The tv audience and tv dollars were basically known from the git go. This Navy provision was not an overnight thing; my guess is Navy put that in from the git go....based on their review of known data. Regarding Navy, my guess is their acceptance is based (or their continued membership in Nbe) on absolutely NO week nite games.

It seems to me that the Nbe has gone exactly backwards in pursuing the tv contract. What should have been done is to make a proposal of so many teams with so many divisions across so many sections of this country. Then take the proposal to tv to bid on. If the results were unsatisfactory, the tweak, add, delete, whatver, to get issues resolved. And then take the proposal back to tv. If no acceptable tv contract is obtained, then don't go thru all the turmoil and wasted time and energy to form a conference that, in the words of Darrell Royal, this dog won't hunt.

What has happened is the exact reverse. A conference was formed, many schools made drastic changes, and all this was done without a known tv contract. My view is that hopes caused many people to ignore reality with one exception, Navy.

The Nbe tv contract forever documents the total failure of Nbe. Supposedly, the worst schools were dropped (Tulsa, Marshall, UAB, Rice, UTEP) and four outstanding schools were added (UConn, Cincy, Temple, and Navy). Yet, for the Nbe invitees, their payout per school increased only marginally, from $1.2M to $1.8M or whatever, a very marginal increase.

A very marginal increase despite the fact that many week nite games are agreed to be telecast and despite the fact that the whole inventory of Nbe games are telecast....Nbe is getting practically nothing in return for all this new televised inventory now available to ESPN.

Nbe keep, keep, keep coming up with excuses. ESPiN is screwing us!!! It is an ESPiN conspiracy!!! How many times have we heard that? Yet, once C7 separated, FOX immediately put a $3M per C7 school offer on the table with oooodles of tv telelcasts. Folks, what is the REAL signficance of this action by C7, that is, to withdraw from Nbe? The C7 schools KNEW the KNOWN tv data, just like Navy.

Nbe fans will counter and say look at the great exposure? Really? The exposure is due primarily to the new tv platforms and technologies now available, which has really benefitted the NonAQ world. The increase in exposure touted by Nbe is not due to the "power," of old and new elite Nbe schools; but rather to the new technologies and platforms. ESPN needs "filler" games for its less viewed sports channels.

If Nbe expansion never occurred, my guess is CUSA would probably have ended up with about the same contract in terms of exposure and probably also boosted its payout. When CUSA renegotiates its contract in a few years, CUSA will probably end up with a tv contract that looks pretty much like Nbe. FOX and CBS...and NBC will all be there.

Nbe not only ignored known data (while Navy and C7 didn't), but Nbe also ignored the realities of the BCS conferences putting just about every one of their conference games on tv. This really increases the competition, especially for the casual tv viewer, the bread and butter audience for NonAQ teams and conferences.

A few other comments. Fresno State fills its football stadium on Saturdays but Fresno's tv audience does not seem to extend beyond the city limits. It appears to me that this is a similar situation for ECU, USF, and UCF. Their tv appeal is not the statewide appeal of a UF or FSU.

I see the Houston U boyz are back at it again, touting themselves as one of the elite 4. Really? The way I view Houston is the most failed IA football program in the USA. By any measure whatsoever, Houston should be in B12. But it isn't. Houston U administration, alumni, and fans were asleep at the switch. Here we are! A big university! A big town! A big football crazy state! SEC and B12, leave your invitations on our doorstep and we will get back to you in due time.

The significance of the Nbe expansion is that, like Houston U, the NonAQ Nbe was also asleep at the switch.....while BCS put in an expanded playoff and pushed the NonAQ teams and conferences further down and out.

Remember how Nbe fans and Arseco were touting a "special" bowl to be set up by BCS especially for Nbe? And Nbe, with that "special" bowl of its own, would be amongst the Big 5? The reality is this: Good-bye Champs Bowl, good-by Charlotte Bowl, and adios Pinstrible Bowl.

What was need at the git go was a coordinated and cooperative effort by the NonAQs to fight off BCS and do this battle in the arena of public opinion, the only hope for NonAQs to make any dent in opening up a better situation in the larger bowls and playoff.

(03-20-2013 10:16 AM)Tallgrass Wrote:  The tv audience and tv dollars were basically known from the git go. This Navy provision was not an overnight thing; my guess is Navy put that in from the git go....based on their review of known data. Regarding Navy, my guess is their acceptance is based (or their continued membership in Nbe) on absolutely NO week nite games.

It seems to me that the Nbe has gone exactly backwards in pursuing the tv contract. What should have been done is to make a proposal of so many teams with so many divisions across so many sections of this country. Then take the proposal to tv to bid on. If the results were unsatisfactory, the tweak, add, delete, whatver, to get issues resolved. And then take the proposal back to tv. If no acceptable tv contract is obtained, then don't go thru all the turmoil and wasted time and energy to form a conference that, in the words of Darrell Royal, this dog won't hunt.

What has happened is the exact reverse. A conference was formed, many schools made drastic changes, and all this was done without a known tv contract. My view is that hopes caused many people to ignore reality with one exception, Navy.

The Nbe tv contract forever documents the total failure of Nbe. Supposedly, the worst schools were dropped (Tulsa, Marshall, UAB, Rice, UTEP) and four outstanding schools were added (UConn, Cincy, Temple, and Navy). Yet, for the Nbe invitees, their payout per school increased only marginally, from $1.2M to $1.8M or whatever, a very marginal increase.

A very marginal increase despite the fact that many week nite games are agreed to be telecast and despite the fact that the whole inventory of Nbe games are telecast....Nbe is getting practically nothing in return for all this new televised inventory now available to ESPN.

Nbe keep, keep, keep coming up with excuses. ESPiN is screwing us!!! It is an ESPiN conspiracy!!! How many times have we heard that? Yet, once C7 separated, FOX immediately put a $3M per C7 school offer on the table with oooodles of tv telelcasts. Folks, what is the REAL signficance of this action by C7, that is, to withdraw from Nbe? The C7 schools KNEW the KNOWN tv data, just like Navy.

Nbe fans will counter and say look at the great exposure? Really? The exposure is due primarily to the new tv platforms and technologies now available, which has really benefitted the NonAQ world. The increase in exposure touted by Nbe is not due to the "power," of old and new elite Nbe schools; but rather to the new technologies and platforms. ESPN needs "filler" games for its less viewed sports channels.

If Nbe expansion never occurred, my guess is CUSA would probably have ended up with about the same contract in terms of exposure and probably also boosted its payout. When CUSA renegotiates its contract in a few years, CUSA will probably end up with a tv contract that looks pretty much like Nbe. FOX and CBS...and NBC will all be there.

Nbe not only ignored known data (while Navy and C7 didn't), but Nbe also ignored the realities of the BCS conferences putting just about every one of their conference games on tv. This really increases the competition, especially for the casual tv viewer, the bread and butter audience for NonAQ teams and conferences.

A few other comments. Fresno State fills its football stadium on Saturdays but Fresno's tv audience does not seem to extend beyond the city limits. It appears to me that this is a similar situation for ECU, USF, and UCF. Their tv appeal is not the statewide appeal of a UF or FSU.

I see the Houston U boyz are back at it again, touting themselves as one of the elite 4. Really? The way I view Houston is the most failed IA football program in the USA. By any measure whatsoever, Houston should be in B12. But it isn't. Houston U administration, alumni, and fans were asleep at the switch. Here we are! A big university! A big town! A big football crazy state! SEC and B12, leave your invitations on our doorstep and we will get back to you in due time.

The significance of the Nbe expansion is that, like Houston U, the NonAQ Nbe was also asleep at the switch.....while BCS put in an expanded playoff and pushed the NonAQ teams and conferences further down and out.

Remember how Nbe fans and Arseco were touting a "special" bowl to be set up by BCS especially for Nbe? And Nbe, with that "special" bowl of its own, would be amongst the Big 5? The reality is this: Good-bye Champs Bowl, good-by Charlotte Bowl, and adios Pinstrible Bowl.

What was need at the git go was a coordinated and cooperative effort by the NonAQs to fight off BCS and do this battle in the arena of public opinion, the only hope for NonAQs to make any dent in opening up a better situation in the larger bowls and playoff.

Breakfast burrito and nice Columbian blend coffee.

I would rather drink turpentine and piss on a brush fire than read the continuous drivel from the sad fellow who continues to start threads on this board.

Do yourself a favor and just ignore.

Right on the money, Tallgrass.

If Melky is agreeing with Trollgrass then you pretty much know the entire opinion is crap.

(03-20-2013 10:38 AM)Carolina Stang Wrote:  I would rather drink turpentine and piss on a brush fire than read the continuous drivel from the sad fellow who continues to start threads on this board.

Do yourself a favor and just ignore.

Now that I would like to see just one time.
Actually he brings some good points to light here...

This thread is worthless w/o pictures -- to break up all the wordiness of the original post...

I'm astonished at how much you know so much about media negotiations, Tallgrass. The BE should have hired you as commissioner before settling for a guy that has spent his whole career negotiating television contracts.

(03-20-2013 11:28 AM)ecuacc4ever Wrote:  This thread is worthless w/o pictures -- to break up all the wordiness of the original post...

Maybe this would be a good time to repost those old pics of the Time Square announcements for the new teams...

(03-20-2013 10:22 AM)Knightsweat Wrote:  

(03-20-2013 10:16 AM)Tallgrass Wrote:  The tv audience and tv dollars were basically known from the git go. This Navy provision was not an overnight thing; my guess is Navy put that in from the git go....based on their review of known data. Regarding Navy, my guess is their acceptance is based (or their continued membership in Nbe) on absolutely NO week nite games.

It seems to me that the Nbe has gone exactly backwards in pursuing the tv contract. What should have been done is to make a proposal of so many teams with so many divisions across so many sections of this country. Then take the proposal to tv to bid on. If the results were unsatisfactory, the tweak, add, delete, whatver, to get issues resolved. And then take the proposal back to tv. If no acceptable tv contract is obtained, then don't go thru all the turmoil and wasted time and energy to form a conference that, in the words of Darrell Royal, this dog won't hunt.

What has happened is the exact reverse. A conference was formed, many schools made drastic changes, and all this was done without a known tv contract. My view is that hopes caused many people to ignore reality with one exception, Navy.

The Nbe tv contract forever documents the total failure of Nbe. Supposedly, the worst schools were dropped (Tulsa, Marshall, UAB, Rice, UTEP) and four outstanding schools were added (UConn, Cincy, Temple, and Navy). Yet, for the Nbe invitees, their payout per school increased only marginally, from $1.2M to $1.8M or whatever, a very marginal increase.

A very marginal increase despite the fact that many week nite games are agreed to be telecast and despite the fact that the whole inventory of Nbe games are telecast....Nbe is getting practically nothing in return for all this new televised inventory now available to ESPN.

Nbe keep, keep, keep coming up with excuses. ESPiN is screwing us!!! It is an ESPiN conspiracy!!! How many times have we heard that? Yet, once C7 separated, FOX immediately put a $3M per C7 school offer on the table with oooodles of tv telelcasts. Folks, what is the REAL signficance of this action by C7, that is, to withdraw from Nbe? The C7 schools KNEW the KNOWN tv data, just like Navy.

Nbe fans will counter and say look at the great exposure? Really? The exposure is due primarily to the new tv platforms and technologies now available, which has really benefitted the NonAQ world. The increase in exposure touted by Nbe is not due to the "power," of old and new elite Nbe schools; but rather to the new technologies and platforms. ESPN needs "filler" games for its less viewed sports channels.

If Nbe expansion never occurred, my guess is CUSA would probably have ended up with about the same contract in terms of exposure and probably also boosted its payout. When CUSA renegotiates its contract in a few years, CUSA will probably end up with a tv contract that looks pretty much like Nbe. FOX and CBS...and NBC will all be there.

Nbe not only ignored known data (while Navy and C7 didn't), but Nbe also ignored the realities of the BCS conferences putting just about every one of their conference games on tv. This really increases the competition, especially for the casual tv viewer, the bread and butter audience for NonAQ teams and conferences.

A few other comments. Fresno State fills its football stadium on Saturdays but Fresno's tv audience does not seem to extend beyond the city limits. It appears to me that this is a similar situation for ECU, USF, and UCF. Their tv appeal is not the statewide appeal of a UF or FSU.

I see the Houston U boyz are back at it again, touting themselves as one of the elite 4. Really? The way I view Houston is the most failed IA football program in the USA. By any measure whatsoever, Houston should be in B12. But it isn't. Houston U administration, alumni, and fans were asleep at the switch. Here we are! A big university! A big town! A big football crazy state! SEC and B12, leave your invitations on our doorstep and we will get back to you in due time.

The significance of the Nbe expansion is that, like Houston U, the NonAQ Nbe was also asleep at the switch.....while BCS put in an expanded playoff and pushed the NonAQ teams and conferences further down and out.

Remember how Nbe fans and Arseco were touting a "special" bowl to be set up by BCS especially for Nbe? And Nbe, with that "special" bowl of its own, would be amongst the Big 5? The reality is this: Good-bye Champs Bowl, good-by Charlotte Bowl, and adios Pinstrible Bowl.

What was need at the git go was a coordinated and cooperative effort by the NonAQs to fight off BCS and do this battle in the arena of public opinion, the only hope for NonAQs to make any dent in opening up a better situation in the larger bowls and playoff.

Breakfast burrito and nice Columbian blend coffee.

I like pie. Preferably apple pie with a scoop of vanilla on the side. Mmmmmm, Good!

Give me a blueberry cobbler with ice cream instead. Apple pie is solid, but not quite on par with a well made cobbler.

(03-20-2013 11:43 AM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  I'm astonished at how much you know so much about media negotiations, Tallgrass. The BE should have hired you as commissioner before settling for a guy that has spent his whole career negotiating television contracts.

Anyone of us could have taken the job and blew up the conference... couldn't have gone much worse could it? I will admit that he took on a task that was almost impossible...

First off, the fact fans didn't know about the Navy deal has nothing to do with a failure by NBE. They simply are letting navy fulfill a former contract agreement, which is to the NBE advantage as of today. The ESPN $$$ will be split 11 ways rather than 12. 22 mil divided 11 ways is 2 mil per school.

The original schools going to BE were going to a different conf than what we ended up with. S happens. As for bowls, with Rutgers, Louisville, gone you couldn't expect to keep all of those bowls, even with them the BE would have lost some of them.

In the end the current group along with Tulsa, and Navy in 2015 will still be the best of the rest, with better TV deal, and bowls than CUSA or the MWC.

You are right that USF ans UCF do not have the state wide appeal of UF, of course no one else does either, FSU is a distant #2, and UM an even more distant #3 if they are still #3 in fl.

I give you credit in having the ability to keep smoking the Tall grass, and maintaining a total fixation on the NBE.

Anyone who watched the NAVY to the Big East press conference or even listened to it, knew from the get go that the Big East was going to work around Navy's existing television contract - that was the same approach they used for the second go at BYU.

The problem with the Big East's media negotiations was they really didn't get to have them, there was no real open market, the way the old ESPN deal was written and the defections that conveniently happened at the exact same time in September and October ruined any hope of garnering any serious money, as all ESPN had to do was match an existing offer to win, there was no chance of a bidding war on anything.

(03-20-2013 12:08 PM)goodknightfl Wrote:  In the end the current group along with Tulsa, and Navy in 2015 will still be the best of the rest, with better TV deal, and bowls than CUSA or the MWC.

The real best of the rest will be the conference that wins their out of conference games especially against the AQ, puts an undefeated champion in the big payout bowl game, and takes home the loot from that game. Otherwise, we all have equal access.

(03-20-2013 12:31 PM)IceJus10 Wrote:  Anyone who watched the NAVY to the Big East press conference or even listened to it, knew from the get go that the Big East was going to work around Navy's existing television contract - that was the same approach they used for the second go at BYU.

The problem with the Big East's media negotiations was they really didn't get to have them, there was no real open market, the way the old ESPN deal was written and the defections that conveniently happened at the exact same time in September and October ruined any hope of garnering any serious money, as all ESPN had to do was match an existing offer to win, there was no chance of a bidding war on anything.

I don't think that is totally true. Aresco, tv insider that he is, could have easily taken the NBC offer over to Fox or CBS and asked them to do better. I would not be surprised to learn that NBC was the best he could do and then he took that to espn. Who wouldn't do that? ESPN did have the right to match but Aresco could have shopped until he thought he had his best offer before seeing if espn would match. If he didn't do that then he really isn't the sharp knife everyone thought he was.

(03-20-2013 11:49 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  Give me a blueberry cobbler with ice cream instead. Apple pie is solid, but not quite on par with a well made cobbler.

I'll take cherry pie myself, with ice cream.

(03-20-2013 11:43 AM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  I'm astonished at how much you know so much about media negotiations, Tallgrass. The BE should have hired you as commissioner before settling for a guy that has spent his whole career negotiating television contracts.

Probably one of the best posts every made by a Nbe poster. My first action would have been to hire this guy. My second action would have been to fire Arsco. Then, I would have brought C7 and Cincy, UConn, USF, Rutgers, Louisville into one room and asked: "In the perfect world, what would you like to see? Do you want to make the BE work? Given that vision, do you think it is actually possible? What is possible? What is not possible? Basketball schools, what are you willing to give up to help the football schools? Football schools, what are you willing to give up to help the basketball schools? At what point, would you say stop; the BE cannot survive?"

http://www.neinassports.com/bio.html

Aresco might be ok when he has two known parties sitting across the table from each other. That is negotiation and certainly not management. Management is bringing parts together so that the sum is more than the parts. Aresco has not shown any of that kind of management ability and understanding the situation. A person inside college football who knew the motivations of the BCS conferences driving this whole mess....was what was needed.

(03-20-2013 01:22 PM)Tallgrass Wrote:  

(03-20-2013 11:43 AM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  I'm astonished at how much you know so much about media negotiations, Tallgrass. The BE should have hired you as commissioner before settling for a guy that has spent his whole career negotiating television contracts.

Probably one of the best posts every made by a Nbe poster. My first action would have been to hire this guy. My second action would have been to fire Arsco. Then, I would have brought C7 and Cincy, UConn, USF, Rutgers, Louisville into one room and asked: "In the perfect world, what would you like to see? Do you want to make the BE work? Given that vision, do you think it is actually possible? What is possible? What is not possible? Basketball schools, what are you willing to give up to help the football schools? Football schools, what are you willing to give up to help the basketball schools? At what point, would you say stop; the BE cannot survive?"

http://www.neinassports.com/bio.html

Aresco might be ok when he has two known parties sitting across the table from each other. That is negotiation and certainly not management. Management is bringing parts together so that the sum is more than the parts. Aresco has not shown any of that kind of management ability and understanding the situation. A person inside college football who knew the motivations of the BCS conferences driving this whole mess....was what was needed.

Ive advocated hiring Neinas as a crisis manager. I think he unnamed conference needs him.

(03-20-2013 11:45 AM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  

(03-20-2013 11:28 AM)ecuacc4ever Wrote:  This thread is worthless w/o pictures -- to break up all the wordiness of the original post...

Maybe this would be a good time to repost those old pics of the Time Square announcements for the new teams...

This place was more fun when pictures of hot girls were in everybody's signature lines. I still have dreams about that UCF girl.