(05-01-2013 07:10 PM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  

(05-01-2013 06:04 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(05-01-2013 09:44 AM)Poliicious Wrote:  

(05-01-2013 01:19 AM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  

(04-30-2013 11:24 PM)Poliicious Wrote:  With NAFTA & CAFTA in place, the companies that are moving south for cheap labor and just going to keep going south across the Rio Grande into Mexico, Costa Rica and Panama since they can mfg their products there are ship them into the states tariff free. Panama is almost totally devoid of income taxation.

Devaluing labor is a losing zero sum game.

Companies that help retailers and small manufacturers and distributors grow brand loyalty and enhance the customer experience are growing and adding staff. That is one of the key segments in the economic recovery. Amazon(Living Social), Belly, Grub Hub, Restaurant.com .

Not talking about devaluing labor. Talking about a fair wage. Companies that have to pay high-end wages have already lost the economic war. Worried about NAFTA? Try worrying about China. That's a losing zero sum game. Enough about this can of worms I opened. Let's move on.

The auto makers have rebounded tremendously since the 08 Bush auto bailout and one of the most successful retailers in Costco who pays the highest wages in the industry and offers the best benefits in retail. Starbucks continues to grow profitably and provides some form of healthcare for most if not all their employees. You don't have to cut wages or offer healthcare that none of your employees can afford like WalMart to be profitable.

The Right to Work for Less States have picked up jobs but on average their unemployment rates are still higher than the states that have a higher percentage of Union membership.

The Red States in the South take in more Federal dollars than they pay out in taxes/fees, etc. to the Federal government.

This is a fact despite the South, on average, being where more people complain about Federal taxes and Federal payouts/entitlements.


http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_reckoning...taxes.html


http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/...ing-state/


Rick Perry always decries Federal money and intervention and even threatened to secede, but was yelling loudly for Federal aid after the recent West, Texas explosion.

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/04/18/ri...explosion/


I view it as hypocrisy. But, who cares what I think?

I grew up in a working class area of Pennsylvania. I am the son and grandson of coal miners and steelworkers. To this day, I view everything through that prism.

If something doesn't equate to higher wages and benefits for the middle/working class and seems to only benefit large, multinational corporations and upper class folks, I am not for it and probably am against it.

Anyway, back to arguing about sports.

My Maytag dryer costed me less this last year than the one I purchased in 1982. Same goes for my TV, and just about everything else that used to be made in the USA. We fuss about wages but we all love the imported product prices. Buy American and we will all make more money, union and right to work...

If I were Czar of the USA, I would tariff/tax the $hit out of companies who take jobs away from Americans and outsource them overseas.

I would gladly pay more for products if the net result was a higher wage for working class Americans.

(05-01-2013 11:49 AM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Devaluing labor usually ends up in situations like we saw in Bangladesh, where workers are paid next to nothing, and work in deplorable conditions, often to the detriment...

http://news.yahoo.com/collapsed-building...23478.html

In West Virginia, coal company stores and housing is still well remembered by old timers. It was situations like what happened in Bangladesh that led to unions being created in the first place...

Thanks for your perspective. Coal mining is a very dangerous job and not designing adequate safety standards or having procedures in place to ensure that those precautions are carried out is a recipe for disaster, safe rooms with food, water and oxygen should be a no brainer. My great uncle was a coal miner in southern Poland, died due to an accident at a young age.

There is extensive coal mining in western Canada, but you don't hear about mine disasters from that region nearly as frequently as Kentucky and West Virginia. The fact that all Canadian mine workers are unionized and there are gov't mandated life saving procedures in place could be why you rarely hear of deaths caused by mine accidents from that region.

Maytag dryers are made in the US. Just bought a dryer yesterday and the appliance store owner (whose been in the business for nearly 40 years) told me that Whirlpool is now not only manufacturing Sears but several other brands as well including Maytag. Benton Harbor/St Joe Michigan.

Whirlpool is also manufacturing Amana clothes dryers as well.

(05-01-2013 09:57 PM)Poliicious Wrote:  Whirlpool is also manufacturing Amana clothes dryers as well.

Whirlpool has a Mexican made brand too...Roper. I do hope the jobs come back.

(05-01-2013 09:46 PM)Poliicious Wrote:  

(05-01-2013 11:49 AM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Devaluing labor usually ends up in situations like we saw in Bangladesh, where workers are paid next to nothing, and work in deplorable conditions, often to the detriment...

http://news.yahoo.com/collapsed-building...23478.html

In West Virginia, coal company stores and housing is still well remembered by old timers. It was situations like what happened in Bangladesh that led to unions being created in the first place...

Thanks for your perspective. Coal mining is a very dangerous job and not designing adequate safety standards or having procedures in place to ensure that those precautions are carried out is a recipe for disaster, safe rooms with food, water and oxygen should be a no brainer. My great uncle was a coal miner in southern Poland, died due to an accident at a young age.

There is extensive coal mining in western Canada, but you don't hear about mine disasters from that region nearly as frequently as Kentucky and West Virginia. The fact that all Canadian mine workers are unionized and there are gov't mandated life saving procedures in place could be why you rarely hear of deaths caused by mine accidents from that region.

I think the rate of mine disasters in Appalachian Mountains is more related to the type of coal mined. In western Canada, the mines there are producing Anthracite coal, which is a hard coal. The mines throughout West Virginia, and much of the Appalachian Mountains is Bituminous, or soft coal. Soft coal seams are more unstable than hard coal seams, with the surrounding rock being of a much more unstable protecting layer as well, leading to a higher chance of a mine collapse. Hard coal has been in the ground over a far longer period of time, allowing for more compression of the surrounding rock layers, giving them more stability. Ask any geologist...

The southern West Virginia coal mines also have a very low sulfur content in the Bituminous coal as well, which gives off fewer contaminants and precipitant particles when it burns, making it as clean burning as Anthracite coal, which is the rarer form of coal in the USA, which isn't mined as much, since it's more expensive to mine. Much more coal is mined in West Virginia and eastern Kentucky than is mined in western Canada, or anywhere else for that matter, which raises the odds of mine disasters occurring...

(05-02-2013 11:04 AM)bitcruncher Wrote:  

(05-01-2013 09:46 PM)Poliicious Wrote:  

(05-01-2013 11:49 AM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Devaluing labor usually ends up in situations like we saw in Bangladesh, where workers are paid next to nothing, and work in deplorable conditions, often to the detriment...

http://news.yahoo.com/collapsed-building...23478.html

In West Virginia, coal company stores and housing is still well remembered by old timers. It was situations like what happened in Bangladesh that led to unions being created in the first place...

Thanks for your perspective. Coal mining is a very dangerous job and not designing adequate safety standards or having procedures in place to ensure that those precautions are carried out is a recipe for disaster, safe rooms with food, water and oxygen should be a no brainer. My great uncle was a coal miner in southern Poland, died due to an accident at a young age.

There is extensive coal mining in western Canada, but you don't hear about mine disasters from that region nearly as frequently as Kentucky and West Virginia. The fact that all Canadian mine workers are unionized and there are gov't mandated life saving procedures in place could be why you rarely hear of deaths caused by mine accidents from that region.

I think the rate of mine disasters in Appalachian Mountains is more related to the type of coal mined. In western Canada, the mines there are producing Anthracite coal, which is a hard coal. The mines throughout West Virginia, and much of the Appalachian Mountains is Bituminous, or soft coal. Soft coal seams are more unstable than hard coal seams, with the surrounding rock being of a much more unstable protecting layer as well, leading to a higher chance of a mine collapse. Hard coal has been in the ground over a far longer period of time, allowing for more compression of the surrounding rock layers, giving them more stability. Ask any geologist...

The southern West Virginia coal mines also have a very low sulfur content in the Bituminous coal as well, which gives off fewer contaminants and precipitant particles when it burns, making it as clean burning as Anthracite coal, which is the rarer form of coal in the USA, which isn't mined as much, since it's more expensive to mine. Much more coal is mined in West Virginia and eastern Kentucky than is mined in western Canada, or anywhere else for that matter, which raises the odds of mine disasters occurring...

Wow. Learning a lot here. I believe the coal my brother in law mined in Illinois was anthracite as well. Seemed like I remember learning that in geography class too a long time ago. lol

At one time most everybody in this country was poor, EVERY REGION. I know may grandparents were poor. The south was still relatively rural and poor as recent as the 1980's.

This internal memo was leaked overnight to state media:


Comrades,

A breif overview of upcoming party business:

Politburo meet month of July, discuss way to take back funds for disaster prevention/relief from redneck southern states. Southeast United states get unfair amount of dollar. We tax more.

Cannot take back federal monies allocated to lesson impact of past and future natural disasters so now punish redneck In South with hammer and sickle.

Future natural disaster policy we move displaced redneck from south to north and re-educate indoctrinate redneck in way of hammer and sickle.


Head of central planning committee allocate funds to commission white paper on destructive ways of redneck culture, Slate/George Soros combine forces to do study and use other left outlets like Politifact to fact check. Final edit of white paper must be approved by politburo committee of information.


August Central Planning Five Point Plan Agenda for social jusstice and econimic reform.

(1) Central planning meet August to put plan in place to take redneck guns and shut down redneck college FB. Redneck football to be abolished, power to swing back to rightful place.

(2) Redneck to be put back in place by way of hammer and sickle. Capitalism to be crushed with hammer and sickle, economic social justice to replace.


(3) most effective was to implment New policy to take effect 2014…. Politburo to re-organize redneck life according to “progressive” principles. Redneck culture of work, beer, and football destructive to revolutions cause…..A study commissioned by the Economist established this culture far more destructive and decadent than gangster rap, street crime, and organized crime. People’s Republic of California and New York to be blueprint for re-education of dumb redneck. Dear leader and Politburo cannot allow redneck beliefs to spread to rest of country, we cannot allow rest of country to open his eye and compare the “progressive” narrative with facts on the ground, one might start asking questions. Fairness Doctrine to be reintroduced on grand scale. Critical mass has been reached, time to strike with hammer and sickle.

(4) State to take over auto industry, consolidate all operations move south production to north for purposes of fairness. Only two product lines to exist so everyone drive same car and truck, this make comrades all feel belong to same social class…middle class must be crushed with hammer and sickle. Social economic justice demand fairness for lower class, middle class standards must be brought down to achieve ultimate goal of bring middle and lower class to equality.

(5) Committee on social engineering determine all it takes for those not party elites to live on is seven dollars a day. Politburo to put forth plan to raise corporate tax rate to 98% and personal income tax to 90%, study by office minister of public finance sttes this allows everyone seven dollars a day to live on and provide basic needs while at the same time increase in tax rate allow state run Red Rider BB gun manufacturer to produce enough BB guns to arm entire civilian population with Red Rider BB gun to go along with monthly ration of 100 BB’ for personal safety. Left over funds from increase to go toward party building, People’s Republic army, and tax cut for party elite.


Stay strong comrades and always remember “revolutionary” changes have turned reality on its head — which is what “revolution” literally means.

Stay strong to progressive principles:

People can’t do anything right. government bureaucracy via dear leader and politburo can do everything.

American capitalism is outdated model. Peoples Republic of economic social justice and of hammer and sickle is way forward…..just pretend to work and we pretend to pay.

Re-educate southern redneck.



Politburo agenda for 2015 forward. To stamp out with hammer and sickle Texas Cowboy. Texas cowboy stubborn and stupid….politburo see know way but to crush with Iron fist.


In closing politburo at the direction of dear leader pleased to announce the follwoing party promotions:

(1) Comrade Jay Z appointed minister of Arts
(2) Comrade Michael Moore minister of film and propoganda
(3) Comrade Reggi Love minister of Basketball

(05-02-2013 11:04 AM)bitcruncher Wrote:  

(05-01-2013 09:46 PM)Poliicious Wrote:  

(05-01-2013 11:49 AM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Devaluing labor usually ends up in situations like we saw in Bangladesh, where workers are paid next to nothing, and work in deplorable conditions, often to the detriment...

http://news.yahoo.com/collapsed-building...23478.html

In West Virginia, coal company stores and housing is still well remembered by old timers. It was situations like what happened in Bangladesh that led to unions being created in the first place...

Thanks for your perspective. Coal mining is a very dangerous job and not designing adequate safety standards or having procedures in place to ensure that those precautions are carried out is a recipe for disaster, safe rooms with food, water and oxygen should be a no brainer. My great uncle was a coal miner in southern Poland, died due to an accident at a young age.

There is extensive coal mining in western Canada, but you don't hear about mine disasters from that region nearly as frequently as Kentucky and West Virginia. The fact that all Canadian mine workers are unionized and there are gov't mandated life saving procedures in place could be why you rarely hear of deaths caused by mine accidents from that region.

I think the rate of mine disasters in Appalachian Mountains is more related to the type of coal mined. In western Canada, the mines there are producing Anthracite coal, which is a hard coal. The mines throughout West Virginia, and much of the Appalachian Mountains is Bituminous, or soft coal. Soft coal seams are more unstable than hard coal seams, with the surrounding rock being of a much more unstable protecting layer as well, leading to a higher chance of a mine collapse. Hard coal has been in the ground over a far longer period of time, allowing for more compression of the surrounding rock layers, giving them more stability. Ask any geologist...

The southern West Virginia coal mines also have a very low sulfur content in the Bituminous coal as well, which gives off fewer contaminants and precipitant particles when it burns, making it as clean burning as Anthracite coal, which is the rarer form of coal in the USA, which isn't mined as much, since it's more expensive to mine. Much more coal is mined in West Virginia and eastern Kentucky than is mined in western Canada, or anywhere else for that matter, which raises the odds of mine disasters occurring...

When I was about ten years old (1967), I looked around at all of male relatives who were coal miners.

I had an Uncle missing half of his right foot. Another uncle was missing most of his right thumb and had his back broken in slate fall. My Dad had lost most of his nose in a slate fall.

My maternal grandfather had his left arm cut off in a mine accident.

My Dad and most of my Uncles had black lung disease. My Uncle Andrew had to carry oxygen around with him.

I decided right then and there that I never would enter the coal mines and would go to college.

(05-02-2013 11:39 AM)Tiger8589 Wrote:  This internal memo was leaked overnight to state media:


Comrades,

A breif overview of upcoming party business:

Politburo meet month of July, discuss way to take back funds for disaster prevention/relief from redneck southern states. Southeast United states get unfair amount of dollar. We tax more.

Cannot take back federal monies allocated to lesson impact of past and future natural disasters so now punish redneck In South with hammer and sickle.

Future natural disaster policy we move displaced redneck from south to north and re-educate indoctrinate redneck in way of hammer and sickle.


Head of central planning committee allocate funds to commission white paper on destructive ways of redneck culture, Slate/George Soros combine forces to do study and use other left outlets like Politifact to fact check. Final edit of white paper must be approved by politburo committee of information.


August Central Planning Five Point Plan Agenda for social jusstice and econimic reform.

(1) Central planning meet August to put plan in place to take redneck guns and shut down redneck college FB. Redneck football to be abolished, power to swing back to rightful place.

(2) Redneck to be put back in place by way of hammer and sickle. Capitalism to be crushed with hammer and sickle, economic social justice to replace.


(3) most effective was to implment New policy to take effect 2014…. Politburo to re-organize redneck life according to “progressive” principles. Redneck culture of work, beer, and football destructive to revolutions cause…..A study commissioned by the Economist established this culture far more destructive and decadent than gangster rap, street crime, and organized crime. People’s Republic of California and New York to be blueprint for re-education of dumb redneck. Dear leader and Politburo cannot allow redneck beliefs to spread to rest of country, we cannot allow rest of country to open his eye and compare the “progressive” narrative with facts on the ground, one might start asking questions. Fairness Doctrine to be reintroduced on grand scale. Critical mass has been reached, time to strike with hammer and sickle.

(4) State to take over auto industry, consolidate all operations move south production to north for purposes of fairness. Only two product lines to exist so everyone drive same car and truck, this make comrades all feel belong to same social class…middle class must be crushed with hammer and sickle. Social economic justice demand fairness for lower class, middle class standards must be brought down to achieve ultimate goal of bring middle and lower class to equality.

(5) Committee on social engineering determine all it takes for those not party elites to live on is seven dollars a day. Politburo to put forth plan to raise corporate tax rate to 98% and personal income tax to 90%, study by office minister of public finance sttes this allows everyone seven dollars a day to live on and provide basic needs while at the same time increase in tax rate allow state run Red Rider BB gun manufacturer to produce enough BB guns to arm entire civilian population with Red Rider BB gun to go along with monthly ration of 100 BB’ for personal safety. Left over funds from increase to go toward party building, People’s Republic army, and tax cut for party elite.


Stay strong comrades and always remember “revolutionary” changes have turned reality on its head — which is what “revolution” literally means.

Stay strong to progressive principles:

People can’t do anything right. government bureaucracy via dear leader and politburo can do everything.

American capitalism is outdated model. Peoples Republic of economic social justice and of hammer and sickle is way forward…..just pretend to work and we pretend to pay.

Re-educate southern redneck.



Politburo agenda for 2015 forward. To stamp out with hammer and sickle Texas Cowboy. Texas cowboy stubborn and stupid….politburo see know way but to crush with Iron fist.


In closing politburo at the direction of dear leader pleased to announce the follwoing party promotions:

(1) Comrade Jay Z appointed minister of Arts
(2) Comrade Michael Moore minister of film and propoganda
(3) Comrade Reggi Love minister of Basketball

You must have never been to places like Western Pennsylvania, Northeast Ohio and Western New York, for example, if you think that "redneck" culture of work, beer and football is limited to the South.....

(05-02-2013 01:02 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(05-02-2013 11:39 AM)Tiger8589 Wrote:  This internal memo was leaked overnight to state media:


Comrades,

A breif overview of upcoming party business:

Politburo meet month of July, discuss way to take back funds for disaster prevention/relief from redneck southern states. Southeast United states get unfair amount of dollar. We tax more.

Cannot take back federal monies allocated to lesson impact of past and future natural disasters so now punish redneck In South with hammer and sickle.

Future natural disaster policy we move displaced redneck from south to north and re-educate indoctrinate redneck in way of hammer and sickle.


Head of central planning committee allocate funds to commission white paper on destructive ways of redneck culture, Slate/George Soros combine forces to do study and use other left outlets like Politifact to fact check. Final edit of white paper must be approved by politburo committee of information.


August Central Planning Five Point Plan Agenda for social jusstice and econimic reform.

(1) Central planning meet August to put plan in place to take redneck guns and shut down redneck college FB. Redneck football to be abolished, power to swing back to rightful place.

(2) Redneck to be put back in place by way of hammer and sickle. Capitalism to be crushed with hammer and sickle, economic social justice to replace.


(3) most effective was to implment New policy to take effect 2014…. Politburo to re-organize redneck life according to “progressive” principles. Redneck culture of work, beer, and football destructive to revolutions cause…..A study commissioned by the Economist established this culture far more destructive and decadent than gangster rap, street crime, and organized crime. People’s Republic of California and New York to be blueprint for re-education of dumb redneck. Dear leader and Politburo cannot allow redneck beliefs to spread to rest of country, we cannot allow rest of country to open his eye and compare the “progressive” narrative with facts on the ground, one might start asking questions. Fairness Doctrine to be reintroduced on grand scale. Critical mass has been reached, time to strike with hammer and sickle.

(4) State to take over auto industry, consolidate all operations move south production to north for purposes of fairness. Only two product lines to exist so everyone drive same car and truck, this make comrades all feel belong to same social class…middle class must be crushed with hammer and sickle. Social economic justice demand fairness for lower class, middle class standards must be brought down to achieve ultimate goal of bring middle and lower class to equality.

(5) Committee on social engineering determine all it takes for those not party elites to live on is seven dollars a day. Politburo to put forth plan to raise corporate tax rate to 98% and personal income tax to 90%, study by office minister of public finance sttes this allows everyone seven dollars a day to live on and provide basic needs while at the same time increase in tax rate allow state run Red Rider BB gun manufacturer to produce enough BB guns to arm entire civilian population with Red Rider BB gun to go along with monthly ration of 100 BB’ for personal safety. Left over funds from increase to go toward party building, People’s Republic army, and tax cut for party elite.


Stay strong comrades and always remember “revolutionary” changes have turned reality on its head — which is what “revolution” literally means.

Stay strong to progressive principles:

People can’t do anything right. government bureaucracy via dear leader and politburo can do everything.

American capitalism is outdated model. Peoples Republic of economic social justice and of hammer and sickle is way forward…..just pretend to work and we pretend to pay.

Re-educate southern redneck.



Politburo agenda for 2015 forward. To stamp out with hammer and sickle Texas Cowboy. Texas cowboy stubborn and stupid….politburo see know way but to crush with Iron fist.


In closing politburo at the direction of dear leader pleased to announce the follwoing party promotions:

(1) Comrade Jay Z appointed minister of Arts
(2) Comrade Michael Moore minister of film and propoganda
(3) Comrade Reggi Love minister of Basketball

You must have never been to places like Western Pennsylvania, Northeast Ohio and Western New York, for example, if you think that "redneck" culture of work, beer and football is limited to the South.....

I have and those folks are in the same boat but they don't identify with bakward souther redneck. Western PA is more like Alabama. Dont forget about West Virginia.

(05-02-2013 01:12 PM)Tiger8589 Wrote:  

(05-02-2013 01:02 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(05-02-2013 11:39 AM)Tiger8589 Wrote:  This internal memo was leaked overnight to state media:


Comrades,

A breif overview of upcoming party business:

Politburo meet month of July, discuss way to take back funds for disaster prevention/relief from redneck southern states. Southeast United states get unfair amount of dollar. We tax more.

Cannot take back federal monies allocated to lesson impact of past and future natural disasters so now punish redneck In South with hammer and sickle.

Future natural disaster policy we move displaced redneck from south to north and re-educate indoctrinate redneck in way of hammer and sickle.


Head of central planning committee allocate funds to commission white paper on destructive ways of redneck culture, Slate/George Soros combine forces to do study and use other left outlets like Politifact to fact check. Final edit of white paper must be approved by politburo committee of information.


August Central Planning Five Point Plan Agenda for social jusstice and econimic reform.

(1) Central planning meet August to put plan in place to take redneck guns and shut down redneck college FB. Redneck football to be abolished, power to swing back to rightful place.

(2) Redneck to be put back in place by way of hammer and sickle. Capitalism to be crushed with hammer and sickle, economic social justice to replace.


(3) most effective was to implment New policy to take effect 2014…. Politburo to re-organize redneck life according to “progressive” principles. Redneck culture of work, beer, and football destructive to revolutions cause…..A study commissioned by the Economist established this culture far more destructive and decadent than gangster rap, street crime, and organized crime. People’s Republic of California and New York to be blueprint for re-education of dumb redneck. Dear leader and Politburo cannot allow redneck beliefs to spread to rest of country, we cannot allow rest of country to open his eye and compare the “progressive” narrative with facts on the ground, one might start asking questions. Fairness Doctrine to be reintroduced on grand scale. Critical mass has been reached, time to strike with hammer and sickle.

(4) State to take over auto industry, consolidate all operations move south production to north for purposes of fairness. Only two product lines to exist so everyone drive same car and truck, this make comrades all feel belong to same social class…middle class must be crushed with hammer and sickle. Social economic justice demand fairness for lower class, middle class standards must be brought down to achieve ultimate goal of bring middle and lower class to equality.

(5) Committee on social engineering determine all it takes for those not party elites to live on is seven dollars a day. Politburo to put forth plan to raise corporate tax rate to 98% and personal income tax to 90%, study by office minister of public finance sttes this allows everyone seven dollars a day to live on and provide basic needs while at the same time increase in tax rate allow state run Red Rider BB gun manufacturer to produce enough BB guns to arm entire civilian population with Red Rider BB gun to go along with monthly ration of 100 BB’ for personal safety. Left over funds from increase to go toward party building, People’s Republic army, and tax cut for party elite.


Stay strong comrades and always remember “revolutionary” changes have turned reality on its head — which is what “revolution” literally means.

Stay strong to progressive principles:

People can’t do anything right. government bureaucracy via dear leader and politburo can do everything.

American capitalism is outdated model. Peoples Republic of economic social justice and of hammer and sickle is way forward…..just pretend to work and we pretend to pay.

Re-educate southern redneck.



Politburo agenda for 2015 forward. To stamp out with hammer and sickle Texas Cowboy. Texas cowboy stubborn and stupid….politburo see know way but to crush with Iron fist.


In closing politburo at the direction of dear leader pleased to announce the follwoing party promotions:

(1) Comrade Jay Z appointed minister of Arts
(2) Comrade Michael Moore minister of film and propoganda
(3) Comrade Reggi Love minister of Basketball

You must have never been to places like Western Pennsylvania, Northeast Ohio and Western New York, for example, if you think that "redneck" culture of work, beer and football is limited to the South.....

I have and those folks are in the same boat as the rednecks in the south. Western PA is more like Alabama. Dont forget about West Virginia.

I grew up there and have been to Alabama often. It ain't the same. But, Pittsburgh area folks have the beer, football and hard work mentality.

PA is described as Pittsburgh in the west, Philadelphia in the east and Alabama in between. I would agree with that.

(05-02-2013 12:58 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(05-02-2013 11:04 AM)bitcruncher Wrote:  

(05-01-2013 09:46 PM)Poliicious Wrote:  

(05-01-2013 11:49 AM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Devaluing labor usually ends up in situations like we saw in Bangladesh, where workers are paid next to nothing, and work in deplorable conditions, often to the detriment...

http://news.yahoo.com/collapsed-building...23478.html

In West Virginia, coal company stores and housing is still well remembered by old timers. It was situations like what happened in Bangladesh that led to unions being created in the first place...

Thanks for your perspective. Coal mining is a very dangerous job and not designing adequate safety standards or having procedures in place to ensure that those precautions are carried out is a recipe for disaster, safe rooms with food, water and oxygen should be a no brainer. My great uncle was a coal miner in southern Poland, died due to an accident at a young age.

There is extensive coal mining in western Canada, but you don't hear about mine disasters from that region nearly as frequently as Kentucky and West Virginia. The fact that all Canadian mine workers are unionized and there are gov't mandated life saving procedures in place could be why you rarely hear of deaths caused by mine accidents from that region.

I think the rate of mine disasters in Appalachian Mountains is more related to the type of coal mined. In western Canada, the mines there are producing Anthracite coal, which is a hard coal. The mines throughout West Virginia, and much of the Appalachian Mountains is Bituminous, or soft coal. Soft coal seams are more unstable than hard coal seams, with the surrounding rock being of a much more unstable protecting layer as well, leading to a higher chance of a mine collapse. Hard coal has been in the ground over a far longer period of time, allowing for more compression of the surrounding rock layers, giving them more stability. Ask any geologist...

The southern West Virginia coal mines also have a very low sulfur content in the Bituminous coal as well, which gives off fewer contaminants and precipitant particles when it burns, making it as clean burning as Anthracite coal, which is the rarer form of coal in the USA, which isn't mined as much, since it's more expensive to mine. Much more coal is mined in West Virginia and eastern Kentucky than is mined in western Canada, or anywhere else for that matter, which raises the odds of mine disasters occurring...

When I was about ten years old (1967), I looked around at all of male relatives who were coal miners.

I had an Uncle missing half of his right foot. Another uncle was missing most of his right thumb and had his back broken in slate fall. My Dad had lost most of his nose in a slate fall.

My maternal grandfather had his left arm cut off in a mine accident.

My Dad and most of my Uncles had black lung disease. My Uncle Andrew had to carry oxygen around with him.

I decided right then and there that I never would enter the coal mines and would go to college.

My first exposure to mining was a trip down the Beckley Exhibition Coal Mine. After a trip down into that old mine, I knew that I never wanted to be a miner. I did a good bit of exploring in the old abandoned coal mines where I grew up, and enjoy spelunking. But I had no desire to go down there for a living. Exploring caves and mines was one thing, working there was another...

Look, i'm just messing with people a little bit. I hope every conference does well going forward, I really do. I truly believer the SEC has a stranglehold on this thing long term though. I have no allegiance to either the SEC or Big 10. Again I hope both do well, it's clear to me these two conferences are the lead dogs and I just don't see it changing anytime soon. However, the ACC does have alot of upside going forward if they play there cards right, the ND affiliation only helps that cause. FB just isn't as serious West of the Rocky mountains and while the Big12 is currently in a position of strength for the foreseeable future they have basically no footprint outside of the state of Texas, if the Big12 GOR holds they stick it out but long term once it runs out I can see the Big12 loosing lots of members and the holdovers raiding whoever the best brands are from the conferences below them. Just my opinion is all it is.

Since the discussion turned to social commentary I just figured I would joke around with a little social commentary of my own. Not meant to look down on any region, we are all Americans and I want the entire country to succeed.

(05-02-2013 05:14 PM)Tiger8589 Wrote:  Look, i'm just messing with people a little bit. I hope every conference does well going forward, I really do. I truly believer the SEC has a stranglehold on this thing long term though. I have no allegiance to either the SEC or Big 10. Again I hope both do well, it's clear to me these two conferences are the lead dogs and I just don't see it changing anytime soon. However, the ACC does have alot of upside going forward if they play there cards right, the ND affiliation only helps that cause. FB just isn't as serious West of the Rocky mountains and while the Big12 is currently in a position of strength for the foreseeable future they have basically no footprint outside of the state of Texas, if the Big12 GOR holds they stick it out but long term once it runs out I can see the Big12 loosing lots of members and the holdovers raiding whoever the best brands are from the conferences below them. Just my opinion is all it is.

Since the discussion turned to social commentary I just figured I would joke around with a little social commentary of my own. Not meant to look down on any region, we are all Americans and I want the entire country to succeed.

Hell, no offense taken. It was a good debate/discussion even if it veered into politics and economics (which is really never a good idea, along with religion).

(05-02-2013 12:58 PM)TerryD Wrote:  When I was about ten years old (1967), I looked around at all of male relatives who were coal miners.

I had an Uncle missing half of his right foot. Another uncle was missing most of his right thumb and had his back broken in slate fall. My Dad had lost most of his nose in a slate fall.

My maternal grandfather had his left arm cut off in a mine accident.

My Dad and most of my Uncles had black lung disease. My Uncle Andrew had to carry oxygen around with him.

I decided right then and there that I never would enter the coal mines and would go to college.

My granddad was missing part of a finger, but then he was a farmer rather than a miner. They had a song back in the roaring 20's, "how are you gonna to keep them down on the farm, once they've seen Gay Paris?", but my Dad used to say, "How you gonna keep them down on the farm, once they've seen the farm?"

I have always told my new SEC friends down here that if they don't think Missouri belongs in the SEC, they should just take a drive through Missouri.

(05-02-2013 10:57 PM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  I have always told my new SEC friends down here that if they don't think Missouri belongs in the SEC, they should just take a drive through Missouri.

If you take I55 south through Missouri and then into Arkansas you will see AND feel a very obvious difference.

(05-03-2013 05:52 AM)He1nousOne Wrote:  

(05-02-2013 10:57 PM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  I have always told my new SEC friends down here that if they don't think Missouri belongs in the SEC, they should just take a drive through Missouri.

If you take I55 south through Missouri and then into Arkansas you will see AND feel a very obvious difference.

I have driven from Baton Rouge to St. Louis and back a number of times.

On the way back, I have not noticed much of a difference between Cape Girardeau and New Madrid, Missouri versus Blytheville and Marion, Arkansas.

It pretty much looked and felt the same to me.