(05-06-2013 11:55 AM)Underdog Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 11:48 AM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 11:07 AM)Underdog Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 10:54 AM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  Even if--out of heaven--ECU gets invited to the BIG XII, it may not be our best choice besides the cash. Does it help our recruiting? Will we ever be competitive against all of those schools with heavy Texas pipelines? UConn would have to ask themselves the same question.

Cincy would have the most to gain outside of money, IMO.

The $$ alone is enough to go. Being in the B12 would elevate ECU to almost the pinnacle of college football (the SEC is at the top). Recruiting would improve immensely by being in the B12. ECU would have a realistic shot every year at not only playing in the college playoff, but for a national championship. Do you need more reasons why ECU should join if invited?

I never said that we shouldn't go if invited. We'd probably be able to win more in-state recruiting battles--and probably still have some influence in VA, GA, FL, and SC--but I don't know if we'd be able to compete with the guys that these schools get from Texas.

IMO, we'd be better than Iowa State and Kansas in FB, but is the money worth being in a conference where we'd be fighting to be the 9th best team?

YE$.... Would you rather see ECU "fighting to be the 9th best team" in the B12 or in a conference that's fighting for survival with the other mid-majors?

It depends. In the AAC, if things go moderately right for us, we could be in the championship hunt most years. I want us to win wherever we are since we as fans aren't going to see that money.

(05-06-2013 07:22 AM)Underdog Wrote:  "If the Big 12 does decide that they want to expand, it will have to focus efforts on members of the American Athletic Conference, the former Big East that will end up housing many former members of Conference USA. With the departure of Louisville to the ACC, the number of appealing options for the Big 12 has never been lower.

Cincinnati is still on the table as a possibility, but otherwise the Big 12 would have to look into expanding into Florida or bringing back former members of the SWC like SMU or Houston.

Florida schools like Central Florida or South Florida would be appealing because they could help open up the fertile state of Florida to Big 12 recruiting efforts...."

http://www.burntorangenation.com/2013/4/...ealignment

Not sure if this will ever happen, but it would be nice to get back with the old SWC rivals and join the big 12, lord knows we need the money!!!

GO COOGS

(05-06-2013 11:51 AM)HartfordHusky Wrote:  If the Big 12 wants to expand anytime soon, I think the best bet would be to grab UConn, Cincy, USF, and Temple. UConn and Cincy are by far the best overall brands left on the table. USF and Temple have both been BCS schools before for sustained periods of time.

The big name Big 12 schools would definitely sell out the NFL stadiums that Temple and USF play in and all 4 are in fairly large TV markets. Cincy, Temple, and UConn would completely get WVU off of an island and build a fairly cohesive eastern wing for the Big 12.

The biggest question would be, what Big 12 schools draw the short straw and get sent out to the eastern division? They could avoid that by having non-geographic divisions though where everyone has some far division mates and some fairly close by.

Here's a suggestion that I've already posted in this thread:

Big West Division: Baylor, Kansas St, Oklahoma, OSU, Texas, TT, TCU

Big East Division: Cincinnati, ECU, Iowa St, Kansas, USF, UCF, WV

(05-06-2013 11:51 AM)HartfordHusky Wrote:  If the Big 12 wants to expand anytime soon, I think the best bet would be to grab UConn, Cincy, USF, and Temple. UConn and Cincy are by far the best overall brands left on the table. USF and Temple have both been BCS schools before for sustained periods of time.

The big name Big 12 schools would definitely sell out the NFL stadiums that Temple and USF play in and all 4 are in fairly large TV markets. Cincy, Temple, and UConn would completely get WVU off of an island and build a fairly cohesive eastern wing for the Big 12.

The biggest question would be, what Big 12 schools draw the short straw and get sent out to the eastern division? They could avoid that by having non-geographic divisions though where everyone has some far division mates and some fairly close by.

I think, if the Big12 were to take four, those could well be the four they'd take --- and for the reasons provided. All four represent major markets. And all four have decent brands --- especially UConn, Cincinnati, and Temple. And at least three of the four are above average academically.

EDIT -- and I wouldn't be shocked if either Houston or SMU were in the mix.

Bottomline is, we havent even played a game as a conference. Can we just take a chill pill for a little while and consolidate before wondering whats next

Funny how many of the folks that bash Aresco and even the Friar Hobbit are all over this post salivating at even the mention of a Big12 invite. This thread perfectly illustrates why the commissioner position in the old/new Big East is an almost impossible situation. ESPN, NBC et al all saw what we have witnessed the last three years: there is no stability when everyone if the conference wants to be somewhere else. Hence the piss poor TV contract reflecting our collective lack of commitment.

With that said, the only question regarding an invite to both USF/UCF is who gets bragging rights for saying "HELL YES" to Big12 first.

Recent expansion almost without an exception has been strictly about adding TV markets to each conference's portfolio. If that is the case, the best stand alone, never mind combined markets are in Tampa and Orlando. Each school may not "own" it's market but brings more than enough interest as the second place team in their region of Florida.

ECU has everything except the market which is a HUGE negative. Otherwise, they would have been invited to join BigEast 2.0, 3.0, 4.0 and offered full membership instead of initially just partial membership for Big East 5.0. BTW, I may be off in the different iterations of the Big East....there have been sooooo many over the last two years alone...that it's easy to miss some.

(05-06-2013 12:11 PM)CyberBull Wrote:  Funny how many of the folks that bash Aresco and even the Friar Hobbit are all over this post salivating at even the mention of a Big12 invite. This thread perfectly illustrates why the commissioner position in the old/new Big East is an almost impossible situation. ESPN, NBC et al all saw what we have witnessed the last three years: there is no stability when everyone if the conference wants to be somewhere else. Hence the piss poor TV contract reflecting our collective lack of commitment.

With that said, the only question regarding an invite to both USF/UCF is who gets bragging rights for saying "HELL YES" to Big12 first.

Recent expansion almost without an exception has been strictly about adding TV markets to each conference's portfolio. If that is the case, the best stand alone, never mind combined markets are in Tampa and Orlando. Each school may not "own" it's market but brings more than enough interest as the second place team in their region of Florida.

ECU has everything except the market which is a HUGE negative. Otherwise, they would have been invited to join BigEast 2.0, 3.0, 4.0 and offered full membership instead of initially just partial membership for Big East 5.0. BTW, I may be off in the different iterations of the Big East....there have been sooooo many over the last two years alone...that it's easy to miss some.

When youre in the B12 and have home football games against Oklahoma and Texas you don't need a city market. We would bring a huge chunk of NC and VA in that league. More than enough to outweigh our 99th ranked home market.

(05-06-2013 10:53 AM)ecumbh1999 Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 10:36 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  ^^^ Don't discount Tulane. Last year some of the Texas mouthpieces' threw their names out there as a strong candidate. The reason they would be so attractive to the B12 is because of their academics and because it extends the conference east of Texas into SEC territory. Texas is very concerned the lack of academic research by current B12 members and wants to add another member they can collaborate with. ECU has a lot of virtues but I think their weakness in this capacity could cause Texas to thumb their nose at them.

You might want to learn a bit more about ECU...............

Seriously, it doesn't matter, ECU is not a research university. ECU's only way in is through football, and it hasn't been great lately. Worry about that, because the academics will never be there.

I think too many people are using what the Big East deemed as important to expansion. Is market size going to really be as important as it was to the Big East? The B12 is the same conference that has Lubbock, Manhattan, KS, Lawrence, and Charleston, WV. They have schools that can infiltrate several different markets and that's something that Temple, UCF, and USF don't do yet, but that's admittedly from my limited understanding. Are people in Pittsburgh going to turn their televisions to watch Temple football? Are people in Jacksonville going to watch USF or UCF?

ECU may not have a large market, but we penetrate Charlotte, the Triad, the Triangle, and areas in SC and VA quite well. With that said, Cincy and UConn are the best choices, IMO. UConn is in an awkward position though.

(05-06-2013 12:17 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 10:53 AM)ecumbh1999 Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 10:36 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  ^^^ Don't discount Tulane. Last year some of the Texas mouthpieces' threw their names out there as a strong candidate. The reason they would be so attractive to the B12 is because of their academics and because it extends the conference east of Texas into SEC territory. Texas is very concerned the lack of academic research by current B12 members and wants to add another member they can collaborate with. ECU has a lot of virtues but I think their weakness in this capacity could cause Texas to thumb their nose at them.

You might want to learn a bit more about ECU...............

Seriously, it doesn't matter, ECU is not a research university. ECU's only way in is through football, and it hasn't been great lately. Worry about that, because the academics will never be there.

ECU is higher ranked academically than Memphis

Source: US News

(05-06-2013 11:59 AM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 11:55 AM)Underdog Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 11:48 AM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 11:07 AM)Underdog Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 10:54 AM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  Even if--out of heaven--ECU gets invited to the BIG XII, it may not be our best choice besides the cash. Does it help our recruiting? Will we ever be competitive against all of those schools with heavy Texas pipelines? UConn would have to ask themselves the same question.

Cincy would have the most to gain outside of money, IMO.

The $$ alone is enough to go. Being in the B12 would elevate ECU to almost the pinnacle of college football (the SEC is at the top). Recruiting would improve immensely by being in the B12. ECU would have a realistic shot every year at not only playing in the college playoff, but for a national championship. Do you need more reasons why ECU should join if invited?

I never said that we shouldn't go if invited. We'd probably be able to win more in-state recruiting battles--and probably still have some influence in VA, GA, FL, and SC--but I don't know if we'd be able to compete with the guys that these schools get from Texas.

IMO, we'd be better than Iowa State and Kansas in FB, but is the money worth being in a conference where we'd be fighting to be the 9th best team?

YE$.... Would you rather see ECU "fighting to be the 9th best team" in the B12 or in a conference that's fighting for survival with the other mid-majors?

It depends. In the AAC, if things go moderately right for us, we could be in the championship hunt most years. I want us to win wherever we are since we as fans aren't going to see that money.

Things would have to go more than just "moderately right for us [to] be in the championship hunt most years;" we would need a miracle. The system is not designed for us to have a realistic chance, which is why a school as anemic as Washington St makes almost as much $$ than this conference combined. Consequently, this illustrates how big the odds are stacked against us. There is already a separation between the Big 5 and MM 5—financial. As each year goes by, the Big 5 widen the financial separation until they will be unreachable. If you were to add Texas and Oklahoma to the AAC, we would be making almost $20 mil per school while the Big 8 would see a drastic cut in pay and prestige. Any school that has the opportunity to get to higher ground before drowning in debt trying to be like the Big 5 must take that opportunity. Therefore, I truly hope that ECU may one day gets that opportunity; ECU has paid its DUE$.

(05-06-2013 12:17 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 10:53 AM)ecumbh1999 Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 10:36 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  ^^^ Don't discount Tulane. Last year some of the Texas mouthpieces' threw their names out there as a strong candidate. The reason they would be so attractive to the B12 is because of their academics and because it extends the conference east of Texas into SEC territory. Texas is very concerned the lack of academic research by current B12 members and wants to add another member they can collaborate with. ECU has a lot of virtues but I think their weakness in this capacity could cause Texas to thumb their nose at them.

You might want to learn a bit more about ECU...............

Seriously, it doesn't matter, ECU is not a research university. ECU's only way in is through football, and it hasn't been great lately. Worry about that, because the academics will never be there.

Says Memphis.

(05-06-2013 10:53 AM)ecumbh1999 Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 10:36 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  ^^^ Don't discount Tulane. Last year some of the Texas mouthpieces' threw their names out there as a strong candidate. The reason they would be so attractive to the B12 is because of their academics and because it extends the conference east of Texas into SEC territory. Texas is very concerned the lack of academic research by current B12 members and wants to add another member they can collaborate with. ECU has a lot of virtues but I think their weakness in this capacity could cause Texas to thumb their nose at them.

You might want to learn a bit more about ECU...............

Sorry, compared to the academic research and endowment ECU does not match up to Tulane. This is not earth-shattering. ECU's endowment is $180M whereas Tulane is pushing $1B. Tulane is a member of the AAU and is designated as a research heavyweight. ECU has some nice programs but some of the more snobbish institutions out there would have a problem with ECU's credentials in this regard. I don't like it either but it is just the way it is.

(05-06-2013 12:22 PM)Underdog Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 11:59 AM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 11:55 AM)Underdog Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 11:48 AM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 11:07 AM)Underdog Wrote:  The $$ alone is enough to go. Being in the B12 would elevate ECU to almost the pinnacle of college football (the SEC is at the top). Recruiting would improve immensely by being in the B12. ECU would have a realistic shot every year at not only playing in the college playoff, but for a national championship. Do you need more reasons why ECU should join if invited?

I never said that we shouldn't go if invited. We'd probably be able to win more in-state recruiting battles--and probably still have some influence in VA, GA, FL, and SC--but I don't know if we'd be able to compete with the guys that these schools get from Texas.

IMO, we'd be better than Iowa State and Kansas in FB, but is the money worth being in a conference where we'd be fighting to be the 9th best team?

YE$.... Would you rather see ECU "fighting to be the 9th best team" in the B12 or in a conference that's fighting for survival with the other mid-majors?

It depends. In the AAC, if things go moderately right for us, we could be in the championship hunt most years. I want us to win wherever we are since we as fans aren't going to see that money.

Things would have to go more than just "moderately right for us [to] be in the championship hunt most years;" we would need a miracle. The system is not designed for us to have a realistic chance, which is why a school as anemic as Washington St makes almost as much $$ than this conference combined. Consequently, this illustrates how big the odds are stacked against us. There is already a separation between the Big 5 and MM 5—financial. As each year goes by, the Big 5 widen the financial separation until they will be unreachable. If you were to add Texas and Oklahoma to the AAC, we would be making almost $20 mil per school while the Big 8 would see a drastic cut in pay and prestige. Any school that has the opportunity to get to higher ground before drowning in debt trying to be like the Big 5 must take that opportunity. Therefore, I truly hope that ECU may one day get that opportunity.

I meant conference championships.

(05-06-2013 12:15 PM)NBPirate Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 12:11 PM)CyberBull Wrote:  Funny how many of the folks that bash Aresco and even the Friar Hobbit are all over this post salivating at even the mention of a Big12 invite. This thread perfectly illustrates why the commissioner position in the old/new Big East is an almost impossible situation. ESPN, NBC et al all saw what we have witnessed the last three years: there is no stability when everyone if the conference wants to be somewhere else. Hence the piss poor TV contract reflecting our collective lack of commitment.

With that said, the only question regarding an invite to both USF/UCF is who gets bragging rights for saying "HELL YES" to Big12 first.

Recent expansion almost without an exception has been strictly about adding TV markets to each conference's portfolio. If that is the case, the best stand alone, never mind combined markets are in Tampa and Orlando. Each school may not "own" it's market but brings more than enough interest as the second place team in their region of Florida.

ECU has everything except the market which is a HUGE negative. Otherwise, they would have been invited to join BigEast 2.0, 3.0, 4.0 and offered full membership instead of initially just partial membership for Big East 5.0. BTW, I may be off in the different iterations of the Big East....there have been sooooo many over the last two years alone...that it's easy to miss some.

When youre in the B12 and have home football games against Oklahoma and Texas you don't need a city market. We would bring a huge chunk of NC and VA in that league. More than enough to outweigh our 99th ranked home market.

If that was true then you would have been invited into the original Big East a long time ago. Moreover, you would have not been made to wait for BE membership until the league was on it's last leg. There is obviously something with how TV values your complete package that has not made ECU more competitive in realignment. This is not my opinion but just the observed facts.

(05-06-2013 12:24 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 10:53 AM)ecumbh1999 Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 10:36 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  ^^^ Don't discount Tulane. Last year some of the Texas mouthpieces' threw their names out there as a strong candidate. The reason they would be so attractive to the B12 is because of their academics and because it extends the conference east of Texas into SEC territory. Texas is very concerned the lack of academic research by current B12 members and wants to add another member they can collaborate with. ECU has a lot of virtues but I think their weakness in this capacity could cause Texas to thumb their nose at them.

You might want to learn a bit more about ECU...............

Sorry, compared to the academic research and endowment ECU does not match up to Tulane. This is not earth-shattering. ECU's endowment is $180M whereas Tulane is pushing $1B. Tulane is a member of the AAU and is designated as a research heavyweight. ECU has some nice programs but some of the more snobbish institutions out there would have a problem with ECU's credentials in this regard. I don't like it either but it is just the way it is.

I'd surmise that Texas might have more of a problem with matching up with Tulane football than ECU academics. After all, WVU and TT are no academic heavyweights.

(05-06-2013 12:27 PM)CyberBull Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 12:15 PM)NBPirate Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 12:11 PM)CyberBull Wrote:  Funny how many of the folks that bash Aresco and even the Friar Hobbit are all over this post salivating at even the mention of a Big12 invite. This thread perfectly illustrates why the commissioner position in the old/new Big East is an almost impossible situation. ESPN, NBC et al all saw what we have witnessed the last three years: there is no stability when everyone if the conference wants to be somewhere else. Hence the piss poor TV contract reflecting our collective lack of commitment.

With that said, the only question regarding an invite to both USF/UCF is who gets bragging rights for saying "HELL YES" to Big12 first.

Recent expansion almost without an exception has been strictly about adding TV markets to each conference's portfolio. If that is the case, the best stand alone, never mind combined markets are in Tampa and Orlando. Each school may not "own" it's market but brings more than enough interest as the second place team in their region of Florida.

ECU has everything except the market which is a HUGE negative. Otherwise, they would have been invited to join BigEast 2.0, 3.0, 4.0 and offered full membership instead of initially just partial membership for Big East 5.0. BTW, I may be off in the different iterations of the Big East....there have been sooooo many over the last two years alone...that it's easy to miss some.

When youre in the B12 and have home football games against Oklahoma and Texas you don't need a city market. We would bring a huge chunk of NC and VA in that league. More than enough to outweigh our 99th ranked home market.

If that was true then you would have been invited into the original Big East a long time ago. Moreover, you would have not been made to wait for BE membership until the league was on it's last leg. There is obviously something with how TV values your complete package that has not made ECU more competitive in realignment. This is not my opinion but just the observed facts.

Worked out well for us in the TV deal eh.

(05-06-2013 12:21 PM)NBPirate Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 12:17 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 10:53 AM)ecumbh1999 Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 10:36 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  ^^^ Don't discount Tulane. Last year some of the Texas mouthpieces' threw their names out there as a strong candidate. The reason they would be so attractive to the B12 is because of their academics and because it extends the conference east of Texas into SEC territory. Texas is very concerned the lack of academic research by current B12 members and wants to add another member they can collaborate with. ECU has a lot of virtues but I think their weakness in this capacity could cause Texas to thumb their nose at them.

You might want to learn a bit more about ECU...............

Seriously, it doesn't matter, ECU is not a research university. ECU's only way in is through football, and it hasn't been great lately. Worry about that, because the academics will never be there.

ECU is higher ranked academically than Memphis

Source: US News

Straw man, I didn't say anything about Memphis. Worry about your own caveat, football, because nothing else will be good enough for Texas to give a **** about you.

This is like watching twenty-some-odd ducks going after a piece of bread....

(05-06-2013 12:32 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 12:21 PM)NBPirate Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 12:17 PM)Lord2FLI Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 10:53 AM)ecumbh1999 Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 10:36 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  ^^^ Don't discount Tulane. Last year some of the Texas mouthpieces' threw their names out there as a strong candidate. The reason they would be so attractive to the B12 is because of their academics and because it extends the conference east of Texas into SEC territory. Texas is very concerned the lack of academic research by current B12 members and wants to add another member they can collaborate with. ECU has a lot of virtues but I think their weakness in this capacity could cause Texas to thumb their nose at them.

You might want to learn a bit more about ECU...............

Seriously, it doesn't matter, ECU is not a research university. ECU's only way in is through football, and it hasn't been great lately. Worry about that, because the academics will never be there.

ECU is higher ranked academically than Memphis

Source: US News

Straw man, I didn't say jack **** about Memphis. Worry about your own ****, football, because nothing else will be good enough for Texas to give a **** about you.

Wow, no need to be so testy. Just pointing out facts. Those that live in glass houses should not cast stones. We all have our warts. If we didn't we wouldnt be here together.