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bearcatfan Offline
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Bowl attendance
There is an article in the Cincinnati Enquirer this morning that indicates WVU used 9300 tickets for the Fiesta Bowl last year.

Everyone is getting all over UC even before they have even qualified for a BCS game.

From The Enquirer -

"That's a lot of tickets to move. Last year when West Virginia went to the Fiesta Bowl, which cost $135 per ticket, they didn't move all their tickets. They probably were able to give some of them back, but they may have ended up swallowing (the cost of) some of those tickets."

West Virginia used only 9,300 of its allotted 17,500 tickets - including those tickets it sold plus complimentary tickets for players, coaches, staff members, the traveling party and the band.

The school had to absorb the cost of all the tickets from its allotment that weren't sold.

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20081...5/1062/SPT

Is this information correct? I'm guessing there will be some WVU fans saying it is not. I have also read that WVU had a donor step up and purchase a lot of the unsold tickets.

Either way - UC fans have been led to believe on message boards that every team travels well but them. UC took over 10,000 to the Papa John's Bowl in Birmingham last year.

And don't get me wrong - going from WVU to Arizona is a long distance to travel. I completely understand if 9300 made it there and to me that is a good turnout. It may not be in the eyes of the BCS or the bowl game but with the state of the economy then (and especially now) it is not easy to spend that much money getting tickets and traveling to a bowl game.
(This post was last modified: 11-19-2008 08:24 AM by bearcatfan.)
11-19-2008 06:44 AM
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SoCalPanther Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Bowl attendance
bearcatfan Wrote:UC fans have been led to believe on message boards that every team travels well but them. UC took over 10,000 to the Papa John's Bowl in Birmingham last year.

I think the worst traveling fans in the BE are from Pitt and SU. I could be wrong about that though.

Not sure where you get that UC fans are lead to believe that every BE team travels but them - on UC message boards? I think many ASSUME that UC doesn't travel well because UC doesn't have 'high' FB attendance.

I, and many others that post here and elsewhere, know that UC brought a heck of a lot of people to B'ham for the Pizza Bowl. I hope that trend continues.

UC and fans should be commended for increasing the attendance since being part of the BE and having fans show up at the bowl game! 04-bow
(This post was last modified: 11-19-2008 07:59 AM by SoCalPanther.)
11-19-2008 07:59 AM
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MichaelSavage Offline
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RE: Bowl attendance
Last year many WVU fans made non-refundable reservations in New Orleans for the BCS title game (following the win over UConn and prior to the Pitt loss). Due to the loss to Pitt many fans just weren't going to make the trip to the Fiesta Bowl.
11-19-2008 08:07 AM
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bearcatfan Offline
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RE: Bowl attendance
MichaelSavage Wrote:Last year many WVU fans made non-refundable reservations in New Orleans for the BCS title game (following the win over UConn and prior to the Pitt loss). Due to the loss to Pitt many fans just weren't going to make the trip to the Fiesta Bowl.

That's a good point that I had not thought of. There was also the nonsense happening with Rodriguez at the end of the year.

My point is UC is building something. It's a work in progress. Yes - the speculation that UC does not travel well is in part from message boards and it is the perception based on their past home attendance.

UC simply does not have the tradition that most other schools (WVU, Pitt, UofL to some extent) have. UC is new at this but hopefully it will become a yearly event.
11-19-2008 08:13 AM
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bitcruncher Offline
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Post: #5
RE: Bowl attendance
A lot of WVU fans were upset with the administration, as well as Rodriguez, and showed it by not buying the tickets. Normally, WVU fans have a waiting list for tickets in such circumstances. But it was a totally different situation for the Mountaineer faithful last year...

I think UC's fanbase will grow, as long as they continue to have success, especially if they keep Kelly around for a while. He's the biggest salesman the Bearcats have ever had, and he has a real nice personality too. He'll win the Queen City over if he sticks around, and he could build himself a legacy. He's smart enough...

But as for how many UC fans will travel... who knows at this point? It's still early in Kelly's campaign to win over the city...
11-19-2008 08:27 AM
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bearcatfan Offline
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RE: Bowl attendance
Good post - and as a follow up to your question.... from the Enquirer this morning -

UC Fighting History/Bengaldom
By Paul Daugherty • pdaugherty@enquirer.com • November 18, 2008

I’ve never understood the concept of Loyal Fan. What does that mean, exactly? Blind love? Or steady date? Does loyalty make you a hero, a dreamer or a fool, or maybe all of the above?
Too often, teams take advantage of their fans’ loyalty. “If you’re a fan, be a fan,” Bengals coach Marvin Lewis decreed earlier this fall, when the Bengals were 0-for-the-season. Love us, even as we abuse you. There are hotlines for that sort of thing.
If you continue to spend time and money being a loyal Bengals fan, is that something to be proud of, or something to have looked at by a professional? It’s not up to you to support bad business. It’s up to bad business to give you something to support. Isn’t it?

Which brings me to Brian Kelly.

The UC football coach allowed after his team’s win in Louisville Saturday that he would be (word for angry, rhymes with “kissed”) if there weren’t “five hundred thousand” fans at Nippert Stadium Saturday, for this week’s biggest football game in UC history. He and his team had done all they could do, the coach said. Now, it’s up to the people. It sounded like a referendum on local fans, and on the support for Bearcats football in general. Which was nuts.

No one knows what the time frame is for converting pro football fans to college football fans, in a pro football town. We could be about to find out. It’s wishful, in this economy, to think there are enough of both here to fill up two stadiums every fall weekend.

For now, here’s what Kelly has to deal with: A local affection for the Bengals that borders on delusional; a UC football history featuring middling results at best, in leagues nobody cared about; a two-year run on major success that still needs padding.

If you want a sold-out stadium, don’t win one Big East title. Win two in a row, three out of five. Don’t just schedule Oklahoma. Beat Oklahoma. This isn’t Morgantown. Change can occur here. Usually in geologic time. Certainly not in two years.
[/size]

At his Tuesday media gathering, Kelly defused the postgame comment, typically smoothly and with humor. “My boss disciplined me severely. (It was) probably the strongest discipline I’ve faced since I’ve been here.” Just as you were reaching for the cell phone to dial up athletic director Mike Thomas for a comment, Kelly added, “My boss is my wife. (She) was really upset because of my language. My 7-year-old heard that.”

Brian Kelly is Irish in all respects, most of them delightful. He could charm a viper from a basket and make it think it was a puppy. He has the twinkly eyes, the quick wit and the gift of con. If he has to hold himself up for inspection to help his program, he will. And, frankly, he has a point. “You made 60 public appearances in the offseason,” I began a question. “Seventy-six,” Kelly corrected. “It’s all been grassroots. Chicken On The Run (restaurant, in Deer Park) was one of my favorite places.”

The coach has sold UC football, and UC football is 18-5 under his command. So when he says “There’s no reason why it should not be the largest crowd in the history of Nippert Stadium” Saturday, he has earned the right. Still, change doesn’t occur overnight.

“I don’t think there’s an obligation. There is nothing that says, ‘I live in Cincinnati, I gotta go see the Bearcats.’ If you stink and you’re not recruiting locally, and you’re not engaging the community, if you’re not doing it the right way, I wouldn’t go pay your money, either. But we’re doing those things,” Kelly said. In other words, loyalty is a two-way street.

The Bearcats play Pitt Saturday. Nippert Stadium should be sold out. If not, keep winning, BK, and it will be. Love for UC football is conditional, not blind. Just the way it should be.

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20081...3/1062/SPT
(This post was last modified: 11-19-2008 08:50 AM by bearcatfan.)
11-19-2008 08:47 AM
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bitcruncher Offline
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Post: #7
RE: Bowl attendance
It sounds like he agrees with me on the subject of how many fans will show. It's too early to tell... 07-coffee3
11-19-2008 09:09 AM
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KnightLight Offline
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RE: Bowl attendance
One thing Cinci is smart about in regards to bowl attendance...is they basically give free a bowl tix (up to $50 in value) to almost all season ticket holders.

That is SMART as Cinci can say immediately on selection day how many "tickets" that they have pre-sold/distributed...which will help their overall bowl attendance...even if some tickets never get used at all.

UC did this same thing last year...which helped their distributed and actual (not to far of a drive at all) attendance for their bowl game in Birmingham.

From UC website:

2008 Bearcats Football Season Ticket packages include:

UCATS Reserved - $232 (includes a $50 bowl ticket credit - donation required)
Sit in the best seats in the house! UCATS reserved tickets offer priority seating, while enjoying the benefits of a UCATS membership. Also earn a $50 bowl ticket credit and additional bowl game incentives including seat and other special offers. Bowl game tickets may require an additional charge per ticket.

Non-UCATS Reserved - $232 (includes a $50 bowl ticket credit, No UCATS donation required)
Non-UCATS Reserved season tickets lock in your seat for all of the excitement of a Bearcats Football game day. Also earn a $50 bowl ticket credit and additional bowl game incentives including seat and other special offers. Bowl game tickets may require an additional charge per ticket.

Faculty/Staff - $158 (includes a $50 bowl ticket credit)
Employees of the University of Cincinnati will enjoy discounted season ticket rates again for the 2008 season in the Non-UCATS areas of the stadium. Order now and save $74 off a regularly priced single game ticket purchase. Also earn a $50 bowl ticket credit and additional bowl game incentives including seat and other special offers. Bowl game tickets may require an additional charge per ticket.
(This post was last modified: 11-19-2008 09:28 AM by KnightLight.)
11-19-2008 09:27 AM
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bitcruncher Offline
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Post: #9
RE: Bowl attendance
It's not a free bowl ticket. It's just a $50 credit. Ticket costs will vary widely bowl to bowl...
11-19-2008 10:09 AM
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Ring of Black Offline
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Post: #10
RE: Bowl attendance
You’re correct Bit. UC fans need to pay for their OB tix, minus the $50 credit.
Hoquista Wrote:I think the worst traveling fans in the BE are from Pitt and SU. I could be wrong about that though.
Significant point Hoq, that can’t be ignored. I’ve seen several fans from both Pitt/SU that are pissed about the new BE arrangement. The common tone is “PSU and/or BC are our rivals, not UC/UL/USF.”

I don’t intend to lump the guys on this board into that, because they appreciate the newer schools, but, if the disenfranchised (per above) are a significant amount of the fan base, then it’s no wonder the travel takes a hit. I’m sure, for example, Pitt has a lot less of a problem traveling to Morgantown, than to Cincinnati or Louisville.

At any rate, because SU/Pitt are two storied traditional programs, it would really help the league to see those two traveling strongly.
11-19-2008 10:21 AM
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CD11 Offline
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Post: #11
RE: Bowl attendance
KnightLight Wrote:One thing Cinci is smart about in regards to bowl attendance...is they basically give free a bowl tix (up to $50 in value) to almost all season ticket holders.

That is SMART as Cinci can say immediately on selection day how many "tickets" that they have pre-sold/distributed...which will help their overall bowl attendance...even if some tickets never get used at all.

UC did this same thing last year...which helped their distributed and actual (not to far of a drive at all) attendance for their bowl game in Birmingham.

From UC website:

2008 Bearcats Football Season Ticket packages include:

UCATS Reserved - $232 (includes a $50 bowl ticket credit - donation required)
Sit in the best seats in the house! UCATS reserved tickets offer priority seating, while enjoying the benefits of a UCATS membership. Also earn a $50 bowl ticket credit and additional bowl game incentives including seat and other special offers. Bowl game tickets may require an additional charge per ticket.

Non-UCATS Reserved - $232 (includes a $50 bowl ticket credit, No UCATS donation required)
Non-UCATS Reserved season tickets lock in your seat for all of the excitement of a Bearcats Football game day. Also earn a $50 bowl ticket credit and additional bowl game incentives including seat and other special offers. Bowl game tickets may require an additional charge per ticket.

Faculty/Staff - $158 (includes a $50 bowl ticket credit)
Employees of the University of Cincinnati will enjoy discounted season ticket rates again for the 2008 season in the Non-UCATS areas of the stadium. Order now and save $74 off a regularly priced single game ticket purchase. Also earn a $50 bowl ticket credit and additional bowl game incentives including seat and other special offers. Bowl game tickets may require an additional charge per ticket.

I know Jose already said but that's just a credit, not a ticket. Anyway, I wanted to add that according to UC's marketing dept, there will be a student ticket package available for the bowl game as well. Last year was the first time the dept had planned something for the students, and if I remember right, it was a big success and played a large part in our 10k pilgrimage down to Birmingham. The package was $50 for a hotel room, charter bus, and game ticket. Now, I'm sure the package will be a little more expensive this time around, especially if we go to the BCS (more expensive ticket + further distance from Cincinnati) but as a student, the idea of being in Miami for New Year's Eve, followed by my team in the Orange Bowl the next day......well, I and a lot of other students would pay pretty much whatever price necessary to make that happen. So I think the student package will again be a large success and aid in our bowl attendance.

Edit: Oh yeah, we got a t-shirt and hat too. Can't forget that.
(This post was last modified: 11-19-2008 10:57 AM by CD11.)
11-19-2008 10:42 AM
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Post: #12
RE: Bowl attendance
bearcatfan Wrote:There is an article in the Cincinnati Enquirer this morning that indicates WVU used 9300 tickets for the Fiesta Bowl last year.

There are a couple of reasons why you didn't hear a single complaint last year about WVU's ticket problems at the Fiesta bowl.

1) Perception. WVU is perceived to be a good traveling team and 99% of the time, they are. Whether we like it or not, perception in college football is everything (look at O$U and the Big Ten for example). Bowls don't complain about WVU, even if they fall short on tickets every once and awhile, because they know that most of the time, they are going to get a horde of mountaineer fans packing the stadium. UofL, UC, etc. can't say the same thing because our fanbases are not as large and don't have the reputation of traveling as well as WVU.

2) Made-for-TV Matchup. The Fiesta Bowl didn't care about WVU shortfall because they knew that Oklahoma v. WVU would bring high television ratings. The game featured two name programs that were both highly ranked and had garner a lot of media attention. So even when WVU didn't sell all their tickets, the bowl knew it would still have very high ratings to compensate. In fact, I'd agrue that the bowl would prefer to pick a team that would bring a lot of eyeballs to TV (WVU) over one that couldn't but would sell their full allotment (UofL). See below.

3) Opponent. This is another reason why WVU didn't take any flak. Even if WVU didn't sell a ton of tickets, the Fiesta bowl knew that Oklahoma would make up for that fact because they would bring a lot of fans to the game.

What do I base these assumptions on? Louisville's last two bowl appearences and how UofL was treated by the bowl representatives.

- In 2006, Louisville took a lot of flak from the Gator Bowl who claimed that Louisville was a huge disappointment due to low ticket sales. Louisville ended up selling out their allotment + some and had roughly 23-25K fans at the bowl. Cardinal fans outnumbered Virginia Tech Fans at the game. Despite that, our reputation for traveling still took a hit. My guess for why the Gator acted as it did was because Louisville brought fans but not ratings to the game and because the bowl didn't want to insult the ACC, its tie-in conference, for lack of support.

- In 2007, Louisville took flak from some of the Orange Bowl people for "only" bringing 40,000 to the game. These same folks seemed to forget that Louisville brought more than double the amount of fans that Wake did (~17,000). Like the Gator bowl, I suspect that the Orange bowl was pissed because Louisville didn't deliver high ratings (we were the last picked I believe) and because they couldn't insult Wake and the ACC was underpreforming.
(This post was last modified: 11-19-2008 11:16 AM by UofL07.)
11-19-2008 11:13 AM
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bitcruncher Offline
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Post: #13
RE: Bowl attendance
Jose_Jalapeno_on_a_Stick Wrote:I’ve seen several fans from both Pitt/SU that are pissed about the new BE arrangement. The common tone is “PSU and/or BC are our rivals, not UC/UL/USF.”
Of course, Syracuse fans are ignoring the fact that neither BC or Penn State want anything to do with them... 01-wingedeagle
Jose_Jalapeno_on_a_Stick Wrote:At any rate, because SU/Pitt are two storied traditional programs, it would really help the league to see those two traveling strongly.
It would help. But don't expect it. History backs me up on this... 07-coffee3
11-19-2008 11:26 AM
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Jackson1011 Offline
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Post: #14
RE: Bowl attendance
Jose_Jalapeno_on_a_Stick Wrote:You’re correct Bit. UC fans need to pay for their OB tix, minus the $50 credit.
Hoquista Wrote:I think the worst traveling fans in the BE are from Pitt and SU. I could be wrong about that though.
Significant point Hoq, that can’t be ignored. I’ve seen several fans from both Pitt/SU that are pissed about the new BE arrangement. The common tone is “PSU and/or BC are our rivals, not UC/UL/USF.”

I don’t intend to lump the guys on this board into that, because they appreciate the newer schools, but, if the disenfranchised (per above) are a significant amount of the fan base, then it’s no wonder the travel takes a hit. I’m sure, for example, Pitt has a lot less of a problem traveling to Morgantown, than to Cincinnati or Louisville.

At any rate, because SU/Pitt are two storied traditional programs, it would really help the league to see those two traveling strongly.


-- Syracuse and Pitt's poor traveling history have nothing to do with the makeup of the conference. I'm sure losing Penn St and to a much lesser degree BC has effected home attendnace because college fans will be more likely to show to watch your school play a traditional or geographical rival. For most of the Eastern Indys, Penn St was both as well as being the big bully on the block..so they were a huge, huge draw at the gate. PSU to eastern football is very similar to what G-Town was to early BE basketball

-- However, with that being said, Pitt and SU were schools that had a poor traveling histories before all of this realignment and honestly I just don't see that changing. Syracuse is a private school with a limited # of alums and traveling football fans in Western Pa travel with the Steelers. The real hope for the BE is developing traveling fan bases at Rutgers and Uconn. IMO, those two schools have the type of makeup could really help in that area in future


Jackson
(This post was last modified: 11-19-2008 11:52 AM by Jackson1011.)
11-19-2008 11:51 AM
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RE: Bowl attendance
Jackson1011 Wrote:The real hope for the BE is developing traveling fan bases at Rutgers and Uconn. IMO, those two schools have the type of makeup could really help in that area in future
Makes sense, being state schools.

But, don't SU/Pitt, as well as other BE schools, have considerable alumni in FLA? I always thought that was part of the basis for including USF in the league to replace Miami.
11-19-2008 12:33 PM
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RE: Bowl attendance
Jackson1011 Wrote:The real hope for the BE is developing traveling fan bases at Rutgers and Uconn. IMO, those two schools have the type of makeup could really help in that area in future


Jackson

Both UCONN and RU have already proved that they can travel better than SU and Pitt in their short history of bowls. UCONN is new to football altogether and they already travel better to bowls than Pitt or SU. Here is another bowl season and another opportunity to prove it.

I hope Cincy can develop that fanbase. BE sure can use some more schools that can sell out the stadium and travel better to bowls.
11-19-2008 01:58 PM
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RE: Bowl attendance
Good post ... whatever the specific reasons re WVU and last year's FB, this is a MAJOR problem for the conference, one that is largely responsible for our ****** bowl tie-ins.

Our teams can win on the field, and that's great, but until our fans ante up the big dollars that the fans of other BCS-conference programs do, we'll always be treated second-class.
11-19-2008 01:59 PM
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RE: Bowl attendance
Jose_Jalapeno_on_a_Stick Wrote:
Jackson1011 Wrote:The real hope for the BE is developing traveling fan bases at Rutgers and Uconn. IMO, those two schools have the type of makeup could really help in that area in future
Makes sense, being state schools.

But, don't SU/Pitt, as well as other BE schools, have considerable alumni in FLA? I always thought that was part of the basis for including USF in the league to replace Miami.

-- Alums was part of the equation but the big reason was recruiting exposure IMO...

Quote:Good post ... whatever the specific reasons re WVU and last year's FB, this is a MAJOR problem for the conference, one that is largely responsible for our ****** bowl tie-ins.

Our teams can win on the field, and that's great, but until our fans ante up the big dollars that the fans of other BCS-conference programs do, we'll always be treated second-class.

-- The lose of Va Tech was critical when it came to bowl tie ins...VT, WVU and Notre Dame basically carried the old BE bowl tie ins...that's why the Gator Bowl took one of those three almost every year...Frankly, the old league had similar problems but losing the Hokies has made it worse

I guess the positive thing about bowl tie ins is this is something fans can effect. You want better bowl tie ins for the league? If so, then travel



Jackson
(This post was last modified: 11-19-2008 03:15 PM by Jackson1011.)
11-19-2008 03:14 PM
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RE: Bowl attendance
bitcruncher Wrote:[quote=Jose_Jalapeno_on_a_Stick]I’ve seen several fans from both Pitt/SU that are pissed about the new BE arrangement. The common tone is “PSU and/or BC are our rivals, not UC/UL/USF.”
Quote:Of course, Syracuse fans are ignoring the fact that neither BC or Penn State want anything to do with them... :wingedeagle
Your blind hatred for SU and its fans doesnt allow you to see the facts clearly. The fact that SU started a home and home series with Penn St this season, and a multi year home and home with BC proves that you know very little about what you are talking about. And it was BC who approached SU. 01-wingedeagle
(This post was last modified: 11-19-2008 06:24 PM by cuseroc.)
11-19-2008 04:31 PM
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RE: Bowl attendance
Jose_Jalapeno_on_a_Stick Wrote:
Jackson1011 Wrote:The real hope for the BE is developing traveling fan bases at Rutgers and Uconn. IMO, those two schools have the type of makeup could really help in that area in future
Makes sense, being state schools.

But, don't SU/Pitt, as well as other BE schools, have considerable alumni in FLA? I always thought that was part of the basis for including USF in the league to replace Miami.

The last time we played the Gator Bowl we had close to 15,000 fans there. Its not great, but its not terrible either.
(This post was last modified: 11-19-2008 04:34 PM by cuseroc.)
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