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Snoop Dog reportedly met up with Silas Redd during his USC visit...
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blunderbuss Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Snoop Dog reportedly met up with Silas Redd during his USC visit...
(08-21-2013 04:40 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 04:38 PM)TomThumb Wrote:  PSU fans really need to post posting these lame defenses. Fulfilled legal obligations? WTF! Children were being raped in the PSU locker room and you're throwing out a "fulfilled legal obligations"?

Ok, what should he have done? Call the police immediately after receiving an incredibly vague story?

Yes. Especially when it involves child rape. Is that a difficult concept for you?
08-21-2013 05:49 PM
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psualltheway5 Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Snoop Dog reportedly met up with Silas Redd during his USC visit...
(08-21-2013 05:49 PM)blunderbuss Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 04:40 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 04:38 PM)TomThumb Wrote:  PSU fans really need to post posting these lame defenses. Fulfilled legal obligations? WTF! Children were being raped in the PSU locker room and you're throwing out a "fulfilled legal obligations"?

Ok, what should he have done? Call the police immediately after receiving an incredibly vague story?

Yes. Especially when it involves child rape. Is that a difficult concept for you?

He did inform the head of campus police, who McQueary was on record as saying that he often called him "the police".
08-21-2013 05:54 PM
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psualltheway5 Offline
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Post: #23
RE: Snoop Dog reportedly met up with Silas Redd during his USC visit...
(08-21-2013 05:05 PM)TomThumb Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 04:59 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  McQuery didn't say that under oath, either.

http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.s...atern.html

"There's no question in my mind that I conveyed to them that I saw Jerry in the showers and that it was severe sexual acts and that it was wrong and over the line," he said.

Continue reading the testimony...
08-21-2013 05:56 PM
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TomThumb Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Snoop Dog reportedly met up with Silas Redd during his USC visit...
(08-21-2013 05:56 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 05:05 PM)TomThumb Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 04:59 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  McQuery didn't say that under oath, either.

http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.s...atern.html

"There's no question in my mind that I conveyed to them that I saw Jerry in the showers and that it was severe sexual acts and that it was wrong and over the line," he said.

Continue reading the testimony...

McQueary made the decision to tell Paterno after consulting with his father the night before, he said.

"I got up the next morning early and called (Paterno's) house and told him I needed to see him," he said. "He said, I don't have a job for you and if that's what it's about, don't bother coming over, and I said coach it's about something much more serious. I need to come over and see you."

"I went to his house and sat at his kitchen table and told him I saw Jerry with a young boy in the shower. That it was way over the lines and extremely sexual in nature," McQueary testified. "The rough positioning I described but not in much detail.
08-21-2013 05:57 PM
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Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Offline
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Post: #25
RE: Snoop Dog reportedly met up with Silas Redd during his USC visit...
(08-21-2013 04:40 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 04:38 PM)TomThumb Wrote:  PSU fans really need to post posting these lame defenses. Fulfilled legal obligations? WTF! Children were being raped in the PSU locker room and you're throwing out a "fulfilled legal obligations"?

Ok, what should he have done? Call the police immediately after receiving an incredibly vague story?

No, he should have waited all weekend and then tell bits and pieces to the business manager and university president so as to not ruin anybody's weekend (except, of course that of the little boy who was very likely being repeatedly raped).

You guys are flat out nuts. It is honestly frightening. Now I know how Hitler did it.
08-21-2013 06:25 PM
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psualltheway5 Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Snoop Dog reportedly met up with Silas Redd during his USC visit...
(08-21-2013 06:25 PM)Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 04:40 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 04:38 PM)TomThumb Wrote:  PSU fans really need to post posting these lame defenses. Fulfilled legal obligations? WTF! Children were being raped in the PSU locker room and you're throwing out a "fulfilled legal obligations"?

Ok, what should he have done? Call the police immediately after receiving an incredibly vague story?

No, he should have waited all weekend and then tell bits and pieces to the business manager and university president so as to not ruin anybody's weekend (except, of course that of the little boy who was very likely being repeatedly raped).

You guys are flat out nuts. It is honestly frightening. Now I know how Hitler did it.

Have you ever read the boy's account of what happened? I suggest you check that out.
08-21-2013 06:34 PM
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NJRedMan Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Snoop Dog reportedly met up with Silas Redd during his USC visit...
(08-21-2013 04:21 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 02:07 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 01:47 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 12:56 PM)LUcanesfan Wrote:  "Hell, Miami had boosters paying for prostitutes to get abortions and that pales in comparison with what happened up at Penn State."

Uh, the prostitutes claim was never proven. You'll see that in the final report that should come out pretty soon... A lot of what Nevin said was thrown out and he tried his best to see what sticks. The NCAA, being master investigators (LOL), basically charged Miami with anything Nevin mentioned twice in the interviews. So in essence, they are taking the words of a lying felon as Gospel... Please don't let me compare how different the Penn State situation is/was. Two totally different situations and should not be compared together.

You're right. One involved student athletes and the other didn't.

What's gone on at all of these places is downright despicable. Only more despicable is the NCAA's arbitrary scale of priority. Which one makes them look better having addressed?

I'm pretty sure that covering up child rape is more despicable than anything the NCAA can ever do.

That had nothing to do with football. Don't give me the "They covered it up to protect the football program" excuse.
1. Paterno fulfilled his legal obligations in all of this, thus he was never charged before he died.
2. Schultz reported the issue to Wendell Courtney, who was in charge of the Second Mile, the place where Sandusky was actually getting kids. Courtney should have done something from that point on, and he did not.
3. Paterno never wanted Sandusky to bring kids around the facilities. Despite the fact that he supposedly "ran" the campus, there was a retirement agreement with Sandusky and Spanier, granting Sandusky emeritus status and giving him access to campus facilities.
4. People act like Sandusky retired after the 1998 investigation and that "Joe knew". He didn't. He retired a full 2 seasons after that. He was really "forced" to retire, wasn't he?
5. Sandusky was cleared of any wrongdoing in 1998 and it was illegal for Joe to know any details of the investigation.

Finally, if they tried to cover anything up, why did Joe even report the issue in the first place? Isn't the point of a cover up to tell the least amount of people as possible?

Paterno was never charged because he died before anyone was charged. If he didn't he would have been.

You guys would be funny if it wasn't so freakin' sad.
08-21-2013 06:51 PM
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TomThumb Offline
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Post: #28
RE: Snoop Dog reportedly met up with Silas Redd during his USC visit...
(08-21-2013 06:34 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  Have you ever read the boy's account of what happened? I suggest you check that out.

Link please.

I couldn't google what victim #2 had to say. All I found was some screwed up Paterno-worshipper threatening to out him in the media if he wouldn't agree to an interview for a documentary trying to clear Paterno's name:

http://www.tmz.com/2013/03/26/jerry-sand...tim-outed/
08-21-2013 06:56 PM
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blunderbuss Offline
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Post: #29
RE: Snoop Dog reportedly met up with Silas Redd during his USC visit...
This Ped State fan's mentality is disgusting. Seriously warped. I don't know what else to say.
08-21-2013 07:12 PM
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psualltheway5 Offline
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Post: #30
RE: Snoop Dog reportedly met up with Silas Redd during his USC visit...
(08-21-2013 06:51 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 04:21 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 02:07 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 01:47 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 12:56 PM)LUcanesfan Wrote:  "Hell, Miami had boosters paying for prostitutes to get abortions and that pales in comparison with what happened up at Penn State."

Uh, the prostitutes claim was never proven. You'll see that in the final report that should come out pretty soon... A lot of what Nevin said was thrown out and he tried his best to see what sticks. The NCAA, being master investigators (LOL), basically charged Miami with anything Nevin mentioned twice in the interviews. So in essence, they are taking the words of a lying felon as Gospel... Please don't let me compare how different the Penn State situation is/was. Two totally different situations and should not be compared together.

You're right. One involved student athletes and the other didn't.

What's gone on at all of these places is downright despicable. Only more despicable is the NCAA's arbitrary scale of priority. Which one makes them look better having addressed?

I'm pretty sure that covering up child rape is more despicable than anything the NCAA can ever do.

That had nothing to do with football. Don't give me the "They covered it up to protect the football program" excuse.
1. Paterno fulfilled his legal obligations in all of this, thus he was never charged before he died.
2. Schultz reported the issue to Wendell Courtney, who was in charge of the Second Mile, the place where Sandusky was actually getting kids. Courtney should have done something from that point on, and he did not.
3. Paterno never wanted Sandusky to bring kids around the facilities. Despite the fact that he supposedly "ran" the campus, there was a retirement agreement with Sandusky and Spanier, granting Sandusky emeritus status and giving him access to campus facilities.
4. People act like Sandusky retired after the 1998 investigation and that "Joe knew". He didn't. He retired a full 2 seasons after that. He was really "forced" to retire, wasn't he?
5. Sandusky was cleared of any wrongdoing in 1998 and it was illegal for Joe to know any details of the investigation.

Finally, if they tried to cover anything up, why did Joe even report the issue in the first place? Isn't the point of a cover up to tell the least amount of people as possible?

Paterno was never charged because he died before anyone was charged. If he didn't he would have been.

You guys would be funny if it wasn't so freakin' sad.

Wrong.
08-21-2013 07:14 PM
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NJRedMan Offline
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Post: #31
RE: Snoop Dog reportedly met up with Silas Redd during his USC visit...
(08-21-2013 07:14 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 06:51 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 04:21 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 02:07 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 01:47 PM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  You're right. One involved student athletes and the other didn't.

What's gone on at all of these places is downright despicable. Only more despicable is the NCAA's arbitrary scale of priority. Which one makes them look better having addressed?

I'm pretty sure that covering up child rape is more despicable than anything the NCAA can ever do.

That had nothing to do with football. Don't give me the "They covered it up to protect the football program" excuse.
1. Paterno fulfilled his legal obligations in all of this, thus he was never charged before he died.
2. Schultz reported the issue to Wendell Courtney, who was in charge of the Second Mile, the place where Sandusky was actually getting kids. Courtney should have done something from that point on, and he did not.
3. Paterno never wanted Sandusky to bring kids around the facilities. Despite the fact that he supposedly "ran" the campus, there was a retirement agreement with Sandusky and Spanier, granting Sandusky emeritus status and giving him access to campus facilities.
4. People act like Sandusky retired after the 1998 investigation and that "Joe knew". He didn't. He retired a full 2 seasons after that. He was really "forced" to retire, wasn't he?
5. Sandusky was cleared of any wrongdoing in 1998 and it was illegal for Joe to know any details of the investigation.

Finally, if they tried to cover anything up, why did Joe even report the issue in the first place? Isn't the point of a cover up to tell the least amount of people as possible?

Paterno was never charged because he died before anyone was charged. If he didn't he would have been.

You guys would be funny if it wasn't so freakin' sad.

Wrong.

Prove it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/02/sports....html?_r=0
08-21-2013 07:20 PM
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psualltheway5 Offline
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Post: #32
RE: Snoop Dog reportedly met up with Silas Redd during his USC visit...
(08-21-2013 07:20 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 07:14 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 06:51 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 04:21 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 02:07 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  I'm pretty sure that covering up child rape is more despicable than anything the NCAA can ever do.

That had nothing to do with football. Don't give me the "They covered it up to protect the football program" excuse.
1. Paterno fulfilled his legal obligations in all of this, thus he was never charged before he died.
2. Schultz reported the issue to Wendell Courtney, who was in charge of the Second Mile, the place where Sandusky was actually getting kids. Courtney should have done something from that point on, and he did not.
3. Paterno never wanted Sandusky to bring kids around the facilities. Despite the fact that he supposedly "ran" the campus, there was a retirement agreement with Sandusky and Spanier, granting Sandusky emeritus status and giving him access to campus facilities.
4. People act like Sandusky retired after the 1998 investigation and that "Joe knew". He didn't. He retired a full 2 seasons after that. He was really "forced" to retire, wasn't he?
5. Sandusky was cleared of any wrongdoing in 1998 and it was illegal for Joe to know any details of the investigation.

Finally, if they tried to cover anything up, why did Joe even report the issue in the first place? Isn't the point of a cover up to tell the least amount of people as possible?

Paterno was never charged because he died before anyone was charged. If he didn't he would have been.

You guys would be funny if it wasn't so freakin' sad.

Wrong.

Prove it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/02/sports....html?_r=0

Spanier was charged much later than Schultz and Spanier.

I win.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/colleg...e-1.973110
08-21-2013 07:29 PM
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NJRedMan Offline
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Post: #33
RE: Snoop Dog reportedly met up with Silas Redd during his USC visit...
(08-21-2013 07:29 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 07:20 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 07:14 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 06:51 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  
(08-21-2013 04:21 PM)psualltheway5 Wrote:  That had nothing to do with football. Don't give me the "They covered it up to protect the football program" excuse.
1. Paterno fulfilled his legal obligations in all of this, thus he was never charged before he died.
2. Schultz reported the issue to Wendell Courtney, who was in charge of the Second Mile, the place where Sandusky was actually getting kids. Courtney should have done something from that point on, and he did not.
3. Paterno never wanted Sandusky to bring kids around the facilities. Despite the fact that he supposedly "ran" the campus, there was a retirement agreement with Sandusky and Spanier, granting Sandusky emeritus status and giving him access to campus facilities.
4. People act like Sandusky retired after the 1998 investigation and that "Joe knew". He didn't. He retired a full 2 seasons after that. He was really "forced" to retire, wasn't he?
5. Sandusky was cleared of any wrongdoing in 1998 and it was illegal for Joe to know any details of the investigation.

Finally, if they tried to cover anything up, why did Joe even report the issue in the first place? Isn't the point of a cover up to tell the least amount of people as possible?

Paterno was never charged because he died before anyone was charged. If he didn't he would have been.

You guys would be funny if it wasn't so freakin' sad.

Wrong.

Prove it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/02/sports....html?_r=0

Spanier was charged much later than Schultz and Spanier.

I win.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/colleg...e-1.973110

You sure you won?

"Penn State football icon Joe Paterno probably adhered to the letter of the law when he told the school’s athletic director - but not the police - that former defensive coordinator Jerry Sandusky allegedly sexually abused a boy in the Nittany Lions’ locker room in 2002.

But attorneys familiar with child abuse statutes say that while the venerable college coach may not face criminal charges, he is hardly an innocent bystander."


Probably is such a law binding word.

From the article I posted.

"As for Paterno, who died in January, Kelly would not comment on his relationship to the investigation, saying, “He’s deceased, and that’s the end of it.”"
08-21-2013 07:56 PM
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Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Offline
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Post: #34
RE: Snoop Dog reportedly met up with Silas Redd during his USC visit...
No, you don't win. You have lost in a rout and that's the whole point. Your culture is so inward looking and insular that you don't even recognize how foolish you all look to the outside world. It's rather weird to be perfectly honest with you.

Believe me, I know this phenomenon well as my wife and her entire family are all PSU alums and they have all (except my wife) taken this very hard and very personally (which is super weird and deserving of a comprehensive mass psychology study, IMHO). The sad part is that they're all good, kind, generous people and normally very rational - except when it comes to Penn State football - and especially Joe Paterno - in which case all reason goes straight out the window in favor of an assortment of fairy tales of things they'd like to be true.

Seriously, we can talk domestic politics, geopolitics, history, other sports, religion, etc., without much of a problem even though we typically come at things from very different places. However, once Penn State comes up - even before this scandal - and they immediately launch into very rigid, often absurd, talking points that really stretch credulity.

I just spent a week on vacation with all of them and it's normally a very interesting week - our annual vacation to the beach. Last year and especially this year (now that they have regrouped) I spent all week listening to them trying to convince me - and themselves - that this is all one big mistake and/or conspiracy involving all sorts of different illogical bed fellows and that the truth will eventually come out and that when it does JoePa will be vindicated and the universe restored. I tell them, "Yeah, and when he gets out of prison, OJ will resume looking for Nicole's real killers." I also tell them that the problem is the that the truth HAS come out and that's why we have found ourselves where we are.

They don't like that one bit and frankly, I don't blame them. I wouldn't either if I was in their shoes. However, at some point you have to face reality even when it sucks.

Their mentality is basically that your BOT, your acting president, various media and news organizations - most notably ESPN, the president of the NCAA, the president of the Big Ten, the former director of the FBI, the Queen of England and Elvis' ghost are all involved in some sort of widespread nebulous conspiracy to make JoePa look bad for reasons that remain unclear to any sane human being. However, at the same time it is patently ridiculous for anyone to suggest that four men who work together every single day, have known each other well for years and years, and who all have a vested financial interest in protecting the money train that is the football program, would act on said interest.

I'm sorry but that is straight out of Crazytown, USA and it simply doesn't hold up to any modicum of common sense. Look, I'd like to believe in the Easter Bunny and Santa Claus and that most people are inherently kind and generous souls but that doesn't make that true either.

For me it just comes down to the timeline being messed up. Seriously, who waits 24 hours to report a child rape as McQueery did; or 48 hours as Paterno did? That kid may or may not have been raped by Sandusky in the shower - who knows? However that's not the point. The point is that Paterno certainly didn't know that at the time and he probably didn't know one way or the other the day he died. So why the hesitancy to do the humane thing?

More troubling, why was McQueery reporting a child rape to the football coach? This isn't like he saw someone in the office steal a stapler. He saw - or thought he saw - a little boy being raped by a grown man. What kind of a phucked up place has it where one reports the raping of children to the local football coach? In other words, why was Paterno involved at all? Further, when he was involved, why did he say to McQueery (according to Paterno himself), "Okay, you have done what you need to do. Now I have to figure out what I need to do?"

What the phuck was there to figure out?! A little boy was being raped for God's sake. Paterno did eventually report the rape - 48 hours later. Again, why on earth would anyone wait 48 hours to report the raping - or potential raping - of a child? I just cannot get past that point that everyone agrees on (including Paterno himself).

Here's what I think: I think EVERYTHING went through the Don. I think it was made clear to everyone inside or around the program that Joe had to be in the loop on everything from skipped classes, to roughed up girlfriends to stolen stereo equipment and so on and so forth. They had an image of being the paragons of college football to protect and that image would be tarnished if the minor indiscretions that happen at every football program were reported to the police and by extension the media.

That's what I think happened. I think McQueery knew this was more serious than most of the other hijinks their kids have gotten involved with. However, he also knew that the old man would be pissed at him if he went around him and straight to the po-po. The kid needed a job and that was the only program he had ever been around - indeed the only town he had ever lived in. He choked and chose the program over humanity. Then Paterno, fearing that this animal Sandusky - who he had long suspected of being a creep - was going to tear down all that JoePa had built up over the course of decades due to Sandusky's sexual proclivities and perversions. I think Paterno spent that 48 hour window consulting (read: conspiring) with his son - an attorney - and his other legal advisors over what he had to do to be legally clear while at the same time not blowing the roof off his program.

I think they all got away with it until Jerry got touchy feely a little too far outside of the PSU bubble and some alert guidance counselor and a victim's mom courageously stepped forward and said ENOUGH! That led to Sarah Ganim - who is an absolute hero in all of this and should have the PSU journalism school named after her - doing her thing which led to a monster being put away and possibly three more monsters joining him.

It's over and JoePa has been disgraced in the public's minds eye. That is not going to change no matter what happens with Spanier, Curley or Shultz. It is over and your best bet now is to take your medicine, turn the page and support Bill O'Brien. Also, please acknowledge how callously your leaders treated those poor kids. Even if you don't agree that they conspired against them (even though they pretty obviously did do just that), at the very least they were terribly uncaring about those "throw away kids." Let me put it another way. Had that been JoePa's grandchild alone with the Tickle Monster, he would have taken a much more aggressive course of action regarding the authorities.

That is a disgraceful revelation.

I think that is why people are so venomous towards PSU. You all just seem so uncaring towards those poor kids while at the same time wailing about your own victim status (for being stripped of a few scholies - BFD). It's just so incredibly tacky and off-putting and yet the wailing seems to be intensifying and the callousness towards the actual victims is as strong as ever. I don't pretend to speak for everyone but it has left a very sour taste in my mouth.

Your football coach - who spent 40 years telling everyone how virtuous he was - choked when the chips were on the table. He may - may - have done just enough to avoid a prison sentence (we'll never know because he died of a guilty conscience before we could ever find out) but he fell well short of his own standard and frankly, short of the basic standard you or I would expect from a man in his position were it one of our loved ones who needed help.
(This post was last modified: 08-21-2013 10:15 PM by Dr. Isaly von Yinzer.)
08-21-2013 10:06 PM
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bitcruncher Offline
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Post: #35
RE: Snoop Dog reportedly met up with Silas Redd during his USC visit...
This thread has become thoroughly unproductive, and totally off subject. The discussion was supposed to be about Snoop Dog's visit with Silas Redd while on an official visit to USC...

It was not supposed to turn into a discussion about Penn State and the events in Happy Valley. I expect psualltheway5 to not turn every discussion into a debate about what went on with Sandusky et al...

IMO Penn State is lucky it still exists. Were it up to me I would have had the campus wiped from the face of the Earth, and the ground salted so no ideas could ever grow there again...

Penn State is an unholy organization that needs to be removed from the Earth, and the fact that you're debating what happened merely proves that Penn State alums don't give a damn about the victims. They see themselves as victims, not the abused, merely because it hurt their precious football program...

The U.S. Dept. of Education still has yet to address PSU's Cleary Act violations. I wish they'd yank Penn State's accreditation. But if that were going to happen it would have by now. I can dream, however...

IMO any culture that causes people to defend those that molest children is an anathema to the people of Earth, and should be scoured from the face of the planet, as should anyone who defends such a culture...
(This post was last modified: 08-22-2013 11:02 AM by bitcruncher.)
08-22-2013 11:02 AM
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