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Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
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randaddyminer Offline
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Post: #61
RE: Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
(07-31-2013 09:58 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(07-31-2013 07:17 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  
(07-31-2013 03:29 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(07-31-2013 03:11 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  
(07-31-2013 07:50 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  Thanks man, glad you acknowledged it. 04-cheers

no problem, I'm glad that was your only response to the post 03-nutkick 04-cheers

Just remember, UTEP has no kind of pull with the Sun Bowl that could possibly be leveraged for AAC membership. The Sun Bowl wants P5 affiliations, only. Their entire history confirms that. 07-coffee3

so you concede UTEP has the pull? or why are you changing the topic?

What? UTEP obviously does not have the pull to bring the Sun to the AAC. Crazy. And that is the topic of this thread.

deflection... It's okay dude, just as long as you realize it
08-01-2013 12:39 AM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #62
RE: Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
(08-01-2013 12:39 AM)randaddyminer Wrote:  
(07-31-2013 09:58 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(07-31-2013 07:17 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  
(07-31-2013 03:29 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(07-31-2013 03:11 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  no problem, I'm glad that was your only response to the post 03-nutkick 04-cheers

Just remember, UTEP has no kind of pull with the Sun Bowl that could possibly be leveraged for AAC membership. The Sun Bowl wants P5 affiliations, only. Their entire history confirms that. 07-coffee3

so you concede UTEP has the pull? or why are you changing the topic?

What? UTEP obviously does not have the pull to bring the Sun to the AAC. Crazy. And that is the topic of this thread.

deflection... It's okay dude, just as long as you realize it

Dude, WTF are you talking about? The topic of this thread is whether UTEP could leverage the Sun to join the AAC, and the OP claims it could:

"UTEP owns the Sun Bowl so one would think they could get this done if they wanted to."

So my retort that UTEP clearly does NOT have the pull with the Sun Bowl to get it to sign with the AAC is no 'deflection', it is right on point. You're starting to get weird now. 01-wingedeagle

The main evidence the OP marshaled to support his view was that in 1998, UTEP (allegedly) influenced the Sun to take TCU over Wyoming because of displeasure that Wyoming was being invited to the newly-forming MWC while UTEP was getting left behind. First, that is questionable (the Sun also passed over 9-2 UCF, a school had nothing to do with the WAC/MWC situation, so the decision to invite TCU could have just been partiality to another Texas school), and second, even if true, it's a trivial point, since passing over one no-name WAC team for another is a pretty meaningless indicator of the Sun's willingness to sign a tie-in deal with a non-P5 conference, when they've only invited ONE non-P5/AQ school since 1970 and even in that one year, 1998, that was because no P5/AQ schools were available!

So dude, you have no point, coming or going. I was just trying to be gentle with you by allowing you to back-track from your most obvious goof, 1998 vs 1999. But if you insist... 07-coffee3
(This post was last modified: 08-01-2013 07:30 AM by quo vadis.)
08-01-2013 07:07 AM
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Runner Offline
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Post: #63
RE: Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
Why would UTEP want in to the AAC? I think they have their sights on the MWC.
08-01-2013 10:29 AM
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randaddyminer Offline
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Post: #64
RE: Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
(08-01-2013 07:07 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(08-01-2013 12:39 AM)randaddyminer Wrote:  
(07-31-2013 09:58 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(07-31-2013 07:17 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  
(07-31-2013 03:29 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Just remember, UTEP has no kind of pull with the Sun Bowl that could possibly be leveraged for AAC membership. The Sun Bowl wants P5 affiliations, only. Their entire history confirms that. 07-coffee3

so you concede UTEP has the pull? or why are you changing the topic?

What? UTEP obviously does not have the pull to bring the Sun to the AAC. Crazy. And that is the topic of this thread.

deflection... It's okay dude, just as long as you realize it

Dude, WTF are you talking about? The topic of this thread is whether UTEP could leverage the Sun to join the AAC, and the OP claims it could:

"UTEP owns the Sun Bowl so one would think they could get this done if they wanted to."

So my retort that UTEP clearly does NOT have the pull with the Sun Bowl to get it to sign with the AAC is no 'deflection', it is right on point. You're starting to get weird now. 01-wingedeagle

The main evidence the OP marshaled to support his view was that in 1998, UTEP (allegedly) influenced the Sun to take TCU over Wyoming because of displeasure that Wyoming was being invited to the newly-forming MWC while UTEP was getting left behind. First, that is questionable (the Sun also passed over 9-2 UCF, a school had nothing to do with the WAC/MWC situation, so the decision to invite TCU could have just been partiality to another Texas school), and second, even if true, it's a trivial point, since passing over one no-name WAC team for another is a pretty meaningless indicator of the Sun's willingness to sign a tie-in deal with a non-P5 conference, when they've only invited ONE non-P5/AQ school since 1970 and even in that one year, 1998, that was because no P5/AQ schools were available!

So dude, you have no point, coming or going. I was just trying to be gentle with you by allowing you to back-track from your most obvious goof, 1998 vs 1999. But if you insist... 07-coffee3

Read the damn thread, dip 03-thumbsup, are you really this dumb or are you just deflecting more? 07-coffee3

I initially stated UTEP fans would rather be in the MWC rather than the AAC. If that upset you, too bad. You replied to ME by saying something to the effect that UTEP didn't have any pull with the sun bowl, not even for Cusa. Now that I've shown you that is not the case, you are trying to weasel your way out of the argument by trying to reference the original question. Good try 04-cheers
(This post was last modified: 08-01-2013 03:22 PM by randaddyminer.)
08-01-2013 03:01 PM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #65
RE: Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
(08-01-2013 03:01 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  
(08-01-2013 07:07 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(08-01-2013 12:39 AM)randaddyminer Wrote:  
(07-31-2013 09:58 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(07-31-2013 07:17 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  so you concede UTEP has the pull? or why are you changing the topic?

What? UTEP obviously does not have the pull to bring the Sun to the AAC. Crazy. And that is the topic of this thread.

deflection... It's okay dude, just as long as you realize it

Dude, WTF are you talking about? The topic of this thread is whether UTEP could leverage the Sun to join the AAC, and the OP claims it could:

"UTEP owns the Sun Bowl so one would think they could get this done if they wanted to."

So my retort that UTEP clearly does NOT have the pull with the Sun Bowl to get it to sign with the AAC is no 'deflection', it is right on point. You're starting to get weird now. 01-wingedeagle

The main evidence the OP marshaled to support his view was that in 1998, UTEP (allegedly) influenced the Sun to take TCU over Wyoming because of displeasure that Wyoming was being invited to the newly-forming MWC while UTEP was getting left behind. First, that is questionable (the Sun also passed over 9-2 UCF, a school had nothing to do with the WAC/MWC situation, so the decision to invite TCU could have just been partiality to another Texas school), and second, even if true, it's a trivial point, since passing over one no-name WAC team for another is a pretty meaningless indicator of the Sun's willingness to sign a tie-in deal with a non-P5 conference, when they've only invited ONE non-P5/AQ school since 1970 and even in that one year, 1998, that was because no P5/AQ schools were available!

So dude, you have no point, coming or going. I was just trying to be gentle with you by allowing you to back-track from your most obvious goof, 1998 vs 1999. But if you insist... 07-coffee3

Read the damn thread, dip 03-thumbsup, are you really this dumb or are you just deflecting more? 07-coffee3

I initially stated UTEP fans would rather be in the MWC rather than the AAC. If that upset you, too bad. You replied to ME by saying something to the effect that UTEP didn't have any pull with the sun bowl, not even for Cusa. Now that I've shown you that is not the case, you are trying to weasel your way out of the argument by trying to reference the original question. Good try 04-cheers

Are you really this stupid to think I couldn't go back and check to see if your account of the thread is accurate? 01-wingedeagle

First, I had no qualms with anyone saying UTEP would prefer to be in the MWC than AAC. In fact, i questioned why UTEP would want to be in the AAC too (#21).

Second, you claimed that UTEP "controls" the Sun Bowl and is UTEP's "property" (both post #19), which implies that UTEP could indeed guarantee a tie-in with the AAC if it wanted to.

That struck me as silly, so I then replied (#22) that the Sun has no interest in being tied to small-time, G5 conferences and would only make such a tie if they had no choice, so no, UTEP does not have enough pull to do that. I did not say UTEP had no pull at all with the Sun.

You replied (#27) that if i doubted how much pull UTEP has, I could reference 1999 (sic! LOL) Wyoming and how they missed out on the bowl thanks to UTEP's influence.

That's when I began to school you (#30, 39) about how the Sun hasn't invited UTEP since the 1960s and it was revealed that since 1970, the ONLY time the Sun invited a team from a small conference (TCU, 1998) was when nobody from a major, AQ conference was available.

Of course you thought that your goof about Wyoming 1999 vs 1998 saved you, but i just explained how that doesn't matter at all, since even if UTEP exerted pull to get TCU in over Wyoming in 1998 because of the WAC/MWC issue (again, debatable since 9-2 UCF was passed by too) having pull to get the Sun to choose one G5 team over another tells us NOTHING about UTEP's ability to get the Sun to sign with a G5 conference as a tie-in. A silly idea, since the entire Sun history since 1970 shows it wants to match major-conference teams.

Yet you keep rambling about "deflection", which of course is YOUR own method of deflection, since I have shown that you have no defensible point whatsoever in this exchange.

Bottom line: There is NO REASON AT ALL to think that UTEP has ANYWHERE NEAR the pull needed to bring the Sun Bowl with it to the AAC. NONE.
08-01-2013 04:11 PM
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UTEPDallas Offline
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Post: #66
RE: Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
Quo,

UTEP owns the stadium that alone makes UTEP have some pull with the Sunnies. Having said that, it's VERY unlikely that UTEP would ever go nuclear with the Sunnies and demand to have UTEP's conference or any other Gof5 conference anchoring the bowl. The reason for that it's because it's economic suicide. CBS has been a great partner for the Sunnies and the city of El Paso along with local businesses like the platform the network offers to region on New Year's Eve. That's way better than the alternative which would be ESPN2 between Christmas and New Year's Eve with a very bad time slot. It's not about ticket sales since the locals support it very well. Does it really matter if it's Pitt, Houston, Southern Miss, Fresno State, Georgia Tech or Temple against the Pac-12? Absolutely not. People will show up regardless. It's CBS the one who calls the shots and if they want P5 vs P5 that's what they'll get. The day UTEP demands things to the Sunnies and they comply that will be the day CBS will cease their partnership with the Sunnies. UTEP knows that and they will not go that far to bat for their conference. UTEP not flexing its muscles is WAY different than not having any pull with the Sunnies. The only thing UTEP is doing is turning a blind eye and getting money in return since the Sun Bowl is a money maker for the community. That's a win win for everybody.
08-01-2013 04:16 PM
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Melky Cabrera Offline
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Post: #67
RE: Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
Remember when Memphis was going to bring us the Liberty Bowl? 03-lmfao
(This post was last modified: 08-01-2013 04:41 PM by Melky Cabrera.)
08-01-2013 04:41 PM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #68
RE: Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
(08-01-2013 04:16 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  Quo,

..... UTEP not flexing its muscles is WAY different than not having any pull with the Sunnies.

UTEPDallas, thanks for that information, but I have never said that UTEP has NO pull with the Sun Bowl. I've only said UTEP does not have enough pull to get the Sun Bowl to sign a tie-in with the AAC. Big difference there. 07-coffee3
(This post was last modified: 08-01-2013 05:59 PM by quo vadis.)
08-01-2013 05:58 PM
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randaddyminer Offline
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Post: #69
RE: Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
(08-01-2013 04:11 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(08-01-2013 03:01 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  
(08-01-2013 07:07 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(08-01-2013 12:39 AM)randaddyminer Wrote:  
(07-31-2013 09:58 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  What? UTEP obviously does not have the pull to bring the Sun to the AAC. Crazy. And that is the topic of this thread.

deflection... It's okay dude, just as long as you realize it

Dude, WTF are you talking about? The topic of this thread is whether UTEP could leverage the Sun to join the AAC, and the OP claims it could:

"UTEP owns the Sun Bowl so one would think they could get this done if they wanted to."

So my retort that UTEP clearly does NOT have the pull with the Sun Bowl to get it to sign with the AAC is no 'deflection', it is right on point. You're starting to get weird now. 01-wingedeagle

The main evidence the OP marshaled to support his view was that in 1998, UTEP (allegedly) influenced the Sun to take TCU over Wyoming because of displeasure that Wyoming was being invited to the newly-forming MWC while UTEP was getting left behind. First, that is questionable (the Sun also passed over 9-2 UCF, a school had nothing to do with the WAC/MWC situation, so the decision to invite TCU could have just been partiality to another Texas school), and second, even if true, it's a trivial point, since passing over one no-name WAC team for another is a pretty meaningless indicator of the Sun's willingness to sign a tie-in deal with a non-P5 conference, when they've only invited ONE non-P5/AQ school since 1970 and even in that one year, 1998, that was because no P5/AQ schools were available!

So dude, you have no point, coming or going. I was just trying to be gentle with you by allowing you to back-track from your most obvious goof, 1998 vs 1999. But if you insist... 07-coffee3

Read the damn thread, dip 03-thumbsup, are you really this dumb or are you just deflecting more? 07-coffee3

I initially stated UTEP fans would rather be in the MWC rather than the AAC. If that upset you, too bad. You replied to ME by saying something to the effect that UTEP didn't have any pull with the sun bowl, not even for Cusa. Now that I've shown you that is not the case, you are trying to weasel your way out of the argument by trying to reference the original question. Good try 04-cheers

Are you really this stupid to think I couldn't go back and check to see if your account of the thread is accurate? 01-wingedeagle

First, I had no qualms with anyone saying UTEP would prefer to be in the MWC than AAC. In fact, i questioned why UTEP would want to be in the AAC too (#21).

Second, you claimed that UTEP "controls" the Sun Bowl and is UTEP's "property" (both post #19), which implies that UTEP could indeed guarantee a tie-in with the AAC if it wanted to.

That struck me as silly, so I then replied (#22) that the Sun has no interest in being tied to small-time, G5 conferences and would only make such a tie if they had no choice, so no, UTEP does not have enough pull to do that. I did not say UTEP had no pull at all with the Sun.

You replied (#27) that if i doubted how much pull UTEP has, I could reference 1999 (sic! LOL) Wyoming and how they missed out on the bowl thanks to UTEP's influence.

That's when I began to school you (#30, 39) about how the Sun hasn't invited UTEP since the 1960s and it was revealed that since 1970, the ONLY time the Sun invited a team from a small conference (TCU, 1998) was when nobody from a major, AQ conference was available.

Of course you thought that your goof about Wyoming 1999 vs 1998 saved you, but i just explained how that doesn't matter at all, since even if UTEP exerted pull to get TCU in over Wyoming in 1998 because of the WAC/MWC issue (again, debatable since 9-2 UCF was passed by too) having pull to get the Sun to choose one G5 team over another tells us NOTHING about UTEP's ability to get the Sun to sign with a G5 conference as a tie-in. A silly idea, since the entire Sun history since 1970 shows it wants to match major-conference teams.

Yet you keep rambling about "deflection", which of course is YOUR own method of deflection, since I have shown that you have no defensible point whatsoever in this exchange.

Bottom line: There is NO REASON AT ALL to think that UTEP has ANYWHERE NEAR the pull needed to bring the Sun Bowl with it to the AAC. NONE.

Yeah, okay... Anything else? 03-thumbsup
08-02-2013 02:42 AM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #70
RE: Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
(08-02-2013 02:42 AM)randaddyminer Wrote:  
(08-01-2013 04:11 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Bottom line: There is NO REASON AT ALL to think that UTEP has ANYWHERE NEAR the pull needed to bring the Sun Bowl with it to the AAC. NONE.

Yeah, okay... Anything else? 03-thumbsup

Now that you mention it:

03-nutkick

03-lmfao
08-02-2013 07:38 AM
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RE: Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
(07-30-2013 08:44 AM)EarthBoundMisfit Wrote:  If Memphis can KEEP around 40,000+ butts in the seats on Saturdays and rebuild under Coach Fuente...I think the LB will come back to us with hand in hands.

Honest question: Has Memphis football ever averaged 40,000 butts in seats for a season? Just because you haven't lately doesn't mean you haven't ever.

Quote:As for UTEP bringing the Sun Bowl...it could happen. The AAC NEEDS exposure. We have it with our contract with ESPN. I think that UTEP is in the same boat as Memphis though....they have to rebuild their football.

To REbuild, don't you have to have built something in the first place?
08-02-2013 08:32 AM
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gulfcoastgal Offline
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Post: #72
RE: Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
(08-02-2013 08:32 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(07-30-2013 08:44 AM)EarthBoundMisfit Wrote:  If Memphis can KEEP around 40,000+ butts in the seats on Saturdays and rebuild under Coach Fuente...I think the LB will come back to us with hand in hands.

Honest question: Has Memphis football ever averaged 40,000 butts in seats for a season? Just because you haven't lately doesn't mean you haven't ever.

Quote:As for UTEP bringing the Sun Bowl...it could happen. The AAC NEEDS exposure. We have it with our contract with ESPN. I think that UTEP is in the same boat as Memphis though....they have to rebuild their football.

To REbuild, don't you have to have built something in the first place?

I didn't even know this board existed...looks like I've got lots of reading I to do. To answer your first question, the Tigers averaged @ 40,000 per season three times within the last decade. I only know this b/c I attended games during the 2003-05 seasons. I asked on another board if this is considered "good" for a school like Memphis and was told that it is. Just looking at last season, over 39,000 attended the opener against UT Martin. I don't think 40,000 is an unreasonable expectation or out of the question based on recent history (within the last 10 years).

As to the other point, I don't know many Tiger football fans with unreasonable expectations. Most would be thrilled with bowl eligibility at this point...which is what garnered 40,000 attendees in the past. Not sure if this applies here or not, but it does show that Memphis has a dedicated fan base to build upon. https://blogs.emory.edu/sportsmarketing/...onference/
08-02-2013 10:33 AM
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blunderbuss Offline
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Post: #73
RE: Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
40K is great for a non-AQ school. Hell, it's better than several AQ schools. Memphis' problem is that it's obvious their core football fanbase is very small and the rest of the folks that show are showing up for the big game vs Cincy or Louisville or whoever else would be considered a big game. If Memphis could draw 40K vs anybody they play then that would be really impressive for a non-AQ urban school.
08-02-2013 10:42 AM
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gulfcoastgal Offline
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Post: #74
RE: Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
Eh, maybe...maybe not. Here are the home attendance numbers for the time frame I referenced. BTW, I selected 2003-2005 b/c this is when I attended games.

2003 Ave. 40,622
Tennessee Tech 26,101
Ole Miss 51,914
Arkansas State 38,093
UAB 37,354
ECU 40,131
Cincinnati 42,884
USF 47,875

2004 Ave. 41,175
Chattanooga 38,133
Houston 35,297
Tulane 32,897
Louisville 52,384 CUSA attendance record
USM 47,163

2005 Ave. 39,991
Ole Miss 53,339
Chattanooga 30,772
UTEP 30,053
ECU 31,710
UAB 47,669
Marshall 46,403

The Ole Miss game is a rivalry/water cooler game. The Louisville game set a CUSA attendance record on a weeknight. I remember walking around the Liberty Bowl, looking for a bathroom w/o an insane line thinking "Pregnant lady here...Get out of the way." 03-lmfao

IDK, I'm inclined to side with the Emory study and feel 40,000 is doable with a quality on the field product. Heck, close to 40,000 were curious enough to check out the new coach during last year's opener against UT Martin. Unfortunately, the Tigers lost the game and the curiosity seekers.
08-02-2013 04:55 PM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #75
RE: Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
(08-02-2013 04:55 PM)gulfcoastgal Wrote:  IDK, I'm inclined to side with the Emory study and feel 40,000 is doable with a quality on the field product. Heck, close to 40,000 were curious enough to check out the new coach during last year's opener against UT Martin. Unfortunately, the Tigers lost the game and the curiosity seekers.

40,000 is a very respectable fan-base. That is indeed a solid foundation for Memphis to build on. 04-cheers
08-02-2013 06:20 PM
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randaddyminer Offline
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RE: Could UTEP use Sun Bowl tie in to gain entrance into AAC?
(08-02-2013 07:38 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(08-02-2013 02:42 AM)randaddyminer Wrote:  
(08-01-2013 04:11 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Bottom line: There is NO REASON AT ALL to think that UTEP has ANYWHERE NEAR the pull needed to bring the Sun Bowl with it to the AAC. NONE.

Yeah, okay... Anything else? 03-thumbsup

Now that you mention it:

03-nutkick

03-lmfao

deflect much? 03-thumbsup
08-04-2013 04:10 PM
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