New St. Pete Bowl would bolster Big East's lineup
by by Tom Luicci/Star-Ledger staff
Monday March 31, 2008, 5:45 PM

The Big East should know by the end of April whether it has another football bowl game to add to its lineup, with the St. Petersburg Bowl -- to be run by ESPN and the league -- having submitted a proposal to the NCAA bowl certifying committee to start this season.
If approved, the game will be played Dec. 21 at Tropicana Field and will have a Big East team playing one from Conference-USA.
It immediately raises two questions:
1 -- What happens to the new bowl game if the eight-team Big East can't fill what would then be seven bowl slots?

2 -- How does the league's role as a bowl partner in the game affect the Big East's stated desire to upgrade its bowl affiliation when the current contracts run out in two years?
League officials won't discuss the St. Petersburg Bowl yet because he hasn't been approved. But the league desperately wants this new bowl to succeed. With ESPN having a vested interest in the game -- it would be the sixth one run by the network and would be shown on either ESPN or ESPN2 -- it has a real chance to make it. The Big East wants a full-fledged bowl tie-in with a game in Florida. The St. Petersburg Bowl gives the league just that.
So let's address the two pressing issues.
The Big East will have tie-ins this year with the BCS, Gator or Sun, Meineke, Texas, International, Papajohns.com and, possibly St. Petersburg Bowl.
If the league can't qualify seven bowl teams, the new game won't take the hit. The Big East will have a financial stake in the St. Petersburg bowl as a partner. So either the Texas, Papajohns.com or International Bowl will be the game that the league opens up to other conferences. With ESPN also running the Papajohns.com and International bowls, it makes it a little easier to work a deal with other leagues for those games if the Big East qualifies only six teams.
The future?
The Big East's current bowl deals are up in two years.
If the league has its way when negotiations start on new deals, it would like to continue with tie-ins to the BCS, Gator and Meinke, then add the St. Petersburg bowl and two others. The Sun Bowl, played in El Paso, has geographical issues, so it could get dropped from the lineup.
The Big East also wants to strengthen its affialiation with the Gator Bowl to position that game as No. 2 in its lineup. The partnership with the Big 12 (the Big East and Big 12 alternate sending teams there) hasn't been the success Gator Bowl folks had hoped. Last year, Texas Tech brought just 5,000 people to the game.
So the league wants to lock that game up for itself, although Notre Dame would still be part of the deal. Instead of the Irish having a shot two out of every four years to play in the Gator Bowl in place of a Big East team, however, the league would like to modify that to once every four years.
Ultimately, the Big East wants to keep six bowl tie-ins, and the St. Petersburg Bowl would be one of the staples in the lineup. There's even speculation that the game will be moved in 2012 if the Tampa Devil Rays get a new outdoor stadium.
Are there too many bowls? No question. If the bowl certifying committee approves the new Congressional Bowl in Washington as well (that will be an ACC-military academy matchup), it will mean 34 bowl games next year. So more than half the country will have a postseason game to play in.
But the Big East needs a stronger bowl presence in Florida. Securing the Gator Bowl would be a boost. Having another in the St. Pete-Tampa area would be a strong addition. The Big East-ESPN partnership in the St. Petersburg Bowl would give the new game a real chance to succeed.

I'd be perfectly fine with the St. Pete bowl replacing the Papa John's Bowl in Birmingham. I'd rather keep the Sun Bowl, it has a great deal of tradition.

I see the BE keeping the same plus the st pete and trying to get the gator back to the pre raid status. That would give 7 bowls most years for 8+1.

BCS
Gator
muffler
st pete
texas
toronto
papa

BCS
Gator / Sun
Liberty
Meinkee
St. Petersburg
International
Texas (Every Year)
Birmingham

Bowl picture would be ok for now for 8 + 1 + 1.

Bring Memphis into the conference with the Liberty
Bowl and keep the rest if the BE is going to allow
ND to horn in on bowl packages.

wvucrazed Wrote:I'd be perfectly fine with the St. Pete bowl replacing the Papa John's Bowl in Birmingham. I'd rather keep the Sun Bowl, it has a great deal of tradition.

I agree, I'd rather have the Sun Bowl as the #2 Bowl. I don't understand why Tranghese and the Big East officials are kissing the Gator Bowl's ass so much. It's obvious that the Gator Bowl has a big head, why try and keep up an assocation with them? I think Cincinnati and Connecticut traveling so well last year helped the league a ton. We already knew that Louisville, West Virginia and Rutgers would travel but now we know that Connecticut and Cincinnati can send tons of fans. And UConn being picked over UC for the Tire Bowl actually helped out everyone involved. As co-Big East champ UConn got to play a BCS opponent, and Cincinnati got to show that they could send over 10,000 fans without the excuse that the other team brought the fans, or that Cincinnati fans only traveled because a "big name" team was on the marquee.

panite Wrote:BCS
Gator / Sun
Liberty
Meinkee
St. Petersburg
International
Texas (Every Year)
Birmingham

Bowl picture would be ok for now for 8 + 1 + 1.

Bring Memphis into the conference with the Liberty
Bowl and keep the rest if the BE is going to allow
ND to horn in on bowl packages.

That's my preferred bowl lineup as well (at least at the top). The added advantage of adding Memphis/Liberty Bowl is that we wouldn't need Notre Dame to hold on to bowls, and Notre Dame's desires would have little to no impact on the Liberty Bowl. So my preferred bowl alignment:

BCS
Sun/Gator
Liberty
Tire
St. Petersburg
Birmingham

Though it would be nice to have the Texas Bowl or Motor City Bowl down there or to make the St Pete bowl a matchup against a BCS opponent. But that bowl lineup would have helped the Big East a ton this year. The Big East wouldn't have had infighting for bowl arrangements and the Big East would have had bowl credibility (at Top 25 UC team playing a BCS opponent instead of a near .500 non-BCS opponent). So, with that bowl lineup, UConn, WVU and USF would have played in the bowls they played in and a Top 25 Cincinnati, instead of playing USM would have played a BCS opponent, particularly a SEC opponent. So all four of the Big East's Top 25 teams would have played BCS opponents in bowl games and that would have added a ton of cred to the league.

I would prefer for the Big East to play in the Gator Bowl every year - if we even keep that game - but think having the Sun Bowl as an option is a good thing too. Letting the Meineke Car Care Bowl and Sun Bowl rotate the third spot would be better for the Big East. This guarantees the league a New Year's Day game in the form of the Gator Bowl. Both the Meineke Car Care Bowl and Sun Bowl have similar dates the last week of December.

Inviting the Big East every year might not make much overall sense for the Texas Bowl. They might prefer making it into a Big 12 vs. CUSA game every year. If they wanted the Big East every year then they would not be making us share a spot with other leagues in the first place. We are a BCS league and we need to be signing bowl deals worthy of that status. All of the sharing going on with some of these bowl games is totally ridiculous.

CatsClaw Wrote:

wvucrazed Wrote:I'd be perfectly fine with the St. Pete bowl replacing the Papa John's Bowl in Birmingham. I'd rather keep the Sun Bowl, it has a great deal of tradition.

I agree, I'd rather have the Sun Bowl as the #2 Bowl. I don't understand why Tranghese and the Big East officials are kissing the Gator Bowl's ass so much. It's obvious that the Gator Bowl has a big head, why try and keep up an assocation with them? I think Cincinnati and Connecticut traveling so well last year helped the league a ton. We already knew that Louisville, West Virginia and Rutgers would travel but now we know that Connecticut and Cincinnati can send tons of fans. And UConn being picked over UC for the Tire Bowl actually helped out everyone involved. As co-Big East champ UConn got to play a BCS opponent, and Cincinnati got to show that they could send over 10,000 fans without the excuse that the other team brought the fans, or that Cincinnati fans only traveled because a "big name" team was on the marquee.

Seriously, the Gator Bowl always has been a bigger bowl than the Sun Bowl and anyone who had ever been to both games would laugh right in your face at your comments.

Herd Swimming Wrote:

CatsClaw Wrote:

wvucrazed Wrote:I'd be perfectly fine with the St. Pete bowl replacing the Papa John's Bowl in Birmingham. I'd rather keep the Sun Bowl, it has a great deal of tradition.

I agree, I'd rather have the Sun Bowl as the #2 Bowl. I don't understand why Tranghese and the Big East officials are kissing the Gator Bowl's ass so much. It's obvious that the Gator Bowl has a big head, why try and keep up an assocation with them? I think Cincinnati and Connecticut traveling so well last year helped the league a ton. We already knew that Louisville, West Virginia and Rutgers would travel but now we know that Connecticut and Cincinnati can send tons of fans. And UConn being picked over UC for the Tire Bowl actually helped out everyone involved. As co-Big East champ UConn got to play a BCS opponent, and Cincinnati got to show that they could send over 10,000 fans without the excuse that the other team brought the fans, or that Cincinnati fans only traveled because a "big name" team was on the marquee.

Seriously, the Gator Bowl always has been a bigger bowl than the Sun Bowl and anyone who had ever been to both games would laugh right in your face at your comments.

Uh noo... The Sun Bowl is an amazing game with tradition that trumps the Gator Bowl. Throw in the fact that it is the ONLY bowl game on CBS... thats right CBS not ESPN, the amazing support from the locals and you got yourself a fantastic bowl game. Its obvious you have never been to the Sun Bowl. I saw Texas v.s UNC and TCU beat USC and it was an amazing experience.

:iagree:

Herd Swimming Wrote:

CatsClaw Wrote:

wvucrazed Wrote:I'd be perfectly fine with the St. Pete bowl replacing the Papa John's Bowl in Birmingham. I'd rather keep the Sun Bowl, it has a great deal of tradition.

I agree, I'd rather have the Sun Bowl as the #2 Bowl. I don't understand why Tranghese and the Big East officials are kissing the Gator Bowl's ass so much. It's obvious that the Gator Bowl has a big head, why try and keep up an assocation with them? I think Cincinnati and Connecticut traveling so well last year helped the league a ton. We already knew that Louisville, West Virginia and Rutgers would travel but now we know that Connecticut and Cincinnati can send tons of fans. And UConn being picked over UC for the Tire Bowl actually helped out everyone involved. As co-Big East champ UConn got to play a BCS opponent, and Cincinnati got to show that they could send over 10,000 fans without the excuse that the other team brought the fans, or that Cincinnati fans only traveled because a "big name" team was on the marquee.

Seriously, the Gator Bowl always has been a bigger bowl than the Sun Bowl and anyone who had ever been to both games would laugh right in your face at your comments.

:iagree:

FYI, this year both the Gator and Sun Bowls were on CBS.

chavster Wrote:Uh noo... The Sun Bowl is an amazing game with tradition that trumps the Gator Bowl. Throw in the fact that it is the ONLY bowl game on CBS... thats right CBS not ESPN, the amazing support from the locals and you got yourself a fantastic bowl game. Its obvious you have never been to the Sun Bowl. I saw Texas v.s UNC and TCU beat USC and it was an amazing experience.

While El Paso does an incredible job in supporting the Sun Bowl Game...normally, "network tv" (CBS, ABC, NBC and FOX) generates higher TV ratings than cable...this past year, ESPN (Cable) had 10 bowl games with HIGHER TV ratings vs CBS' Sun Bowl....and ESPN had 8 bowl games with HIGHER TV ratings vs CBS' Gator Bowl.

History is great for locals/fans to enjoy...but that means little in regards to TV ratings today.

I went to the Sun Bowl and the support from the city was awesome. They do a great job for that Bowl and the scenery is fantastic. With that said while it was a nice road trip, it was far and expensive to get there. So the gator Bowl makes much better sense for our schools. Justa as the Big12 in the Sun Bowl makes better sense for them.
I think the Gator has learned its mistake and the BE will become ab ACC-BE Bowl game. I do agree that MT or whoever is in charge has to insist that ND can only replace the BE team ONCE in a 4 year period.

I have said it all along add Memphis and bring the Liberty Bowl. Keep ND,Gtown and Villanova and thats 12 teams for basketbal that would be the BEST league around and keeps the Big East name.

So we would have
BCS
Gator
Meineke
Liberty
Houston
St Pete
Bhman
Toronto
Thats a good Bowl line-up with the first 4 vs BCS squads and the 5th vs Big12 possible.

Easy, split add Memphis for Liberty Bowl and Basketball.

1. BCS
2. Gator Bowl-(ACC)
3. Liberty Bowl-(SEC)
4. Meineke Car Care Bowl-(ACC)
5. Saint Petersburg Bowl-(after a few years get a SEC or ACC Team)
6. Papa John's.com Bowl-(C-USA)

BIG EAST Football after split
West Virginia
Syracuse
Pittsburgh
UConn
Rutgers
Louisville
Cincinnati
South Florida
Memphis

If you go 10 then bring in Central Florida.

KnightLight Wrote:

chavster Wrote:Uh noo... The Sun Bowl is an amazing game with tradition that trumps the Gator Bowl. Throw in the fact that it is the ONLY bowl game on CBS... thats right CBS not ESPN, the amazing support from the locals and you got yourself a fantastic bowl game. Its obvious you have never been to the Sun Bowl. I saw Texas v.s UNC and TCU beat USC and it was an amazing experience.

While El Paso does an incredible job in supporting the Sun Bowl Game...normally, "network tv" (CBS, ABC, NBC and FOX) generates higher TV ratings than cable...this past year, ESPN (Cable) had 10 bowl games with HIGHER TV ratings vs CBS' Sun Bowl....and ESPN had 8 bowl games with HIGHER TV ratings vs CBS' Gator Bowl.

History is great for locals/fans to enjoy...but that means little in regards to TV ratings today.

Yes, but that is deceiving. Because the Cable total audience is different than the Broadcast Network total audience. A 2.3 on Network TV is equivalent to a 3.37 on cable when you are talking total audience. Case in point, the Outback Bowl had a 3.37 rating with 3.2 million viewers on ESPN. The Sun Bowl had a 2.3 rating with 3.2 million viewers. The things you can learn while in an airport bar waiting for a flight.

GoMinersGo Wrote:Yes, but that is deceiving. Because the Cable total audience is different than the Broadcast Network total audience. A 2.3 on Network TV is equivalent to a 3.37 on cable when you are talking total audience. Case in point, the Outback Bowl had a 3.37 rating with 3.2 million viewers on ESPN. The Sun Bowl had a 2.3 rating with 3.2 million viewers. The things you can learn while in an airport bar waiting for a flight.

Good info didn't know that--but it makes sense.

I don't have a problem with the Big East having a backup agreement with the Sun Bowl but the Bg East needs to get back the Gator Bowl Full Time. Like others said link the Sun Bowl with another bowl game but the only one I see that makes sense geographically is with the Texas Bowl.

Cubanbull Wrote:I went to the Sun Bowl and the support from the city was awesome. They do a great job for that Bowl and the scenery is fantastic. With that said while it was a nice road trip, it was far and expensive to get there. So the gator Bowl makes much better sense for our schools. Justa as the Big12 in the Sun Bowl makes better sense for them.
I think the Gator has learned its mistake and the BE will become ab ACC-BE Bowl game. I do agree that MT or whoever is in charge has to insist that ND can only replace the BE team ONCE in a 4 year period.

I have said it all along add Memphis and bring the Liberty Bowl. Keep ND,Gtown and Villanova and thats 12 teams for basketbal that would be the BEST league around and keeps the Big East name.

So we would have
BCS
Gator
Meineke
Liberty
Houston
St Pete
Bhman
Toronto
Thats a good Bowl line-up with the first 4 vs BCS squads and the 5th vs Big12 possible.

I think keeping the Big East name would be more difficult than you think. If the football schools (and a few basketball schools) leave and form there a new conference that's one thing. Can the league just kick out 5 members because it wants to change though? I'd imagine the other 5 schools might have a case under those circumstances.

Thinking a little more about it though, I suppose if the 11 teams (to be joined by Memphis) are going to split off anyhow, the other 5 would probably be better off agreeing to take some comprensation rather than being left with a name that would quickly lose its meaning.

What I don't understand is why the bowls haven't coordinated to avoid this sort of thing and simply done away with conference tie-ins. I would think that some sort of committee (not unlike the NCAA committee) that doled out the bowl bids in a way that made geographic, competitive and financial sense would be the most logical way of doing things. It would do away with things like ensuring that a team gets sent to the same destination too often (anybody remember the famous "you can't spell Citrus without UT" quote from Spurrier?), like sending geographically misfit teams to places like USF to El Paso or Texas Tech to Jacksonville and probably could be used to help avoid bad date conflicts (like Memphis fans having to choose between a big basketball game and their bowl). I guess you could argue that it would somehow be an antitrust violation, but I've got to figure that it would make for better bowls, better attendance and build the business even further.

USFFan

usffan Wrote:anybody remember the famous "you can't spell Citrus without UT" quote from Spurrier?

A great quote. Still pisses off my friend when I say it since he's a TN fan (******* calls me on gamedays to sing Rocky Top). And I've modified it to be "You can't spell Outback without UT".

It would be nice to face'em like this...

BCS vs. the other NC contender
Gator vs. ACC
Liberty vs. SEC
St. Pete vs. Big 10
Meineke vs. ACC
GMAC vs. C-USA
Sun vs. Pac 10

That sets us up against 5 BCS conferences minus the B12. There is not room for 7 bowl games in the BEast right now though. Maybe add a 9th member and it would be practical.