Tusculum College Names Dr. Paul Stanton To Board

I must have been out of town when this originally happened, because I just heard about it 20 minutes ago. I can't believe that ANY institution with a football program would have Paul Stanton on their Board of Trustees . . . . . I certainly don't think any of us trust the guy! Are they stupid? Why would they want in any way to put their football program at risk? I don't get it . . . I just don't understand.

http://www.greenevillesun.com/Local_News...-id-320015

.

(07-25-2012 07:16 PM)BucSinceTheSixties Wrote:  Tusculum College Names Dr. Paul Stanton To Board

I must have been out of town when this originally happened, because I just heard about it 20 minutes ago. I can't believe that ANY institution with a football program would have Paul Stanton on their Board of Trustees . . . . . I certainly don't think any of us trust the guy! Are they stupid? Why would they want in any way to put their football program at risk? I don't get it . . . I just don't understand.

http://www.greenevillesun.com/Local_News...-id-320015

.

Maybe this will get him completely out of Dr. Noland's hair. Who knows, maybe Mullins can be hired away and follow him over there.

(07-25-2012 08:14 PM)Buc66 Wrote:  

(07-25-2012 07:16 PM)BucSinceTheSixties Wrote:  Tusculum College Names Dr. Paul Stanton To Board

I must have been out of town when this originally happened, because I just heard about it 20 minutes ago. I can't believe that ANY institution with a football program would have Paul Stanton on their Board of Trustees . . . . . I certainly don't think any of us trust the guy! Are they stupid? Why would they want in any way to put their football program at risk? I don't get it . . . I just don't understand.

http://www.greenevillesun.com/Local_News...-id-320015

.

Maybe this will get him completely out of Dr. Noland's hair. Who knows, maybe Mullins can be hired away and follow him over there.

ya. hiring that ahole means they dont wnt football

Come in off the ledge, folks. As long as Scott Niswonger is cutting checks over at TC, he's in charge. Football stays. I'd say ol' Paul won't have much to do with athletics, but if he can help them grow their college with some nice undergrad programs, then good for him.

(07-26-2012 10:43 AM)Buccaneerlover Wrote:  Come in off the ledge, folks. As long as Scott Niswonger is cutting checks over at TC, he's in charge. Football stays. I'd say ol' Paul won't have much to do with athletics, but if he can help them grow their college with some nice undergrad programs, then good for him.

Hopefully he won't start a university-devouring med school program! I wouldn't wish that on anybody . . . except possibly Kennesaw.

(07-27-2012 01:00 AM)BucSinceTheSixties Wrote:  

(07-26-2012 10:43 AM)Buccaneerlover Wrote:  Come in off the ledge, folks. As long as Scott Niswonger is cutting checks over at TC, he's in charge. Football stays. I'd say ol' Paul won't have much to do with athletics, but if he can help them grow their college with some nice undergrad programs, then good for him.

Hopefully he won't start a university-devouring med school program! I wouldn't wish that on anybody . . . except possibly Kennesaw.

Must say that I totally disagree with you on that one. The Medical School at ETSU has been and is the diamond in the academic line-up. It is a major plus, along with the other health sciences, for ETSU --- the envy of many other regional state universities. ETSU has developed strong undergraduate and graduate programs, even against opposition --- programs that should be grown and enhanced and tied to a good athletic program so as to be fully seen and appreciated through that athletic front porch.

(07-27-2012 06:59 AM)Buc66 Wrote:  

(07-27-2012 01:00 AM)BucSinceTheSixties Wrote:  

(07-26-2012 10:43 AM)Buccaneerlover Wrote:  Come in off the ledge, folks. As long as Scott Niswonger is cutting checks over at TC, he's in charge. Football stays. I'd say ol' Paul won't have much to do with athletics, but if he can help them grow their college with some nice undergrad programs, then good for him.

Hopefully he won't start a university-devouring med school program! I wouldn't wish that on anybody . . . except possibly Kennesaw.

Must say that I totally disagree with you on that one. The Medical School at ETSU has been and is the diamond in the academic line-up. It is a major plus, along with the other health sciences, for ETSU --- the envy of many other regional state universities. ETSU has developed strong undergraduate and graduate programs, even against opposition --- programs that should be grown and enhanced and tied to a good athletic program so as to be fully seen and appreciated through that athletic front porch.

Absolutely right. ETSU has some wonderful academic programs due to our medical program. Both the medical school and the football program should be used to promote and grow the University together. This will make it be the major, regional state university that it should be.

Ask Memphis about having a med school that's theirs and doesn't have the letters U.T. on it...
One thing I am suprised about with ETSU is that they don't have a program for Health Information and Informatics Management. There are very few universities that offer that exact program and is something that is in extremely high demand right now.

(07-27-2012 07:07 AM)bucfan81 Wrote:  

(07-27-2012 06:59 AM)Buc66 Wrote:  

(07-27-2012 01:00 AM)BucSinceTheSixties Wrote:  

(07-26-2012 10:43 AM)Buccaneerlover Wrote:  Come in off the ledge, folks. As long as Scott Niswonger is cutting checks over at TC, he's in charge. Football stays. I'd say ol' Paul won't have much to do with athletics, but if he can help them grow their college with some nice undergrad programs, then good for him.

Hopefully he won't start a university-devouring med school program! I wouldn't wish that on anybody . . . except possibly Kennesaw.

Must say that I totally disagree with you on that one. The Medical School at ETSU has been and is the diamond in the academic line-up. It is a major plus, along with the other health sciences, for ETSU --- the envy of many other regional state universities. ETSU has developed strong undergraduate and graduate programs, even against opposition --- programs that should be grown and enhanced and tied to a good athletic program so as to be fully seen and appreciated through that athletic front porch.

Absolutely right. ETSU has some wonderful academic programs due to our medical program. Both the medical school and the football program should be used to promote and grow the University together. This will make it be the major, regional state university that it should be.

True enough, the med school has evolved into something that is identified with ETSU. But, from a purely athletic point-of-view, it has cost ETSU quite a bit...

Imagine if time machines were real:
<begin> Dial back to the early '70's to stop the med school from opening.
<then> There is no need to ever hire Dr. Paul E. Stanton as Dean of the College of Medicine.
<then> Paul Stanton doesn't get promoted to University President.
<result> We still have football, we still play in the SoCon, and we're possibly in the talk for CAA or an outright upgrade to D-1 football.

Or, at the very least, go back to the '80's and install a university policy to prevent future hirings of upper leadership from within.

That is the age old academics vs athletics argument. You're implying that the med school resulted in a chain of events that diminished athletics since Paul Stanton came out of the med school. Without the med school, we could be a Troy U type school today? No matter where Paul Stanton came from, the result would have been the same with him. I prefer an East Carolina type school, for example. They grew their academics, including a med and dental school, displayed them through a good athletic front porch -- and their enrollment is approaching 30,000 today. Both ETSU and ECU started at about the same place in the 60's.

(07-27-2012 07:50 PM)Buc66 Wrote:  That is the age old academics vs athletics argument. You're implying that the med school resulted in a chain of events that diminished athletics since Paul Stanton came out of the med school. Without the med school, we could be a Troy U type school today? No matter where Paul Stanton came from, the result would have been the same with him. I prefer an East Carolina type school, for example. They grew their academics, including a med and dental school, displayed them through a good athletic front porch -- and their enrollment is approaching 30,000 today. Both ETSU and ECU started at about the same place in the 60's.

First, let me say that even though all this is purely speculative, I am thoroughly enjoying our conversation!

With that said, ECU has had the benefit of great leadership, where we've had Stanton/Mullins.

With regards to my "if we had a time machine" (to fix where no med school = no Stanton), I do think that we could be like Troy U. by having football and no med school. We could also be like UT-Chattanooga, Furman, Western Carolina, Elon, Samford, Campbell, Appalachian State, UT-Martin, Tennessee Tech, MTSU, Western Kentucky, Eastern Kentucky, Morehead State, Emory & Henry, Liberty, or Radford. Every one of them are fine academic institutions with football and no med school. ETSU could also aim to be like Bigham Young University. BYU seems to be highly regarded for both academics and athletics, and they, too, have football and no med school.

Setting aside football for a moment, I don't think that, by default, having a med school necessarily qualifies a university as a superior academic institution. Is ETSU stronger academicly AND athleticly than Lipscomb and Belmont? Neither of them have a med school or football (for now, anyway). Despite our superiority in Tennis (which seems to land that All-Sports Trophy for us every year), they both appear to do an ample amount of winning against us in everything else. To ad insult to defeat, Belmont has won the A-Sun All-Academic Trophy a conference record nine times. Even with ETSU having a med school, we have yet to win it at all.

So, I'll 99% agree with you. If we could go back in time, we should totally copy the ECU blueprint. Otherwise, I'd be happy to skip the whole Paul Stanton med school thing settling for ETSU still having football and being like a Furman, UT-Chattanooga, MTSU, Western Kentucky, Troy, or Brigham Young.

I disagree with Sixties very strongly. I am a strong supporter of the athletic pogram but that medical school has done alot for this area. I wouldn't trade all the good things that have been produced from the med school for any athletic success. First and foremost ETSU is about education, not sports,you seem to have lost sight of that.
Wow

(07-28-2012 10:07 AM)RodShaw2 Wrote:  I disagree with Sixties very strongly. I am a strong supporter of the athletic pogram but that medical school has done alot for this area. I wouldn't trade all the good things that have been produced from the med school for any athletic success. First and foremost ETSU is about education, not sports,you seem to have lost sight of that.
Wow

Thank you, Rod, for articulating that. I too am stunned by the lack of perspective.

(07-28-2012 11:01 AM)Bucfaithful Wrote:  

(07-28-2012 10:07 AM)RodShaw2 Wrote:  I disagree with Sixties very strongly. I am a strong supporter of the athletic pogram but that medical school has done alot for this area. I wouldn't trade all the good things that have been produced from the med school for any athletic success. First and foremost ETSU is about education, not sports,you seem to have lost sight of that.
Wow

Thank you, Rod, for articulating that. I too am stunned by the lack of perspective.

Also let us all never forget that these things are not "either/or". The med school has totally enriched the region in uncountable ways but the athletic program is integral to promoting and further growing the University. For large growth, football must be part of the equation. All these things work together and add up to what makes up East Tennessee State University a great school.

There are few rivals among regional state universities to ETSU when it comes to reach and depth of academic programs. ETSU's strong undergraduate and graduate degrees, that lead to actual jobs and careers, are somewhat under appreciated and taken for granted. A successful campaign to change this perception and marry it to athletics as an avenue of expressing pride and enhancing public relations could unleash this sleeping giant. If Dr Noland can move the university forward here, he can be a hero in Upper East Tennessee and among alumni and supporters elsewhere.

(07-28-2012 03:39 AM)BucSinceTheSixties Wrote:  

(07-27-2012 07:50 PM)Buc66 Wrote:  That is the age old academics vs athletics argument. You're implying that the med school resulted in a chain of events that diminished athletics since Paul Stanton came out of the med school. Without the med school, we could be a Troy U type school today? No matter where Paul Stanton came from, the result would have been the same with him. I prefer an East Carolina type school, for example. They grew their academics, including a med and dental school, displayed them through a good athletic front porch -- and their enrollment is approaching 30,000 today. Both ETSU and ECU started at about the same place in the 60's.

First, let me say that even though all this is purely speculative, I am thoroughly enjoying our conversation!

With that said, ECU has had the benefit of great leadership, where we've had Stanton/Mullins.

With regards to my "if we had a time machine" (to fix where no med school = no Stanton), I do think that we could be like Troy U. by having football and no med school. We could also be like UT-Chattanooga, Furman, Western Carolina, Elon, Samford, Campbell, Appalachian State, UT-Martin, Tennessee Tech, MTSU, Western Kentucky, Eastern Kentucky, Morehead State, Emory & Henry, Liberty, or Radford. Every one of them are fine academic institutions with football and no med school. ETSU could also aim to be like Bigham Young University. BYU seems to be highly regarded for both academics and athletics, and they, too, have football and no med school.

Setting aside football for a moment, I don't think that, by default, having a med school necessarily qualifies a university as a superior academic institution. Is ETSU stronger academicly AND athleticly than Lipscomb and Belmont? Neither of them have a med school or football (for now, anyway). Despite our superiority in Tennis (which seems to land that All-Sports Trophy for us every year), they both appear to do an ample amount of winning against us in everything else. To ad insult to defeat, Belmont has won the A-Sun All-Academic Trophy a conference record nine times. Even with ETSU having a med school, we have yet to win it at all.

So, I'll 99% agree with you. If we could go back in time, we should totally copy the ECU blueprint. Otherwise, I'd be happy to skip the whole Paul Stanton med school thing settling for ETSU still having football and being like a Furman, UT-Chattanooga, MTSU, Western Kentucky, Troy, or Brigham Young.

I disagree with your shotgun approach to this.

Furman, Elon, Emory & Henry, Lipscomb, Belmont, and Liberty are all private liberal arts colleges. Samford and Campbell are private, religious oriented, universities. Brigham Young University is in a category of its own. Comparing ETSU to these schools muddies the issues.

I am certainly not going to disparage the other state schools you mentioned but when I think of fine academic institutions Appalachian State, specifically, does not come to mind. Sure, they have their sh!t together when it comes to football but the school has always been portrayed (to me) as a place where rich kids go to ski or where you end up after you flunk out of Chapel Hill. Supposedly TTU has a credible engineering department but would you rather have an engineering degree from TTU or UTK? Radford was a joke back in the 90's.

I would argue that the medical school distinguishes ETSU from schools like Western Carolina, APSU, UT-M, Radford, EKU, TTU, Morehead State, UT-C, UNC-A, etc.

As for ETSU being a fine academic institution, let me just say that with the lottery and the growing state population, I hoped ETSU would have pursued quality instead of quantity.

(07-28-2012 03:39 AM)BucSinceTheSixties Wrote:  

(07-27-2012 07:50 PM)Buc66 Wrote:  That is the age old academics vs athletics argument. You're implying that the med school resulted in a chain of events that diminished athletics since Paul Stanton came out of the med school. Without the med school, we could be a Troy U type school today? No matter where Paul Stanton came from, the result would have been the same with him. I prefer an East Carolina type school, for example. They grew their academics, including a med and dental school, displayed them through a good athletic front porch -- and their enrollment is approaching 30,000 today. Both ETSU and ECU started at about the same place in the 60's.

First, let me say that even though all this is purely speculative, I am thoroughly enjoying our conversation!

With that said, ECU has had the benefit of great leadership, where we've had Stanton/Mullins.

With regards to my "if we had a time machine" (to fix where no med school = no Stanton), I do think that we could be like Troy U. by having football and no med school. We could also be like UT-Chattanooga, Furman, Western Carolina, Elon, Samford, Campbell, Appalachian State, UT-Martin, Tennessee Tech, MTSU, Western Kentucky, Eastern Kentucky, Morehead State, Emory & Henry, Liberty, or Radford. Every one of them are fine academic institutions with football and no med school. ETSU could also aim to be like Bigham Young University. BYU seems to be highly regarded for both academics and athletics, and they, too, have football and no med school.

Setting aside football for a moment, I don't think that, by default, having a med school necessarily qualifies a university as a superior academic institution. Is ETSU stronger academicly AND athleticly than Lipscomb and Belmont? Neither of them have a med school or football (for now, anyway). Despite our superiority in Tennis (which seems to land that All-Sports Trophy for us every year), they both appear to do an ample amount of winning against us in everything else. To ad insult to defeat, Belmont has won the A-Sun All-Academic Trophy a conference record nine times. Even with ETSU having a med school, we have yet to win it at all.

So, I'll 99% agree with you. If we could go back in time, we should totally copy the ECU blueprint. Otherwise, I'd be happy to skip the whole Paul Stanton med school thing settling for ETSU still having football and being like a Furman, UT-Chattanooga, MTSU, Western Kentucky, Troy, or Brigham Young.

Campbell actually is in the process of starting a med school. They have a pharmacy school and also have a PA school. Just as an FYI.

As for the All-Academic trophy, I think the posters on this board are a little misguided if they think that ETSU, Belmont, and Lipscomb have the same caliber of students. Most ETSU men's basketball players wouldn't get into Belmont. ETSU basketball players live off of the interdisciplinary studies degree. Yes, there are good student-athletes at ETSU. However, not among the basketball teams. Football also wasn't full of "scholars" when they existed.

ETSU has several good programs, but overall it's not that difficult of an academic institution. There basically are no admissions requirements. Anyone can get in. I'd say this is reflected in the overall rankings of the university. I would say that ETSU is behind App St, Elon, Samford, Campbell, and Furman academically on the list you posted. This is with the medical school. Without the med school, ETSU would be very, very average as an academic institution.

(07-28-2012 04:32 PM)Seattle Bucs Wrote:  

(07-28-2012 03:39 AM)BucSinceTheSixties Wrote:  

(07-27-2012 07:50 PM)Buc66 Wrote:  That is the age old academics vs athletics argument. You're implying that the med school resulted in a chain of events that diminished athletics since Paul Stanton came out of the med school. Without the med school, we could be a Troy U type school today? No matter where Paul Stanton came from, the result would have been the same with him. I prefer an East Carolina type school, for example. They grew their academics, including a med and dental school, displayed them through a good athletic front porch -- and their enrollment is approaching 30,000 today. Both ETSU and ECU started at about the same place in the 60's.

First, let me say that even though all this is purely speculative, I am thoroughly enjoying our conversation!

With that said, ECU has had the benefit of great leadership, where we've had Stanton/Mullins.

With regards to my "if we had a time machine" (to fix where no med school = no Stanton), I do think that we could be like Troy U. by having football and no med school. We could also be like UT-Chattanooga, Furman, Western Carolina, Elon, Samford, Campbell, Appalachian State, UT-Martin, Tennessee Tech, MTSU, Western Kentucky, Eastern Kentucky, Morehead State, Emory & Henry, Liberty, or Radford. Every one of them are fine academic institutions with football and no med school. ETSU could also aim to be like Bigham Young University. BYU seems to be highly regarded for both academics and athletics, and they, too, have football and no med school.

Setting aside football for a moment, I don't think that, by default, having a med school necessarily qualifies a university as a superior academic institution. Is ETSU stronger academicly AND athleticly than Lipscomb and Belmont? Neither of them have a med school or football (for now, anyway). Despite our superiority in Tennis (which seems to land that All-Sports Trophy for us every year), they both appear to do an ample amount of winning against us in everything else. To ad insult to defeat, Belmont has won the A-Sun All-Academic Trophy a conference record nine times. Even with ETSU having a med school, we have yet to win it at all.

So, I'll 99% agree with you. If we could go back in time, we should totally copy the ECU blueprint. Otherwise, I'd be happy to skip the whole Paul Stanton med school thing settling for ETSU still having football and being like a Furman, UT-Chattanooga, MTSU, Western Kentucky, Troy, or Brigham Young.

I disagree with your shotgun approach to this.

Furman, Elon, Emory & Henry, Lipscomb, Belmont, and Liberty are all private liberal arts colleges. Samford and Campbell are private, religious oriented, universities. Brigham Young University is in a category of its own. Comparing ETSU to these schools muddies the issues.

I am certainly not going to disparage the other state schools you mentioned but when I think of fine academic institutions Appalachian State, specifically, does not come to mind. Sure, they have their **** together when it comes to football but the school has always been portrayed (to me) as a place where rich kids go to ski or where you end up after you flunk out of Chapel Hill. Supposedly TTU has a credible engineering department but would you rather have an engineering degree from TTU or UTK? Radford was a joke back in the 90's.

I would argue that the medical school distinguishes ETSU from schools like Western Carolina, APSU, UT-M, Radford, EKU, TTU, Morehead State, UT-C, UNC-A, etc.

As for ETSU being a fine academic institution, let me just say that with the lottery and the growing state population, I hoped ETSU would have pursued quality instead of quantity.

Actually, App St has really made strides academically. They're the 10th ranked regional university in the south according to US News and World Report (behind Elon, Stetson, Samford, the Citadel, Belmont, and Mercer). They've become a desirable school for kids in NC now. They're still behind Chapel Hill and NC State, but that's probably never going to change (just like ETSU will always be behind UT-Knoxville).

A desirable school. That's exactly what Dr Noland could do for ETSU. My guess is that more and more students are already choosing ETSU because of its desirable, competitive degrees. As the application pool increases, so will the selection standards. But, as a state regional university, access will always be a mandate from the state. But again, there are few state regional universities in the nation with the line up of undergraduate and graduate programs as ETSU. That's why US News has it classified as a national university. As the cost of higher education escalates, students will more and more weigh the benefits and/or liabilities of degrees/programs of study. ETSU is well positioned to take advantage of this. These unique strengths should be aggressively marketed --- again where a good athletic program enters. I believe that ETSU is a school that has the potential to reach levels that could not
be imagined by many of its peers because of the solid programs that it has established over the past
thirty years.

For what its worth, I think that two things:

1) If it truly is an either/or, academics should always come before athletics. I absolutely love athletics (and even sports other than basketball), but it would be hard for me to be supportive of any decrease in academic program's budget before there is a decrease in athletics. Lets not forget that ETSU is in the education business.

2) We have a major issue in the country (not just ETSU) regarding trying to get quantity of students rather than quality. Any college (other than maybe community colleges) should have rather strict admission standards and degree of difficulty. I dont mean Harvard standards, but certainly UT level. I have heard the argument that regional universities (not only ETSU) should have loose standards because if they get tougher it will hurt their surrounding high school students the most. Lets just say I dont understand that logic at all. If the surrounding high school students happen to be the poorest performing candidates- they should not get in. Bad area high schools is not the fault of the area university.