Just a thought. Richmond has been to the Sweet 16 as recently as 2011, and has been to the NCAA tournament 2 of the last 3 years. They are a private school, but like Butler are not religious. Also, they have a HUGE endowment, at nearly $2 billion.

Obviously, they probably aren't getting much discussion because of the other Richmond school up for grabs. Without VCU in the discussion though, I think Richmond would be getting a lot more looks.

Should we talk about them more?

I too have this fascination with Richmond, mostly because of their endowment. My other questions would be, are they willing to invest in their athletic program-to be specific-their mens bball program? What are their currently facilities like?

If it came between VCU or Richmond, I think VCU might have an edge on them as of now.

I think if VCU is not taken in this round of expansion, Richmond might be a candidate for future expansion as they are similar institutionally as the other BE7 schools. This is assuming their basketball improves. Supposedly, their arena will undergo renovations.

(01-27-2013 02:26 PM)College Basketball Fan Wrote:  Should we talk about them more?

no

(01-27-2013 04:27 PM)monroedoctrine Wrote:  

(01-27-2013 02:26 PM)College Basketball Fan Wrote:  Should we talk about them more?

no

No. They don't have much of a track record--9 trips to the tournament, 5 of those in an 8-year stretch from 1984-91. Since coach Dick Tarrant retired, 4 bids in 20 years. Richmond under Chris Mooney is less a program you want in your conference than a coach you look at hiring.

Yes they should be disussed. I think they compliment Butler very well. Butler has more bb success of late but Richmond could improve. They certainly have the $$. The also offer a variety of Olympic sports including men's lax which is helpful to the c7. Still think vcu gets the nod before them if a team from Richmond is chosen

Do we talk about Richmond the right amount? I'd say we have now.

Should we talk about them more than a certain Kansas school, in terms of realistic possibilities? Yes. The presidents could choose a Catholic private school with a massive endowment. They shouldn't, but they could.

I would take VCU first and not even consider Richmond. VCU is a basketball school first. Richmond has a lower level football program . Really not interested in any football schools. That is the problem we should be trying to rid ourselves from.

(01-28-2013 10:48 AM)BigmanU Wrote:  I would take VCU first and not even consider Richmond. VCU is a basketball school first. Richmond has a lower level football program . Really not interested in any football schools. That is the problem we should be trying to rid ourselves from.

You think Richmond's a threat to bring up football? There's many legitimate reasons to not take-in Richmond but their low-level football program isn't one of them. I personally can't see any private school raise their football to FBS. The financial commitment is simply too large nowadays for anything other than public schools (UMass, Charlotte).

Richmond matches the conference profile and as stated was in the Sweet 16 in 2011. Great win by the Spiders over VCU Thursday night before a sold out Robins Center crowd of over 9,000. UR has no issues with increased budgets for recruiting, coaches or travel, and currently has the highest basketball budget in the A-10 at over $4M. Richmond has a $150 Million Athletic Department Endowment, as well as a $2 Billion General Endowment, and importantly is never looking to move to FBS football. Richmond also brings a strong all around athletic department that has been in the top 3 of the A10 "Commisioners Cup" every year since the move to the A10 in 2001, including adding Men's Varsity Lacrosse next season. Richmond currently has plans for a $25 to 30 Million renovation of the Robin Center to add all the newest amenities, like luxury suites, video boards, renovated concourses and updated food concessions. Richmond has already renovated the locker rooms and basketball suite. Also in the plans is converting the old Gym into a dedicated practice facility for the basketball teams. Academically, socially, geographically and institutionally Richmond matches up with the all the Big East has to offer, and has the name recognition that the new Big East will find very useful.

(01-28-2013 10:51 AM)aughnanure Wrote:  You think Richmond's a threat to bring up football? There's many legitimate reasons to not take-in Richmond but their low-level football program isn't one of them. I personally can't see any private school raise their football to FBS. The financial commitment is simply too large nowadays for anything other than public schools (UMass, Charlotte).

Richmond just built a brand new Football Stadium that seats less than 9,000. I can pretty much assure anyone that the only direction our Football team would take would be to join the Patriot League with Georgetown and our current conference mate of Villanova. Interestingly, Butler and Dayton also have FCS football, just like Georgetown, Villanova and Richmond. It is just Villanova and Richmond have worked to be the best at the level they compete, winning national titles in 2008 (UR) and 2009 (VU).

Robins Stadium is a top notch little stadium, perfect for private school FCS football as well as lacrosse. UR is not ever going back to FBS football. Now VCU on the other hand is more likely to follow the lead of their sister school ODU in adding FBS football, even if not in the near future.

Here is Robins Stadium, completed in 2010, which shows how UR does things, all in a first class manner, no matter the size..

(01-28-2013 10:51 AM)aughnanure Wrote:  

(01-28-2013 10:48 AM)BigmanU Wrote:  I would take VCU first and not even consider Richmond. VCU is a basketball school first. Richmond has a lower level football program . Really not interested in any football schools. That is the problem we should be trying to rid ourselves from.

You think Richmond's a threat to bring up football? There's many legitimate reasons to not take-in Richmond but their low-level football program isn't one of them. I personally can't see any private school raise their football to FBS. The financial commitment is simply too large nowadays for anything other than public schools (UMass, Charlotte).

Didn't know that. I truthfully haven't paid enough attention. I do know their FBall games are aired and I beleive they are pretty successful. Truthfully didn't know what their football situation was. I do know they get alot of support for their team however.

I would never touch them for basketball (which I do know) however. They truly have no prominent history.

(01-28-2013 10:48 AM)BigmanU Wrote:  I would never touch them for basketball (which I do know) however. They truly have no prominent history.

This.

However, they did beat SUcks in the first round back in the early 90s. First 15/2 upset I believe. That's gotta be worth something

(01-28-2013 01:53 PM)BigmanU Wrote:  I would never touch them for basketball (which I do know) however. They truly have no prominent history.

Richmond has a prominent history, post 1980, it is just different as they were always in a lower level league. They are the only school to win as a #15, #14, #13 and #12 seed. Even up here in Massachusetts, if you say I went to Richmond, most guys I know say "oh, the Spiders." Having a very unique mascot, combined with a history of upsets in the NCAA's leads to a lot of casual fans knowing the school.

(01-28-2013 02:28 PM)bostonspider Wrote:  

(01-28-2013 01:53 PM)BigmanU Wrote:  I would never touch them for basketball (which I do know) however. They truly have no prominent history.

Richmond has a prominent history, post 1980, it is just different as they were always in a lower level league. They are the only school to win as a #15, #14, #13 and #12 seed. Even up here in Massachusetts, if you say I went to Richmond, most guys I know say "oh, the Spiders." Having a very unique mascot, combined with a history of upsets in the NCAA's leads to a lot of casual fans knowing the school.

If you have to say this, I think the Basketball 7 should look in another direction.

For the record I think Richmond is a very nice University, Their just not ready for the big time.

That looks vaguely similar to the new Butler Bowl (finished a few years ago)

I really like Richmond, but they are probably 5-8 years away from where we need them to be as a program. They're closer than a Duquesne, Detroit or Drake currently are - but its still a bit of stretch.

....But when the pickings are slim you start to move that timetable up (and a $2 billion endowment can certainly help).

Fans don't make expansion decisions, Presidents do. I would venture to say that C7 Presidents like Richmond institutionally as a fit much moreso than VCU. VCU has Shaka Smart, recent history, and likely preference over Richmond by TV executives, but that's about it. VCU, as a large public institution with a comparatively low graduation rate and easier admissions, isn't a positive for C7 Presidents. C7 Presidents had to hold their nose when adding WVU (back in the days), Temple, Houston, UCF, and Memphis to the Big East. No offense, but VCU starts with two strikes against it. VCU could easily be looked over in favor of Creighton, St Louis, Dayton just on the institutional fit basis.

Also doesn't hurt that Richmond had the foresight to announce adding men's lacrosse just this past fall. The C7 is going to need another men's team for an autobid. Richmond is also a northeastern-focused school with its student and alumni base. VCU is definitely not.

(01-30-2013 01:01 AM)NoDak Wrote:  Fans don't make expansion decisions, Presidents do. I would venture to say that C7 Presidents like Richmond institutionally as a fit much moreso than VCU. VCU has Shaka Smart, recent history, and likely preference over Richmond by TV executives, but that's about it. VCU, as a large public institution with a comparatively low graduation rate and easier admissions, isn't a positive for C7 Presidents. C7 Presidents had to hold their nose when adding WVU (back in the days), Temple, Houston, UCF, and Memphis to the Big East. No offense, but VCU starts with two strikes against it. VCU could easily be looked over in favor of Creighton, St Louis, Dayton just on the institutional fit basis.

Also doesn't hurt that Richmond had the foresight to announce adding men's lacrosse just this past fall. The C7 is going to need another men's team for an autobid. Richmond is also a northeastern-focused school with its student and alumni base. VCU is definitely not.

I agree with all of this post except for the portion in bold. VCU admits 66%. Several of the C7 admits 60% or more or so with the exception of Georgetown, St Johns & Nova. For comparison Creighton admits nearly 80%, Dayton 76%, Xavier 70%, SLU 61% and Butler 61%. Not really that much difference when you look at the existing membership and "usual suspect" candidates.

All that said Richmond makes MUCH more sense for all the reasons you stated. They fit the mold much better. I wonder how much religious affiliation will come into play when finalizing the membership.

I find it amusing that a history of upsets is a somehow proof that UR is not ready. I mean awesome upsets are what most of the new and some of the C7 schools have in common. How many schools did Nova upset on their way to the 1985 title? Everyone of VCU's win in their Final 4 year was an "upset". Butler's run in 2011 was as an 8 seed, so every game but their first and the win over VCU in the FF was an upset. Xavier's elite 8 appearances were fueled by upsets. How do you get to be a "big dog", by first upsetting a lot of teams, and continuing to do it, until it is no longer an upset..

Richmond has the money, facilities, market, program, coach, athletic sports mix and institutional fit to be a great and highly productive member of the new conference, just as UR has been in their previous conferences, first the CAA, and then the step up to the A10.