Kyle is just beginning to scratch the surface of how good he can become; right now he's having some foul problems that have kept him from impacting at an even greater level. Thing is though, people keep underestimating the supporting cast, most of which are just beginning to get their feel at the D-1 level . That's fine, it's a long year and there's lots to prove. We certainly aren't even playing at the level we can yet; nagging injuries to McFarland, Patterson, and Porter have kept them form contributing as much as they should be able to, and Ricks has had a typical juco learning curve. Those 4 right there were thought to be serious candidates to start earlier so getting them to that level will hopefully see us continue to improve as the season evolves vs hitting a wall.

(12-20-2009 12:41 AM)Aargh Wrote:  I think MSU's players will hit a wall and fade. At least no one out of the MSU camp is making noise about going undefeated for the entire season. That didn't work well when IlSU started hot last year

I doubt ANYONE in our camp is talking about going undefeated either...that is just a ridiculous comment. Most of us are just happy that we are competitive again after last year and no matter what you think we are greatly improved from a year ago. I know you don't respect our program based on your post on ValleyTalk and Shockernet...but we have been a pretty good program the last 10 years minus the last 2 and we are only going to get better with everyone back next year plus more players coming in to fit Zo's system

[REDLINE UPSET ALERT} Drake 70 SIU 65 Final

Contenders
UNI
WSU
MSU
ISUr

Pretenders
Everyone else

(01-10-2010 02:26 AM)FeartheQ Wrote:  Contenders
UNI
WSU
MSU
ISUr

Pretenders
Everyone else

Not much doubt that the league champ is going to come from that group of 4. Of course, I think it's also going to come from this group:

UNI.

I think everyone knows UNI will win the regular season title. but if MSU and WSU win all there games and split with each other then there will be some serious talk about auto bids come march

(01-10-2010 01:08 PM)FeartheQ Wrote:  I think everyone knows UNI will win the regular season title. but if MSU and WSU win all there games and split with each other then there will be some serious talk about auto bids come march

Not to be an ass, but that hurt my brain to read.

If WSU wins all of "their" games except to split with Missouri State, then WSU is going to be the 1 seed, MSU the 2 and UNI the 3 and none of those 3 results are going to provide any autobids to anything except WSU to the NIT, so I am not sure of your point.

Well I meant UNI potentially going 18-0 or 17-1... I was talking more along the lines of WSU and MSU tied for 2nd

UNI is good but I don't think they are 18-0 or perhaps not even 16-2 good.

I think UNI goes 14-4. If anyone can come close to that... I think 2nd place could be 12-6 or 11-7.

I think it fly's this way
UNI
Wichita State
Indiana State
Illinois State
These are all of the tougher defensive teams in the Valley

(01-12-2010 01:16 PM)beststrikingskillsinthevalley Wrote:  I think it fly's this way
UNI
Wichita State
Indiana State
Illinois State
These are all of the tougher defensive teams in the Valley

Wow..... Youz 'n ideot

Why is he an idiot? Because MSU isn't on his list? I don't know if the facts back up his stance on these being the four toughest defenses in the league, but if he's right, at this point that is as valid a list as any other. Defense will take you a long, long way in the MVC, so until proven otherwise, his point is valid. And yes, Indiana State is statistically one of the better defenses in the league. Not to mention we're tied with your Bears right now. Who knows how this race will go? The only solid bet right now is that UNI has the inside track on the title. Positions 2-7 are solidly up for grabs.

But here's the thing. The Sycs have gone 3-2 against the softest MVC schedule so far and all teams with losing Valley records. Given that, one might expect the losses for INSU to begin piling up as UNI, WSU, ILSU and MSU start appearing on the schedule. We'll find out a little more tonight.

Very true about our conference schedule thus far. We did, however, play a much more difficult non-con schedule than just about anyone else. At this point, before the first round of conference games is over, it's just not logical to say that the guy with the really long screen name is an idiot.

Royal, I could say the same thing about WSU's 14 wins - a very soft non-con, with a decent win sprinkled in now and then.

We really won't know until later in the season. That road win at MSU might not end up being the accomplishment that everyone (including me) thought it was!!! But who knows...

Should be a good game tonight in Terre Haute. We're most likely going to be without our leading scorer and rebounder again. That will really hurt against an athletic team like the Shocks. I look for a dogfight!!! I can't wait to get there!!!

You could say the same thing about WSU, but WSU didn't lose at home to the likes of Coastal Carolina (by 15) or Ball State. WSU took care of business against those mid-tier RPI teams (@ Cleveland St, TCU and Iowa.), winning each by double-digits. The only real hiccup for WSU is the lopsided loss at ILSU.

INSU's non-con shows inconsistency, which can also be seen somewhat in league play so far (lopsided loss at SIU, lopsided win at DU). No doubt the Sycamore will beat some good teams (perhaps WSU tonight), but to see a 3-2 record against a weak league schedule and predict they will finish better than both MSU and ILSU is a stretch, especially with Kelly out for the year. "Idiot" is a big strong, but I think the point is accurate.

I'm sorry, do you mean the Coastal Carolina team that is 16-2? Seems a lot of people have been losing to them...

Yeah, the Ball State game was a big goose egg. Still, you seem to ignore the SOS numbers that suggest our schedule in the non-con was tougher than anyone else in the league except Bradley (I think). Finishing 8-3 in that schedule isn't too bad. At least our SOS isn't in the 300 range...

As for our two losses in conference, in both of those games, we lost an important player to injury. That doesn't excuse what happened, but it certainly explains a lot. And remember, you can only play the games that are on the schedule. So I'd say we know less about the Trees at this point than most other teams. The team has bounced back nicely after both losses, and my only real point in this whole exchange is that to call "guy with the long screen name" an idiot simply doesn't make any point other than a desire to "mix it up." I don't think we're going to win the league, but if you want to argue with someone (and it wasn't you, Royal), at least try a little harder than just calling someone an idiot!!!

Strangely enough, the team seems to play better without Kelly. There were some ego clashes that were killing team chemistry (not Kelly's fault, btw). And, from what I hear, we'd better get used to life without Kelly, too. I heard from a local doctor that he might end up being redshirted next year. That seriously sucks - for him and for the team.

This evening's game will tell a lot for my Trees. Can we handle WSU's athletic big men? Our inside game is a serious weakness. But, our defense has been pretty staunch all year. Can we muster enough "drive and dish" opportunities and rebounds without Dwayne Lathan? How will WSU handle playing in a big, mostly empty arena? (Don't get me started) Seriously, we'll learn a lot about both teams tonight. I expect a really good game.

Coastal has a gaudy record, but outside of Duke, INSU and Coll. of Charleston, they haven't played a team with an RPI better than 215. Seven of their wins are against teams with 2 or fewer victories.

I understand the overall SOS numbers. But I like to also look at individual games for ones that carry a little more significance than the others to put things in perspective. And the RPI numbers indicate that WSU has done better against it's schedule than INSU has against it's schedule (59 to 83). Sagarin predicts a 4-pt WSU win, Pomeroy a 5-pt win and I think I saw the Vegas line favoring WSU by 4. If those predictions pan out, it should at the very least be a close game!

This season WSU has already played in two mostly empty arenas (Cleveland St. and UMKC). It's too bad you guys are having to deal with that at home. I'd like to see every Valley arena busting at the seams.

One hell of a game by WSU tonight. They shot the ball incredibly well, were very stiff defensively, and played like exactly what they were - the better team. The Sycamores really missed leading scorer and rebounder Dwayne Lathan and swingman Koang Doluony tonight - two of our most athletic players. Without them, we really had no answer for the athleticism of the Shockers. When we get those guys back, we're gonna be OK. I think, assuming we are healthy, the rematch will be a good game.

The standings are starting to get some separation. Will UNI, WSU and Illinois State stay at the top and be the only contenders? I think so but the middle of the pack has MSU, Indiana State and Creighton. Another contender at this point would have to come from one of them.

Having to improve to get out of the play in game are SIU, Bradley, Drake and Evansville.

The Shocker-Sycamore game was much different than I thought it would be. The Shocker big men were not a factor and the win can be credited to WSU's perimeter play. Durley once again fouled his way out of playing time. Stutz and Blair were not 100 percent. Assuming Indiana State is back to full strength the return game in Wichita will probably be a different looking game.