(03-13-2011 12:07 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  The atmosphere among the presidents in the conference tends to put a kibosh on your prediction, animus. I don't see any kind of movement in that direction. What leads you to think otherwise?

I don't think a split is happening anytime soon.

As I said above, I'm not saying right after a tv contract...I'm saying once the new contract is in place, will the all sports look at it as not adding up to the revenue they need to stay with the other BCS schools, and for that they will reccomment to split to shrink the number of mouths at the table back to 10 or 12 all sports.....which wouldn't happen for a few years after the contract, however could play into negotiating the length of the upcoming contract, so they are not locked in for 10+ years before a split could be possible.

When the time and money are right, Notre Dame will choose between the Big Ten and the ACC.

(03-13-2011 08:15 PM)XLance Wrote:  When the time and money are right, Notre Dame will choose between the Big Ten and the ACC.

If money is a deciding factor, hello Big 10, and the acc wont even be in the picture.

I saw big crowds of Hispanic ND fans at San Antonio at the Alamo Bowl game in 10/09 and in El Paso at the Sun Bowl game last January.

I have also seen many pro-ND Hispanic fans at ND baseball games that I have attended at Houston, San Antonio and Corpus Christi.

There is a big untapped group of Hispanic ND fans in the Southwest. ND plans to play at Texas Stadium and will probably return to San Antonio in the near future.

ND also recruits well in California in most years, so yes, ND considers itself a "national school".

ND will never join the Big Ten unless there is absolutely NO other course of action. It would have to be Big Ten or Armageddon for the Irish to choose to join the Big Ten.

I just LOVE that we've re-located the expansion board. Now all the BE split discussion comes back here

I dont think a split is in the offering and there is no way that the Big East ftball members would ever kick out Notre Dame even if a split happened. The Irish tied to the Big East schools keeps the Big Ten at bay.

With that said I think the league will stay as it is and Nova moves up. If the league ever decided to go to 12 football members I could see them trying to buy out a school like DePaul, Seton Hall or Providence to move out rather than split. Maybe one of those schools would agree to move out if they were NOT successful in the league in basketball and were guaranteed that they would still have match ups vs Big East schools after they leave the league.

(03-13-2011 08:58 PM)BJUnklFkr Wrote:  I just LOVE that we've re-located the expansion board. Now all the BE split discussion comes back here

Since I started this one here...for the future, do the mods not want this type of discussion in here? I assumed this was specifically Big East, and not necessarily an expansion "conference realignment" forum thread....Let me know if it needs to be in the other forum

(03-13-2011 11:08 AM)SO#1 Wrote:  

(03-13-2011 08:46 AM)USFMike Wrote:  

(03-11-2011 08:33 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  I think it's more that we need to continue to build the programs we have currently, before we commit ourselves to further expansion. In the future, that may change. But not at the present time...

agreed 110%

No, you don’t always have a perfect linear progression. You will have a league going up and down but yours odd of having at least one or two teams excel is much better when you have a lot of teams. People will not overlook your league when you don’t have any team in the top-25. As bad as the old BE were when they have multiple teams ranked in the bottom of 110 teams D-IA every year but they have at least one or two teams in the top-10 most years. Our current members invested a lot of money into football programs that was not done in the old BE but still we don’t have a program progress far enough to be a fixture in the top-25. We need to do both continue to build the programs and expand. Ten should be the minimum numbers for the football league.

The all-sports members of the Big East have a different mission from the basketball-only members. Any action by all-sports members to strength their sport required the consent of basketball-only members to okay it before any action takes place. I don’t understand why there even question on this issue.

This rebuild Big East was temporary until we all can qualify to stand our own. It’s no longer a conference when you have this many members. The question is when both groups part way. Another decade, okay what concession we get from Notre Dame?

again, how are the bball schools holding us back? they let tcu in, please let me know specifically how the bball schools have held us back.

(03-14-2011 12:22 AM)USFMike Wrote:  

(03-13-2011 11:08 AM)SO#1 Wrote:  

(03-13-2011 08:46 AM)USFMike Wrote:  

(03-11-2011 08:33 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  I think it's more that we need to continue to build the programs we have currently, before we commit ourselves to further expansion. In the future, that may change. But not at the present time...

agreed 110%

No, you don’t always have a perfect linear progression. You will have a league going up and down but yours odd of having at least one or two teams excel is much better when you have a lot of teams. People will not overlook your league when you don’t have any team in the top-25. As bad as the old BE were when they have multiple teams ranked in the bottom of 110 teams D-IA every year but they have at least one or two teams in the top-10 most years. Our current members invested a lot of money into football programs that was not done in the old BE but still we don’t have a program progress far enough to be a fixture in the top-25. We need to do both continue to build the programs and expand. Ten should be the minimum numbers for the football league.

The all-sports members of the Big East have a different mission from the basketball-only members. Any action by all-sports members to strength their sport required the consent of basketball-only members to okay it before any action takes place. I don’t understand why there even question on this issue.

This rebuild Big East was temporary until we all can qualify to stand our own. It’s no longer a conference when you have this many members. The question is when both groups part way. Another decade, okay what concession we get from Notre Dame?

again, how are the bball schools holding us back? they let tcu in, please let me know specifically how the bball schools have held us back.

The only thing that I know is that this comglomeration is getting an incredible amount of attention. This is the BE's money sport and having all the schools together makes the BE a media 800 lb gorilla during tourney and bb season time. The amount of exposure this conference has been getting for basketball is unreal. While the bb schools once upon a time, have probably got in the way of the fb schools, I dont believe that to be the case anymore. They see what the fb schools bring and they dont want to be seperated from this exposure. If this league were to split at any time in the next 5 years we lose our trump card as neither side would attract this sort of exposure on their own. Right now, whether we like it or not, their is mutual benefits to this conglomeration. The next tv contract will confirm this. If not, then it may be time to part ways and each side try to make it on their own. But for the time being, we have to see what type of tv revenue this league can get.

DGrace, I was just kidding. Have at it

I agree, cuse. The level of basketball played in The BEast is far superior to any conference in history, and the northeast does sit up and notice that. Many conference games are better entertainment than NBA games IMO, with far more uncertainty as to who will win and a lot more excitement. Now all we need is a network willing to showcase BEast basketball...

(03-14-2011 08:11 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(03-14-2011 12:22 AM)USFMike Wrote:  

(03-13-2011 11:08 AM)SO#1 Wrote:  

(03-13-2011 08:46 AM)USFMike Wrote:  

(03-11-2011 08:33 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  I think it's more that we need to continue to build the programs we have currently, before we commit ourselves to further expansion. In the future, that may change. But not at the present time...

agreed 110%

No, you don’t always have a perfect linear progression. You will have a league going up and down but yours odd of having at least one or two teams excel is much better when you have a lot of teams. People will not overlook your league when you don’t have any team in the top-25. As bad as the old BE were when they have multiple teams ranked in the bottom of 110 teams D-IA every year but they have at least one or two teams in the top-10 most years. Our current members invested a lot of money into football programs that was not done in the old BE but still we don’t have a program progress far enough to be a fixture in the top-25. We need to do both continue to build the programs and expand. Ten should be the minimum numbers for the football league.

The all-sports members of the Big East have a different mission from the basketball-only members. Any action by all-sports members to strength their sport required the consent of basketball-only members to okay it before any action takes place. I don’t understand why there even question on this issue.

This rebuild Big East was temporary until we all can qualify to stand our own. It’s no longer a conference when you have this many members. The question is when both groups part way. Another decade, okay what concession we get from Notre Dame?

again, how are the bball schools holding us back? they let tcu in, please let me know specifically how the bball schools have held us back.

The only thing that I know is that this comglomeration is getting an incredible amount of attention. This is the BE's money sport and having all the schools together makes the BE a media 800 lb gorilla during tourney and bb season time. The amount of exposure this conference has been getting for basketball is unreal. While the bb schools once upon a time, have probably got in the way of the fb schools, I dont believe that to be the case anymore. They see what the fb schools bring and they dont want to be seperated from this exposure. If this league were to split at any time in the next 5 years we lose our trump card as neither side would attract this sort of exposure on their own. Right now, whether we like it or not, their is mutual benefits to this conglomeration. The next tv contract will confirm this. If not, then it may be time to part ways and each side try to make it on their own. But for the time being, we have to see what type of tv revenue this league can get.

my thoughts exactly, whatever problems we have in football is not the bball school's fault, in fact they've performed much better than anyone expected post raid (especially now with st. john's coming back to national prominence) and they let tcu in, which balances the schedule while adding a nationally recognized football program.

the presidents will not give up the big east name, ncaa credits, madison square garden tournament, and elite bball/academic programs with huge markets in georgetown,nova,notre dame,st. john's, and marquette - just to bring in one or two of the usual suspects.

(03-10-2011 08:38 PM)USFMike Wrote:  unless your expansion candidates consist of kansas/kansas st/missouri, your on crack if you think we'd receive any financial windfall from splitting and going to 12 teams.

Even then, I do not think you would see a windfall: you might even see a reduction.

(03-11-2011 02:03 PM)dgrace4cards Wrote:  I would think it would take a few years post upcoming new contract to evaluate and decide that there is more to be made and grow into with an all sports conference.

Still wondering how more money would be made? Just because the conference is "all sports" does not all of a sudden make it more valuable.

(03-11-2011 02:36 PM)Sammy11 Wrote:  However the entire deal depends on how their tier 3 rights would do individually as that is likely to determine the revenue differential. Big Ten only gets 15-17 million FROM TV right now (5 mil comes from tournament money, bowl shares, merchandising) that the Big 12 already compares similarly on.

Aren't the BigTen's third tier rights what they used to create the Big Ten Network? If so, that number is much closer to $90 million for the conference ($6-$7 mil a year per team plus conference share), not $15-$17 million per year.

(03-15-2011 10:15 AM)adcorbett Wrote:  

(03-11-2011 02:36 PM)Sammy11 Wrote:  However the entire deal depends on how their tier 3 rights would do individually as that is likely to determine the revenue differential. Big Ten only gets 15-17 million FROM TV right now (5 mil comes from tournament money, bowl shares, merchandising) that the Big 12 already compares similarly on.

Aren't the BigTen's third tier rights what they used to create the Big Ten Network? If so, that number is much closer to $90 million for the conference ($6-$7 mil a year per team plus conference share), not $15-$17 million per year.

The 15-17 is a per-team figure like the 6-7 you referenced.