I don't know why this took me so long to figure out, but it finally hit the other day.

I like talk radio. I like the exchange of ideas, the details and commentary a host can give a story.

So I was listening to WJCW and heard a promo for Dave Hogan and Carl Swann's morning show.

The promo encouraged us to listen to Wednesday's show because they were going to have a spokesman talk about "National Tire Safety Week."

BEAT STILL MY HEART!!!!!!

I have to ask this question. WHAT IS THE DEAL IN THIS MARKET WITH 50+ YEAR OLD WHITE GUY HOSTS WHO SAY ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!!!????!!!!!

WPWT doesn't count. Not because they have a younger host. Because he WANTS to be 50+.

I don't want to bash Swann and Hogan too much. They have smooth voices and are laid back. They seem intelligent.

But they are exactly the sort of people who will put you right back to sleep in the morning, along with their guests.

I think this area has fallen to crap because it has been ALLOWED to fall to crap.

We'll be pleasant, but we'll say absolutely NOTHING and fill up the time of our shows talking about "National Tire Safety" week.

I know that March is National Noodle Month. Personally, I think you could get a whole lot more milage out of that!

It seems the local stations are so afraid to offend someone that they don't do anything to ATTRACT listeners and sponsors, either.

Final straw to me today was listening to Helman's show. I only tuned in to the morning- I was in my car early- but he led off the show's sportscast talking about some Tennessee basketball goings on- a player was eligible for the draft or had been recruited or some such minor thing.

WHO THE HELL CARES?

THEN he got into ETSU beating UT and the golf team losing to North Florida.

In the Tri-Cities, the station LED OFF with Knoxville instead of what was going on here.

But despite these really great topics to talk about- "Does this keep Skole for next year?"

"Since Tennessee is consistently losing to mid-major teams was it a mistake to get rid of Rod Delmonico?"

"Does Fred Warren deserve 10 lucurative years on his contract if his team, with the top two golfers in the conference, can't win the A-Sun Tournament?"

Instead, let's see here- I heard-

Birds carry lice.

Bud doesn't shoot hoops well.

And other assorted pieces of nonsense- TO LEAD OFF THE SHOW, MIND YOU- that I cannot recall because I couldn't care less.

I will give them credit that they touched upon PacMan Jones. After about 10 minutes of "Don't touch a birds nest because then the mama bird will not care for her young."

But the thing is- ESPN is going to cover the "Jones to the Cowboys story"- and cover it better- than hosts in Johnson City will. What hosts in Johnson City will cover better is what is going on in Johnson City, and there were two pretty big ETSU stories.

Unless PacMan Jones' agent was on the line for an interview you're not going to break anything there.

Talk show ratings around here are sickly. When WJCW went to news-talk they initially got a really big rating because of the buzz and it was almost halved the very next book- presumably because people didn't want to hear a conversation about "National Tire Safety Week."

The Sports Monster has been stagnant. In comparison to other sports stations around the country they've been about average in terms of ratings, but the local gospel station tied them in the book, along with the classic country station Citadel moved to a weaker frequency.

WFHG puts up really embarassing ratings. They've never had as good of ratings as they did when I was there (perhaps because people want to listen to news reporters that don't mumble their way through stories?) but that's patting myself on the back.

Of course, when you have a host in Florida who asks questions to me like "Did baseball sack Marge Schott to appease the Jews?" doing a regular call-in show, what do you expect?

When will these guys learn that you have to advance local issues and take stands on them? I don't care what the stand is now- they can push for the legalization of murder for all I care- but I can honestly say that there isn't another market in the country that would put up with this crap!!!!!!!

I have never listened to the JC area sports talk shows.....Are any available online? If so can someone post the link(s) and times?

Just go to the WXSM website.

You can also listen to Scott Gray at WKPT-AM Monday 6-8.

Then come back to me.

I'll tell you why Pitt. And you really know why because you have worked in local radio in this market. Its because NO ONE IS WILLING TO TAKE ANY RISK around here. Whats the point of putting an up and coming talk show host on, that might say a few things that riles up local fans, when you can have the 50 year old white guy who agrees with every caller. Nobody wants to take a chance. It's called resting on your laurels, and its BORING radio.

Quote:In the Tri-Cities, the station LED OFF with Knoxville instead of what was going on here.

You know why that goes on too. Bill Meade and the rest of those bozos wish they were in Knoxville. To Helmans credit, I don't think he wants to be in K-town, but when every other host wants to kiss the Vols feet, what is he supposed to do?

Hogan and Swann are both nice guys. Carl has got a TON of creative talent. My guess is using two older guys is an attempt to make the 25-54's feel comfortable listening to the older, wiser men. Keep in mind that most of the tri-cities is still too closed minded to listen to anyone under the age of 40 because they are too young.
As for the sports shows, it's no better down here. Tom Abraham is Nashville's Bill Meade, or vice versa, the difference is Tom has two producers that do line up some interesting interviews for his shows. His producer, who goes by Schaef, is awful. The Citadel guys at 104.5 make you want to try to slit your wrists with a spoon. Some of those guys will take a stand atleast, but they take their stands based on opinion with no real facts to back them up, and when someone more educated than them calls in, they get stumped on the air, cut them off and go to break. The radio stations both up there and don't here want the ad revenue, but they don't want to do the things to get it. Atleast dinnertime Don does make an effort.

Dave Hogan and Carl Swann might be attracting 54 year olds but they aren't attracting 25s.

Now, that's not a total sin in my book. I do understand the concept of the show. It's just that there are lots of people in this market doing it. And if you say Swann has creative talent, fantastic!

But then why isn't it used more?

My guess is the executives. I remember when the Monster came on there was Bob Gordon- whose exact title I don't recall but he is essentially the talk show hosts' boss- saying "We're just guys talking about sports . . . "

Boring!

Right on target Pitt!

Thank goodness for XM Radio.

I have come to a point that I rarely listen to broadcast radio anymore. Tuned in for a brief moment to see what might be on the Munster this morning, Herman and Eddie were interviewing Mike Keith, WHO CARES. Hit the old button to return to XM quickly.

Same old, same old. It won't change in my lifetime.

Actually if you ask the right questions, Mike Keith is a pretty interesting guy to talk to. I'm sure they didn't hit the Pacman questions the right way though, which is a tough subject, but Keith can handle it.
Bob Gordon is one of the top bosses, it's also a shame he isn't on there more, I think him, Don and Bud would work REALLY WELL together as a team.
And yes Pitt, not that many 25's are listening to talk radio. It's like I was always told, one day you get in the radio, and don't change the station when Paul Harvey comes on. All of a sudden, The Rest of the Story is interesting. that's the crowd that WJCW wants, primarily because they are the ones with discretionary income. It's why the rap station is number one in Nashville but WSIX blows them away in revenue.

Buccaneerlover Wrote:And yes Pitt, not that many 25's are listening to talk radio.

Wait a minute. First you were championing Swann and Hogan's appeal to a 25-54 demo. Now you're saying the younger part doesn't exist?

While I realize not too many 18 year olds are listening to Paul Harvey, I would point out Howard Stern is kicking some serious tail on Sirius.

And while I realize by now Stern is such a name he transends generations, I would think his demographics tend to lean younger.

And Stern isn't the only one. Sports talk tends to slant younger these days.

When I've heard Gordon, he generally doesn't have much to say. It's stuff like "I grew up watching the Bucs at their old stadium and was the biggest Vols fan!"

You and 50,000 other people around here. Maybe it's said to gain some acceptance with the audience, I don't discount that, but it's hardly cutting edge.

Every time I've heard him he seems to be very smooth in saying nothing. "We're just a bunch of guys back here talking sports . . ."

You're supposed to be giving news, breaking stories, and giving commentary while using all the entertainment vehicles radio has to offer (music, humor, etc.)

It's not supposed to be a 1920s general store by the pickle barrell!

Problem is- and this is a big problem in radio- there's not much competition around here. WXSM is really the only sports station in town (don't give me Sports Fox or whatever). So they really don't have to do that much.

Still, you get the feeling, IF SOMEONE WOULD JUST BREAK OUT OF THE MOLD . . . .

Buccaneerlover Wrote:Actually if you ask the right questions, Mike Keith is a pretty interesting guy to talk to.

So when can we expect to hear the radio person for Charlotte? After all it is nearly 100 miles closer to TRI than the Nashville Oilers.
How about the Falcons coach? He has ties to TRI and Atlanta is only 12 miles further from TRI than Nashville. Both Atlanta and Charlotte are at least in the same time zone!!

Keith has nothing of interest, he is in another time zone.

Pitt's right, this is a terrible sports area.

Remember the station carries the Titans' games.

But I agree with you- I wouldn't mind hearing a guy who covers/broadcasts other teams' games.

And I'm not sure Smith hasn't been on Helman's show. I could be wrong about that (forgive me Don, usually I'm listening to Imus. I'm a HUGE fan. But I love your Saturday show!) but he might have been.

I know Gerald Sensabaugh was on the show and called Peyton Manning "the greatest QB of all time."

And I wish they would have picked up on that a bit more.

Ask for it. Let them know you want to hear interviews from Panther personnel, or Falcons personnel. They aren't mind readers, they're broadcasters. I'm not defending everything they do, WXSM is the Titans affiliate, that was part of the caravan. I think more interviews would be better for the shows, they just don't do it.
And Pitt, I use the 25-54 as a general demo, it leans more towards the back end of that and you know it. You worked in the biz, you know that middle aged to older married women are where the money is.

BucDoctor Wrote:

Buccaneerlover Wrote:Actually if you ask the right questions, Mike Keith is a pretty interesting guy to talk to.

So when can we expect to hear the radio person for Charlotte? After all it is nearly 100 miles closer to TRI than the Nashville Oilers.
How about the Falcons coach? He has ties to TRI and Atlanta is only 12 miles further from TRI than Nashville. Both Atlanta and Charlotte are at least in the same time zone!!

Keith has nothing of interest, he is in another time zone.

Pitt's right, this is a terrible sports area.

Who told you middle aged women are where the money is?

I'm curious.

The Radio Advertising Bureau when I went through their classes. Women control the checkbook, because they control something else. It's a fact of life. Most women buy the groceries, shop for the kids, make decisions on housing decorations, buy the presents for weddings, showers. Guys don't want to fool with shopping, we want to talk about hot women and ETSU sports on this messageboard!

I don't think the Radio Advertising Board really paid much attention to the sports format.

Tell you the truth, since men, on average (not as a whole) tend to be more conservative politically than women, and radio is dominated by right wing talk, I don't think that's true.

And it certainly isn't with sports talk. In Pittsburgh, I have heard lots of ads on sports stations, very profitable ads, for products like-

A- Strip joints
B- A deli
C- Tout services
D- Beer

The top billing station in the country was WFAN. It may not be now as Imus is no longer on the airwaves there, but men are a good demographic.

Perhaps that's why the talk shows around here are often boring. They are trying to use female marketing strategies in sponsorships and content when they should be using male ones.

You wouldn't try to sell WQUT the way you sell WTFM. Why would you try to sell as sports station like WTFM?

You wouldn't, but you're also comparing AM versus FM stations, and there is a HUGE difference in how you sell the two. Also, comparing WFAN to stations in this market is ridiculous, but it's kinda funny you did that because the guys at WGFX were doing that crap today during the afternoon drive show here. They were ripping on the Atlanta guys for the way they do their shows, primarily "Two Live Stews," who outside of the barking are pretty funny. They also likened themselves to actually being more informed then people like John Clayton at ESPN. So basically, it's not just the Tri-Cities market in Tennessee, this whole state has issues with sports radio.

I'll buy the last, but I also don't buy that the Radio Advertising Bureau is the end-all be-all of how to make profits with a media outlet.

I actually think you CAN compare stations to this market to WFAN. Now, obviously there will be differences but why not use that as a model for quality and sponsorships?

Besides, I don't think I've ever heard an ad for Scores or anything like that on WFAN. So if you wanted to have that moral high road you could and still be profitable.

One of the reasons this board has been so successful is that we do talk local. As someone once said on here "Everything I need to know about Johnson City I get from here."

Really, that should be your local talk radio show. But instead we're getting the NBA playoffs and "National Tire Safety Week" stuffed down our throat.

You also can't compare northern sports talk from southern. It actually was the only decent point George and the idiots at The Zone made yesterday in their conversation about sports radio. It seems the culture of the WFAN's of the world is more along the lines of Stephen A. Smith and Jim Rome types, or the PTI crowd, whereas personalities like Tirico, Dan Patrick, Cowherd, John Kincaid in Atlanta, etc... are doing their thing.
Ironically enough, they were bashing "Two Live Stews" down here yesterday, yet they are now a national show on Sirius/XM, and Sporting News Radio. As for Don, Bill and Co., like I've said before, Bill always claims it's caller driven, so call in. The times that Bob Gordon has filled in for them in the mornings he has done a really good job, and that short stint that Tom Taylor was on he did a great job. Again though, it's small market vs. big market, people in the tri-cities don't want to hear the screaming and yelling. I do think however they could focus more on things in the Tri-Cities, and not be homers who talk about the Jamocha Shake Classic, how great George Pitts is or what Jonathan Crompton is doing today.

What did you think Gordon and/or Taylor did that was remotely interesting? I remember Gordon with his infamous "we're just guys talking about sports" and Taylor seemed to give the time and temperature an awful lot without doing much but taking traditional stands on issues ("Boy, I think it's amazing what Fred Warren does with the golf program at ETSU") and interviewing flacks.

WFAN most certainly is not a haven for Steven A. Smith types. Smith was actually on their competitor, ESPN 1050.

Nor do I think that a region prefers one kind of sports talk show over another. Personally I think an "attack" talk show, a la Mark Madden or Pete Franklin, would work here IF there were the programmers who had enough guts to stick with it.

I meet enough people who just come up to me when I'm wearing my Cleveland Indians jacket that say "Are you an Indians fan? Boy, I used to listen to Pete Franklin all the time!" around here that I'm convinced it would work. It would stick out. And it would shake people up.

Or just back in Pittsburgh. Myron Cope used to do a talk show that was charming. Madden does one that is not. It's about talent.

Now, a few things here-

A- I've heard enough sports radio programmers say they like The Stews because they are black and sports talk radio had been a middle-aged, white male domain.

Now, a "hip-hop talk show" is not going to be my personal cup of tea. However, that doesn't mean it isn't good.

What I fear is that too many people think of The Stews as "a black person's sports talk show." Why does a black person's sports talk show have to be filled with rap references? Why wouldn't a thought-provoking show be "a black man's sports talk show?"

Were/are not Art Rust Jr., Bill Daugherty, or Freddie Coleman black sports talk show hosts?

But the bottom line is Nashville is going to make fun of a hip-hop talk show. A hip-hop talk show is going to make fun of a Nashville talk show.

Personally, I remember Bill King and Bob Bell on WLAC. They were straight laced, professional, informative, and tremendously boring.

B- Caller driven radio is a misnomer. A host dictates what kind of calls he gets. Hence, Bill gets lots of Vols fans who complain about national conspiracies and the like.

Madden gets lowest common denominator calls because he caters to them. It's not so much because he's an "attack" host but rather because he'll do things like have on a guest insisting Roberto Clemente is alive and living a secret life as a Carrabean Drug Lord. Therefore, he'll get the guy calling insisting the Penguins are going to tank Game Four so they could come home and get another sell-out.

Bell and King used to get lots of callers asking what player was going to go to what college because they were big on recruiting.

Myron used to get characters because he was a character.