Coach did the only thing he could, he went Bobby Knight on the refs and it cost us 15 after their swallow of the whistle.
I also was at the game and I was busy celebrating a great UT play and was left wondering what happened on the field after Page put us into position to tie the game.
Gang these MAC refs quite frankly are second ranked and seemingly are being directed to position certain teams in a certain way.
Let me actually be serious, ... uhm I am.

(11-27-2009 07:37 PM)robroy Wrote:  A man crush how sickening- Dantin is too little, made too many mistakes early but coaches left him in. Freshman mistakes. This game made me sick! Coaches fault- I still say they should have used Pettee but maybe , just maybe would have done better than the golden child. The coaches decisions lost this game and a couple of others. Seniors got screwed. I watched this game on Rocket Vision( had to work) so I know what I was watching. I hope next year the QB with the power to bring a win gets the start not the recriut the coaches promised the world. The Rockets did not deserve to go out like this.

I feel your pain, Robroy. To start the season, logic would have it that they would redshirt both freshmen and make Pettee and Pasquale the backups, come what may. I got nothing against Pettee in any way, but apparently the coaches have a reason for making Dantin #2 at it's fairly obvious what it is.

That being said, Dantin is a true freshman and I can't recall seeing a true freshman at Toledo play like he does. He's deadly accurate, dangerous on his feet and, most importantly, is capable of executing a spread offense. No way can you hang the loss on him. Yeah, he put the ball on the ground again, but freshmen are going to do that. He just did an incredible job of keeping his head on straight and leading us to a comeback. That mess of a 1st quarter was mostly on special teams.

QB is the least of our worries next year. We're going to need support at RB and we're going to need a tall deep threat to replace Williams. Maybe Kenny Stafford will step into that role. I think Bellinger has a lot of potential, too. Can't forget about OL either.

(11-27-2009 09:01 PM)Chugalug Wrote:  Coach did the only thing he could, he went Bobby Knight on the refs and it cost us 15 after their swallow of the whistle.
I also was at the game and I was busy celebrating a great UT play and was left wondering what happened on the field after Page put us into position to tie the game.
Gang these MAC refs quite frankly are second ranked and seemingly are being directed to position certain teams in a certain way.
Let me actually be serious, ... uhm I am.

My thoughts exactly Coach...

That sums up my thoughts of the 1st quarter.

(11-27-2009 09:36 PM)RocketRobert Wrote:  

(11-27-2009 07:37 PM)robroy Wrote:  A man crush how sickening- Dantin is too little, made too many mistakes early but coaches left him in. Freshman mistakes. This game made me sick! Coaches fault- I still say they should have used Pettee but maybe , just maybe would have done better than the golden child. The coaches decisions lost this game and a couple of others. Seniors got screwed. I watched this game on Rocket Vision( had to work) so I know what I was watching. I hope next year the QB with the power to bring a win gets the start not the recriut the coaches promised the world. The Rockets did not deserve to go out like this.

I feel your pain, Robroy. To start the season, logic would have it that they would redshirt both freshmen and make Pettee and Pasquale the backups, come what may. I got nothing against Pettee in any way, but apparently the coaches have a reason for making Dantin #2 at it's fairly obvious what it is.

That being said, Dantin is a true freshman and I can't recall seeing a true freshman at Toledo play like he does. He's deadly accurate, dangerous on his feet and, most importantly, is capable of executing a spread offense. No way can you hang the loss on him. Yeah, he put the ball on the ground again, but freshmen are going to do that. He just did an incredible job of keeping his head on straight and leading us to a comeback. That mess of a 1st quarter was mostly on special teams.

QB is the least of our worries next year. We're going to need support at RB and we're going to need a tall deep threat to replace Williams. Maybe Kenny Stafford will step into that role. I think Bellinger has a lot of potential, too. Can't forget about OL either.

We'll be ok next year.

Sorry, guys but from the East stands you did not have a good angle on the Page play. He was still turning and moving the ball forward. And you guys have watched Page all year so you of all people should know that he is tough to tackle and always keeps driving and moving the pile. BG was not trying to tackle him, they were tackling the ball and that is why Page's momentum was still going forward.

That being said, the call certainly could have gone the other way so I know it sucks. But your coach should also know that progress calls are not reviewable and the 15 yards was a costly penalty as UT still had 3 timeouts left I think. You really needed him to keep his composure at that critical time and he failed.

(11-27-2009 08:08 PM)rocketfootball Wrote:  Oh, and by the way, if Dantin is too small than so is Pettee as both are 6-2 in height.

Dantin looks tiny out there. He needs to bulk up at a minimum.
"Open competition" for the QB job next fall but Dantin will be the only guy with significant game experience here in the spring. I don't know much about the young QB who redshirted this season.
Not much of a competition if the options are two sophomores and some true freshman recruits. One, EJ Tucker, who is a known QB project with athleticism but needs refining.

(11-28-2009 09:26 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  Sorry, guys but from the East stands you did not have a good angle on the Page play. He was still turning and moving the ball forward. And you guys have watched Page all year so you of all people should know that he is tough to tackle and always keeps driving and moving the pile. BG was not trying to tackle him, they were tackling the ball and that is why Page's momentum was still going forward.

That being said, the call certainly could have gone the other way so I know it sucks. But your coach should also know that progress calls are not reviewable and the 15 yards was a costly penalty as UT still had 3 timeouts left I think. You really needed him to keep his composure at that critical time and he failed.

Page was moving his feet and leaning forward but going no place. My angle was the BCSN replay who agreed with you that it was a tough judgment call and they could have seen it go either way.

It was close and PAGE had both hands firmly around the ball. One falcon really got in there to go after the ball while the others were on his back. It was certainly the big play to win the game.

(11-27-2009 08:37 PM)MotoRocket Wrote:  This is one of the only times ever that I wanted to throw something out on the field in protest. A freaking sun dial would have been appropriate. They then did nothing to explain to Beckman what happened other than to shrug their shoulders as if to say - "what do you want me to do now - it's not reviewable.." I thought Beckman was going to take his head off - and rightfully so. They took what could have been one of the most exciting endings in the history of the game - and became the determining factor in how the game would end.

I'm with you!

I'd feel more sympathetic if I hadn't seen the same call go against Willie Geter twice against Minnesota (at the Doyt no less) in 2008... I think Beckman was wrong to go off to the extent that he got flagged. The only way his team was going to win was to keep us from scoring again....starting from the 26 made it a hell of a lot easier than starting from the 11.

If it were one of his players getting that flag he would have let t slide?

(11-28-2009 01:27 PM)El Grande Flippero Wrote:  I'd feel more sympathetic if I hadn't seen the same call go against Willie Geter twice against Minnesota (at the Doyt no less) in 2008... I think Beckman was wrong to go off to the extent that he got flagged. The only way his team was going to win was to keep us from scoring again....starting from the 26 made it a hell of a lot easier than starting from the 11.

If it were one of his players getting that flag he would have let t slide?

Beckman did the right thing by getting aggressive with the officials at that point I think.

(11-28-2009 01:32 PM)owen Wrote:  

(11-28-2009 01:27 PM)El Grande Flippero Wrote:  I'd feel more sympathetic if I hadn't seen the same call go against Willie Geter twice against Minnesota (at the Doyt no less) in 2008... I think Beckman was wrong to go off to the extent that he got flagged. The only way his team was going to win was to keep us from scoring again....starting from the 26 made it a hell of a lot easier than starting from the 11.

If it were one of his players getting that flag he would have let t slide?

Beckman did the right thing by getting aggressive with the officials at that point I think.

What did it accomplish?

Supported the players but hurt their chances in the game. He should have been more tempered IMO. Make the complaint, even follow up after the game with the league office but getting a 15 yards penalty didn't accomplish anything.

(11-28-2009 02:52 PM)eastisbest Wrote:  

(11-28-2009 01:32 PM)owen Wrote:  

(11-28-2009 01:27 PM)El Grande Flippero Wrote:  I'd feel more sympathetic if I hadn't seen the same call go against Willie Geter twice against Minnesota (at the Doyt no less) in 2008... I think Beckman was wrong to go off to the extent that he got flagged. The only way his team was going to win was to keep us from scoring again....starting from the 26 made it a hell of a lot easier than starting from the 11.

If it were one of his players getting that flag he would have let t slide?

Beckman did the right thing by getting aggressive with the officials at that point I think.

What did it accomplish?

Supported the players but hurt their chances in the game. He should have been more tempered IMO. Make the complaint, even follow up after the game with the league office but getting a 15 yards penalty didn't accomplish anything.

I don't think head coaches know when something is or is not reviewable half the time.

But regardless of the outcome (this time a penalty) a coach needs to be outspoken when the game is on the line, and a potentially erroneous call by the officials may have just helped determine the outcome of the game in the final minutes.

His choices were sit back and almost certainly lose because of the turnover or argue to get a replay determination at the risk of penalty.

I'm not saying he shouldn't get in their ear...Clawson is really good at that ...but you have to know where the line is. At that point you need to keep your team focused getting the three and out...taking a 15 yard flag at that point was a serious lapse.

I think he's going to be fine at UT....but this was not go down as a shining moment in his career...