an historical perspective, Jim Jones and his followers were able to do both

Atta Boy, Doc!!!!!!

(11-03-2013 04:52 PM)BigMac Wrote:  

(11-03-2013 04:34 PM)eastisbest Wrote:  Exactly where were you "bashed?" Unless you are Hadsel, no one said a word against you. Actually it was you calling others "bible thumper." Now, why would you choose that particular phrasing? Sounds like you are accusing us of holding Hadsel to a moral standard but since you argue he committed no moral offense, it's a bit difficult to follow your reasoning. Point is, as H2Oville tried mightedly to point out to you, Dude's gone. No erasing that history. We can debate truth of the accusations till doomsday and nothing will change. Opinions of his behavior, pro or con can only be changed by him, not by people on a message board. The question was posed, what did the new coach do or NOT do that resulted in what most feel was a team not meeting their potential. More interesting to me, what exactly do you think Hadsel would have done differently?

Linh eliminated cross training. This is a big part of building strength and endurance when racing. The schedule was awful. We didn't have any races to compare where the team was at physically during training. The workouts were way to easy.Not at all what Hadsell had the team used to. Probably would have been better to keep Ari on for awhile.He could have learned a lot from her as well, but he wanted to bring his asst. from Uncg in, understandable, but I think we would have had a different outcome this week if he had adapted some of Hadsells training in with his laid back southern coaching style.The team got soft pure and simple,lost there edge.Linh coached them like a division 3 team. His coaching style may have worked at UNCG but not here. Coach Linh welcome to the "Big Show".Good Luck at Regionals................I would like to add on the flip side I know I am being very critical of Linhs' coaching ability based on my disappointment over our loss. I do however believe the university is extremely happy with their choice of head coach for a non rev sport.

I hope I can make my points here......

A lot of people were disappointed with the MAC results, including me. I am not a CC or an track guy (although on track team in high school for something to do in spring). Maybe Linh is a good coach, maybe not. Can't tell yet. But like I said I'm disappointed right now. At some schools CC and track fly under the radar. Not here at Toledo. We, as many have read, have very passionate followers the sport(s). Which I think is great!!!!!! If your on scholarship, you should be cheered on and supported like the football and basketball teams by the fans whenever possible.

As for the new coach, Linh. maybe he built his last program from nothing to it's elevated status without any pressure or expections from his former university to a level that was alright for them. However, he has now stepped into an established CC program, and has some new adjusting to do. Problem is: no for learning curve here. He is not "under the radar" as we all can see. Perhaps he needs to be told that he is expected to win, and people (fans, us) are watching. We expect our teams to win. Including Cross Country and Track!!!!!!!!

Just Win Baby!!!!, Just Win!!!!!!!

(11-04-2013 10:34 AM)Terry Wrote:  

(11-03-2013 04:52 PM)BigMac Wrote:  

(11-03-2013 04:34 PM)eastisbest Wrote:  Exactly where were you "bashed?" Unless you are Hadsel, no one said a word against you. Actually it was you calling others "bible thumper." Now, why would you choose that particular phrasing? Sounds like you are accusing us of holding Hadsel to a moral standard but since you argue he committed no moral offense, it's a bit difficult to follow your reasoning. Point is, as H2Oville tried mightedly to point out to you, Dude's gone. No erasing that history. We can debate truth of the accusations till doomsday and nothing will change. Opinions of his behavior, pro or con can only be changed by him, not by people on a message board. The question was posed, what did the new coach do or NOT do that resulted in what most feel was a team not meeting their potential. More interesting to me, what exactly do you think Hadsel would have done differently?

Linh eliminated cross training. This is a big part of building strength and endurance when racing. The schedule was awful. We didn't have any races to compare where the team was at physically during training. The workouts were way to easy.Not at all what Hadsell had the team used to. Probably would have been better to keep Ari on for awhile.He could have learned a lot from her as well, but he wanted to bring his asst. from Uncg in, understandable, but I think we would have had a different outcome this week if he had adapted some of Hadsells training in with his laid back southern coaching style.The team got soft pure and simple,lost there edge.Linh coached them like a division 3 team. His coaching style may have worked at UNCG but not here. Coach Linh welcome to the "Big Show".Good Luck at Regionals................I would like to add on the flip side I know I am being very critical of Linhs' coaching ability based on my disappointment over our loss. I do however believe the university is extremely happy with their choice of head coach for a non rev sport.

I hope I can make my points here......

A lot of people were disappointed with the MAC results, including me. I am not a CC or an track guy (although on track team in high school for something to do in spring). Maybe Linh is a good coach, maybe not. Can't tell yet. But like I said I'm disappointed right now. At some schools CC and track fly under the radar. Not here at Toledo. We, as many have read, have very passionate followers the sport(s). Which I think is great!!!!!! If your on scholarship, you should be cheered on and supported like the football and basketball teams by the fans whenever possible.

As for the new coach, Linh. maybe he built his last program from nothing to it's elevated status without any pressure or expections from his former university to a level that was alright for them. However, he has now stepped into an established CC program, and has some new adjusting to do. Problem is: no for learning curve here. He is not "under the radar" as we all can see. Perhaps he needs to be told that he is expected to win, and people (fans, us) are watching. We expect our teams to win. Including Cross Country and Track!!!!!!!!

Just Win Baby!!!!, Just Win!!!!!!!

Well spoken!!! The biggest disappointment in all of this is knowing what could have been this year.Top ten NCAA for one. Should a ,could a , would a.

Congrats to Miami on a hard earned victory. I totally understand the UT women supporters, who feel ,that our new coach, took a team, that ON PAPER ,should have easily won the MAC, and failed.
In sport... ON PAPER, is just that.
The better team, last Saturday, won the team Championship.
Here is hoping, we now have a Track and Field coach at UT...something that we have lacked.
Good Luck Coach Linh

Chug is not worth reading

(11-04-2013 11:44 PM)utxctrack Wrote:  Chug is not worth reading

Yeah, he is. A lot of us would have liked to see us stronger in track. I love what we've done in x-country but it kills me that we have NEVER won a MACC in track. I want that as badly as RP. You disagree but your disagreement doesn't make your opinion unworthy of reading.

Unfortunately, Linh is a distance guy and we lost our jump coach who was responsible for getting us most of our non-distance points in T and F. I don't see any immediate hope for track succcess but just once, before I die....

I believe that all of Miami's top runners return next year, FWIW. Any news on recruiting?

(11-05-2013 08:45 AM)DetroitRocket Wrote:  I believe that all of Miami's top runners return next year, FWIW. Any news on recruiting?

Haven't seen anything-the UT site usually has a list in the spring but may do x-country signees earlier.

FWIW they won't win a MAC track title until they build an indoor track. Only 6 of the 12 MAC schools have ever won a MAC track title indoor or outdoor. Those are the six with competition indoor tracks. 40 years of history.

Hadsell's last track season they finished 2nd by like 2-3 points and scored over 130 points. One of highest point totals in MAC history.

And as far as Miami being more talented: Toledo has 7 women that have broken 17:00 for 5k. Miami has one. Toledo has three of the greatest distance runners in MAC history on their team in Tullis, Chognavki, Vogelsong (all-time rankings MAC history). Miami has zero. Toledo coach inherited 13 All-MAC women to choose from. Miami has three. Toledo's same exact women were ranked 15th in nation and even added three redahirted all-mac's to that group. Those same exact runners are now not only not ranked but went from setting all-time MAC record last year with 24 points and 8 all-MAC finishers to not even winning. Same runners.

If this was basketball (since you need 5) and we had a team that had 8 All-MAC players, three of which were all-time greatest scorers on a team that won three straight titles and went to three straight NCAAs. They were ranked in top-15 in nation. They return them all back and add three more studs that were all-MAC. That team then not only isn't ranked at all but they don't even win the conference and are barely an NIT team, we would be calling for that coach to be fired. But we are congratulating him?

These are not good signs. Congratulations you say? Congratulations for what exactly?

(11-05-2013 09:09 AM)utxctrack Wrote:  FWIW they won't win a MAC track title until they build an indoor track. Only 6 of the 12 MAC schools have ever won a MAC track title indoor or outdoor. Those are the six with competition indoor tracks. 40 years of history.

Hadsell's last track season they finished 2nd by like 2-3 points and scored over 130 points. One of highest point totals in MAC history.

And as far as Miami being more talented: Toledo has 7 women that have broken 17:00 for 5k. Miami has one. Toledo has three of the greatest distance runners in MAC history on their team in Tullis, Chognavki, Vogelsong (all-time rankings MAC history). Miami has zero. Toledo coach inherited 13 All-MAC women to choose from. Miami has three. Toledo's same exact women were ranked 15th in nation and even added three redshirted all-mac's to that group. Those same exact runners are now not only not ranked but went from setting all-time MAC record last year with 24 points and 8 all-MAC finishers to not even winning. Same runners.

These are not good signs. Congratulations you say? Congratulations for what exactly?

I think it's pretty obvious he's congratulating Miami on winning the conference. As far as track goes there were promises made for an indoor track at Fedderman. Those weren't kept and were played off with "Well, we have a sprint lane." The track failures weren't all laid at the foot of Hadsell-he did what he could with the facilities he had but IMO didn't push to get the athletes that could give us ten or fifteen points in sprints, relays or throws that could have won a MACC. Whether it was hard to do because of facilities or track wasn't his, or other coaches', strong suits, the fact remains that King Bob never won a MACC. I never won a MACC. You never won a MACC. Chug never won a MACC. Nor has any other track athlete in a UT singlet. I want one.

(11-05-2013 09:12 AM)H2Oville Rocket Wrote:  

(11-05-2013 09:09 AM)utxctrack Wrote:  FWIW they won't win a MAC track title until they build an indoor track. Only 6 of the 12 MAC schools have ever won a MAC track title indoor or outdoor. Those are the six with competition indoor tracks. 40 years of history.

Hadsell's last track season they finished 2nd by like 2-3 points and scored over 130 points. One of highest point totals in MAC history.

And as far as Miami being more talented: Toledo has 7 women that have broken 17:00 for 5k. Miami has one. Toledo has three of the greatest distance runners in MAC history on their team in Tullis, Chognavki, Vogelsong (all-time rankings MAC history). Miami has zero. Toledo coach inherited 13 All-MAC women to choose from. Miami has three. Toledo's same exact women were ranked 15th in nation and even added three redshirted all-mac's to that group. Those same exact runners are now not only not ranked but went from setting all-time MAC record last year with 24 points and 8 all-MAC finishers to not even winning. Same runners.

These are not good signs. Congratulations you say? Congratulations for what exactly? As far as track goes there were promises made for an indoor track at Fedderman. Those weren't kept and were played off with "Well, we have a sprint lane." The track failures weren't all laid at the foot of Hadsell-he did what he could with the facilities he had but IMO didn't push to get the four or five points in sprints, relays or throws that could have won a MACC. Whether it was ahrd to do because of facilities or track wasn't his, or other coaches, strong suits, the fact remains that King Bob never won a MACC. I never won a MACC. You never won a MACC. Chug never won a MACC. Nor has any other track athlete in a UT singlet. I want one.

I think it's pretty obvious he's congratulating Miami on winning the conference.

Take out my part about him congratulating new coach. I misread.

What say you on the rest? No comment?