You have had to be DI for at least 15 years. That leaves 5 ASUN teams.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=3481843#51

Yes, that's how far we've fallen

They threw ETSU a nice ranking. I think the #253 is appropriate for Mercer, considering where the previous staff left us. We have a lot of work to do to improve our basketball image.

82nd is extremely respectable.

That list is garbage....I know this is going to offend the ETSU fans here, but here is a small sample of teams that they list ETSU above in the rankings of best programs:

Mississippi State
Notre Dame
Auburn
Texas Tech
Vanderbilt
Tennessee
Georgia
California
Clemson
Providence
Oregon

I don't care by what standards you are judging this ranking...that is just plain dumb. ETSU should be in the mid 100's, which is very respectable for a low-major (which is exactly what ETSU is at this point in time). ESPN just throws lists out there I think sometimes to create controversy so they can talk about it.

KennesawBasketball Wrote:That list is garbage....I know this is going to offend the ETSU fans here, but here is a small sample of teams that they list ETSU above in the rankings of best programs:

Mississippi State
Notre Dame
Auburn
Texas Tech
Vanderbilt
Tennessee
Georgia
California
Clemson
Providence
Oregon

I don't care by what standards you are judging this ranking...that is just plain dumb. ETSU should be in the mid 100's, which is very respectable for a low-major (which is exactly what ETSU is at this point in time). ESPN just throws lists out there I think sometimes to create controversy so they can talk about it.

I hear what you're saying KB, but ESPN's methodology accounted for mulitple variables (see below). That's not to say that it does not have its flaws (e.g.-winning the SOCON is a hell of a lot different than winning the ACC...same number of points for both), but I think it does reward teams for consistency over the long haul.

Explanation of the scoring system
We wanted to account for a program's positive accomplishments. National titles and deep advances in the NCAA tournament are the big point-getters.

Having the best record in your conference's regular season is a fairly big deal, as well. We didn't just give out points here for conference titles. (Considering how many conferences are split into divisions and award shares of the title for, say, a 12-6 team from the West Division when a 14-4 team is in the East Division. In this scoring system, the 14-4 team would be the only one to earn five points.)

We also doled out four points for conference tournament titles. These were given fewer points than a regular-season title because a three- or four-day stretch of domination in your conference shouldn't be rewarded as much as a season-long one. For conferences that didn't hold conference tourneys (notably the Pac-10 and Big Ten for years and the Ivy currently), we simply awarded the points to the team that was given the conference's automatic bid to that year's NCAA tournament.

What about Cinderellas? We all remember 15th-seeded Richmond over Syracuse and 15th-seeded Hampton over Iowa State, and first-round upset wins by 12- through 16-seeds are rewarded accordingly.

We also had to factor in negatives. When your highly seeded team falls flat on its face in the first round against a no-name school, your program loses two points. When your team is caught breaking the rules and the NCAA bans it from the postseason, that is an embarrassment for the fan base. Same thing goes for losing seasons. Both cost your program three points in our rankings.

• National title … 25
• Title game loss … 20
• National semifinal loss … 15
• Elite Eight loss … 10
• Best record in conference's regular season … 5
• 30-plus wins in a season … 5
• Sweet 16 loss … 5
• Conference tournament title … 3
• AP first-team All-American … 3
• Losing in NCAA second round … 3
• Player in top 10 of NBA draft … 2
• NCAA first-round win as a 12-16-seed … 2
• NIT title … 2
• AP second-team All-American … 2
• 20-29 wins in a season … 1
• NCAA tournament berth … 1
• Postseason NIT berth … 1
• AP third-team All-American … 1
• NCAA first-round loss vs. 12-16-seed … -2
• Losing season … -3
• Ban from NCAA tournament … -3
>> Minimum 15 seasons in Division I
** Ties are broken by overall winning percentage since the 1984-85 season
^^ Teams are listed by their current conferences

That didn't take long BucFaithful :) That scoring system is heavily weighted for smaller conference teams. Like you said...there is a big difference in winning the SoCon and the ACC...or having a winning season in the SoCon and the ACC. Just a stupid scoring system in my opinion. Doesn't take into account the level of competition that the teams are playing against. With that scoring system you might as well count DII's like Kennesaw.

ETSU has a good basketball history, and right now is trying to figure out if they belong as a low major or a mid major. For what it is worth, if they did an actual ranking of D1 programs that was somewhat legit, my guess is that ETSU would be mid 150's to 200 and Kennesaw would be in the 300's. So this isn't some sort of vendetta opinion. I just don't agree with their gimic rankings.

KennesawBasketball Wrote:That list is garbage....I know this is going to offend the ETSU fans here, but here is a small sample of teams that they list ETSU above in the rankings of best programs:

Mississippi State
Notre Dame
Auburn
Texas Tech
Vanderbilt
Tennessee
Georgia
California
Clemson
Providence
Oregon

I don't care by what standards you are judging this ranking...that is just plain dumb. ETSU should be in the mid 100's, which is very respectable for a low-major (which is exactly what ETSU is at this point in time). ESPN just throws lists out there I think sometimes to create controversy so they can talk about it.

I agree, these rankings are ridiculous. There is NO WAY some of these non-BCS conference teams should be ranked ahead of major programs. Yes the occasional non-BCS team (Davidson, Butler) deserves respect, but overall you cannot compare the A-Sun or even the So Con to the BCS conferences.

Great ranking and well deserved for ETSU because of its vast history of success. Any poo-pooing of the ranking on here is is just sour grapes.

Just for starters as to the Bucs vs. Big School opponents, during this time period ETSU has wins over: NC State (3 times in fact), Tennessee (twice), Xavier, Cincinnati, Wake Forest, East Carolina, Virginia Tech, Arizona (in the NCAAs), Mississippi State, Brigham Young, Southern Miss, George Mason, Fresno State and Georgia. Not a bad list.

Give the Bucs their due.

CWG Wrote:There is NO WAY some of these non-BCS conference teams should be ranked ahead of major programs.

I'm with Buc2002 on this one. Being in a BCS conference does not make a team good. It's that ideal that we're trying to shake away from the masses. The Bucs deserve credit, and it only helps the A-Sun.

Buc2002 Wrote:Great ranking and well deserved for ETSU because of its vast history of success. Any poo-pooing of the ranking on here is is just sour grapes.

Just for starters as to the Bucs vs. Big School opponents, during this time period ETSU has wins over: NC State (3 times in fact), Tennessee (twice), Xavier, Cincinnati, Wake Forest, East Carolina, Virginia Tech, Arizona (in the NCAAs), Mississippi State, Brigham Young, Southern Miss, George Mason, Fresno State and Georgia. Not a bad list.

Give the Bucs their due.

I agree not a bad list... But overall the A-Sun cannot and does not compete with BCS schools. Mercerfan, the conference DOES matter--I wish it didn't but the fact is that it does. Please tell me the last time someone from a "Mid-Major" won the NCAA Championship. (honestly I don't think the A-Sun is even classed as a Mid-Major).

No sour grapes--I wish the A-Sun Conference could get better too...

Maybe this is the year the A-Sun gets 2 teams in the NCAA...

CWG Wrote:Maybe this is the year the A-Sun gets 2 teams in the NCAA...

They only way that happens, is if two teams go undefeated (except against each other ofcourse), and both make it to the championship game . You would have two 30 win teams. The likelyhood of that happening is about as good as me laying Shakira down by the fireplace.

ETSUfan1 Wrote:

CWG Wrote:Maybe this is the year the A-Sun gets 2 teams in the NCAA...

They only way that happens, is if two teams go undefeated (except against each other ofcourse), and both make it to the championship game . You would have two 30 win teams. The likelyhood of that happening is about as good as me laying Shakira down by the fireplace.

Yeah, I didn't say it was likely. I do think there will be some good teams in the A-Sun this year though. I think Mercer will be better than most think with Emerson & Florence. Belmont will also be very good. Honestly, I don't know much about the rest of the league.

CWG Wrote:Maybe this is the year the A-Sun gets 2 teams in the NCAA...

That's already happened before..... I could see it happening again sometime soon, but not this year.

CWG Wrote:Mercerfan, the conference DOES matter--I wish it didn't but the fact is that it does. Please tell me the last time someone from a "Mid-Major" won the NCAA Championship.

You're dodging my argument I'm not saying that the conference doesn't matter. It does, I agree. I'm saying that being a MEMBER of a big conference does not make your team good. In other words, just being a member of the Big 12 does not give your team a ranking above East Tennessee State by default.

ETSUfan1 Wrote:The likelyhood of that happening is about as good as me laying Shakira down by the fireplace.

If you did that you would absolutely be my hero!

I've done it...or at least the next best thing

MercerFan Wrote:

CWG Wrote:Mercerfan, the conference DOES matter--I wish it didn't but the fact is that it does. Please tell me the last time someone from a "Mid-Major" won the NCAA Championship.

You're dodging my argument I'm not saying that the conference doesn't matter. It does, I agree. I'm saying that being a MEMBER of a big conference does not make your team good. In other words, just being a member of the Big 12 does not give your team a ranking above East Tennessee State by default.

First, I'm not dodging anything! Second I never said that every team in a BCS conference was better than ETSU all the time. Generally, however, A-Sun teams cannot compete with bigger conference teams.

CWG Wrote:however, A-Sun teams cannot compete with bigger conference teams.

Really? Do I need to list the big conference teams that the ASUN beat last year?

The point ETSUFan1 is that if you stuck ETSU or even Belmont in the ACC they would finish last every time for the forseeable future. Doesn't mean that an ASun team can't beat anyone in the country on any given night (we have proven we can) but it does mean on a night in night out basis the ASun is dealing with a lesser talent basis than the BCS.

I do think there will be a time in the near future where we could possibly get two teams into the NCAA tournament. All it would take is to have one team have an unreal season (ala Davidson) but lose in the championship of the tournament. It wouldn't necessarily take two great seasons, just one and that team losing the finals.

By the way, even though I disagree with the ranking system, if I was an ETSU fan I would be living it up. This is a great recruiting tool, and good for their program. I am not trying to take away from that, just saying that I don't agree with the premise of the rankings...doesn't mean ETSU fans shouldn't be happy :)