(04-24-2013 08:19 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:09 AM)bearcat29 Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 07:50 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 07:22 AM)JMUDuke25 Wrote:  The big 12 is viable as long as Texas stays. If Texas leaves who knows. Has nothing to do with Cincinnati and UConn

This--^

The Big12 is relevant as long as UT and to a lessor degree OU stay.

Adding Cincy, Ville would've been my choices with WVU. Get WVU in for '10 then announce Cincy and Ville within 27 months.

I would've looked at BYU, Boise, USF, UCF and Memphis as possible extra adds but not right away.

I agree. The problem with the big east was not markets, it was that they did not have a premier team. WVU was good, but a team that was going to challenge for the national title a few times a decade. A conference needs a few heavyweights for national perception and to help with the TV contract. As long as you have TX and OU, the B12 will be fine. Also, the B12 has schools like OSU, KU, Baylor, KSU that will rise up and have a top 15 season every few years.

I understand why they did not invite UofL (and to a lesser extent UC) right away. While UofL is hot, they could potentially pick off ACC teams with bigger footprints and national notoriety. The ACC stepped up and got their act together with ND, potential Cable channel and GOR stopping it to their credit.

Unless the SEC or Big 10 had raided the Acc first, the Big 12 was never in a position to raid the Acc. Acc fans have repeatedly said this. Does anyone really believe that if FSU was willing to leave the Acc and join the Big 12 that the Big 12 would have waited more than a New York minute to invite them?

FSU and Clemson talked about moving in board meetings, so they did seriously consider it, so the Big 12 was in a "position" to raid. But ultimately FSU and Clemson decided to stick with the ACC, just like the Big 12 schools other than CU decided not to go to the Pac when the Pac was in a "position" to raid. And virtually everyone believes the Big 12 would have said yes to FSU and found a #12 even if Clemson or Miami wasn't coming. There may have been an issue of FSU wanting a 13 and 14 which the Big 12 wasn't willing to do, but I suspect it was just FSU not being willing to move.

(04-24-2013 08:21 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:09 AM)bearcat29 Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 07:50 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 07:22 AM)JMUDuke25 Wrote:  The big 12 is viable as long as Texas stays. If Texas leaves who knows. Has nothing to do with Cincinnati and UConn

This--^

The Big12 is relevant as long as UT and to a lessor degree OU stay.

Adding Cincy, Ville would've been my choices with WVU. Get WVU in for '10 then announce Cincy and Ville within 27 months.

I would've looked at BYU, Boise, USF, UCF and Memphis as possible extra adds but not right away.

I agree. The problem with the big east was not markets, it was that they did not have a premier team. WVU was good, but a team that was going to challenge for the national title a few times a decade. A conference needs a few heavyweights for national perception and to help with the TV contract. As long as you have TX and OU, the B12 will be fine. Also, the B12 has schools like OSU, KU, Baylor, KSU that will rise up and have a top 15 season every few years.

I understand why they did not invite UofL (and to a lesser extent UC) right away. While UofL is hot, they could potentially pick off ACC teams with bigger footprints and national notoriety. The ACC stepped up and got their act together with ND, potential Cable channel and GOR stopping it to their credit.

If you don't have at least one particularly team regularly getting in the top 10-15 and one other team (doesn't have to be the same one) regularly joining them, you get ignored by the public. The BE survived longer than many expected (including me) because they did that starting in 2005 with UL and WVU both good for a few years and others rising up. But then UL went down and no one else consistently moved up. There was still some decent value, but then WVU, Pitt and SU left.

The Big East started doing this in 2005???

How about in 1991 when they had the 1-2-3-4 punch of Miami-VA Tech-Syracuse-West Virginia?

(04-24-2013 08:24 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:19 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  Does anyone really believe that if FSU was willing to leave the Acc and join the Big 12 that the Big 12 would have waited more than a New York minute to invite them?

Well, yes, i do. :)

IMO. the Big 12 never seriously wanted FSU, except for that brief period of time after the SEC raid when its existence seemed imperiled and it added TCU and WVU to stave that off.

But once the big TV contracts were signed, the Big 12 didn't need FSU and didn't seriously pursue them. Too much geographical and cultural distance there.

Then why was expansion for the Big 12 so on again and off again after adding WV an TCU? To me,it seemed that expansion was on when they thought the could land FSU. One fb coach even said something about FSU being one of the schoolsin contact with the Big 12,and then a few days later backed off. Then a couple of weeks later, expansion was off again, again.

Do you really think FSU would have left the Acc to go to the Big 12?

(04-24-2013 08:24 AM)Frog in the Kitchen Sink Wrote:  IMO, the ACC GOR makes it most likely both the ACC and the Big 12 survive, at least for the intermediate-term foreseeable future (10-20 years) because is stops the Big 10/SEC creep.

I think it is important to realize that the the Big 12 and ACC are partnering up here on some level. Right now informally (helping the ACC up draw a GOR, as the DMN reports), and soon to be more formally (schedule alliances, maybe some bowl sharing, other mutual service sharing). I could see maybe even in the future some sort of TV rights sharing.

The Big 12 survived because three things happened: Texas decided not to join the PAC, FOX threw a ton of money at them when they appeared ripe for further picking, and the SEC decided that they and not the ACC would be their Sugar Bowl dancing partner.

Since none of those things involved the ACC, there is no reason to believe that Big 12 survival as a top-level conference depended in any way on teaming up with the ACC.

(04-24-2013 08:14 AM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  

(04-23-2013 10:57 PM)UCbball21 Wrote:  

It's not like they're out of options if they want to get to 12.

I hate to say this but.... I agree.

(04-24-2013 08:26 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:19 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:09 AM)bearcat29 Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 07:50 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 07:22 AM)JMUDuke25 Wrote:  The big 12 is viable as long as Texas stays. If Texas leaves who knows. Has nothing to do with Cincinnati and UConn

This--^

The Big12 is relevant as long as UT and to a lessor degree OU stay.

Adding Cincy, Ville would've been my choices with WVU. Get WVU in for '10 then announce Cincy and Ville within 27 months.

I would've looked at BYU, Boise, USF, UCF and Memphis as possible extra adds but not right away.

I agree. The problem with the big east was not markets, it was that they did not have a premier team. WVU was good, but a team that was going to challenge for the national title a few times a decade. A conference needs a few heavyweights for national perception and to help with the TV contract. As long as you have TX and OU, the B12 will be fine. Also, the B12 has schools like OSU, KU, Baylor, KSU that will rise up and have a top 15 season every few years.

I understand why they did not invite UofL (and to a lesser extent UC) right away. While UofL is hot, they could potentially pick off ACC teams with bigger footprints and national notoriety. The ACC stepped up and got their act together with ND, potential Cable channel and GOR stopping it to their credit.

Unless the SEC or Big 10 had raided the Acc first, the Big 12 was never in a position to raid the Acc. Acc fans have repeatedly said this. Does anyone really believe that if FSU was willing to leave the Acc and join the Big 12 that the Big 12 would have waited more than a New York minute to invite them?

FSU and Clemson talked about moving in board meetings, so they did seriously consider it, so the Big 12 was in a "position" to raid. But ultimately FSU and Clemson decided to stick with the ACC, just like the Big 12 schools other than CU decided not to go to the Pac when the Pac was in a "position" to raid. And virtually everyone believes the Big 12 would have said yes to FSU and found a #12 even if Clemson or Miami wasn't coming. There may have been an issue of FSU wanting a 13 and 14 which the Big 12 wasn't willing to do, but I suspect it was just FSU not being willing to move.

This is the point. FSU never wanted to leave.

(04-24-2013 08:28 AM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:21 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:09 AM)bearcat29 Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 07:50 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 07:22 AM)JMUDuke25 Wrote:  The big 12 is viable as long as Texas stays. If Texas leaves who knows. Has nothing to do with Cincinnati and UConn

This--^

The Big12 is relevant as long as UT and to a lessor degree OU stay.

Adding Cincy, Ville would've been my choices with WVU. Get WVU in for '10 then announce Cincy and Ville within 27 months.

I would've looked at BYU, Boise, USF, UCF and Memphis as possible extra adds but not right away.

I agree. The problem with the big east was not markets, it was that they did not have a premier team. WVU was good, but a team that was going to challenge for the national title a few times a decade. A conference needs a few heavyweights for national perception and to help with the TV contract. As long as you have TX and OU, the B12 will be fine. Also, the B12 has schools like OSU, KU, Baylor, KSU that will rise up and have a top 15 season every few years.

I understand why they did not invite UofL (and to a lesser extent UC) right away. While UofL is hot, they could potentially pick off ACC teams with bigger footprints and national notoriety. The ACC stepped up and got their act together with ND, potential Cable channel and GOR stopping it to their credit.

If you don't have at least one particularly team regularly getting in the top 10-15 and one other team (doesn't have to be the same one) regularly joining them, you get ignored by the public. The BE survived longer than many expected (including me) because they did that starting in 2005 with UL and WVU both good for a few years and others rising up. But then UL went down and no one else consistently moved up. There was still some decent value, but then WVU, Pitt and SU left.

The Big East started doing this in 2005???

How about in 1991 when they had the 1-2-3-4 punch of Miami-VA Tech-Syracuse-West Virginia?

The Big East was fine before they lost Miami and VT. They needed someone else to step up in 2005 is what I was saying.

If you could pop in cincy and lville to the big 12 with uconn in the acc, just about all school's would have been covered with the big 12, pac 12, sec, acc, and big 10 set up nicely. Of course, leagues were greedy and instead of setting up a system that made some sense, they just wanted to cherry pick the prime school's. My guess is the big 10's focus now turns to ripping apart the big 12 someday. The big 10 probably would love to jump to 16 with KU and texas and maybe call it a day with that setup. I think getting above 16 creates problems but the big 10 could look at OU + missouri for 18. Than finish it off with FSU and target ND one more time or settle with cuse for nice 20 team lineup of 4 pods of 5.

Big 10

a:NW, ILL, WIS, MIN, IO
b:UM,MSU, IU, PUR, OSU
c: PSU,Rut, MAr, FSU, ND/cuse
d: Tx, OU, KU, NEb, Mo

http://texas.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1363940

As to why the Big 12 would not take BE teams after TCU and WVU-from this May article:

"For weeks and months, I had been told the Big 12 was good with 10 schools. Nine conference football games. Home-and-home in basketball league games. Good. No need for a Big 12 championship football game because it would only risk knocking a possible undefeated or one-loss team out of a national title shot with an upset.

But last week I talked to some people who said, "Well, if it's the right two." And that was different from what I had heard before.

I was also told that studies had been done looking at what value might be added if any of the original members of the Big East (Louisville, Cincinnati, etc.) would bring to the Big 12, and that report did not come back favorably, sources said. "

The whole remaining Big East (even with UL for one year) is getting $20.6 million a year from their ESPN and CBS contracts. That's approximately what each team in the Big 12 is getting for TV without considering playoff money. Conferences aren't going to expand to reduce their payout.

IMO, The only real threat to the Big 12 is from the PAC.

They still want entry to the CTZ and I think when the time comes they will make another play for the UT/TTU/OU/OSU combo to be one of their 4 pods in a 16 team conference.

(04-24-2013 08:39 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:28 AM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:21 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:09 AM)bearcat29 Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 07:50 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  This--^

The Big12 is relevant as long as UT and to a lessor degree OU stay.

Adding Cincy, Ville would've been my choices with WVU. Get WVU in for '10 then announce Cincy and Ville within 27 months.

I would've looked at BYU, Boise, USF, UCF and Memphis as possible extra adds but not right away.

I agree. The problem with the big east was not markets, it was that they did not have a premier team. WVU was good, but a team that was going to challenge for the national title a few times a decade. A conference needs a few heavyweights for national perception and to help with the TV contract. As long as you have TX and OU, the B12 will be fine. Also, the B12 has schools like OSU, KU, Baylor, KSU that will rise up and have a top 15 season every few years.

I understand why they did not invite UofL (and to a lesser extent UC) right away. While UofL is hot, they could potentially pick off ACC teams with bigger footprints and national notoriety. The ACC stepped up and got their act together with ND, potential Cable channel and GOR stopping it to their credit.

If you don't have at least one particularly team regularly getting in the top 10-15 and one other team (doesn't have to be the same one) regularly joining them, you get ignored by the public. The BE survived longer than many expected (including me) because they did that starting in 2005 with UL and WVU both good for a few years and others rising up. But then UL went down and no one else consistently moved up. There was still some decent value, but then WVU, Pitt and SU left.

The Big East started doing this in 2005???

How about in 1991 when they had the 1-2-3-4 punch of Miami-VA Tech-Syracuse-West Virginia?

The Big East was fine before they lost Miami and VT. They needed someone else to step up in 2005 is what I was saying.

Okay. Then how did the ACC survive and thrive over the past 10 years? Even with expansion in 2004, they haven't had a premier team + a back up.

(04-24-2013 08:32 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:24 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:19 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  Does anyone really believe that if FSU was willing to leave the Acc and join the Big 12 that the Big 12 would have waited more than a New York minute to invite them?

Well, yes, i do. :)

IMO. the Big 12 never seriously wanted FSU, except for that brief period of time after the SEC raid when its existence seemed imperiled and it added TCU and WVU to stave that off.

But once the big TV contracts were signed, the Big 12 didn't need FSU and didn't seriously pursue them. Too much geographical and cultural distance there.

Then why was expansion for the Big 12 so on again and off again after adding WV an TCU? To me,it seemed that expansion was on when they thought the could land FSU. One fb coach even said something about FSU being one of the schoolsin contact with the Big 12,and then a few days later backed off. Then a couple of weeks later, expansion was off again, again.

Do you really think FSU would have left the Acc to go to the Big 12?

IMO, once they added TCU and WVU and signed the TV contracts, the Big 12 never really vacillated about expansion, at least not any more than any other P5 was. That was all internet rumor-mongering and who knows what was true about it?

My gut feeling:

Big 12: Didn't want FSU save for the brief moment after Mizzzou and A/M left.

FSU: Would have seriously considered the Big 12 if an offer had been made any time this past year. Not saying they would have joined, but FSU was seriously unhappy with ACC money, and the new deal signed after Pitt and Cuse joined did little to molify them. Maryland leaving unhinged things further.

This is why i believe the Big 12 didn't want FSU: FSU was at least somewhat ripe for picking and yet Big 12 didn't make serious bid for them.

What really saved FSU's ACC membership, and the ACC, was the Swofford master-stroke of getting Notre Dame to commit to play football games vs the ACC, making them quasi-members of ACC football. That reportedly boosted the ACC contract a lot more than adding Pitt and Cuse did, putting the dollars in the $20m a year range that FSU could live with.

(04-24-2013 08:46 AM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:39 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:28 AM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:21 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:09 AM)bearcat29 Wrote:  I agree. The problem with the big east was not markets, it was that they did not have a premier team. WVU was good, but a team that was going to challenge for the national title a few times a decade. A conference needs a few heavyweights for national perception and to help with the TV contract. As long as you have TX and OU, the B12 will be fine. Also, the B12 has schools like OSU, KU, Baylor, KSU that will rise up and have a top 15 season every few years.

I understand why they did not invite UofL (and to a lesser extent UC) right away. While UofL is hot, they could potentially pick off ACC teams with bigger footprints and national notoriety. The ACC stepped up and got their act together with ND, potential Cable channel and GOR stopping it to their credit.

If you don't have at least one particularly team regularly getting in the top 10-15 and one other team (doesn't have to be the same one) regularly joining them, you get ignored by the public. The BE survived longer than many expected (including me) because they did that starting in 2005 with UL and WVU both good for a few years and others rising up. But then UL went down and no one else consistently moved up. There was still some decent value, but then WVU, Pitt and SU left.

The Big East started doing this in 2005???

How about in 1991 when they had the 1-2-3-4 punch of Miami-VA Tech-Syracuse-West Virginia?

The Big East was fine before they lost Miami and VT. They needed someone else to step up in 2005 is what I was saying.

Okay. Then how did the ACC survive and thrive over the past 10 years. Even with expansion in 2004, they haven't had a premier team + a back up.

Virginia Tech with Clemson and GT occasionally moving up. And FSU and Miami are brands that still have value when they are 8-4 or 9-3. Both were ranked frequently.

And still the ACC was at risk of being picked apart prior to the GOR.

(04-24-2013 08:49 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:32 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:24 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:19 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  Does anyone really believe that if FSU was willing to leave the Acc and join the Big 12 that the Big 12 would have waited more than a New York minute to invite them?

Well, yes, i do. :)

IMO. the Big 12 never seriously wanted FSU, except for that brief period of time after the SEC raid when its existence seemed imperiled and it added TCU and WVU to stave that off.

But once the big TV contracts were signed, the Big 12 didn't need FSU and didn't seriously pursue them. Too much geographical and cultural distance there.

Then why was expansion for the Big 12 so on again and off again after adding WV an TCU? To me,it seemed that expansion was on when they thought the could land FSU. One fb coach even said something about FSU being one of the schoolsin contact with the Big 12,and then a few days later backed off. Then a couple of weeks later, expansion was off again, again.

Do you really think FSU would have left the Acc to go to the Big 12?

IMO, once they added TCU and WVU and signed the TV contracts, the Big 12 never really vacillated about expansion, at least not any more than any other P5 was. That was all internet rumor-mongering and who knows what was true about it?

My gut feeling:

Big 12: Didn't want FSU save for the brief moment after Mizzzou and A/M left.

FSU: Would have seriously considered the Big 12 if an offer had been made any time this past year. Not saying they would have joined, but FSU was seriously unhappy with ACC money, and the new deal signed after Pitt and Cuse joined did little to molify them. Maryland leaving unhinged things further.

This is why i believe the Big 12 didn't want FSU: FSU was at least somewhat ripe for picking and yet Big 12 didn't make serious bid for them.

What really saved FSU's ACC membership, and the ACC, was the Swofford master-stroke of getting Notre Dame to commit to play football games vs the ACC, making them quasi-members of ACC football. That reportedly boosted the ACC contract a lot more than adding Pitt and Cuse did, putting the dollars in the $20m a year range that FSU could live with.

Cuse and Pitt added approx $4M but extra years were tacked on.

Notre Dame added about $1M ot $1.5M per school from what we know ($18M+) I think the GORs signed is what brought it up over $20M. ESPN is paying a premium for brand stability...little threat of the ESPN owned brands (ACC) going to FOX, NBC, etc...now with the GOR in place. FOX did the same thing in '11 with the B12.

If the B12 was smart they would look at Cincy, BYU, Boise, USF, UCF and even UConn to build up. WVU will not last forever on an island. Edit: Forgot to add Memphis as another potential add.

(04-24-2013 10:20 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:49 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:32 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:24 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:19 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  Does anyone really believe that if FSU was willing to leave the Acc and join the Big 12 that the Big 12 would have waited more than a New York minute to invite them?

Well, yes, i do. :)

IMO. the Big 12 never seriously wanted FSU, except for that brief period of time after the SEC raid when its existence seemed imperiled and it added TCU and WVU to stave that off.

But once the big TV contracts were signed, the Big 12 didn't need FSU and didn't seriously pursue them. Too much geographical and cultural distance there.

Then why was expansion for the Big 12 so on again and off again after adding WV an TCU? To me,it seemed that expansion was on when they thought the could land FSU. One fb coach even said something about FSU being one of the schoolsin contact with the Big 12,and then a few days later backed off. Then a couple of weeks later, expansion was off again, again.

Do you really think FSU would have left the Acc to go to the Big 12?

IMO, once they added TCU and WVU and signed the TV contracts, the Big 12 never really vacillated about expansion, at least not any more than any other P5 was. That was all internet rumor-mongering and who knows what was true about it?

My gut feeling:

Big 12: Didn't want FSU save for the brief moment after Mizzzou and A/M left.

FSU: Would have seriously considered the Big 12 if an offer had been made any time this past year. Not saying they would have joined, but FSU was seriously unhappy with ACC money, and the new deal signed after Pitt and Cuse joined did little to molify them. Maryland leaving unhinged things further.

This is why i believe the Big 12 didn't want FSU: FSU was at least somewhat ripe for picking and yet Big 12 didn't make serious bid for them.

What really saved FSU's ACC membership, and the ACC, was the Swofford master-stroke of getting Notre Dame to commit to play football games vs the ACC, making them quasi-members of ACC football. That reportedly boosted the ACC contract a lot more than adding Pitt and Cuse did, putting the dollars in the $20m a year range that FSU could live with.

Cuse and Pitt added approx $4M but extra years were tacked on.

Notre Dame added about $1M ot $1.5M per school from what we know ($18M+) I think the GORs signed is what brought it up over $20M. ESPN is paying a premium for brand stability...little threat of the ESPN owned brands (ACC) going to FOX, NBC, etc...now with the GOR in place. FOX did the same thing in '11 with the B12.

If the B12 was smart they would look at Cincy, BYU, Boise, USF, UCF and even UConn to build up. WVU will not last forever on an island.

The way to do that is schedule them ooc, not to admit them and hope.

The Big XII doesn't have to do anything...what happened with the ACC GoR is it stopped everything for @ least 12 years.

The Power 5 Leagues-(yes since we now have peace in our time in college athletics it is the Power 5) have no incentive what so ever to expand...as for the Big XII, as long as Texas & Oklahoma are happy and they are no need to expand.

(04-24-2013 10:23 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 10:20 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:49 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:32 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:24 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  Well, yes, i do. :)

IMO. the Big 12 never seriously wanted FSU, except for that brief period of time after the SEC raid when its existence seemed imperiled and it added TCU and WVU to stave that off.

But once the big TV contracts were signed, the Big 12 didn't need FSU and didn't seriously pursue them. Too much geographical and cultural distance there.

Then why was expansion for the Big 12 so on again and off again after adding WV an TCU? To me,it seemed that expansion was on when they thought the could land FSU. One fb coach even said something about FSU being one of the schoolsin contact with the Big 12,and then a few days later backed off. Then a couple of weeks later, expansion was off again, again.

Do you really think FSU would have left the Acc to go to the Big 12?

IMO, once they added TCU and WVU and signed the TV contracts, the Big 12 never really vacillated about expansion, at least not any more than any other P5 was. That was all internet rumor-mongering and who knows what was true about it?

My gut feeling:

Big 12: Didn't want FSU save for the brief moment after Mizzzou and A/M left.

FSU: Would have seriously considered the Big 12 if an offer had been made any time this past year. Not saying they would have joined, but FSU was seriously unhappy with ACC money, and the new deal signed after Pitt and Cuse joined did little to molify them. Maryland leaving unhinged things further.

This is why i believe the Big 12 didn't want FSU: FSU was at least somewhat ripe for picking and yet Big 12 didn't make serious bid for them.

What really saved FSU's ACC membership, and the ACC, was the Swofford master-stroke of getting Notre Dame to commit to play football games vs the ACC, making them quasi-members of ACC football. That reportedly boosted the ACC contract a lot more than adding Pitt and Cuse did, putting the dollars in the $20m a year range that FSU could live with.

Cuse and Pitt added approx $4M but extra years were tacked on.

Notre Dame added about $1M ot $1.5M per school from what we know ($18M+) I think the GORs signed is what brought it up over $20M. ESPN is paying a premium for brand stability...little threat of the ESPN owned brands (ACC) going to FOX, NBC, etc...now with the GOR in place. FOX did the same thing in '11 with the B12.

If the B12 was smart they would look at Cincy, BYU, Boise, USF, UCF and even UConn to build up. WVU will not last forever on an island.

The way to do that is schedule them ooc, not to admit them and hope.

The B12 needs a strategic growth plan. The nBE showed you can take midmajors and grow them. The B12's best COA is to take 2 more teams (minimum) and grow them along with building a bridge to WV.

(04-24-2013 10:29 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 10:23 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 10:20 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:49 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-24-2013 08:32 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  Then why was expansion for the Big 12 so on again and off again after adding WV an TCU? To me,it seemed that expansion was on when they thought the could land FSU. One fb coach even said something about FSU being one of the schoolsin contact with the Big 12,and then a few days later backed off. Then a couple of weeks later, expansion was off again, again.

Do you really think FSU would have left the Acc to go to the Big 12?

IMO, once they added TCU and WVU and signed the TV contracts, the Big 12 never really vacillated about expansion, at least not any more than any other P5 was. That was all internet rumor-mongering and who knows what was true about it?

My gut feeling:

Big 12: Didn't want FSU save for the brief moment after Mizzzou and A/M left.

FSU: Would have seriously considered the Big 12 if an offer had been made any time this past year. Not saying they would have joined, but FSU was seriously unhappy with ACC money, and the new deal signed after Pitt and Cuse joined did little to molify them. Maryland leaving unhinged things further.

This is why i believe the Big 12 didn't want FSU: FSU was at least somewhat ripe for picking and yet Big 12 didn't make serious bid for them.

What really saved FSU's ACC membership, and the ACC, was the Swofford master-stroke of getting Notre Dame to commit to play football games vs the ACC, making them quasi-members of ACC football. That reportedly boosted the ACC contract a lot more than adding Pitt and Cuse did, putting the dollars in the $20m a year range that FSU could live with.

Cuse and Pitt added approx $4M but extra years were tacked on.

Notre Dame added about $1M ot $1.5M per school from what we know ($18M+) I think the GORs signed is what brought it up over $20M. ESPN is paying a premium for brand stability...little threat of the ESPN owned brands (ACC) going to FOX, NBC, etc...now with the GOR in place. FOX did the same thing in '11 with the B12.

If the B12 was smart they would look at Cincy, BYU, Boise, USF, UCF and even UConn to build up. WVU will not last forever on an island.

The way to do that is schedule them ooc, not to admit them and hope.

The B12 needs a strategic growth plan. The nBE showed you can take midmajors and grow them. The B12's best COA is to take 2 more teams (minimum) and grow them along with building a bridge to WV.

This is why the WVU/ECU series will continue, much to the dismay of some of the posters here. I'm not suggesting ECU has an in for a B12 invite. Just that WVU's schedule practically demands that some one close be scheduled. Our universities have a great relationship. Just as it is apparent to WVU and many posters here, WVU will need to be helped in some way. They aren't much of a threat to leave but you really need to do something to help the conference in places it hurts. If it can't get the help, they'll be forced to play the ECUs that are close.

(04-24-2013 07:00 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  But doesn't the Big XII also have a GoR?

Also, this is the best thing that could happen to Cincy. This makes the likelihood of being invited to the Big XII greater since WVU is on that island. In a few years the mountaineers will be pushing for a partner and you guys are the best fit now that the Cards are gone.

+1

If the Big 12 expands, then that means five major conferences will be a permanent fixture in this dog an pony show.