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--- apparently this started when the orginial poster had a conversation with WVU bball color man Jay Jacobs


-- Just for a moment let's set aside if this rumor is true or not...IF there is something to it...what 4 teams would Louisville like to see in? I'm assuming the Cardinals would be pushing for Southern Miss and Memphis


Jackson

The only real solution to this problem is for the football schools to break away, add some teams, and become an all-sports conference. But as we know, the real issues are how many schools need to be added, and which schools should be added. To me, the one school that needs to be added is Memphis. It has good football, basketball, and the Liberty Bowl. Beyond Memphis, the choices get doggier. I think a 9 team sports league is too small. What about a conference of 10 schools that includes:

West Virginia
Cuse
Uconn
Pitt
Rutgers
UL
UC
South Florida
Memphis
Navy (all-sports)

Anything that speeds up the Big East splits and forms an All-Sports conference is ok in my book! And before someone goes running around saying "Syracuse, Pitt, West Virginia and UConn want OUT of the Big East" I'm pretty sure he meant that those programs wanted out of the current Big East deal. That being said, if those bowls are pulling out of the Big East then there is no reason whatsoever to cowtow to Notre Dame. That means an ultimatum, they either join the football schools or enjoy having ALL of their sports be independent or forced to join a conference (Big Ten) and adhere to their rules. Now, it should be interesting to see who would join the football schools in an All-Sports conference. Memphis would have to be a natural since the football conference would need a strong basketball program to offset the loss of the b-ball school. After that it's a crapshoot. UMass has a place at the table if they upgraded their football program.


Now the Louisville thing, that is interesting. One thing to look at is what schools that Louisville and Cincinnati have relationships with because UC will probably be one of the schools Louisville gets to support them in trying to add a school to the conference. Southern Miss makes sense, they're a strong, Top 25 caliber football program, are in SEC territory with Louisville and are natural rivals. I don't know what Louisville's relationship is with East Carolina. If Temple's athletic department would actually give their athletic facilities a major upgrade and support their football program they would be a natural fit. So right now the football conference looks like this:

West Virginia
Syracuse
Pittsburgh
Connecticut
Louisville
Cincinnati
South Florida
Rutgers

We need to add, at least, 2 more teams. People keep saying 9 teams, folks we're going to need 10 teams to add beef to the conference and appeal. Memphis brings the complete package, a solid football and basketball program so pick them up. You have to look at adding East Carolina, they have a huge fan base and bring you into ACC and SEC territory. After that who knows.

Quote:And before someone goes running around saying "Syracuse, Pitt, West Virginia and UConn want OUT of the Big East" I'm pretty sure he meant that those programs wanted out of the current Big East deal

-- I took it exactly the same way....wanting out means out of the verbal deal to stay in the league untill 2010

Quote:Now the Louisville thing, that is interesting. One thing to look at is what schools that Louisville and Cincinnati have relationships with because UC will probably be one of the schools Louisville gets to support them in trying to add a school to the conference. Southern Miss makes sense, they're a strong, Top 25 caliber football program, are in SEC territory with Louisville and are natural rivals

-- If there is something to this...I'm sure you'll see every CUSA east team with any kind of BE tie come calling for entry into the league...if Louisville is driving the expansion bus that Memphis and USM are probably going to get in invite...

-- Wasn't there a post by a USM fan on the CUSA board that he heard similar kind of rumors in Hatteisburg about just such a scenario?


Jackson

the other post mentioned this:

" he stated it was rumored that the Tire/Muffler Bowl and Gator Bowl were trying to find other conferences and open bids to non-BCS schools if there is a "hot" one in the region. "

About the tire/muffler bowl. If you were to add teams I think that teams like Memphis and ECU would be attractive to the charlotte bowl officials. With a mix of teams like WVU/ECU/Memphis to draw from i could see them cemeting a long term relationship with the BE. ECU has played home games at charlotte before against WVU and NC State and I believe the same promoters who did those games are behind the Muffler Bowl. WVU always brings great crowds to bowl games. I could see ECU selling 17K to 22K easy of tickets to a charlotte bowl. I think Memphis would draw well to the game also, with a short cheap plane flight from Memphis to Charlotte.

GQPirate Wrote:the other post mentioned this:

" he stated it was rumored that the Tire/Muffler Bowl and Gator Bowl were trying to find other conferences and open bids to non-BCS schools if there is a "hot" one in the region. "

About the tire/muffler bowl. If you were to add teams I think that teams like Memphis and ECU would be attractive to the charlotte bowl officials. With a mix of teams like WVU/ECU/Memphis to draw from i could see them cemeting a long term relationship with the BE. ECU has played home games at charlotte before against WVU and NC State and I believe the same promoters who did those games are behind the Muffler Bowl. WVU always brings great crowds to bowl games. I could see ECU selling 17K to 22K easy of tickets to a charlotte bowl. I think Memphis would draw well to the game also, with a short cheap plane flight from Memphis to Charlotte.

Those are interesting points. As far as Memphis is concerned, they're right in the heart of SEC country. You could absorb some SEC attention with Memphis in that area, and of course Memphis is a very good program. As far as ECU is concerned people need to realize, football North Carolina isn't all that strong right now. ECU could easily return to being king of football in that state. Again, ECU is in the heart of ACC territory so you could absorb some ACC attention. And both bring huge fan bases. Look at the Big 12, SEC, Big Ten and now ACC. the reason you hear so much about those fans and why they're all over the net is that their fan bases are huge because they have at least 10 teams in a conference. Every week, in conference play, you have 5 or 6 conference games and, potentially, an OOC schedule. Having 8 conference teams limit that. Think about it, when the Big East has a game of the week during the week, then that leaves only 2 or 3 conference games on Saturday, not enough to get national exposure. You already see how vocal Memphis and ECU fans are, and you see them all over the place. That's because their fan bases are a reflection of their areas, SEC and ACC. Basically, they're programs that have the identity of an SEC and ACC program but aren't in those conference. We could use that kind of flavor in the Big East.

Jackson1011 Wrote:

Quote:And before someone goes running around saying "Syracuse, Pitt, West Virginia and UConn want OUT of the Big East" I'm pretty sure he meant that those programs wanted out of the current Big East deal

-- I took it exactly the same way....wanting out means out of the verbal deal to stay in the league untill 2010

Quote:Now the Louisville thing, that is interesting. One thing to look at is what schools that Louisville and Cincinnati have relationships with because UC will probably be one of the schools Louisville gets to support them in trying to add a school to the conference. Southern Miss makes sense, they're a strong, Top 25 caliber football program, are in SEC territory with Louisville and are natural rivals

-- If there is something to this...I'm sure you'll see every CUSA east team with any kind of BE tie come calling for entry into the league...if Louisville is driving the expansion bus that Memphis and USM are probably going to get in invite...

-- Wasn't there a post by a USM fan on the CUSA board that he heard similar kind of rumors in Hatteisburg about just such a scenario?


Jackson

That's right, there was recent talk of Southern Miss being a target for Big East expansion. This would also explain all of the rumors of East Carolina joining the Big East. If you're going to get to a 12 team conference you're going to need 4 teams. It wouldn't surprise me, if there is ANY truth to these rumors, if Louisville isn't thinking of getting the Big East to invite Southern Miss and Memphis, the Big East is looking to add East Carolina, and Notre Dame could play a partial schedule and become a "pseudo" Big East member. Presto, you have a 12 team All-Sports conference with some pretty good football and markets. And with Louisville, Connecticut, Cincinnati, Syracuse, Pitt and Notre Dame, and the emergence of West Virginia as a player on the national scene, and with Rutgers and South Florida being improved you still have an elite basketball conference. It probably wouldn't be the best basketball conference anymore, but easily a Top 3 or 4 program.

The SEC would never add Memphis because Tenn would not allow this. I have been to Memphis, and it seems as if there are more Vols fans there than Tigers fans. The SEC more than likely will look towards West Virginia or North Carolina or Texas, somewhere where they can capture a new market. They already have Tenn.

We are about to become the next Miami, and I think we will be the glue that will hold the Big East together, but I do agree that we will need a 9th member soon. I know many USF fans that hate to see D-1AA teams besides FAMU on the schedule and we have played a load of D-1AA teams since joining D-1A.

USFBullSpit Wrote:The SEC would never add Memphis because Tenn would not allow this. I have been to Memphis, and it seems as if there are more Vols fans there than Tigers fans. The SEC more than likely will look towards West Virginia or North Carolina or Texas, somewhere where they can capture a new market. They already have Tenn.

We are about to become the next Miami, and I think we will be the glue that will hold the Big East together, but I do agree that we will need a 9th member soon. I know many USF fans that hate to see D-1AA teams besides FAMU on the schedule and we have played a load of D-1AA teams since joining D-1A.

The SEC isn't ging to be expanding so they won't be adding anybody. I wouldn't be proclaiming South Florida the glue holding the Big East together. You can say that South Florida could be the next Miami, Louisville could easily be the next USC or Oklahoma, Cincinnati could be the next Virginia Tech, West Virginia and Pitt could re-emergence and national powers (they're close to that right now), so I don't think South Florida is the glue that will hold the conference together. If anything holds this conference together it's the emergence of a number of teams. Cincinnati bringing in a Top 40 or 50 recruiting class this year is a huge step. Pitt, West Virginia and Louisville are already Top 25 programs.

12 teams with Notre Dame doing the Quasi-Member thing would not be bad at all for all parties involved. Have them play 4 games a year in the BE, mainly against the northern schools that lie in ND strongholds of NYC New England and such(Syracuse, Rutgers, UCONN, and Pitt).

Speaking honestly as a Pirate fan, I want the world for my pirates but I can't really see any set-up where ND would be playing against the pirates in football. Just aint gonna happen. IF the there were some restricted list of teams that ND would play that would be fine by me.

BE teams like WV, Syracuse have always drawn great crowds to home games in Greenville and Louisville and Cincy are a known quantity to our fans that would also help attendance. We've won 3 games the past two years but have still averaged over 30K a game. Give us a decent team and a big east schedule and i thjink we could have those numbers in the high 30's low 40K's real quick.

The guy is right about Louisville leading the charge. Jurich is the man here and I've told some of you what I've learned. It was reiterated to me by a very reliable source the night we played ECU in basketball just a few short weeks ago. Don't be surprised if the Big East isn't recruiting any of the schools being mentioned in idle discussion on these message boards. Jurich always swings for the fences.

I know the Pirate fans are going to hate me but honestly they did nothing for CUSA, they are part of the reason we wanted out, basketball and football has gotten worse every year since they came. They were better before they joined CUSA. They have a bad location for us to travel too, but that is not so bad. If they can prove they are getting better I am not opposed to them per se, I mean I am not a Pirate hater, but honestly it would weaken the BE RPI and BCS standings further.
Please don't take this as me being arrogant, I know that ECU did beat Louisville four years ago in Basketball and a few times in Football but those were in ECU' s first years, if they had stayed competitive I would be singing their praises but facts are facts, ECU would not seem to be competitive in the New Big East, and that is what we need.

Personally I vote

WVU
CUSE
PITT
UCONN
LOUISVILLE
USF
Rutgers
CINCY
MEMPHIS
Navy

with possibly adding
Marshall
East Carolina
down the road if they should show the needed improvements and more success in basketball and football.

Forget Southern Miss, nothing against them they are ok, just not in the right footprint.

Well MHS, no hard feelings I respect your opinion. I wouldn't say we did nothing for the conference; we went to three straight bowls for the conference, were in the rankings a tiny bit, and got some respectable out of conference wins (Miami, Syracuse, WV) for CUSA. It is true are fortunes have taken a bit of a downturn recently. Most programs are gonna go through cycles of up and down. When Louisville joined CUSA they had a decent team, had a bit of a down turn during the Cooper years, the rebounded to have some great teams the past few years. I think ECU will recover for the same reason Loiusville did. You had a passionate fanbase that didn't stand pat and surrender to apathy or lowered expectations. I think ECU has that same quality, heck we're paying three football coaches right now, maybe we are a bit too passionate.

I understand your concerns about basketball. We are trying to build a program here and it is slow going, brick by brick. I don't know if ECU hurt CUSA horribly in that respect. It would be interesting to see the # of Ncaa berths for the 4 years prior to our entrance compared to # since we have been a conference member. ECU didn't help the rpi but CUSA did grew much stronger over the past few years, so it wasn't like we were a death blow to the conf. Our attend. numbers could be a little better but they are comparable to say a UAB team that made the final 8 last year or say a temple team that has a strong historical record and bigger name coach.

Quote:The guy is right about Louisville leading the charge. Jurich is the man here and I've told some of you what I've learned. It was reiterated to me by a very reliable source the night we played ECU in basketball just a few short weeks ago. Don't be surprised if the Big East isn't recruiting any of the schools being mentioned in idle discussion on these message boards. Jurich always swings for the fences.

-- L-Yes....has there been anything new on that front? The two prospective schools being courted both had another sub par year...Also...have you heard anything about this 12 team league stuff? I know of two money making programs that would probably be very intersted in a football only membership in the league you have described to us before

Quote:" he stated it was rumored that the Tire/Muffler Bowl and Gator Bowl were trying to find other conferences and open bids to non-BCS schools if there is a "hot" one in the region. "

-- To me this is the real danger...we are probably going to have to bit the bullet on the TV contract..the deal is only going to last for a few more years and then we will probably sign with non-ESPN network.....but the possibility of losing bowls requires immediate action in my book...again...if things are as bad as the author of the orginial post says they are..perhaps paying our exit fees and splitting now isn't the worst idea in the world

Quote:About the tire/muffler bowl. If you were to add teams I think that teams like Memphis and ECU would be attractive to the charlotte bowl officials. With a mix of teams like WVU/ECU/Memphis to draw from i could see them cemeting a long term relationship with the BE

- I could easily live with that...additions of ECU and Memphis would go along way to making the bowl problems go away...it would really be a slam dunk if the Pirate football program could get itself going again

Jackson

The last line of that link reads the the Big East TV deal will be less than the C-USA and MWC TV deals. Is that true?

Jackson1011 Wrote:

Quote:The guy is right about Louisville leading the charge. Jurich is the man here and I've told some of you what I've learned. It was reiterated to me by a very reliable source the night we played ECU in basketball just a few short weeks ago. Don't be surprised if the Big East isn't recruiting any of the schools being mentioned in idle discussion on these message boards. Jurich always swings for the fences.

-- L-Yes....has there been anything new on that front? The two prospective schools being courted both had another sub par year...Also...have you heard anything about this 12 team league stuff? I know of two money making programs that would probably be very intersted in a football only membership in the league you have described to us before

It is still the two schools mentioned and I have heard nothing about going to 12. In fact I've been led to beileve that the only schools being recruited are the ones we've talked about. I think the major variable now is time simply because its appearing that there are some stress fractures appearing that could generate instability in the short term.

Which 2 schools are you refering to Lyes?

USFBullSpit Wrote:The SEC would never add Memphis because Tenn would not allow this. I have been to Memphis, and it seems as if there are more Vols fans there than Tigers fans. The SEC more than likely will look towards West Virginia or North Carolina or Texas, somewhere where they can capture a new market. They already have Tenn.

We are about to become the next Miami, and I think we will be the glue that will hold the Big East together, but I do agree that we will need a 9th member soon. I know many USF fans that hate to see D-1AA teams besides FAMU on the schedule and we have played a load of D-1AA teams since joining D-1A.

We are about to become the next Miami, and I think we will be the glue that will hold the Big East together, but I do agree that we will need a 9th member soon. I


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Quote: I think the major variable now is time simply because its appearing that there are some stress fractures appearing that could generate instability in the short term.

-- To me it seems impossible that MT and the BE leadership did not see all of these problems coming...we have an 8 team league were the majority of schools do not travel well...of course we are going to have bowl problems....12 game season is going to give us problems scheduling but we are co sponsoring the idea with the Big 12....it seems to me that we have to have a plan to solve those issues...I can't believe that our football leadership is that shortsighted


Jackson

The Big East really needs to add 2 teams for football. This would give Big East schools 9 conference games, and 3 out-of-conference games (assuming a 12 game schedule).