Neil,
I think the UC fans here would agree with you on it being USF. One of them mentioned that last week when all the Memphis in to the Big East / not into the Big East news was breaking. A UC fan will have to confirm but l believe they were being told your are not getting in until the invitation arrived.
CJ

4 team playoff.

army56mike Wrote:The hardest thing will be getting the playoff. From that point it will be much easier to expand. A playoff precedent must be set first. I think the best number is 16 for a playoff. All conference champs plus at large teams. Keep the bowl system in place. What's the problem?

The problem is that if you had 11 conference champions in the mix the power conferences like the SEC and Big 12 would have no competitve reason to stick together. If LSU or Florida wanted to make a run at the title every season all they would have to do is join CUSA. That is the perception. Most of the current BCS world would deem the MAC champion as unworthy of playing the B10 champ in a playoff. That's just the way it is. A plus 1 is the most likely playoff structure.

The MAC/Sun Belt champ will never be part of a realistic playoff discussion. Nor should they.

army56mike Wrote:

animus Wrote:i just hope the non bcs conference's don't get an auto bid. how is fair for the 3rd best team from any bcs conference get shafted because the sunbelt gets an auto bid. if conferences get auto bids i could see some major bcs conference juggling to get the conferences smaller.

I have to disagree on this one. I think all should get a fair shake. Because on any given year, like the ACC, they don't deserve a BCS slot any more than C-USA or the MWC, and certainly not as much as the WAC. That could have been said for the BEast several years ago too. I think all deserve a shot. I'm tired of exclusion. Let it be played out on the field. Who knows how good or how far a Troy, Boise, or BYU could go?

Your hatred of the ACC has blinded you to reality if you think C-USA, the MWC and the WAC are more deserving of a BCS berth. It's about total conference strength; not just the conference champ.

If you look at my posts historically, I don't hate the ACC. As a matter of fact I like the make up of the teams in the ACC. But the truth is, the ACC has sucked hard when it comes to BCS success recently. Both the WAC and MWC have had teams climb the ladder to get in and win BCS games. It can't be denied that the ACC has not been the strongest football conference lately. That has nothing to do with my opinion of it. I like the ACC, especially with the additions that they made. So, yes, those conferences do deserve a shot at the big time. How can you say they don't? Ask Oklahoma, Pitt, and a number of other teams if those guys deserve a shot? They may not have the depth of the current BCS conferences, but they certainly have some quality teams at the top.

I would ask Georgia. In my opinion, Hawaii's performance in the last Sugar Bowl all but erased what Boise did in 2006.

Two questions.
1. If it is a 16 team playoff, there will be 15 games I think. Which bowls would be considered the top and be invited to host playoff games and would the other bowls survive by scheduling teams that didn't make the playoffs and how would they schedule their games? Would all the smaller bowls schedule games before the playoffs start?

2. If it were a four team playoff I suppose you would take the top four teams in the BCS rankings. But is it possible to take the subjectivity out of that process? What do you wanna bet the four teams will almost alays be the SEC (some years two teams), the Big Ten, The PAC, and the Big 12. They will always get an assit from the human polls. As long as those teams make up the top four most years, they will have no reason to push for expanding it.

goodknightfl Wrote:I agree it likely will be 4 only. If they were to go to a full blown playoff system 16 makes the most sense.. 11 conf champs plus 5 at large.

I prefer bowl games over anything other than 11+5. The 11+5 is the only fair system you can use. Just like bball with the conference champs and at large bids, it lets every team have a fair shot at a title.

they deserve an at large bid is some years not an auto bid is what i'm saying.

MichaelSavage Wrote:I would ask Georgia. In my opinion, Hawaii's performance in the last Sugar Bowl all but erased what Boise did in 2006.

So now a Non-BCS team losing in one year eliminates the achievements of another Non-BCS team the previous. I can clearly see the logic in that.

How about this...
Does the poor performance of a particular BCS conference, like say the ACC (1-9 in BCS contests) underscore how pathetic the football is that's played there? Your logic, not mine.

Bottomline is Hawaii would have walked through the ACC last year. If they had been matched up with Kansas, I'm sure they would have performed as well as the ACC Champ did. Afterall they performed as well as the ACC Champ did, they lost.
CJ

CardinalJim Wrote:

MichaelSavage Wrote:I would ask Georgia. In my opinion, Hawaii's performance in the last Sugar Bowl all but erased what Boise did in 2006.

So now a Non-BCS team losing in one year eliminates the achievements of another Non-BCS team the previous. I can clearly see the logic in that.

How about this...
Does the poor performance of a particular BCS conference, like say the ACC (1-9 in BCS contests) underscore how pathetic the football is that's played there? Your logic, not mine.

Bottomline is Hawaii would have walked through the ACC last year. If they had been matched up with Kansas, I'm sure they would have performed as well as the ACC Champ did. Afterall they performed as well as the ACC Champ did, they lost.
CJ

Nobody seriously believes Hawaii would have walked through the ACC last year. Using your logic, the SoCon was better than the Big Ten last year since Appy State beat Michigan.

MichaelSavage Wrote:Nobody seriously believes Hawaii would have walked through the ACC last year.

Why not offer the evidence you have that refutes this? Why, because you can't. You can't point to one single victory by your BCS Champion to say "See we belong". That's the ACC fan's MO; Attack those that they see as weaker. First it was the Big East, now it's the Non-BCS schools. They always say the best defense is a good offense. Your comments certainly echo that comment.

Good thing Swafford was blackmailed into taking VT instead of Syracuse or your ACC would have really been screwed.

BTW I don't see ACC schools lining up to play Appalachian State.
CJ

CardinalJim Wrote:

MichaelSavage Wrote:Nobody seriously believes Hawaii would have walked through the ACC last year.

Why not offer the evidence you have that refutes this? Why, because you can't. You can't point to one single victory by your BCS Champion to say "See we belong". That's the ACC fan's MO; Attack those that they see as weaker. First it was the Big East, now it's the Non-BCS schools. They always say the best defense is a good offense. Your comments certainly echo that comment.

Good thing Swafford was blackmailed into taking VT instead of Syracuse or your ACC would have really been screwed.

BTW I don't see ACC schools lining up to play Appalachian State.
CJ

If they are so bad why did they split the season series with the Big East last year? And I'm not an ACC fan, I just can look at things objectively. And any objective observer of college football would tell you that Hawaii wouldn't have run the table in the ACC last year.

And frankly, after the 2007 season it's amusing to see a Louisville fan talking football smack.

XLance Wrote:Mike, why the hostility toward the ACC? If it weren't for the ACC, Louisville would still be on the outside looking in.

I don't know why people keep CONSTANTLY bringing it up, as if we're not allowed to criticize the ACC. I was critical of the ACC before and after the expansion.

MichaelSavage Wrote:

CardinalJim Wrote:

MichaelSavage Wrote:I would ask Georgia. In my opinion, Hawaii's performance in the last Sugar Bowl all but erased what Boise did in 2006.

So now a Non-BCS team losing in one year eliminates the achievements of another Non-BCS team the previous. I can clearly see the logic in that.

How about this...
Does the poor performance of a particular BCS conference, like say the ACC (1-9 in BCS contests) underscore how pathetic the football is that's played there? Your logic, not mine.

Bottomline is Hawaii would have walked through the ACC last year. If they had been matched up with Kansas, I'm sure they would have performed as well as the ACC Champ did. Afterall they performed as well as the ACC Champ did, they lost.
CJ

Nobody seriously believes Hawaii would have walked through the ACC last year. Using your logic, the SoCon was better than the Big Ten last year since Appy State beat Michigan.

And your the same person who is using the logic that Hawaii losing means Boise State's win doesn't mean anything. Excuse us if we think you have zero credbility right now.

MichaelSavage Wrote:

CardinalJim Wrote:

MichaelSavage Wrote:Nobody seriously believes Hawaii would have walked through the ACC last year.

Why not offer the evidence you have that refutes this? Why, because you can't. You can't point to one single victory by your BCS Champion to say "See we belong". That's the ACC fan's MO; Attack those that they see as weaker. First it was the Big East, now it's the Non-BCS schools. They always say the best defense is a good offense. Your comments certainly echo that comment.

Good thing Swafford was blackmailed into taking VT instead of Syracuse or your ACC would have really been screwed.

BTW I don't see ACC schools lining up to play Appalachian State.
CJ

If they are so bad why did they split the season series with the Big East last year? And I'm not an ACC fan, I just can look at things objectively. And any objective observer of college football would tell you that Hawaii wouldn't have run the table in the ACC last year.

And frankly, after the 2007 season it's amusing to see a Louisville fan talking football smack.

For someone who isn't an ACC fan you sure take it personally whenever someone criticizes the ACC. You're objective yet you just go bonkers whenever someone calls out the ACC and now you're bragging because the ACC managed to split a season series with the Big East? Wow. If you want to find something amusing, how about the fact that you think after one season Louisville fans can't talk smack. Using your logic Miami fans haven't been able to talk smack for like 5 years, especially after what Louisville did to them. The only thing more annoying them a fan of another conference coming to our board and criticizing us is someone pretending to be a fan and then constantly criticizing or defending the ACC against the evil Big East.

MichaelSavage Wrote:If they are so bad why did they split the season series with the Big East last year? And I'm not an ACC fan, I just can look at things objectively. And any objective observer of college football would tell you that Hawaii wouldn't have run the table in the ACC last year.

And frankly, after the 2007 season it's amusing to see a Louisville fan talking football smack.

I wouldn't claim to be an ACC fan either. Hawaii was a good as the champion of your conference. They accomplished as much as your conference champion did with the same result.
Don't confuse stating facts like how horrible your conference has been in the BCS as smack. BTW as bad as UofL football was last year we still administered our yearly beat down of an ACC has been / never will be.
CJ

CardinalJim Wrote:

MichaelSavage Wrote:If they are so bad why did they split the season series with the Big East last year? And I'm not an ACC fan, I just can look at things objectively. And any objective observer of college football would tell you that Hawaii wouldn't have run the table in the ACC last year.

And frankly, after the 2007 season it's amusing to see a Louisville fan talking football smack.

I wouldn't claim to be an ACC fan either. Hawaii was a good as the champion of your conference. They accomplished as much as your conference champion did with the same result.
Don't confuse stating facts like how horrible your conference has been in the BCS as smack. BTW as bad as UofL football was last year we still administered our yearly beat down of an ACC has been / never will be.
CJ

But they split the season series CJ! Yay!

Savage, I can probably speak for most when I say that you’re with this season split crap. You consistently miss the fact that two of the eight games vs. the ACC were home games for the BE teams.

Good team Virginia got a last second win vs. UConn – hardly a statement of superiority. And mediocre Pitt was still trying to figure it out when they got blasted by the Cavs.

I’ll admit to the legitimacy of Md’s win at Rutgers, but the way the Knights went through the BE season, even their own fans will tell you their team was nothing resembling that of a year before.

Wake was definitely better than UConn in the bowl. The Deacons probably would have won their division if not for Skinner’s injury.

Still, every BE win over an ACC team was solid. So, IMO you need to look further than head-to-head, and the ACC falls a bit short of the BE when you look into that. Kansas schooled the ACC’s best team in the Orange Bowl. I think Hawaii would have given the Hokies a game too.

The point Jim makes is that the ACC is not leaps and bounds above Hawaii. As Jim states, you’ve done nothing to refute that. You’ve only deflected the point over to your tired “ACC-BE tie-game” argument.