(06-24-2013 04:54 AM)jdgaucho Wrote:  Pacific coming back to the WCC should help the conference's cause.

Agreed, but they need the PAC scheduling them more, too.

(06-24-2013 04:04 AM)Freshy Wrote:  

(06-23-2013 07:27 AM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  I don't think the point of the American is to compare it to the P5 conferences...Its not one of those...and its not supposed to be. That is the biggest difference between it and the Big East, which was a "pretend" football conference. It only had 8 members, which ultimately led to its downfall, IMO. If it wanted to be a power conference, it would have had to build up more football programs to support that title. 8 was most definitely not enough.

Now the conference will stand on its own and although the other G5 conferences want to see it fail, they are in the position to have to make something happen. We have seen a team or two make some noise, but the conferences as a whole have not. What the American has is the ability to makes moves nationally from multiple programs no matter what sport. Having multiple quality programs are the biggest aspirations for the MAC or Sun Belt and may be unattainable going forward. CUSA will remain to be seen...the MWC may have that ability because of its geographic advantages.

It is going to take a few years to see American Conf attention transpire in the national media...but results eventually will garner attention and respect. OOC scheduling is paramount, this is not an anytime, anywhere conference...OOC schedules have to be strategically worked out to give American programs the ability to win OOC games...that means home and home scheduling, more neutral site games in basketball, and no body bag games.

I don't think it is fair to say that other G5 conferences want to see the AAC fail. Rather, what I think is that the other four conferences want to see a conference that in all manners except its newness is perfectly representative of a G5 conference return to the same status that the rest of them suffer from.

What you say about individual teams making noise while whole conferences have not is absolutely true, and is the bane of the G5's existence. This fact alone gives the P5 its prime excuse when putting down the successful G5 teams: competition.

The part about the AAC making moves nationally while other conferences lack that is not true. All conferences can make moves nationally. That is a factor of wins and losses, not of prestige. In terms of having schools positioned for those wins and losses, all of the G5 have that factor to some degree. To use CUSA as an example, their outlook is more long term with three football startups in universities in large cities with existing large athletic departments. Add to that additions like Western Kentucky with their basketball history, ODU with their women's basketball history, FAU and UTSA with recent baseball success, and MTSU with its all-around sports success, and you have a conference that has reason to be optimistic in the long term before you even get to the five holdovers. The other three conferences also have their reasons to see the glass as half-full...the AAC has no monopoly in this area.

AAC's positioning as a representative of the G5 is goin to hurt it in the media in the long term. Results can cause a flair up of attention on occasion, but in general, the G5's accomplishments are always going to get pushed off the front page the moment some P5 recruit wakes up early in the morning and puts his t-shirt on backwards in the darkness.

In theory OOC scheduling is where the AAC could differentiate itself. The conference deliberately went after programs in large cities with capital improvement projects in the works. These types of things intrigue P5 opponents...especially those with major alumni bases in the city. In practice, the brutal economics of being in the G5 are going to bring the AAC down to the level of the other four conferences, where buy games are a fact of life, and P5 teams don't play neutral site without guarantees that are often embarrassing confirmation of the G5 team's stature in the world of amateur athletics.

Two things will be a little different in the AAC.

One, their level of exposure will be very high. Every single football game wil be televised and 60 of 66 games on ABC/ESPN/ESPN2/ESPN-U. Every AAC home basketball game will be televised with 117 on ABC/ESPN/ESPN2/ESPNU plus another 6-12 on CBS broadcast. There's no other G5 conference with a contract anything like that.

Secondly, the AAC athletic budgets are much higher across the board than the athletic budgets of the other G5 conferences. Pay games are not that common in the AAC--in fact several AAC teams actually enjoy 7 game home schedules. The larger athletic budgets give the AAC somewhat of an advantage.

(06-24-2013 08:35 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(06-24-2013 04:04 AM)Freshy Wrote:  

(06-23-2013 07:27 AM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  I don't think the point of the American is to compare it to the P5 conferences...Its not one of those...and its not supposed to be. That is the biggest difference between it and the Big East, which was a "pretend" football conference. It only had 8 members, which ultimately led to its downfall, IMO. If it wanted to be a power conference, it would have had to build up more football programs to support that title. 8 was most definitely not enough.

Now the conference will stand on its own and although the other G5 conferences want to see it fail, they are in the position to have to make something happen. We have seen a team or two make some noise, but the conferences as a whole have not. What the American has is the ability to makes moves nationally from multiple programs no matter what sport. Having multiple quality programs are the biggest aspirations for the MAC or Sun Belt and may be unattainable going forward. CUSA will remain to be seen...the MWC may have that ability because of its geographic advantages.

It is going to take a few years to see American Conf attention transpire in the national media...but results eventually will garner attention and respect. OOC scheduling is paramount, this is not an anytime, anywhere conference...OOC schedules have to be strategically worked out to give American programs the ability to win OOC games...that means home and home scheduling, more neutral site games in basketball, and no body bag games.

I don't think it is fair to say that other G5 conferences want to see the AAC fail. Rather, what I think is that the other four conferences want to see a conference that in all manners except its newness is perfectly representative of a G5 conference return to the same status that the rest of them suffer from.

What you say about individual teams making noise while whole conferences have not is absolutely true, and is the bane of the G5's existence. This fact alone gives the P5 its prime excuse when putting down the successful G5 teams: competition.

The part about the AAC making moves nationally while other conferences lack that is not true. All conferences can make moves nationally. That is a factor of wins and losses, not of prestige. In terms of having schools positioned for those wins and losses, all of the G5 have that factor to some degree. To use CUSA as an example, their outlook is more long term with three football startups in universities in large cities with existing large athletic departments. Add to that additions like Western Kentucky with their basketball history, ODU with their women's basketball history, FAU and UTSA with recent baseball success, and MTSU with its all-around sports success, and you have a conference that has reason to be optimistic in the long term before you even get to the five holdovers. The other three conferences also have their reasons to see the glass as half-full...the AAC has no monopoly in this area.

AAC's positioning as a representative of the G5 is goin to hurt it in the media in the long term. Results can cause a flair up of attention on occasion, but in general, the G5's accomplishments are always going to get pushed off the front page the moment some P5 recruit wakes up early in the morning and puts his t-shirt on backwards in the darkness.

In theory OOC scheduling is where the AAC could differentiate itself. The conference deliberately went after programs in large cities with capital improvement projects in the works. These types of things intrigue P5 opponents...especially those with major alumni bases in the city. In practice, the brutal economics of being in the G5 are going to bring the AAC down to the level of the other four conferences, where buy games are a fact of life, and P5 teams don't play neutral site without guarantees that are often embarrassing confirmation of the G5 team's stature in the world of amateur athletics.

Two things will be a little different in the AAC.

One, their level of exposure will be very high. Every single football game wil be televised and 60 of 66 games on ABC/ESPN/ESPN2/ESPN-U. Every AAC home basketball game will be televised with 117 on ABC/ESPN/ESPN2/ESPNU plus another 6-12 on CBS broadcast. There's no other G5 conference with a contract anything like that.

Secondly, the AAC athletic budgets are much higher across the board than the athletic budgets of the other G5 conferences. Pay games are not that common in the AAC--in fact several AAC teams actually enjoy 7 game home schedules. The larger athletic budgets give he AAC somewhat of an advantage.

Not to mention the facilities. I have said this point before, ticket sales are an undervalued revenue source. Memphis makes a lot of money on basketball because they can average over 16K a game. ECU makes a lot of money in football because it can get 50K in football. This goes under the control what you can control mantra. Functioning like you are in a P5 conference and winning will provide the revenue needed to separate from other G5 conference members. This can put you on a level with lower level (at least) P5 members even if you can't match their TV revenue. That's the goal...act like you belong and perform that way...if you have any doubts, drop on back. Its time for Tulane to step it up, that is the one all around program where there are big time question marks. Of course, then again, Tulane can always be the Northwestern or Vandy of the American Conference.

(06-24-2013 09:24 AM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  Not to mention the facilities. I have said this point before, ticket sales are an undervalued revenue source. Memphis makes a lot of money on basketball because they can average over 16K a game. ECU makes a lot of money in football because it can get 50K in football. This goes under the control what you can control mantra. Functioning like you are in a P5 conference and winning will provide the revenue needed to separate from other G5 conference members. This can put you on a level with lower level (at least) P5 members even if you can't match their TV revenue. That's the goal...act like you belong and perform that way...if you have any doubts, drop on back. Its time for Tulane to step it up, that is the one all around program where there are big time question marks. Of course, then again, Tulane can always be the Northwestern or Vandy of the American Conference.

Tulane needs to step up on the field. But they have stepped up in terms of money - 100Mill in facilities investment the last few year (and growing) plus a significant increase in operating budgets.
Regarding some other comments, C-USA took some growth programs (like ODU) but also took some non-growth programs with limited resources. I'm afraid the political power in that conference has shifted to the non-growthj program side, but we'll see.

The AAC IMO will have an easier time and get more bang for it's buck by investing a great share of it's resources into hoops. At least in that big $ sport, the AAC and the other non power 5/6 have a legit chance at gaining a national championship and the prominence and prestige that goes with it.

SMU was wise to sign Larry Brown & Tim Jankovich as it shows the state of Texas & the college hoops world that SMU is a series player for talent. SMU has already made inroads in Chicago which is to hoops recruiting what DFW is to football recruiting.

With it's academic issues cleared up, UCONN should be a serious national title contender since it will be returning to post season elgibility and returning some players who missed alot of last year with injury. Huskies won the national men's title in 11 and womens again in 13.

With the attendance that Memphis draws, it will almost always be a hoops power and the addition of Temple who has 30 NCAA tourney appearances (among the top 20 prgrams) adds quality depth to a conference with strong hoops tradition in major markets.

I know this may not be what some of you wnat to hear but the AAC is positioned for success much stronger and will have an easier time continuing national prominence in hoops than on the gridiron

AAC will do well enough. Nothing spectacular, nothing to really separate themselves from the MWC or other G5 conferences. The only benefit the AAC really has is they have better TV exposure for football beginning in 2014.

The schools within the AAC need to take advantage of that one and only benefit while they have it, and expect every American Athletic school to leverage that exposure in order to help them when the next wave of change happens in college football.

The AAC will fare as well as the MWC, MAC and CUSA. They'll be there, but not many people will care.

(06-24-2013 03:06 PM)Poliicious Wrote:  The AAC IMO will have an easier time and get more bang for it's buck by investing a great share of it's resources into hoops. At least in that big $ sport, the AAC and the other non power 5/6 have a legit chance at gaining a national championship and the prominence and prestige that goes with it.

SMU was wise to sign Larry Brown & Tim Jankovich as it shows the state of Texas & the college hoops world that SMU is a series player for talent. SMU has already made inroads in Chicago which is to hoops recruiting what DFW is to football recruiting.

With it's academic issues cleared up, UCONN should be a serious national title contender since it will be returning to post season elgibility and returning some players who missed alot of last year with injury. Huskies won the national men's title in 11 and womens again in 13.

With the attendance that Memphis draws, it will almost always be a hoops power and the addition of Temple who has 30 NCAA tourney appearances (among the top 20 prgrams) adds quality depth to a conference with strong hoops tradition in major markets.

I know this may not be what some of you wnat to hear but the AAC is positioned for success much stronger and will have an easier time continuing national prominence in hoops than on the gridiron

I agree......well thought out post.

(06-24-2013 04:24 PM)SMUmustangs Wrote:  

(06-24-2013 03:06 PM)Poliicious Wrote:  The AAC IMO will have an easier time and get more bang for it's buck by investing a great share of it's resources into hoops. At least in that big $ sport, the AAC and the other non power 5/6 have a legit chance at gaining a national championship and the prominence and prestige that goes with it.

SMU was wise to sign Larry Brown & Tim Jankovich as it shows the state of Texas & the college hoops world that SMU is a series player for talent. SMU has already made inroads in Chicago which is to hoops recruiting what DFW is to football recruiting.

With it's academic issues cleared up, UCONN should be a serious national title contender since it will be returning to post season elgibility and returning some players who missed alot of last year with injury. Huskies won the national men's title in 11 and womens again in 13.

With the attendance that Memphis draws, it will almost always be a hoops power and the addition of Temple who has 30 NCAA tourney appearances (among the top 20 prgrams) adds quality depth to a conference with strong hoops tradition in major markets.

I know this may not be what some of you wnat to hear but the AAC is positioned for success much stronger and will have an easier time continuing national prominence in hoops than on the gridiron

I agree......well thought out post.

Ive said for a while that adding VCU is something that needs to be done when Navy joins. That would be 12 for football and 12 for basketball.

(06-24-2013 03:08 PM)Fireman451 Wrote:  AAC will do well enough. Nothing spectacular, nothing to really separate themselves from the MWC or other G5 conferences. The only benefit the AAC really has is they have better TV exposure for football beginning in 2014.

The schools within the AAC need to take advantage of that one and only benefit while they have it, and expect every American Athletic school to leverage that exposure in order to help them when the next wave of change happens in college football.

The AAC will fare as well as the MWC, MAC and CUSA. They'll be there, but not many people will care.

This post is incredibly ignorant. Several AAC programs have a strong commitment financially to compete at the highest level and already boast strong infrastructures, some stronger than several P5 schools. The AAC isn't going anywhere, Cincinnati will continue to churn out top 25 teams and several other programs will continue to rise. They will certainly stay relevant in basketball with Cincy, UConn, Memphis, and Temple as the pillars. The same can be said of the MWC although they aren't quite as deep as the AAC.

The AAC isn't a big fish, it just moved to a smaller pond.

(06-24-2013 10:10 PM)UCbball21 Wrote:  The same can be said of the MWC although they aren't quite as deep as the AAC.

MWC is deeper in football and not terribly off from even in hoops.

(06-24-2013 10:10 PM)UCbball21 Wrote:  

(06-24-2013 03:08 PM)Fireman451 Wrote:  AAC will do well enough. Nothing spectacular, nothing to really separate themselves from the MWC or other G5 conferences. The only benefit the AAC really has is they have better TV exposure for football beginning in 2014.

The schools within the AAC need to take advantage of that one and only benefit while they have it, and expect every American Athletic school to leverage that exposure in order to help them when the next wave of change happens in college football.

The AAC will fare as well as the MWC, MAC and CUSA. They'll be there, but not many people will care.

This post is incredibly ignorant. Several AAC programs have a strong commitment financially to compete at the highest level and already boast strong infrastructures, some stronger than several P5 schools. The AAC isn't going anywhere, Cincinnati will continue to churn out top 25 teams and several other programs will continue to rise. They will certainly stay relevant in basketball with Cincy, UConn, Memphis, and Temple as the pillars. The same can be said of the MWC although they aren't quite as deep as the AAC.

I think you read just a little too much into what I wrote.

Like I said, the AAC will fare well enough.

"That conference is garbage! They should've given our conferences their teams!" - A MAC fan in this thread. lol

(06-25-2013 10:56 AM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  

(06-24-2013 10:10 PM)UCbball21 Wrote:  The same can be said of the MWC although they aren't quite as deep as the AAC.

MWC is deeper in football and not terribly off from even in hoops.

The MWC has the best football team, but they are no way a deeper football league. In basketball, the MW is a pretty nice conference---but lets keep in mind that not one MW team advanced to the second round of the NCAA. I think the AAC is going to be better at the top in basketball and probably deeper too.

(06-25-2013 12:12 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(06-25-2013 10:56 AM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  

(06-24-2013 10:10 PM)UCbball21 Wrote:  The same can be said of the MWC although they aren't quite as deep as the AAC.

MWC is deeper in football and not terribly off from even in hoops.

The MWC has the best football team, but they are no way a deeper football league. In basketball, the MW is a pretty nice conference---but lets keep in mind that not one MW team advanced to the second round of the NCAA. I think the AAC is going to be better at the top in basketball and probably deeper too.

SDSU and Colorado State advanced to the second round, only to be blown away by Florida Gulf Coast and Louisville. Point still holds though. Are people really disregarding AAC hoops? Memphis, Temple, UConn, Cincy - those aren't chumps by any stretch.

(06-25-2013 02:24 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  

(06-25-2013 12:12 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(06-25-2013 10:56 AM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  

(06-24-2013 10:10 PM)UCbball21 Wrote:  The same can be said of the MWC although they aren't quite as deep as the AAC.

MWC is deeper in football and not terribly off from even in hoops.

The MWC has the best football team, but they are no way a deeper football league. In basketball, the MW is a pretty nice conference---but lets keep in mind that not one MW team advanced to the second round of the NCAA. I think the AAC is going to be better at the top in basketball and probably deeper too.

SDSU and Colorado State advanced to the second round, only to be blown away by Florida Gulf Coast and Louisville. Point still holds though. Are people really disregarding AAC hoops? Memphis, Temple, UConn, Cincy - those aren't chumps by any stretch.

My bad. I should have said "past" the second round instead of "to" the second round.

(06-25-2013 12:12 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(06-25-2013 10:56 AM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  

(06-24-2013 10:10 PM)UCbball21 Wrote:  The same can be said of the MWC although they aren't quite as deep as the AAC.

MWC is deeper in football and not terribly off from even in hoops.

The MWC has the best football team, but they are no way a deeper football league. In basketball, the MW is a pretty nice conference---but lets keep in mind that not one MW team advanced to the second round of the NCAA. I think the AAC is going to be better at the top in basketball and probably deeper too.

The MWC isn't deep in football. Their bottom half is horrible. If their bottom half was merely decent, they would have given the BCS problems as they would have been ahead of the BE and ACC on all the criteria for a autobid conference. UNM, UNLV and CSU have been really bad the last 4 or 5 years. And usually someone else joined them-Wyoming or SDSU. Their newer members, SJSU, USU and Nevada have each had a very good year recently, but mostly have been bad also in the last 10 years. Hawaii has been bad recently. And Fresno has been middle of the pack in the WAC in recent years after a run of good seasons. Their consistently good teams-Utah, BYU and TCU, are all gone. Boise alone isn't enough to make up for the losses.

The conference will be fine if (1) UConn and Cinci stay in the fold and (2) if it's leaders set high goals and aggressively pursue them. I know these are no-brainers for us but I wonder that those in education/athletics think sometimes...

If the AAC is smart, it will aggressively pursue BYU for all sports. If BYU wants to keep all of the rights for all of BYU TV, so be it. IF ESPN wants to keep paying them $8M per year for football, so be it. We just need to get them into the fold.

After that, we should go after BSU, SDSU, Fresno State, AFA (football only) and either Colorado State or New Mexico.

We could move Houston, Tulsa and SMU West and have a really nice 9-team division. The East would house everyone else.