When AQ schools are losing to FCS teams.

From a fan of the current system.

D4 = evolution of the game.

D4 is mostly for TV. They want to see Florida vs Texas every weekend and not UCF vs Florida International.

Stuff that happened this weekend is what makes college football special.

Not really, upsets happen in every sport, even more so in basketball

TV wants UT to be playing Ohio State, not New Mexico State this week and to create a system that would make that match up a benefit instead of a liability

(09-01-2013 09:51 AM)10thMountain Wrote:  Not really, upsets happen in every sport, even more so in basketball

TV wants UT to be playing Ohio State, not New Mexico State this week and to create a system that would make that match up a benefit instead of a liability

D4 is a joke. There is really no need for it. If the P-5 schools don't want to schedule the G5 or FCS--then don't. Nobody is forcing them to do it now. Each school has 100% total control over their own schedule. Rice and Sam Houston State didn't force themselves onto A&M's schedule via governmental action or via NCAA requirements. Rice and Sam Houston State are on A&M's schedule because A&M put them there. P-5 fans need to stop whining and schedule all power schools if that's who you want. Until the P-5 does that then this is all a bunch of non-sense.

TV doesn't have to have D-4 to get all power conference matchups. All they have to do is either put language in their conference media contracts that require all P-5 OOC opponents or set up a bonus system that pays the conference more for scheduling P-5 OOC games (could even be paid on an individual school basis).

Bottom line, if a split was important to the networks, it would have already happened. Its actually just the opposite. There is no groundswell of support for this from the public. There is no groundswell of support for it from the networks. Even most of the conference commissioners are not really in favor of a G-5 split. They just want to get away from having FCS and non-football playing schools vote on P-5 issues.

So you want us to stop talking about what actually is happening because some FCS teams played impressively on week 1 against some less than impressive P5 programs?

Do you folks really think it will change anything how you guys fare on the field? If anything, the better you do the more quickly you push this process along.

So I guess....thank you for the effort that your teams are putting forth?

(09-01-2013 11:01 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 09:51 AM)10thMountain Wrote:  Not really, upsets happen in every sport, even more so in basketball

TV wants UT to be playing Ohio State, not New Mexico State this week and to create a system that would make that match up a benefit instead of a liability

D4 is a joke. There is really no need for it. If the P-5 schools don't want to schedule the G5 or FCS--then don't. Nobody is forcing them to do it now. Each school has 100% total control over their own schedule. Rice and Sam Houston State didn't force themselves onto A&M's schedule via governmental action or via NCAA requirements. Rice and Sam Houston State are on A&M's schedule because A&M put them there. P-5 fans need to stop whining and schedule all power schools if that's who you want. Until the P-5 does that then this is all a bunch of non-sense.

TV doesn't have to have D-4 to get all power conference matchups. All they have to do is either put language in their conference media contracts that require all P-5 OOC opponents or set up a bonus system that pays the conference more for scheduling P-5 OOC games (could even be paid on an individual school basis).

Bottom line, if a split was important to the networks, it would have already happened. Its actually just the opposite. There is no groundswell of support for this from the public. There is no groundswell of support for it from the networks. Even most of the conference commissioners are not really in favor of a G-5 split. They just want to get away from having FCS and non-football playing schools vote on P-5 issues.

Why do you guys think in such simple terms? You REALLY think it is just about not wanting to play you guys? It is about RULE CONTROL. New rules are coming and that is the major point. It has nothing to do with playing your schools. I realize that is all you guys can focus on due to this irrational fear of being left out but deal with it, it is happening and it has nothing to do with whether you guys win or lose on Saturday against P5 teams.

*** **** fandom thinking.

(09-01-2013 09:51 AM)10thMountain Wrote:  Not really, upsets happen in every sport, even more so in basketball

TV wants UT to be playing Ohio State, not New Mexico State this week and to create a system that would make that match up a benefit instead of a liability

That system will never exist, though. Just to use your example, Mack Brown's job security depends on him playing a few NMSUs every year. The boosters that fund Mack's $5 million salary want 10 wins a year, and no one will average 10 wins a year if their non-con schedule is filled with the best teams from the other P5 conferences.

Remember Mack's laughable line about "the NFL of college football"? Look at the real NFL. Bill Parcells just joined the Hall of Fame with a career winning percentage of .570. In CFB with a 12-game regular season, that would be an average of 7 wins a year. No modern CFB coach averaging 7 wins a year would last very long at a football factory like Texas or Ohio State or Alabama, let alone become a Hall of Famer. The system demands that the Big Boys be able to pad their win total vs. NMSU or Kent State or whomever.

I think a system where if you are p5 and win your conference you get an aq playoff spot does that.

You don't have to be 12-0 or 11-1

You can play a tough OOC schedule and be rewarded for it by still getting into the playoff at 9-3 or 8-4 if you win out.

Also, we can get rid of the arbitrary 6-6 req for bowls as they are all meaningless exhibition games anyway thanks to the playoffs

In fact, it might be smart for the bowls to coopt the preseason games rather than try to compete with the playoff

Imagine if the Rose Bowl got to pick the #1 preseason PAC vs the #1 preseason B1G

It would be huge and it wouldn't hurt the losers chance at playing for a national title

(09-01-2013 12:01 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 11:01 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 09:51 AM)10thMountain Wrote:  Not really, upsets happen in every sport, even more so in basketball

TV wants UT to be playing Ohio State, not New Mexico State this week and to create a system that would make that match up a benefit instead of a liability

D4 is a joke. There is really no need for it. If the P-5 schools don't want to schedule the G5 or FCS--then don't. Nobody is forcing them to do it now. Each school has 100% total control over their own schedule. Rice and Sam Houston State didn't force themselves onto A&M's schedule via governmental action or via NCAA requirements. Rice and Sam Houston State are on A&M's schedule because A&M put them there. P-5 fans need to stop whining and schedule all power schools if that's who you want. Until the P-5 does that then this is all a bunch of non-sense.

TV doesn't have to have D-4 to get all power conference matchups. All they have to do is either put language in their conference media contracts that require all P-5 OOC opponents or set up a bonus system that pays the conference more for scheduling P-5 OOC games (could even be paid on an individual school basis).

Bottom line, if a split was important to the networks, it would have already happened. Its actually just the opposite. There is no groundswell of support for this from the public. There is no groundswell of support for it from the networks. Even most of the conference commissioners are not really in favor of a G-5 split. They just want to get away from having FCS and non-football playing schools vote on P-5 issues.

Why do you guys think in such simple terms? You REALLY think it is just about not wanting to play you guys? It is about RULE CONTROL. New rules are coming and that is the major point. It has nothing to do with playing your schools. I realize that is all you guys can focus on due to this irrational fear of being left out but deal with it, it is happening and it has nothing to do with whether you guys win or lose on Saturday against P5 teams.

*** **** fandom thinking.

Reading comprehension is your friend. I said it WAS about voting. The entire first part of the post is about how it's obviously NOT about playing just P-5 schools (as 10th Mountain seemed to think).

(09-01-2013 12:10 PM)Wedge Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 09:51 AM)10thMountain Wrote:  Not really, upsets happen in every sport, even more so in basketball

TV wants UT to be playing Ohio State, not New Mexico State this week and to create a system that would make that match up a benefit instead of a liability

That system will never exist, though. Just to use your example, Mack Brown's job security depends on him playing a few NMSUs every year. The boosters that fund Mack's $5 million salary want 10 wins a year, and no one will average 10 wins a year if their non-con schedule is filled with the best teams from the other P5 conferences.

Remember Mack's laughable line about "the NFL of college football"? Look at the real NFL. Bill Parcells just joined the Hall of Fame with a career winning percentage of .570. In CFB with a 12-game regular season, that would be an average of 7 wins a year. No modern CFB coach averaging 7 wins a year would last very long at a football factory like Texas or Ohio State or Alabama, let alone become a Hall of Famer. The system demands that the Big Boys be able to pad their win total vs. NMSU or Kent State or whomever.

I so wish I could still hand out extra reputation. I get why fans think it is about what is going on right now on the field but it has NOTHING to do with what is going on down on the field right now. There will still be some "easy" games scheduled but if anything, if those games become less and less "easy" then that will be more detrimental to those small programs than it will be helpful.

This really is ALL about control of rules. Currently fcs schools and schools that don't play football at all can stop measures put forward by the Major Schools and their Conferences. That is going to stop, one way or another.

Because of my belief that such is the main focus of having a new division, I don't understand the drastic fear by some folks that their strong programs will be left behind. I still strongly believe that there will be a conference such as the AAC that is going to be allowed to exist in that top division. That allowance will be due to precise rules drawn up with the express purpose of allowing such an occurrence to happen.

A school like Houston may even make it higher than that.

Conferences are talking about ceasing playing FCS teams because those are about to become two divisions below the top division instead of just one. There wont be any problem with playing the programs remaining behind in what is now the FBS division. Those games will all still happen and fans of those programs will still be able to come around and have their little one week bragging rights when their programs play well or even score a win. Their interest in college football will be kept that way and yes, the Networks think along those lines.


At least I know one other person gets it Wedge although I can think of enough others that would require fingers on both hands in order to count them all, maybe....

(09-01-2013 12:15 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 12:01 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 11:01 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 09:51 AM)10thMountain Wrote:  Not really, upsets happen in every sport, even more so in basketball

TV wants UT to be playing Ohio State, not New Mexico State this week and to create a system that would make that match up a benefit instead of a liability

D4 is a joke. There is really no need for it. If the P-5 schools don't want to schedule the G5 or FCS--then don't. Nobody is forcing them to do it now. Each school has 100% total control over their own schedule. Rice and Sam Houston State didn't force themselves onto A&M's schedule via governmental action or via NCAA requirements. Rice and Sam Houston State are on A&M's schedule because A&M put them there. P-5 fans need to stop whining and schedule all power schools if that's who you want. Until the P-5 does that then this is all a bunch of non-sense.

TV doesn't have to have D-4 to get all power conference matchups. All they have to do is either put language in their conference media contracts that require all P-5 OOC opponents or set up a bonus system that pays the conference more for scheduling P-5 OOC games (could even be paid on an individual school basis).

Bottom line, if a split was important to the networks, it would have already happened. Its actually just the opposite. There is no groundswell of support for this from the public. There is no groundswell of support for it from the networks. Even most of the conference commissioners are not really in favor of a G-5 split. They just want to get away from having FCS and non-football playing schools vote on P-5 issues.

Why do you guys think in such simple terms? You REALLY think it is just about not wanting to play you guys? It is about RULE CONTROL. New rules are coming and that is the major point. It has nothing to do with playing your schools. I realize that is all you guys can focus on due to this irrational fear of being left out but deal with it, it is happening and it has nothing to do with whether you guys win or lose on Saturday against P5 teams.

*** **** fandom thinking.

Reading comprehension is your friend. I said it WAS about voting. The entire first part of the post is about how it's obviously NOT about playing just P-5 schools (as 10th Mountain seemed to think).

Hmmm, alright, I suppose fully reading the post would be helpful too then. Your first paragraph is about as far as I went.

Now that I have read your full post, it does seem we are of similar mind.

That doesn't mean I agree that the idea for a new division is a joke though. It is either that or a full split from the NCAA. I would say the new division idea is the lesser of two evils. Houston will be just fine with that happening too. I would place a bet on them making it in whether it be out in a final slot in one of the Majors or be it in a mid-major conference that is allowed to be in that new division.

Anyways..... the AQ conferences and all of their Wall-Mart fan bases can suck it.

(09-01-2013 12:19 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 12:10 PM)Wedge Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 09:51 AM)10thMountain Wrote:  Not really, upsets happen in every sport, even more so in basketball

TV wants UT to be playing Ohio State, not New Mexico State this week and to create a system that would make that match up a benefit instead of a liability

That system will never exist, though. Just to use your example, Mack Brown's job security depends on him playing a few NMSUs every year. The boosters that fund Mack's $5 million salary want 10 wins a year, and no one will average 10 wins a year if their non-con schedule is filled with the best teams from the other P5 conferences.

Remember Mack's laughable line about "the NFL of college football"? Look at the real NFL. Bill Parcells just joined the Hall of Fame with a career winning percentage of .570. In CFB with a 12-game regular season, that would be an average of 7 wins a year. No modern CFB coach averaging 7 wins a year would last very long at a football factory like Texas or Ohio State or Alabama, let alone become a Hall of Famer. The system demands that the Big Boys be able to pad their win total vs. NMSU or Kent State or whomever.

I so wish I could still hand out extra reputation. I get why fans think it is about what is going on right now on the field but it has NOTHING to do with what is going on down on the field right now. There will still be some "easy" games scheduled but if anything, if those games become less and less "easy" then that will be more detrimental to those small programs than it will be helpful.

This really is ALL about control of rules. Currently fcs schools and schools that don't play football at all can stop measures put forward by the Major Schools and their Conferences. That is going to stop, one way or another.

Because of my belief that such is the main focus of having a new division, I don't understand the drastic fear by some folks that their strong programs will be left behind. I still strongly believe that there will be a conference such as the AAC that is going to be allowed to exist in that top division. That allowance will be due to precise rules drawn up with the express purpose of allowing such an occurrence to happen.

A school like Houston may even make it higher than that.

Conferences are talking about ceasing playing FCS teams because those are about to become two divisions below the top division instead of just one. There wont be any problem with playing the programs remaining behind in what is now the FBS division. Those games will all still happen and fans of those programs will still be able to come around and have their little one week bragging rights when their programs play well or even score a win. Their interest in college football will be kept that way and yes, the Networks think along those lines.


At least I know one other person gets it Wedge although I can think of enough others that would require fingers on both hands in order to count them all, maybe....

Yea, just keep telling yourself that.

(09-02-2013 05:34 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 12:19 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 12:10 PM)Wedge Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 09:51 AM)10thMountain Wrote:  Not really, upsets happen in every sport, even more so in basketball

TV wants UT to be playing Ohio State, not New Mexico State this week and to create a system that would make that match up a benefit instead of a liability

That system will never exist, though. Just to use your example, Mack Brown's job security depends on him playing a few NMSUs every year. The boosters that fund Mack's $5 million salary want 10 wins a year, and no one will average 10 wins a year if their non-con schedule is filled with the best teams from the other P5 conferences.

Remember Mack's laughable line about "the NFL of college football"? Look at the real NFL. Bill Parcells just joined the Hall of Fame with a career winning percentage of .570. In CFB with a 12-game regular season, that would be an average of 7 wins a year. No modern CFB coach averaging 7 wins a year would last very long at a football factory like Texas or Ohio State or Alabama, let alone become a Hall of Famer. The system demands that the Big Boys be able to pad their win total vs. NMSU or Kent State or whomever.

I so wish I could still hand out extra reputation. I get why fans think it is about what is going on right now on the field but it has NOTHING to do with what is going on down on the field right now. There will still be some "easy" games scheduled but if anything, if those games become less and less "easy" then that will be more detrimental to those small programs than it will be helpful.

This really is ALL about control of rules. Currently fcs schools and schools that don't play football at all can stop measures put forward by the Major Schools and their Conferences. That is going to stop, one way or another.

Because of my belief that such is the main focus of having a new division, I don't understand the drastic fear by some folks that their strong programs will be left behind. I still strongly believe that there will be a conference such as the AAC that is going to be allowed to exist in that top division. That allowance will be due to precise rules drawn up with the express purpose of allowing such an occurrence to happen.

A school like Houston may even make it higher than that.

Conferences are talking about ceasing playing FCS teams because those are about to become two divisions below the top division instead of just one. There wont be any problem with playing the programs remaining behind in what is now the FBS division. Those games will all still happen and fans of those programs will still be able to come around and have their little one week bragging rights when their programs play well or even score a win. Their interest in college football will be kept that way and yes, the Networks think along those lines.


At least I know one other person gets it Wedge although I can think of enough others that would require fingers on both hands in order to count them all, maybe....

Yea, just keep telling yourself that.

Yeah, just keep telling yourselves that you will stop watching all together. Sound like a bunch of kids threatening to take their ball and go home, yet never do.
"Oh no! If we aren't in the same division as you then I will stop following college football!"

Your tears will not stop the progress, too far gone.

There are more football fans not watching college football right now than there are fans such as yourself that the Networks will lose when this all goes through.

Adios!

(09-01-2013 11:55 PM)FAUAEPi Wrote:  Anyways..... the AQ conferences and all of their Wall-Mart fan bases can suck it.

So what other groups of people do you like to negatively stereotype in order to soothe your wounded feelings?

(09-02-2013 05:50 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  

(09-02-2013 05:34 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 12:19 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 12:10 PM)Wedge Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 09:51 AM)10thMountain Wrote:  Not really, upsets happen in every sport, even more so in basketball

TV wants UT to be playing Ohio State, not New Mexico State this week and to create a system that would make that match up a benefit instead of a liability

That system will never exist, though. Just to use your example, Mack Brown's job security depends on him playing a few NMSUs every year. The boosters that fund Mack's $5 million salary want 10 wins a year, and no one will average 10 wins a year if their non-con schedule is filled with the best teams from the other P5 conferences.

Remember Mack's laughable line about "the NFL of college football"? Look at the real NFL. Bill Parcells just joined the Hall of Fame with a career winning percentage of .570. In CFB with a 12-game regular season, that would be an average of 7 wins a year. No modern CFB coach averaging 7 wins a year would last very long at a football factory like Texas or Ohio State or Alabama, let alone become a Hall of Famer. The system demands that the Big Boys be able to pad their win total vs. NMSU or Kent State or whomever.

I so wish I could still hand out extra reputation. I get why fans think it is about what is going on right now on the field but it has NOTHING to do with what is going on down on the field right now. There will still be some "easy" games scheduled but if anything, if those games become less and less "easy" then that will be more detrimental to those small programs than it will be helpful.

This really is ALL about control of rules. Currently fcs schools and schools that don't play football at all can stop measures put forward by the Major Schools and their Conferences. That is going to stop, one way or another.

Because of my belief that such is the main focus of having a new division, I don't understand the drastic fear by some folks that their strong programs will be left behind. I still strongly believe that there will be a conference such as the AAC that is going to be allowed to exist in that top division. That allowance will be due to precise rules drawn up with the express purpose of allowing such an occurrence to happen.

A school like Houston may even make it higher than that.

Conferences are talking about ceasing playing FCS teams because those are about to become two divisions below the top division instead of just one. There wont be any problem with playing the programs remaining behind in what is now the FBS division. Those games will all still happen and fans of those programs will still be able to come around and have their little one week bragging rights when their programs play well or even score a win. Their interest in college football will be kept that way and yes, the Networks think along those lines.


At least I know one other person gets it Wedge although I can think of enough others that would require fingers on both hands in order to count them all, maybe....

Yea, just keep telling yourself that.

Yeah, just keep telling yourselves that you will stop watching all together. Sound like a bunch of kids threatening to take their ball and go home, yet never do.
"Oh no! If we aren't in the same division as you then I will stop following college football!"

Your tears will not stop the progress, too far gone.

There are more football fans not watching college football right now than there are fans such as yourself that the Networks will lose when this all goes through.

Adios!

Sounds like the P5 fans talking about the split.

(09-02-2013 06:01 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  

(09-02-2013 05:50 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  

(09-02-2013 05:34 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 12:19 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 12:10 PM)Wedge Wrote:  That system will never exist, though. Just to use your example, Mack Brown's job security depends on him playing a few NMSUs every year. The boosters that fund Mack's $5 million salary want 10 wins a year, and no one will average 10 wins a year if their non-con schedule is filled with the best teams from the other P5 conferences.

Remember Mack's laughable line about "the NFL of college football"? Look at the real NFL. Bill Parcells just joined the Hall of Fame with a career winning percentage of .570. In CFB with a 12-game regular season, that would be an average of 7 wins a year. No modern CFB coach averaging 7 wins a year would last very long at a football factory like Texas or Ohio State or Alabama, let alone become a Hall of Famer. The system demands that the Big Boys be able to pad their win total vs. NMSU or Kent State or whomever.

I so wish I could still hand out extra reputation. I get why fans think it is about what is going on right now on the field but it has NOTHING to do with what is going on down on the field right now. There will still be some "easy" games scheduled but if anything, if those games become less and less "easy" then that will be more detrimental to those small programs than it will be helpful.

This really is ALL about control of rules. Currently fcs schools and schools that don't play football at all can stop measures put forward by the Major Schools and their Conferences. That is going to stop, one way or another.

Because of my belief that such is the main focus of having a new division, I don't understand the drastic fear by some folks that their strong programs will be left behind. I still strongly believe that there will be a conference such as the AAC that is going to be allowed to exist in that top division. That allowance will be due to precise rules drawn up with the express purpose of allowing such an occurrence to happen.

A school like Houston may even make it higher than that.

Conferences are talking about ceasing playing FCS teams because those are about to become two divisions below the top division instead of just one. There wont be any problem with playing the programs remaining behind in what is now the FBS division. Those games will all still happen and fans of those programs will still be able to come around and have their little one week bragging rights when their programs play well or even score a win. Their interest in college football will be kept that way and yes, the Networks think along those lines.


At least I know one other person gets it Wedge although I can think of enough others that would require fingers on both hands in order to count them all, maybe....

Yea, just keep telling yourself that.

Yeah, just keep telling yourselves that you will stop watching all together. Sound like a bunch of kids threatening to take their ball and go home, yet never do.
"Oh no! If we aren't in the same division as you then I will stop following college football!"

Your tears will not stop the progress, too far gone.

There are more football fans not watching college football right now than there are fans such as yourself that the Networks will lose when this all goes through.

Adios!

Sounds like the P5 fans talking about the split.

The difference is....we have zero control over all of this. You have control over your viewing or you supposed lack there of in the future. So no, it is not like us talking about the split because we are talking about something out of our control.

Nice try though.

MHver3 had an interesting series of tweets going last week in regards to a D4 split. I understand that 99% of his posts are just rumor (and nothing more), but this idea sounded like something that the P5 might like.

His concept is something like this:

1. D4 will be split into two subdivisions - D4-A and D4-B.
2. D4-A will be the P5 + ND + specific schools they want (about 70 members). Power football programs would go here. D4-A schools can no longer play FCS programs, and they only may play 1-2 D4-B schools a year (for the local rivalries).
3. D4-B will be the next 20-30 schools in line. Mid-major football programs would go here. The Big East + high major bball programs would also go here. D4-B schools can no longer play FCS programs. However, D4-B schools may play SEVERAL D4-A schools for increased exposure if they can acquire the agreements.
4. Each subdivision would control its own football playoff system, and has free reign to make all of their own rules regarding football.
5. A network (he says NBC, but that's not important here) will pick up the D4-B TV coverage and playoff schedule. A few cross-over opportunities will be available when both subdivision see fit (2-3 per year for "flavor").
6. In basketball, all D4 programs re-combine to form a much stronger top level of collegiate basketball. This will also happen in the other olympic sports as well.

What the P5 get:
- A stronger basketball field
- Control of their CFP
- Control over rules/regulations
- Better schedules to sell to TV/fans
- The ability to play local grudge matches in their new superconference (WVU-Marshall, LSU-Tulane, UT-Memphis)
- They can now play "elite" early season games without it ruining their playoff hopes

What the "new G3-5" get:
- A stronger basketball field
- Control of their CFP (and a real chance to ACCESS it)
- Control over rules/regulations (they don't have to play like the P5 do if they feel they can't afford it - or if they find it to be noncompetitive)
- A few solid postseason games vs. P5 (that have MEANING to them)
- Separation and a CLEAR path to D4-A (provided they meet requirements)
- MUCH BETTER SCHEDULES TO SELL TO TV/FANS
- They can now play power schools as they wish without it ruining their playoff hopes