There are no minuses worth mentioning.

Can't we just relocate some Ohio MAC schools to other states to create some more elbow room? Miami of Massachusetts?

:crow::tomservo:

(12-02-2010 02:40 PM)RecoveringHillbilly Wrote:  I just can't imagine some fans would think they know more about what's the best course for the MAC when compared to the opinions of our academic and athletic leaders, most having multiple advanced degrees and 20+ years of experience in academia, athletics, and the business of sports.

Oh I get it.

We'z all being a liddle too uppity. Massa says jump, us moonshine donating, corn eating, sister datin hicks should all ask how high?

Good business planning takes into account the future, not just the next 5 years. Reality is a lot of your sacrosant leaders will be onto different and probably better things, MAC be damned.

Quote:I'm sure if UMass was at the level of Boise, Fresno, or Nevada, we'd have a lot less problem with adding them for football only. They'd be an instant boost. While UMass MIGHT eventually be a boost, they certainly wouldn't be to start off with, and might never be.

True, they wouldn't come in a dominate a la Marshall, but I highly doubt they'd be bottom feeders.

If UMass was a MAC member this year, I believe they'd do no worse than a 3-5 or 4-4 conference record.

Quote:They aren't going to hurt it any. There's only 2 of them so they aren't going to destabilize the league and render it an incoherent mush the way some fear.

I agree. 2 of 14 members being "football only" and a bit outside of our traditional Midwest footprint is hardly anything to get bent out of shape about.

Further, Marshall and UCF were odder fits. UCF because of the incredible distance. Marshall because even though they were geographically very close, they definitely identified with and wanted a southern-based league.

(12-02-2010 03:32 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  Oh I get it.

We'z all being a liddle too uppity. Massa says jump, us moonshine donating, corn eating, sister datin hicks should all ask how high?

Good business planning takes into account the future, not just the next 5 years. Reality is a lot of your sacrosant leaders will be onto different and probably better things, MAC be damned.

I'm originally from West Virginia, so the last thing I'd think is people from DeKalb or Muncie are liquored up, sister-dating hicks compared to the heart-of-darkness environment I grew up in.

College sports really can't plan so far ahead to be compared to a typical business. Every FBS conference will have seen a membership change in the last 15 years come 2011.

As it is, UB's president is on to retirement in 2011, having left us and the next president with a path to further greatness. So all he has done is in the best interest of UB, not his resume. And I'm not so jaded to think our other leaders aren't all in with what's best for their institutions now, no matter where they end up later.

(12-02-2010 04:06 PM)Motown Bronco Wrote:  Further, Marshall and UCF were odder fits. UCF because of the incredible distance. Marshall because even though they were geographically very close, they definitely identified with and wanted a southern-based league.

No. UCF is only 226 more miles away from NIU than Amherst. UMass is a plane trip for every school except UB.

Have you read the UMass board about the possible membership? While they are happy the MAC would want them, 9 out of 10 posts have to do with how that will help their rivalries with local eastern teams like BC and UNH. And how those rivalries maybe can help them build a bigger stadium which would help with joining a eastern-based league. The fews posts referencing MAC prowess say something like "how will Akron help fill the stands" etc.

Almost everything their fan base is posting is identifiying how this will help their eastern identity. They are Marshall Squared, but with nicer posters, less cheatin', fewer pickem-up trucks and hopefully hotter women.

UMassers that are reading - I am not anti-UMass. I just really think the MAC is overextending into a market that doesn't help our conference, and perpetuates a bush league rep of taking just about anyone with a starry eyed dreams of FBS football.

Sorry. Nothing personal.

Expanding west means entrenching even further in Big Ten territory. And really, most of the MAC isn't in the Mid-West. The Dakotas, Minnesota, Iowa, Missouri, Indiana, Illinois... that's the Mid-West. Ohio, New York and Michigan (8 of our teams) are in the Great Lakes states.

We have 13 teams now. Even if the conference got raided for the top 5 (pretty unlikely), there'd still be 8 left, enough for a conference. You wouldn't have a conference championship game then, but that's hardly much of a money-maker anyway, right? It's one more game on ESPN. So I don't see why adding more teams in the name of security is a good bet. If the more eastern teams got good, particularly if we added any more eastern teams, they may eventually create an eastern conference, in which case we'd be back to square one anyway, and all we did was act as a springboard to create another FBS conference that competes with us. I guess I can see the argument about having more non-AQ teams as a voting bloc, but anything the MAC does wouldn't affect that enough I don't think.

As Lord Stanley said, they don't think of themselves as a MAC-type school any more than Marshall did.

Actually, Ohio & Michigan are a part of the traditional concept of the United States Midwest. States like Minnesota are a part of the old Northwest.

Lewis & Clark changed everything. GEOGRAPHY, it's awesome; but often you need historical context to understand why things get named the way they are. After all, someday someone will have to explain why St. Louis and Wyoming are in the Atlantic 10 and TCU and Hawaii are in the Big East (with NO teams left along the East Coast for either league).

Honestly feel we would help and not hurt the conference, we are almost middle of the pack now with attendance and being in the MAC should help attendance. We already compete with FBS games and gave Michigan a scare. We have an excellent marching band and check out the new 52 million dollar student recreation center.

Actually, Ohio & Michigan are a part of the traditional concept of the United States Midwest. States like Minnesota are a part of the old Northwest.

Lewis & Clark changed everything. GEOGRAPHY, it's awesome; but often you need historical context to understand why things get named the way they are. After all, someday someone will have to explain why St. Louis and Wyoming are in the Atlantic 10 and TCU and Hawaii are in the Big East (with NO teams left along the East Coast for either league).

(12-02-2010 05:05 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  Expanding west means entrenching even further in Big Ten territory. And really, most of the MAC isn't in the Mid-West. The Dakotas, Minnesota, Iowa, Missouri, Indiana, Illinois... that's the Mid-West. Ohio, New York and Michigan (8 of our teams) are in the Great Lakes states.

The Midwest, as defined by the US Census Bureau, includes the States of Ohio and Michigan. That's 7 teams.



Big Ten territory is a gawd damn football hotbed. The Big 10 is moving westward.

The northeast and New England is not. Yet the MAC continues to move East.

(12-02-2010 05:12 PM)Steve1981 Wrote:  Honestly feel we would help and not hurt the conference, we are almost middle of the pack now with attendance and being in the MAC should help attendance. We already compete with FBS games and gave Michigan a scare. We have an excellent marching band and check out the new 52 million dollar student recreation center.

Do you think you'd get better attendance playing MAC schools versus the (closer) schools you play now? Not that I'm overly concerned about your attendance as we don't have very good attendance in general. But you'll get very few visiting fans at that distance.

Actually, with the Big Ten headed a bit West, moving East is the best bet for the MAC. The Big Ten footprint has been the bane of our existence. Go East, {Young} MAC!

NIU2007 the answer is yes. The MAC is on ESPN and has name recognition, which would influence more casual fan types.

If UMass builds a new stadium, they should build a good one with 30,000+ capacity. I can't help but think that the smaller, more high-school-like stadiums are a big turn off for big-time recruits. It screams "small-time". Just my opinion. I've thought that of Huskie Stadium.

You do have an excellent band though I am sorry about how things turned out when they visited last. I was rooting so hard for you guys just based on what happened in Cuyahoga Falls OH.

(12-02-2010 05:33 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  If UMass builds a new stadium, they should build a good one with 30,000+ capacity. I can't help but think that the smaller, more high-school-like stadiums are a big turn off for big-time recruits. It screams "small-time". Just my opinion. I've thought that of Huskie Stadium.

They could follow Akron's plan. A nice 30k seat stadium for just $61 million, built with future expansion in mind. So you have the stadium you need now, but can easily and cheaply transform it into something more if the need arises.

(12-02-2010 05:13 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  

(12-02-2010 05:05 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  Expanding west means entrenching even further in Big Ten territory. And really, most of the MAC isn't in the Mid-West. The Dakotas, Minnesota, Iowa, Missouri, Indiana, Illinois... that's the Mid-West. Ohio, New York and Michigan (8 of our teams) are in the Great Lakes states.

The Midwest, as defined by the US Census Bureau, includes the States of Ohio and Michigan. That's 7 teams.



Big Ten territory is a gawd damn football hotbed. The Big 10 is moving westward.

The northeast and New England is not. Yet the MAC continues to move East.

Great Lakes Region.



The population centers of the US grouped into regions. There is NOTHING to the west.

(12-02-2010 05:13 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  

(12-02-2010 05:05 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  Expanding west means entrenching even further in Big Ten territory. And really, most of the MAC isn't in the Mid-West. The Dakotas, Minnesota, Iowa, Missouri, Indiana, Illinois... that's the Mid-West. Ohio, New York and Michigan (8 of our teams) are in the Great Lakes states.

The Midwest, as defined by the US Census Bureau, includes the States of Ohio and Michigan. That's 7 teams.



Big Ten territory is a gawd damn football hotbed. The Big 10 is moving westward.

The northeast and New England is not. Yet the MAC continues to move East.

Just eyeballing that map- the MAC has maxed out the potential of the midwest as things stand. We have a meaningful presence in Ohio, Michigan and Illinois.

Wisconsin- No FCS teams
Minnesota- No FCS teams (that I can think of)
Iowa- Nobody lives there. Nobody moving up
Missouri- Nobody moving up.
Dakotas, Nebraska, Kansas- Nobody lives there.

Again, people live in the Northeast. It's not 1850. The future is not in vast open tracts of land but in urbanized areas.

or what akronkid said, since his post has cooler pictures.