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Ask Georgians how that whole education lottery thing has worked out for them. Last I heard they can't afford to pay their bills...

(03-30-2012 05:49 PM)dfarr Wrote:  Ask Georgians how that whole education lottery thing has worked out for them. Last I heard they can't afford to pay their bills...

I've heard the same thing about Alabama.

I keep hearing people talk about hating "Big Brother" in government and then turn around to become "Big Brother" when trying to keep "the poor" from making choices the "Big brother" doesn't want them to make. "Don't let them drink", don't let her get an abortion" or "don't let them gamble" is "Big brother" in operation, just on a more local scale. How about "don't let them borrow money" at "Payday loan" operations when the banks won't touch them with a ten foot pole.

If a friend offered to take my $10 with him to GA when he went to buy his own tickets, I would supply the money and the list of numbers just to have that one in a gazillion shot at hitting. I once lost 25 cents in a slot machine in a casino in Tunica and haven't been back. BTW, many of the casinos in MS are like the ones in Alabama -- owned by native American tribal groups that pay no state taxes either.

I am anti-lottery. Why? I don't want some Bammer taking all day to figure out the birthday of their eighth bastard child in order to scratch it off while I'm waiting in line at the gas station to buy a soda.

I don't often play the lottery but I think people should be free to play wherever they want.

The bigger question wouldn't be having a lottery but if we did, would you trust those in Montgomery to run it right? I wouldn't as most if not all would be skimmed off the top before it even hit the books & it'd be run into the ground not to mention it'd be those down the road from us that we have such a fond opinion of that'd do it.

(03-30-2012 08:09 PM)blazerwkr Wrote:  The bigger question wouldn't be having a lottery but if we did, would you trust those in Montgomery to run it right? I wouldn't as most if not all would be skimmed off the top before it even hit the books & it'd be run into the ground not to mention it'd be those down the road from us that we have such a fond opinion of that'd do it.

Reality is that no one cares who runs it, how they run it or who gets the benefit....just so long as they have a chance to become instant millionares.

The other stuff sounds good though

I did a semester study on an education lottery in Alabama and casinos in Alabama for my Public Budgeting class in Graduate School. I believe the number was around $67 million a year profit for the lottery but it was way way more if Alabama had casinos.

(03-30-2012 02:58 PM)the_blazerman Wrote:  Last time I checked, Mississippi is still 50th in the country in a lot of stuff & they have casinos & lotteries, etc.

More like 49th or 48th. They pay good money to control Alabama's politicians and keep this state dumbed down and casino-dependent. I don't think Mississippi has a lottery, I think that there are only somewhere between 5 - 10 states that don't have one, typically, Alabama's among the ones that doesn't.

I won't lie, I'm pro-lottery, and have made that drive occasionally to buy a few tickets (I hate those &^%@#*! scratch-offs!), but not nearly as much as I used to. We had our one chance in a lifetime to pass a lottery referendum when Don Siegelman (who ran on the lottery platform) was Governor, but once again, we allowed the anti-progress factions to outwork us at the polls, and ignorance prevailed yet again. We blew it, and now we're under gestapo-like rule that won't even allow "the people" to have a say on whether or not they want legalized gambling in this state, as far as full-scale casinos and lotteries are concerned. The subject of this thread is a damn good question. I'm not sure there's anyone here among us that can count that high, but one thing I know for sure...Florida, Georgia, Tennessee and Mississippi are all saying "thank you, Alabama" for its' pretzel logic, primitive political mindset and making its' surrounding states more prosperous and progressive than we'll ever be with every pull off a slot machine or purchase of a lottery ticket, money that could've been damn well generated right here to benefit this state. This place is its' own worst enemy, and we're as much at fault for electing & re-electing these ******** on a regular basis.

(03-30-2012 03:49 PM)LightEmUp70 Wrote:  And the lottery DOES NOT WORK. It doesn't help out the people it is intended to. Studies show that. It doesn't matter how many ways you try to say it's a good thing. It's not a moral issue. It's a money issue. A lottery is a stupid way to fund college.

I've heard that before, but the only study I recall being used as funded by an anti-gambling lobby.

In all seriousness, what studies?

(03-31-2012 05:59 AM)wilsond75 Wrote:  

(03-30-2012 03:49 PM)LightEmUp70 Wrote:  And the lottery DOES NOT WORK. It doesn't help out the people it is intended to. Studies show that. It doesn't matter how many ways you try to say it's a good thing. It's not a moral issue. It's a money issue. A lottery is a stupid way to fund college.

I've heard that before, but the only study I recall being used as funded by an anti-gambling lobby.

In all seriousness, what studies?

Bingo! I suppose that forty-three states, Washington D.C., Puerto Rico and the U.S. Virgin Islands are stupidly funding college educations and government services. It is much better to use non-voluntary taxes paid by those least able pay for our crooked politicians to squander.

Personally I don't think the government should sanction a gambling function which is participated mostly by the poor and people who are already receiving government benefits. I remember back during the Alabama lotto stuff was happening we had a debate in my hs economics class. This one girl broke down and started crying because her mom spent all of their extra money on the Georgia lottery. The cost/benefit just isn't there for me to support it.

I've spent significant periods of my life living in Alabama and Las Vegas. I've seen gambling at its finest and the anti-gambling forces at their finest. All in all, I've learned that people are going to gamble if they want to gamble (poor, middle class, and wealthy). Historically the American people have always been a gambling people. So why not direct and utilize that cash flow for the benefit of your local society?

In Alabama I've seen two main arguments against the lottery or gambling: "religous" beliefs and the "protection" of the poor. I've never appreciated the mindset that seeks to project one group's "religious" beliefs on the rest of society. It seems to me that if you find a lottery objecitonable on moral grounds then perhaps you can just abstain from participating. The action of abstaining from available sin would prove one's strength of belief more than abstaining out of lack of availability or perhaps even criminal prosecution. In this same line, I would oppose any law that requires one to gamble just a strongly as I oppose any law that prevents one from gambling. I also find the argument based on protecting poor people from themselves to be extremely patronizing and, quite frankly, authoritarian. At what income or level or wealth does one gain the right (or I guess it must have become a priviledge) to determine how one disposes of their own money?

(03-31-2012 06:51 AM)dfarr Wrote:  Personally I don't think the government should sanction a gambling function which is participated mostly by the poor and people who are already receiving government benefits. I remember back during the Alabama lotto stuff was happening we had a debate in my hs economics class. This one girl broke down and started crying because her mom spent all of their extra money on the Georgia lottery. The cost/benefit just isn't there for me to support it.

I certainly support your right to not participate in a lottery. However, I do not believe that it is accurate to claim that "the poor and people who are already receiving government benefits" are the main economic groups that participate in state sanctioned lotteries. While not scientific survey, many of the people that I work with, including a number of engineers, purchased Mega Millions tickets for Friday's drawing. I do believe that most of the people that were interviewed by the media were also not "poor and people that were already on government benefits".

I do appreciate your testimony regarding your classmate. It is unfortunate that her mom made, in my view, a poor money management decision. I also grieve for those that die in automobile accidents and from complications of obesity which I am sure you agree harm more people than state sanctioned lotteries. Few would support banning automobiles and fewer still would ban or restrict availablity of food. To me, it is the same thing. Everyone must take responsibilty for one's actions.

(03-31-2012 05:59 AM)wilsond75 Wrote:  

(03-30-2012 03:49 PM)LightEmUp70 Wrote:  And the lottery DOES NOT WORK. It doesn't help out the people it is intended to. Studies show that. It doesn't matter how many ways you try to say it's a good thing. It's not a moral issue. It's a money issue. A lottery is a stupid way to fund college.

I've heard that before, but the only study I recall being used as funded by an anti-gambling lobby.

In all seriousness, what studies?

I posted one on here last time it popped up dealing with the Georgia lottery. It was a relatively simple google search. Quite simply those who play are not those who benefit.

Now if you want to play the lottery just to play it, that's a different story. But don't sit there and say it helps education. It doesn't. The ones who get the scholarships are the ones who could already pay for school. And I won't support encouraging the poor to throw money away on a false hope. I can't help that other states are doing; I don't want mine to when we already have enough problems.

I keep seeing - let the people in the state vote on it.
I am not sure that some people really want to see the results of "the people voting on it".
What would the pro-lottery people do when it is struck down 60-40? (Answer: complain that the majority of the people in the state are ignorant & are against the poor people)

And then you have Milton bribing the elected officials trying to get it on the ballot.
Why do you suppose that is?

People without the money to do so spend exhorbitant amounts on gas to drive to the Georgia state line to buy tickets they don't really have the money to spend on for a chance they don't really have in winning.

Makes perfect sense.

Lotteries in their every-day occurance are an insidious leech upon the poor (who got that way largely because they have no "pre-planning bone" in their body; so let's make it worse. AMIRITE?).

Lotteries are, at their best, a fun aside periodically when driving on a trip out of state. And that's the only place where they belong.

These things come with a price. They are not the panacea perceived.

Obama's current Ad Council TV ads are right: "FEED THE PIG!"* (not un-hilarious that the government has to actually tell Americans this...)

*I would add this little preface to their advice: "Don't be a moron!"

(03-30-2012 02:51 PM)LairDweller Wrote:  Alabama don't need no education lottery no more than it needs an education whore house (just paraphrasing my all time favorite sound bite from lottery opponents)

Why cant we have both?

I buy a ticket every time I go into an area where there is the lottery. Yes I have won as well. Nothing big but as much a $500.00.

While we are preventing the poor from buying lottery tickets someone should stop them from buying alcohol and cigarettes as well. Maybe we should also prevent the poor from indulging on chocolate too? Maybe we should prevent some poor slob from spending grocery money on the latest Crimson Tide National Championship T-shirt? Buying the premier package on cable. What about penny auctions? What about e-bay? I could go on for hours.

A fool and his money will soon be parted one way or another and preventing the lottery in Alabama will not save anyone. The states that have lotteries thank you for your stance against the lottery.

BTW anyone see that RAPS proposal? That RAPS group was saving us all and said once everyone voted it down and they saved us they would bring us a proposal.

Maybe the anti-lottery folks have a plan?

(03-31-2012 08:56 AM)ATTALLABLAZE Wrote:  I buy a ticket every time I go into an area where there is the lottery. Yes I have won as well. Nothing big but as much a $500.00.

While we are preventing the poor from buying lottery tickets someone should stop them from buying alcohol and cigarettes as well. Maybe we should also prevent the poor from indulging on chocolate too? Maybe we should prevent some poor slob from spending grocery money on the latest Crimson Tide National Championship T-shirt? Buying the premier package on cable. What about penny auctions? What about e-bay? I could go on for hours.

A fool and his money will soon be parted one way or another and preventing the lottery in Alabama will not save anyone. The states that have lotteries thank you for your stance against the lottery.

BTW anyone see that RAPS proposal? That RAPS group was saving us all and said once everyone voted it down and they saved us they would bring us a proposal.

Haha you can only smoke so much before you smoke yourself out. You can only drink so much before you fall over. If you don't have a car, the gas to get to GA and the rest you'll really have nothing left to spend the rest of your government money on than food. Put a lotto sale at the local bodega and even that square meal of Maruchan Ramen goes to the ticket patch.

Compare the performance of students in AL to those in states with a lottery. The difference isn't as dramatic as you would think.

The lottery despite your faith in it, isn't your savior.