(12-02-2011 02:58 AM)MercerFan Wrote:  I more I see the more I hope we get NKU!! I wouldn't mind Longwood either as I've said over the years. I think head-to-head NKU wins, though. Longwood would need to be 11th or 12th team IMO if both teams are ready to join.

Adding NKU also opens up the Atlantic Sun geography to Bellarmine (in Louisville, last year's DII mBB champions) as well as Southern Indiana (in Evansville, which is opening up a new arena).

Those three schools were the basketball powers in the DII Great Lakes Valley Conference and in many respects have better facilities and potential fan base than current schools in the OVC.

If something like that were possible, then hopefully it would lead to an A-Sun expansion up to 12, that puts things into two divisions where Stetson, UNF, JU, FGCU, Mercer and Kennesaw were one side with ETSU, Lipscomb, Upstate, NKU, Southern Indiana, and Bellarmine were the other side. Insert Longwood if Lipscomb bolts.
Of course my hope is ETSU reinstates football, gets on the field and bolts with Kennesaw and Mercer.

(12-05-2011 01:56 PM)Buccaneerlover Wrote:  If something like that were possible, then hopefully it would lead to an A-Sun expansion up to 12, that puts things into two divisions where Stetson, UNF, JU, FGCU, Mercer and Kennesaw were one side with ETSU, Lipscomb, Upstate, NKU, Southern Indiana, and Bellarmine were the other side. Insert Longwood if Lipscomb bolts.
Of course my hope is ETSU reinstates football, gets on the field and bolts with Kennesaw and Mercer.

Mercer isn't going anywhere. Its non-scholarship football and would be suprised if it were to ever change. To much money to be made in non-scholarship football.

To go scholarship in football, Mercer would have to generate about $2.6 million for scholarships alone. That does not include operational costs (travel, recruiting, etc.).

(12-05-2011 02:07 PM)Statman101 Wrote:  

(12-05-2011 01:56 PM)Buccaneerlover Wrote:  If something like that were possible, then hopefully it would lead to an A-Sun expansion up to 12, that puts things into two divisions where Stetson, UNF, JU, FGCU, Mercer and Kennesaw were one side with ETSU, Lipscomb, Upstate, NKU, Southern Indiana, and Bellarmine were the other side. Insert Longwood if Lipscomb bolts.
Of course my hope is ETSU reinstates football, gets on the field and bolts with Kennesaw and Mercer.

Mercer isn't going anywhere. Its non-scholarship football and would be suprised if it were to ever change. To much money to be made in non-scholarship football.

To go scholarship in football, Mercer would have to generate about $2.6 million for scholarships alone. That does not include operational costs (travel, recruiting, etc.).

I don't believe Mercer is making all these moves to stay non-scholarship FOREVER. Yes, not right away... but at some point. The stadium plus the former Furman coach does not signal non-scholarship to forever to me. At this point though I'm just enjoying the ride and seeing where it goes. At a minimum it puts Mercer in position to act if the ASun folded.

(12-05-2011 02:31 PM)MercerFan Wrote:  

(12-05-2011 02:07 PM)Statman101 Wrote:  

(12-05-2011 01:56 PM)Buccaneerlover Wrote:  If something like that were possible, then hopefully it would lead to an A-Sun expansion up to 12, that puts things into two divisions where Stetson, UNF, JU, FGCU, Mercer and Kennesaw were one side with ETSU, Lipscomb, Upstate, NKU, Southern Indiana, and Bellarmine were the other side. Insert Longwood if Lipscomb bolts.
Of course my hope is ETSU reinstates football, gets on the field and bolts with Kennesaw and Mercer.

Mercer isn't going anywhere. Its non-scholarship football and would be suprised if it were to ever change. To much money to be made in non-scholarship football.

To go scholarship in football, Mercer would have to generate about $2.6 million for scholarships alone. That does not include operational costs (travel, recruiting, etc.).

I don't believe Mercer is making all these moves to stay non-scholarship FOREVER. Yes, not right away... but at some point. The stadium plus the former Furman coach does not signal non-scholarship to forever to me. At this point though I'm just enjoying the ride and seeing where it goes. At a minimum it puts Mercer in position to act if the ASun folded.

Well you may be right on some level, the shift from non-scholarship football to scholarship football is SUPER expensive.

Instead of bring in $2.6 million dollars in revenue due to tuition, you pay out $2.6 million in scholarships. Thats about $5 million dollars in revenue differential per year.

All that is considering no tuition raises and about $40 K per year per athlete.

The reason a school like Mercer adds football at the non-scholarship level is really not about football as much as it is about making $$$. It is all about revenue generation. Ask JU about having football and how much it made for a school that was slowly going bankrupt.

There is only one public institution that I know of that plays non-scholarship football and that is Morehead. Other than that its alot of schools like Mercer who are in it for the scholarship & grant money they can get from state and federal sources.

Very true but again, if they're just having non-scholarship football then why build a 6,000 seat stadium? Call me crazy but with Georgia's lottery scholarship program and the trend moving towards schools needing the sport at the scholarship level just to compete for first year enrollees, it wouldn't suprise me.

(12-07-2011 11:07 AM)Buccaneerlover Wrote:  Very true but again, if they're just having non-scholarship football then why build a 6,000 seat stadium? Call me crazy but with Georgia's lottery scholarship program and the trend moving towards schools needing the sport at the scholarship level just to compete for first year enrollees, it wouldn't suprise me.

First of all, a 6K seat stadium is nothing in size. Plus, its a dual purpose facility to also host Mercer's lacrosse programs which will be scholarship but again are in place to fill spots and increase enrollment.

Math (WATCH OUT!)
Lacrosse's NCAA Scholarship limit is 12.6 men/12 women. For example, Jacksonville's women's team has 39 athletes with essentially only 12 on scholarship. 27 (Paying Athletes/Grants/Need Based Aid) x $40,000 (Random Guess at Tuition Cost) = $1.08 Million

I would say the money made on a men's program would be VERY similiar. In fact, JU's men's program has even more athletes than its womens.

The reason private schools (very few public) add these sports is to generate LARGE sums of operating capital. I will guarantee the budget for these sports is minimal compared to the long term money making capital.

As far as stadium size, 6K is pretty standard for the PFL. In fact, Drake, Dayton, and several others are over 6K.

I will state again I find it HIGHLY unlikely they will go scholarship anytime in the relatively near future (10 + years). Because if you are going to go scholarship SOON, why would you not just go scholarship from the start like Kennesaw State, Georgia State and Old Dominion to name a few?

Mercer fits the bill as a long term non-scholarship program like Campbell, Jacksonville, Drake, Butler, Valparaiso, San Diego, Davidson, Stetson, Dayton, and others. That bill is small private schools with high tuitions seeking to raise enrollment and increase revenue in a time when the economy is hitting those high dollar institutions enrollment hard! Again that is why all these schools are adding high roster number sports that hand out very few scholarships in comparison.

Northern Kentucky is all but officially a go...that announcement should come from the school and A-Sun tomorrow.

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20111...lantic-Sun

You make good points, and the future of Mercer football at this point in time is uncertain. The main counter to your argument is that Mercer enrollment is at a record high. I have faith in President Underwood and the entire athletic department. They want to win and constantly improve, so I know they will make the proper decisions down the road.

(12-07-2011 02:17 PM)HatterFan Wrote:  Northern Kentucky is all but officially a go...that announcement should come from the school and A-Sun tomorrow.

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20111...lantic-Sun

excellent news! -- and I've been on record saying no more DII's. This school with their track record and facilities changed my mind (but only this once!)

It also occurs to me that for as long as Lipscomb remains with us, NKU works reasonably well as a direct replacement for Belmont as Lipscomb's travel partner to and from the other A-Sun schools in all sports.

As an Northern Kentucky Alum...glad to see the Norse have found a home. Look forward to watching some ASun basketball next season!!

It will be fun to see how they do. What will be more interesting is to see if any other schools join or if we stick to 10 programs.

(12-07-2011 02:20 PM)MercerFan Wrote:  You make good points, and the future of Mercer football at this point in time is uncertain. The main counter to your argument is that Mercer enrollment is at a record high. I have faith in President Underwood and the entire athletic department. They want to win and constantly improve, so I know they will make the proper decisions down the road.

I don't doubt that they will explore the option, but there are very few scholarship programs who teams even break even at the FCS level. I would just find it hard to believe no matter the financial standing of any University that it would decide to add a huge finiancial burden out of a group that would already be netting large sums of money.

I did some research on their website (nkunorse.com) to see what we're getting...they're FGCU North. These people do not screw around when it comes to sports.

baseball - 14 NCAA appearances, last 4 in a row.
men's basketball - 12 NCAA appearances, 6 straight winning seasons, currently in D2 Top 25.
women's basketball - 2000 and 2008 D2 national champs, 14 NCAA appearances, 28 consecutive winning seasons (damn!!)
men's soccer - 8 straight winning seasons, 5 NCAAs in past 6 years, 2010 D2 national champions
women's soccer - NCAA appearances 12 times in its 15-year history, 14 straight winning seasons.
softball - 8 NCAAs, all in the last 10 years, 3 NCAAs in a row, team was 55-2 in 2005 (again, damn!!)
volleyball - 11 NCAAs, 20 consecutive winning seasons

(12-07-2011 03:29 PM)HatterFan Wrote:  I did some research on their website (nkunorse.com) to see what we're getting...they're FGCU North. These people do not screw around when it comes to sports.

baseball - 14 NCAA appearances, last 4 in a row.
men's basketball - 12 NCAA appearances, 6 straight winning seasons, currently in D2 Top 25.
women's basketball - 2000 and 2008 D2 national champs, 14 NCAA appearances, 28 consecutive winning seasons (damn!!)
men's soccer - 8 straight winning seasons, 5 NCAAs in past 6 years, 2010 D2 national champions
women's soccer - NCAA appearances 12 times in its 15-year history, 14 straight winning seasons.
softball - 8 NCAAs, all in the last 10 years, 3 NCAAs in a row, team was 55-2 in 2005 (again, damn!!)
volleyball - 11 NCAAs, 20 consecutive winning seasons

That's impressive. I find it funny that the OVC reportedly turned them down because they would be too competitive. Add the fact that the men's basketball team beat West Virginia this year in an exhibition and you have a solid resume.

Non-scholarship football doesn't typically draw 6,000 fans a game. Neither does Lacrosse. I'm not saying Mercer will have scholarship football, but for them to have basically taken the blueprint of what Coastal Carolina built and integrate it onto their campus then it does make one wonder.
Northern Kentucky University, huh.

NKU will be announced as an ASun member tomorrow.

The ASUN should add Bellarmine and Southern Indiana next year, creating a nice four team pod with Lipscomb.

Bellarmine had desires to move to DI prior to the last NCAA moratorium. It's sports programs are arguably stronger than NKU's. Bellarmine also has a DI lacrosse team,

http://www.bellarmine.edu/about/president/Communiques/may_07_rotary.aspx

Quote:In athletics, we will be highly competitive in NCAA Division II, and we will compete for national championships in several sports. And, because this new vision will put us in the company of peer institutions that are NCAA Division I, we also will study moving Bellarmine to NCAA Division I. (Think of the great in-city rivalry that exists up the river between The Cincinnati Bearcats and the Xavier Musketeers.)

Can't wait to start D1 play in the A-Sun .. Anyone who thinks the Norse will be a push-over, you are mistaken! haha

With that, looking forward to seeing your teams here in NKY, should be alot of fun. Too bad Belmont is leaving, would have liked to see how we stack up against them as well.

Official Announcement today @ 3 PM EST .. Go Norse!

Glad the Norse finally found a home. As was stated, this conference is a bit stretched and i was hoping they would have joined OVC/Horizon. Mainly since there was more regional schools and this would have helped keep costs down for travel. As a measure with Summit, i think the ASUN is more preferable. Would love to see a Southern Indiana/Bellermine added to create a pod system. I know these schools are currently D2, but each operates as D1 schools for sports.
Either way, happy the Norse are now D1 and look for many great seasons in the Atlantic Sun.