(05-07-2013 01:38 PM)CajunFan3406 Wrote:  

(05-07-2013 01:29 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  of course you don't want to hear what I have to say because it is telling you something you don't want to hear and something you can't deal with

and why in the hell does a program like Alabama or LSU or UT or any of the majors want to have to have a contingency plan in place to host a game that none of THEIR fans are interested in seeing or playing.....because it is a game against some team that barely squeaked into the playoffs that they are most likely going to thrash and it is a game that offers up a chance to get some of their major players injured for the next round of meaningful games....there are already 12 games in the regular season programs across the country have the chance to schedule, play, and beat teams in the regular season so they can get to a BCS game....Boise, TCU, Hawaii, NIU, and Utah have done it....so do like they did and just go do it

it is much more difficult to get a major game together than just a weeks time and of course you don't understand that because you don't want to hear that and because you have no experience with that....unless you think that 12-15K fans at a D1-AA playoff that is not on TV is a "major" production.....and again why in the hell do major programs want to have to go through all the crap of trying to put a game like that together in a weeks time when they have ZERO interest in even playing that game

if it is so simple round up the MWC, CUSA, AAC, Sunbelt, and MAC and some move ups and go "pull it off" and get the "big cash moniez rewards".......of course the answer from the MWC, AAC and probably others will be NOT INTERESTED because they know there is no money in that and stop looking to the major programs to "pull something off" that you are not willing to try and make happen and that your stadium and fans could not properly support even if you did have the chance to make it happen

no one at Alabama is going to be excited to see ULM Vs Alabama because it is the "playoffs" they will be asking themselves WTF are we doing playing this game lets GTFO a division with these teams and these types of games and no one at UT will be excited to see a "playoff" game VS north Texas state because north Texas state managed to win the CUSA especially when UT probably already thrashed north Texas state earlier that year or the year before

I just find it funny how you're such a self-absorbed blowhard that you actually think people care enough about your incoherent rambling to take time out of their day to read the crap you spew, and then take further time out of their day to actually respond to it.

thanks for that response

I find it humorous that some people are such self absorbed blowhards that they want to whine and cry for something time and again in thread after thread and yet they really don't want to have an open and honest discussion about it or have a "point" other than I WANT I WANT I WANT and you can't tell me different because I WANT I WANT I WANT.....talk about being a fool

and if they do respond it is only to make themselves look like a bigger cry baby fool with an I WANT I WANT I WANT attitude instead of some realistic perspective on how what THEY WANT WANT WANT might actually work

(05-07-2013 01:47 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  

(05-07-2013 01:38 PM)CajunFan3406 Wrote:  

(05-07-2013 01:29 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  of course you don't want to hear what I have to say because it is telling you something you don't want to hear and something you can't deal with

and why in the hell does a program like Alabama or LSU or UT or any of the majors want to have to have a contingency plan in place to host a game that none of THEIR fans are interested in seeing or playing.....because it is a game against some team that barely squeaked into the playoffs that they are most likely going to thrash and it is a game that offers up a chance to get some of their major players injured for the next round of meaningful games....there are already 12 games in the regular season programs across the country have the chance to schedule, play, and beat teams in the regular season so they can get to a BCS game....Boise, TCU, Hawaii, NIU, and Utah have done it....so do like they did and just go do it

it is much more difficult to get a major game together than just a weeks time and of course you don't understand that because you don't want to hear that and because you have no experience with that....unless you think that 12-15K fans at a D1-AA playoff that is not on TV is a "major" production.....and again why in the hell do major programs want to have to go through all the crap of trying to put a game like that together in a weeks time when they have ZERO interest in even playing that game

if it is so simple round up the MWC, CUSA, AAC, Sunbelt, and MAC and some move ups and go "pull it off" and get the "big cash moniez rewards".......of course the answer from the MWC, AAC and probably others will be NOT INTERESTED because they know there is no money in that and stop looking to the major programs to "pull something off" that you are not willing to try and make happen and that your stadium and fans could not properly support even if you did have the chance to make it happen

no one at Alabama is going to be excited to see ULM Vs Alabama because it is the "playoffs" they will be asking themselves WTF are we doing playing this game lets GTFO a division with these teams and these types of games and no one at UT will be excited to see a "playoff" game VS north Texas state because north Texas state managed to win the CUSA especially when UT probably already thrashed north Texas state earlier that year or the year before

I just find it funny how you're such a self-absorbed blowhard that you actually think people care enough about your incoherent rambling to take time out of their day to read the crap you spew, and then take further time out of their day to actually respond to it.

thanks for that response

I find it humorous that some people are such self absorbed blowhards that they want to whine and cry for something time and again in thread after thread and yet they really don't want to have an open and honest discussion about it or have a "point" other than I WANT I WANT I WANT and you can't tell me different because I WANT I WANT I WANT.....talk about being a fool

and if they do respond it is only to make themselves look like a bigger cry baby fool with an I WANT I WANT I WANT attitude instead of some realistic perspective on how what THEY WANT WANT WANT might actually work

That's all I read, and you're welcome. Funny how you actually think I'm reading any of the other crap. From browsing it I see the word "WANT" a lot. All I want is for you to get your own blog, so the nice posters and mods here at SunBeltbbs don't have to waste their time having to deal with you.

(05-07-2013 12:46 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  

(05-07-2013 11:11 AM)CajunFan3406 Wrote:  tl;dr

responses like the one above are why the internet has made the world an overall dumber place.....people want to discuss a serious topic or a topic they get all worked up over and make their silly and stupid demands and then when you give them a tweet for a replay (which is usually about all of the attention span those type of people can handle) like "this won't work logistics do not work"

they are the same people that will come back time and again and try and challenge that notion with 500 different tweet type replies and then when you finally explain it to them in detail they break out their collection of idiot GIFs and make a fool of themselves and scurry off like a roach when the lights come on...they are incapable of actually having a discussion on what the issues are they just want to sit around and demand something that is not realistically feasible to accomplish and they will never understand why because it can't be explained to them in 140 characters or less or with a GIF....which is true of pretty much every demand they make and explains why they are often not getting the things they are demanding.....because all they do is demand demand demand and ignore the realities of what it would take to meet that demand

(05-07-2013 11:31 AM)FloridaJag Wrote:  Note: Tuscaloosa is about 45 minutes from Birmingham; 35 minutes from Birmingham Metro. It is also only 90 miles from Montgomery.

yes which is why when people plan to go to games at Alabama they make their plans months or even a year in advance....so they know where they are staying, how long it will take to get to the stadium from there, where they can get something to eat or stop for gas and get served in a timely fashion and on and on....they don't just wake up a week before the big game and decide to go and try and get tickets and book a hotel somewhere in a whim....and the few that do try and do that either pay extremely inflated prices or they often end up sleeping in their car when their room falls through or they wait in lines forever for food and other services because they dd not plan ahead

My point was that most of the Alabama fans do not make hotel registrations because they are within 2 to 3 hrs drive of home. In addition, MSU is only 85 mile west of Tuscaloosa. For fans of other schools there are hotel rooms available in Birmingham. However, it is only a three hour drive to Atlanta. About the same drive time from Oxford, Nashville and Auburn.

(05-06-2013 11:04 AM)Complacent Cajun Wrote:  12 + possibly 3 games for CFB. I would love the added access, but I've never played CFB personally. Is that asking too much for those kids?

Take it from Appalachian State and Georgia Southern...yes these kids can take it!

(05-07-2013 01:29 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  of course you don't want to hear what I have to say because it is telling you something you don't want to hear and something you can't deal with

and why in the hell does a program like Alabama or LSU or UT or any of the majors want to have to have a contingency plan in place to host a game that none of THEIR fans are interested in seeing or playing.....because it is a game against some team that barely squeaked into the playoffs that they are most likely going to thrash and it is a game that offers up a chance to get some of their major players injured for the next round of meaningful games....there are already 12 games in the regular season programs across the country have the chance to schedule, play, and beat teams in the regular season so they can get to a BCS game....Boise, TCU, Hawaii, NIU, and Utah have done it....so do like they did and just go do it

it is much more difficult to get a major game together than just a weeks time and of course you don't understand that because you don't want to hear that and because you have no experience with that....unless you think that 12-15K fans at a D1-AA playoff that is not on TV is a "major" production.....and again why in the hell do major programs want to have to go through all the crap of trying to put a game like that together in a weeks time when they have ZERO interest in even playing that game

if it is so simple round up the MWC, CUSA, AAC, Sunbelt, and MAC and some move ups and go "pull it off" and get the "big cash moniez rewards".......of course the answer from the MWC, AAC and probably others will be NOT INTERESTED because they know there is no money in that and stop looking to the major programs to "pull something off" that you are not willing to try and make happen and that your stadium and fans could not properly support even if you did have the chance to make it happen

no one at Alabama is going to be excited to see ULM Vs Alabama because it is the "playoffs" they will be asking themselves WTF are we doing playing this game lets GTFO a division with these teams and these types of games and no one at UT will be excited to see a "playoff" game VS north Texas state because north Texas state managed to win the CUSA especially when UT probably already thrashed north Texas state earlier that year or the year before

^^^ This dude has a major North Texas obsession. I don't think I've EVER seen him enter a conversation without referencing North Texas at some point.

Also, I didn't actually read this crap. Just scanned it for the inevitable North Texas reference that I knew would be there.

(05-07-2013 01:29 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  of course you don't want to hear what I have to say because it is telling you something you don't want to hear and something you can't deal with

and why in the hell does a program like Alabama or LSU or UT or any of the majors want to have to have a contingency plan in place to host a game that none of THEIR fans are interested in seeing or playing.....because it is a game against some team that barely squeaked into the playoffs that they are most likely going to thrash and it is a game that offers up a chance to get some of their major players injured for the next round of meaningful games....there are already 12 games in the regular season programs across the country have the chance to schedule, play, and beat teams in the regular season so they can get to a BCS game....Boise, TCU, Hawaii, NIU, and Utah have done it....so do like they did and just go do it

it is much more difficult to get a major game together than just a weeks time and of course you don't understand that because you don't want to hear that and because you have no experience with that....unless you think that 12-15K fans at a D1-AA playoff that is not on TV is a "major" production.....and again why in the hell do major programs want to have to go through all the crap of trying to put a game like that together in a weeks time when they have ZERO interest in even playing that game

if it is so simple round up the MWC, CUSA, AAC, Sunbelt, and MAC and some move ups and go "pull it off" and get the "big cash moniez rewards".......of course the answer from the MWC, AAC and probably others will be NOT INTERESTED because they know there is no money in that and stop looking to the major programs to "pull something off" that you are not willing to try and make happen and that your stadium and fans could not properly support even if you did have the chance to make it happen

no one at Alabama is going to be excited to see ULM Vs Alabama because it is the "playoffs" they will be asking themselves WTF are we doing playing this game lets GTFO a division with these teams and these types of games and no one at UT will be excited to see a "playoff" game VS north Texas state because north Texas state managed to win the CUSA especially when UT probably already thrashed north Texas state earlier that year or the year before

I disagree. If ULM and Alabama are both Conference Champs, both schools will be able to sell out a 100,000 seat stadium.

(05-07-2013 03:17 PM)FloridaJag Wrote:  I disagree. If ULM and Alabama are both Conference Champs, both schools will be able to sell out a 100,000 seat stadium.

ULM does not have 100,000 fans....ULM would possibly be able to be at a game where Alabama brought 80,000 fans and ULM possibly brought 20,000

and ULM does not have a 100,000 stadium if they managed to be able to host a game some way some how

that is the problem with the whole concept of tams playing playoff games at home stadiums....ignore the fact that the logistics makes it near impossible for any type of meaningful crowd to show up on a weeks notice and have any type of decent experience you are either going to have the big boys always hosting or when the small school finally gets a chance to host they will not come close to having the facilities for hosting a major game

which is why the big boys will laugh at this idea until it gets pushed too far and the big boys just break away....because Alabama fans are not interested in having Alabama play a playoff game against the Sunbelt champ to move on to anything and they are not interested in dealing with the logistics of making that happen at their stadium.....and if there ever was a chance that a smaller school hosted a game they are not interested in their team playing a playoff game at a stadium that holds 40K or less and that their fans will get 10,000 or less tickets for

you can't expect the big boys to do all the heavy lifting of getting the playoff game in place (and stop pretending it is something that is easy) so they can play a Sunbelt school and at the same time if they are always ask to put all of that together if the chance ever comes for a Sunbelt school to host they are not going to put up with getting a few thousand tickets

if you expect and demand that the big boys provide and fill the big venues to face smaller programs and then expect and demand that if the smaller schools ever get a chance to host that the big boys just deal with not getting many tickets.....you can expect that the big boys will just go away and deal with each other and leave the smaller schools behind....because they are not going to tolerate doing all the work and getting little if any of the benefits and even getting short changed if a smaller school ever manages to host a game.....especially when it is games the big boys are not interested in playing....they have no interest in proving they deserve to move through the playoffs by beating the Sunbelt and CUSA and the MAC to end the season

TodgeRodge,

I actually did read through all the ramblings as I tend to ramble a bit myself

Anyway, I want to first say that I think the biggest issue people are going to have with your post is the tone. People can disagree without being disagreeable. If you would slow down on the name calling and acting like you know more than everybody else, you might (as if you care) get more civil and meaningfull conversations going.

You do make some good points, but I'd like to just counter a few of them. Please respond with like curtesy and respect as I would like to have an in depth knowledgable discussion on the topic.

First, I believe Free Enterprise will imop solve a lot of the issues you bring up. I get the hotel room thing, but if a city has that many rooms on any big weekend, they are probably still going to have just as many rooms on a weekend that there is not a game. Outside of some big convention in town, those rooms would otherwise be empty. The hotel management would have plenty of time to make sure people are at work. Coke, Budwieser etc can all easily get trucks into town and resturant owners I am sure would love to have to restock the shelves. All of that is on private industry, not the Big Boys at the Universities. I think that if I had a chance to make that much extra cash flow in one weekend, I'd find a way to do it. There is surely lots of things the Universties have to do but I think they can handle it given some time. I may be naive on the topic? If all of this turned out to be way too much to handle, the option of making "smaller" or lesser bowl games actuall playoff games might solve this issue. Those bowl cities would still host "bowls" at set times, but we might some drop off in attendances that way.

The time that you say is only 7 days is probably longer in most cases.
As far as fans, I'd ask how long fans have to make bowl game plans, especially for the early bowls? There would be plenty projections to show liklyhood of what teams would end up where. In the 12 teams system I proposed, The Major conference champions would know about a month in advance.

The first week only Non-Aq's are playing at venues and stadiums with attendances they can handle or even possibly at the bowl city sites of some current lesser bowls that those conferences have tie ins with.
? Just spit balling there.

The second week would feature NOT AQ conference champions, but the two highest ranked AQ conference teams that did not win their conference. If you hold those at campus stadiums, Those host AQ teams would have had at least two weeks to make plans. Probably longer since they would likly be projected to host. There is always again the chance of these two games being held at other current bowl sites with cities who are prepared for this already. But home games would be higher attended.

You say that the BCS teams fans wouldnt want to come see such a game but respectfully I suggest that they would be thrilled that their team still had a shot and was still alive with a second wind in the national title hunt. I've been there and I know what that is like. There is no reason to expect that fan support excitment or attendance would taper off instead of increase in this situation. You talk about playoff games with 15-20k in attendance in the FCS. But that isnt a drop off for FCS! Any non-AQ that advances beyond this round and further would garner some degree of recognition in a semi final or final in that unlikly event. All of these games would have been Nationally televised and promoted - somthing that the FCS doesnt have. That will lead to more interest and higher attendance. While you make fair points about the FCS playoff and championship as far as attendances, you really have to take into account that it has almost ZERO promotion and doesnt feature the marquee names that this would have.

As far as stadium capacities not being filled. Most Bowl games I watch have much less than full stadiums. The cameras don't usually pan out to reveal that. I'm sure the Semi and Title game would be packed, but viewing the first rounds of the playoffs in similar light as the lesser bowls I dont really see the problem in it.

At the end of the second week, most likly the two AQ, non-conference champs "should" emerge into the final 8. If the "big boys" are right, there will only be 1 Non-AQ left standing. IF there is more than that, it would be hard to argue that they didnt deserve to be there and the national attention, media coverage and promotion should have them sufficiantly hyped enough to present a game any team left standing could get excited about, if not - the possiblity of still advancing to the National championship should pick up the slack imop. IF there is only 1 non-AQ left (the highest ranked non-AQ conf. champion) THEN there would not be much attendance droping or fan disappointment that would be seen in the final 3 weeks of the playoffs.

In this third week, 4 games would be held. IF you did as home games for the 4 highest ranked AQ champs, those programs and cities would have had at least 3 weeks if not a month to prepare to host those games.

Beyond that, it has already been decided that the semi and final will be at neutral sites. So the big logistic issues are 4 teams that have about a month to get ready. And 2 teams that 2 or 3 weeks to prepare?

I am going to finsih this with a thought. If people just accepted what can't be done when they were told they didnt know what they were talking about, Micheal Jordan would have never played basketball, Fed-Ex would have never been founded and The United States would still be under the control of England. I think it can be done and would be great for all of college football. JMOP though.

Ok, show of hands: Who actually read all of this?

I read it

(05-07-2013 03:06 PM)pjc1979 Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 11:04 AM)Complacent Cajun Wrote:  12 + possibly 3 games for CFB. I would love the added access, but I've never played CFB personally. Is that asking too much for those kids?

Take it from Appalachian State and Georgia Southern...yes these kids can take it!

Yes, Ga Southern first college football team to go 15-0 in Erk's final season.

(05-07-2013 04:44 PM)The4thOption Wrote:  Ok, show of hands: Who actually read all of this?

thanks for being willing to have a discussion on a topic VS tweeting about it

here lets use the NFL as an example again....I think that we can all pretty much agree that with a few exceptions NFL teams are in the major markets in the USA and with 32 NFL teams VS 124 NCAA teams that means with a very few exceptions about 90+ NCAA teams will be in markets smaller than NFL markets and the few that are not in markets that are smaller than NFL markets might be going directly up against the NFL for hotel rooms and for facilities to host a game in

it is my opinion as well that with a few exceptions like the dallas Cowboys and Green Bay the vast majority of NFL fans that come to NFL games and even playoff games are local fans....I don't think a ton of people are traveling all over California to see the Chargers or the Raiders or even the 49s....most are coming right from the local major metro area

it is also my opinion that since the vast majority of college teams are in metro areas that are much smaller than NFL metro areas and teams that have stadiums larger than NFL teams like UT, the other UT, Michigan, Alabama, LSU and on and on they have fans that are coming in from out of town and as you get further west of the Mississippi and I-35 (an area that still has a huge number of college football teams and major college teams) the distance driven to see those games increases....and even in places like Arkansas, Oklahoma, Alabama, South Carolina and on and on where states are smaller and the population is still more dense people will drive a long way to see a game and many want to stay over night

that gets us back to the NFL that in my opinion draws more local fans in a metro area with many more hotels and much larger infrastructure.....and the NFL every year year in and year out books blocks of rooms in EVERY NFL city for ALL playoff dates that are possible because they have to have those rooms.....even in NYC the NFL has blocks of rooms for if the Jets make the playoffs or if the Giants win the playoffs AND for if both make the playoffs and they book those rooms at least a year in advance and pay to have them held open and do not release them until it is guaranteed that particular teams will not make the playoffs in

the reason they do that is because they know that the "free market" is not going to just hold rooms open on the off chance the local NFL team makes the playoffs and they are not only going to not hold those rooms open the are going to be actively trying to market those rooms to anyone and everyone that might take one

if the NFL has to do it in major metro areas with massive infrastructure in place and IMO many more local fans right in town filling the stands then it would be impossible that the NCAA (and networks ect) would be able to NOT do that in places that are 200K or less in size.....it makes no sense why would the NFL do so if they did not have to.....well because they do have to or they run the risk of not having available rooms when a particular team makes the playoffs and then it becomes a nightmare to coordinate things

next the idea that the beer trucks and restaurants ect can just have some food ready.....in a city like Tuscaloosa that is pretty large in size (200K metro area) for a college town and you have a 100K stadium even if 20K fans come in from out of town and stay for longer than the game that is still increasing your population by 10% for over 24 hours...restaurants and distributors with "just in time" systems in place are not going to be willing to sit on provisions for a 10% increase in population on the off chance they get a playoff game and getting all that in place in a weeks time is not that simple.....and I think that only 20K fans wanting to stay over night is probably on the low side it is probably more like 40K+ and that is ones staying over night....others still want to eat out, get gas, snacks, beer and on and on

hell look how hard it is with the entire US government, FEMA, the National Guard and the like to get some damn water to places 24/48/72 hours after a major storm that they KNEW was going to hit somewhere for a week or more ahead of time....they did not know where it was going to hit, but they knew it was going to hit somewhere and they can't even get ice and water to them in a timely fashion with the entire US government trying to get it done and "emergency" agencies that have nothing to do day in and day out but sit around and wait for something to happen then take forever to get the crap to people

next the students....the last game UT (Texas) played in 2012 was Dec 1st it happened to be a road game, but it easily could have been a home game....finals for fall 2012 for UT started on the 12th of Dec...so the first round of playoffs would be taking place at the earliest on the 8th of Dec.....how many universities and how many students are going to want to be called in to work out of the blue to serve people coming in for playoff games

Finals for KU started Monday the 10th.....finals is when college students QUIT their day jobs so they can study, because they are going to move home anyway, or because they are going to be graduating.....do universities really want students having to work and university personnel having to work and be deployed and the disruption that comes from hosting a regular season game much less a last minute playoff game that you have a week to prepare for....no....that will be students saying "I quit" in mass if they have not already quit

and if you have a second round of playoffs a week later after finals have ended that is when students move home and the dorms close....are you going to have dorms close and students move out and hold fall graduation the same weekend that you host another playoff game with only a weeks notice

are you expecting the university to hold the dorms open a week longer and put off graduation for a week on the off chance that they make the second round of the on campus playoffs....that sounds highly financially profitable and very popular for graduating students and their families and I don't think most students are going to hang around on the off chance they get called in for their hotel or restaurant or club or Cstore job because of the second round of the playoffs....and most are not going to hang out on the off chance there is a game they can go to either......which means less workers.....less students to fill the stands....and more people from out of town needed to fill the stands while the student workers are all heading out of town and leaving their jobs

to me at least that sounds like people getting bad hotel service, bad restaurant service, waiting in huge lines, and generally saying "I will just watch on TV next time"

generally campus police, campus administrators, and others take the semester breaks as a time for vacations just like students.....do you tell your campus police and administration no vacations for this period of time because we MIGHT host a play off game....do you tell them that every year and then you have to keep them around and on call (even if unpaid) on the off chance you host a playoff game

and that is at LARGE universities with major stadiums like UT and the other UT and Alabama.....those schools have no interest in that logistical nightmare.....hosting a play off game potentially the week before and the week after finals

and for smaller schools and schools in smaller towns it just gets worse....students either trying to actually study for finals or students trying to get out of town and not staying for a game or for their work a day college job while they need more fans than usual to show up on short notice to understaffed and under provisioned venues.....not interested and if the tried it after the horrible fan experience the reaction will be not interested I will stay home and watch on TV.....which defeats the purpose of having it on campus....and again do you expect students the weekend before or the weekend after to be able to travel for a game in a destination venue.....do you actually expect student athletes (most don't go pro) to play a game before and after finals week and for professors to be OK with that delay and inconvenience as well even if the administration was dumb enough to agree with it

and many alumni have kids that are students....that is how the whole breed 100,000 fans thing works....so parents (alumni) are not going to want to travel to a destination playoff game without their kids because their kids are either about to start finals or they are moving out of their dorm after finals......I know for a fact that campus gets crazy on move in and move out day for the dorms even in the Fall semester when students are mostly only going home for winter break and not fully moving out so trying to fit all that in along with a trip to Orlando or Tempe is not going to work for many families/alumni/students

if that type of thing worked then there would not be a week or two week break between the end of the season and bowl games (much less over a month for some) the bowl games would just start the next week

here look at the attendance for the 2012 Big 10 Championship with Nebraska one of the most storied and followed football programs in the country VS Wisconsin

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_Big_T...nship_Game

41,260...played at a neutral site in a major city....not very impressive and it was on Dec 1st so probably a week before students at those school had fall finals

the year before it was 64,152

here look at the ACC games

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ACC_Championship_Game

under 28K in 2008....under 45K in 2009.....Jacksonville declined to bid on the game any longer after those years and even in 2012 under 65K....so then you start adding in finals for college students the next week.....families with high school students and younger with end of the semester testing.....and you are going to see terrible neutral site attendance for "playoff" games featuring some small conference team VS some major conference team

here is what the PAC 12 is pulling off

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pacific-12_...nship_Game

under 60K in 2011 and under 32K in 2012 when played ON CAMPUS at the stadium of the top team

so again the concept that neutral site OR on campus games will be major draws for playoff games or that they will be easy to pull off successfully is not proven by the numbers because the PAC, ACC, and Big 10 all have horrible numbers to show and only the SEC has decent numbers....and that is with both the on campus and the neutral site methods in play with the ACC, Big 10 and PAC 12....for something that should have some type of meaning like a conference championship since winning that gets you a BCS game automatically

so between the fact that the NFL in the largest markets in the USA has to block hotel rooms a year or more in advance for playoffs, most college teams would be hosting a potential game on short notice either days before or just after finals when students will either not want to work (and will be willing to quit) or they will be packing up and leaving and have already quit and graduations will be taking place, students will be moving out and not available to fill the stands and help to serve the needed increase in people from out of town to come in on short notice and fill the stands and from the available figures dealing with both neutral site and on campus championship games I am of the opinion that trying to have a number of playoff games that will accommodate 16 teams would be a disaster and an extremely poor draw for live fans, a massive inconvenience for students and out of town fans and the university and something that would become a big failure just like some of these CCGs are proving to be and they are not even during or just after finals they are actually often just before dead week

GOOD LORD WHAT A RESPONSE: I'll try to keep mine a little shorter, but you bring up a lot of stuff there.
I'm not saying there wont be challanges.

One point there in comparring to NFL games. It sounds like you might be saying unintentionally that the college programs/cities are better set up to take in visiting fans. The larger cities are more likley to have many other events/conventions etc in town that compete for hotel rooms than say Athens GA etc and so might require blocks of rooms to be reserved further in advance. Just another way to look at it.

Also we have to keep in mind that these programs and places are going to have more than a week to get ready. We are talking 2,3 and 4 weeks. A lot of college students and other people also take extra jobs for Christmas money. Job apps usually surge that time of year. And most of all.... We are talking about a very small number of teams/places. 4 Universities would have about a month to get ready for one extra home game.

I get Students leaving town. Thanksgiving weekend is usually a down weekend for the FCS playoffs, but that is also due to most families having other plans as well as students leaving town.

There are specific issues with each of the 3 conference championship games that you site. First, it isnt really fair to compare a game that has no possibility of including the National Champion to a playoff that does still hold that potential. But lets look closer at what is going on at these 3 championship games.
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PAC12:
You site the PAC12 championship game last year as negative to on campus hosting of games that time of year, but that was hosted at the second worse home attended program in the conference. Here is a a quote and link on that. "On the season, Stanford had an average attendance of 43,343 people, good for 11th in the conference. The only team with worse attendance this season was the Washington State Cougars, who had just 30,252 people in Martin Stadium this season as they struggled to a 3-9 finish. Despite having a better team than anyone in the conference, the Cardinal couldn’t out-draw the majority of the league." And the weather was appearntly very bad.
http://www.rantsports.com/ncaa-football/...e-program/
When Oregon hosted the title game, the attendance was somehow more than the official capacity of the Stadium! This might just mean that home sites will work fine if those home sites already have good attendance numbers and there could be premium placed on higher attendance versus higher ranking if that needed to be implemented. Hey, I'm fine with giving the programs that have built the larger fan bases home field advantage. As long as everyone has a legit shot at earning a path to the title game, I'm good with it.
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BIG10
The Big Ten championship was played at a neutral site as you point out, but both games played the same weekend so I dont really have an answer as to why it dropped off about 20k. Maybe it had to do with all the embarrasment the Big Ten had gone through, maybe it was an unranked team playing in the title game, maybe it was the fact that Ohio State should have been in the game but was under sanctions? Maybe a #12 Michigan State travels better to Indianapois than a # 13 Nebraska? I dont know, but the timing had little to do with it. Maybe we would have seen higher attendance if the game had been played at Nebraska who has averaged over 85,000 over the last two years?
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The ACC:
First you lead with the worst attendance in the history of the ACC championship. Under 28k, for a game played in Tampa Fla that played host to Boston College - A dang long way for Boston College fans (already in the bottom 3 or 4 of the ACC in enrollment and attendance averages at home = only 38k) to travel and V.Tech also not a short trip. The next year at the same location featuring closer teams (GT & Clemson) saw an increase of nearly 20k and Ga Tech doesnt travel fans that well. Last year Ga Tech averaged less than 44k a game at home. Maybe the game should have been held at Clemson as they average nearly 80k per home game!! ACC attendance is down overall yet the conference title game attendance has been mostly increasing. Since the game was moved the next season after Clemson/GT from Tampa FL to a more central location for the conference, things have looked better. The game now in Charlotte NC would pit VT twice against first FSU and then Clemson and average around 73k! Last year with FSU and a struggling GT that already (as always) has attendance issues and fan support problems overall - the game still hit nearly 65k. Clemson and FSU both average over 70 plus k and VT averages about 20k MORE than GT at home games. Throw that into the mix and the attandance last year and you can probably figure that the slight drop in attendance is more reflective of GT fans than when the game is played. Again, maybe it should have been hosted by FSU and the attendance would probably have been 75K or so?
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I get what you are saying, I just disagree that all the hassle isnt worth it for the programs the businesses in the host city or the Fans. It is a little funny that fans might be inconvienced with their team having more games to play. A LARGE number of fans will still find a way. There will always be fans who just cant make it due to obligations, $ restrictions etc. But when your team is perieniel power house that is bound to make the playoffs - you learn to budget for it if it is at all possible. College football fans are a dedicated, rabid bunch as a whole. I think that attendances even at Conference Championship games in which the teams playing have already been eliminated are going to be low when comparred to similar post season attendances where every/both team(s) is/are still alive and you could be witnessing a championship run for your team! In fact, I could argue that it will help raise attendances at all conference championship games across the board as the importance of those games will have just reached a new premium.
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Logistics:
As far as the Fed response to disasters like Katrina, well all I can say is that is the difference between free enterprise and the government. The private sector does most things better as profit is a major motivator. If suppliers like Budweisier for example knew a year in advance that there were going to be 4 cities that needed to be ready to supply 50k,70k - 100k people with beer for one specific weekend - They could VERY easily have the supplies on hand waiting to be told what city to roll the trucks to. They would then have 3 weeks to a month to get the supplies to those cities once they are announced. This goes across the board for all suppliers of food,tailgate supplies, ICE etc. Then you are talking about two cities with one less weeks notice. And two cities (with smaller crowds featuring only non-AQ teams) that would only be announced 7 to 14 days in advance. The suppliers however would only be awaiting the announcment of which city to get ready for but they would know every year that the need for the supplies was coming. And this would be for campus sites, if the games are played at current bowl venues then this becomes a non-issue as they already have plans for this. They just wouldnt get to hand pick the teams. Smart scheduling of host campus sites though with high attendance figures being the determining key and not ranking, might be the best way to go after looking at the above points of view in light of the concerns you presented.
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Service Quality and local venue employees:
Again, job applications surge during the Holidays so any drop off from student employment (which is a vaild point) would/could probably be easily made up by locals looking for extra holiday $. Just one example: http://www.contactprofessional.com/Topic...egins-3708
I dont think that there is going to be much lack of available labor for resturants, hotels or gas stations at the time of year when people have to make sure Santa is well funded.
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I'd just like to challange you to try and think of a way that all this could work. What might be the solutions to some of the problems that are bound to come up? As much as you know about the topic, I'd think you might have some good answers to some of those. The Question is, if it would/could work - Would you like to see it? I get the feeling that you dont want to see a playoff were every team is given a fair shot at a title. If that is true, why not? Is it because your team is a current BCS program and is going to have access? If that is true, Have you put yourself in the shoes of a fan whose team does not have access? You said for teams to go out and schedule like Boise State did. Well, with all due respect - Boise State still hasn't been allowed to compete for a National Championship! That should be obtainable for everyone if they are able to combine tough scheduling with that one magic year that they field a dream team. As for the scheduling, we can't make Oregon and Texas or whomever we want to play us! And should we have to schedule #1,2 and 3 in order to gain any traction in the polls. Consider how hard that would even be to do as these schedules are often made years in advance. Again, that impossilbe to shedule- schedule in which we are able to predict who #1-#3 were going to be that many years in advance would have to some how alinge with "the stars" in the same year that we actually fielded the perfect dream team of players combined with the perfect season/coach. How often to even those teams field such a dream team with all the recruiting advantages they have? Outside of Alabama.. not often. At that rate, no non-AQ could EVER win the national championship as they/we will Never get to prove that we could actually do it. If we get to be very good, sometimes ops to play some of the big guys go away. And what if we do get some very high ranked teams on the schedule for say.. 2019. If by then, those teams have dropped off - what will the win mean in terms of our ranking? Also consider that if we win such a game, even if that team is highly ranked before we play - that team is going to take such a dip in the polls that our SOS will still not overcome the obsticles it woud take to get into a 4 team playoff. The poll voters are going to assume NOT that we are that good, but rather that the AQ team must have been that bad and way over rated. We just want a chance to Prove that we are that good, or have it proven to us that we are not. But this is very important.... We want to be able to look a recruit and his parents in the eye and be able to honestly say that we have a "chance" at winning a National Championship. Certainly you cannot fault non-AQ programs from demanding access IF we earn it. I'll conceed that in most years the non-AQ teams will be eliminated quickly.. but again.. it is the mere possiblity of that Cinderella season, that will be a game changer in recruiting and the overall National interest for teams that are able to earn recognition as a pereniel power house amung non-AQ conferences. It is very hard to "rise up" when you do not have the same access to this. Consider that if we start to get good, one of the Big Boys is going to probably steal our Coach away! We are never going to off set the advantages of the biggest programs. BUT - This should be fair. We should all be allowed to earn our way to the National Championship. I'm not loooking for a handout. I think that a private free market is the best for everybody as long as there isnt a monoply granted to a handfull. What is happening now is just that, it needs to opened up and lets see then where all that access might take us non-AQ guys in terms of winning and even possilby rising attendances as we would be relevant to the big picture. I can say this, the SEC and other AQ guys will pay attention and care or at least know who the Sun Belt and CUSA and MWC conference champions are - EVERY YEAR - which is more than I can say for them now. I just see this as what is best for college football as a whole and for the majority of players.

(05-07-2013 03:38 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  

(05-07-2013 03:17 PM)FloridaJag Wrote:  I disagree. If ULM and Alabama are both Conference Champs, both schools will be able to sell out a 100,000 seat stadium.

ULM does not have 100,000 fans....ULM would possibly be able to be at a game where Alabama brought 80,000 fans and ULM possibly brought 20,000

and ULM does not have a 100,000 stadium if they managed to be able to host a game some way some how

that is the problem with the whole concept of tams playing playoff games at home stadiums....ignore the fact that the logistics makes it near impossible for any type of meaningful crowd to show up on a weeks notice and have any type of decent experience you are either going to have the big boys always hosting or when the small school finally gets a chance to host they will not come close to having the facilities for hosting a major game

which is why the big boys will laugh at this idea until it gets pushed too far and the big boys just break away....because Alabama fans are not interested in having Alabama play a playoff game against the Sunbelt champ to move on to anything and they are not interested in dealing with the logistics of making that happen at their stadium.....and if there ever was a chance that a smaller school hosted a game they are not interested in their team playing a playoff game at a stadium that holds 40K or less and that their fans will get 10,000 or less tickets for

you can't expect the big boys to do all the heavy lifting of getting the playoff game in place (and stop pretending it is something that is easy) so they can play a Sunbelt school and at the same time if they are always ask to put all of that together if the chance ever comes for a Sunbelt school to host they are not going to put up with getting a few thousand tickets

if you expect and demand that the big boys provide and fill the big venues to face smaller programs and then expect and demand that if the smaller schools ever get a chance to host that the big boys just deal with not getting many tickets.....you can expect that the big boys will just go away and deal with each other and leave the smaller schools behind....because they are not going to tolerate doing all the work and getting little if any of the benefits and even getting short changed if a smaller school ever manages to host a game.....especially when it is games the big boys are not interested in playing....they have no interest in proving they deserve to move through the playoffs by beating the Sunbelt and CUSA and the MAC to end the season

Why would say that ULM does not have 100,000 fans? You are silly.

The simple scenario. Alabama gets 50,000 tickets and ULM gets 50,000 tickets. Bama sells it 50,000 tickets in 5 hours. ULM in its biggest game ever and against BAMA sells 35,000 tickets (at a minimum to its alumni, SBC and corporate friends) then sells the remaining 15,000 tickets to Alabama fans. Cash money for ULM.

So...ULM should turn down cashing in on 15,000 tickets at $100 (at a minimum) a piece? That is $1,500,000.00 just because you believe they do not have any fans.

You are silly.