buckaineer Wrote:

Tigeer Wrote:

buckaineer Wrote:

Tigeer Wrote:

wvucrazed Wrote:I can't imagine a scenario in which a team from another BCS conference would join the Big East.

The only one that might be within the realm of possibility is BC in 10 years if they get tired of being treated like an afterthought in the ACC, and get tired of having no regional rivals. And of course, if the Big East maintains its status and/or continues to improve.

But realistically I don't think it's feasible. The next BE member will come from either 1-AA or a non-BCS league.

Agreed and it has more to do with money than anything else; this is why BC will not leave.

BTW - buckaineer - Didn't Michigan drop out of the poll after two losses?

BE doesn't need to worry about polls but bowls; winning them that is with fannies in the seats.

In my opinion, not shared by all, the BE does need to expand by at least one, I prefer three, of course; for obvious reasons. With three, split from the BB only schools. I just don't know if the current dollars and cents make it enticing; counter is one does have to have vision.

Michigan actually dropped out after one loss--to 1-AA Appalachian State which since lost to Wofford. I don't think you can compare that to Rutgers losing to top 15 Cincinnati and a Maryland team that won 9 games last year and beat a big Ten team in a bowl game. cincy appears to have hit a brick wall and UConn isn't considered--they'll have to have 8 or 9 wins to be considered for bottom of the top 25. also people are not wanting USF to play for a championship even though the computers have them at 2 and they have at least the second or third most impressive record out of the top 5, having beat two top ten teams-one on the road and one at home.

Having more poll votes wouldn't hurt the BE which still must maintain that BCS standing--last years great season doesn't change that entirely.

I don't think BCS status for the BE is even a question any longer. Maybe by media hacks, but no one that matters. The media hacks have their own agenda - push ratings and affiliations.

USF and WVU just need to keep winning and both will be in a BCS Bowl - period. Can't control the National Championship matchup - its mythical anyhoo.

I don't know that two years BCS wins would eliminate the BCS status issues especially if the league loses a few more big games. Even with Miami in the league those issues never went away.

As far as two BE teams in the BCS I think you are dreaming. There is no way the hacks and pundits are going to stand up for two BE teams getting in. Just as it is difficult for a no loss BE team to get to the MNC even over one or even two loss teams from other conferences, it will be even tougher to get two teams in the BCS. It never happened before even when VT and Miami were in the league and it is very doubtful now.

When VT and Miami were in the league, there were only 8 slots...now there are 10...

West Virginia has a great shot to get in the BCS IMO if they win out...(along with USF)

Bearcats#1 Wrote:why are we talking about the BE's BCS worthiness...AGAIN!?!?!?

We have three teams in the Top15...more than most other BCS conferences and currently the BE is #2 in the BCS ratings index...what the heck else more do we need to do?

This is dumb to even talk about...it's based on some people's perception, not stats and reality.

nuff said.

IMO, its a dead issue...no one is really talking about Big East's worthiness...

There was some doubt about the Big East post-expansion, but the Big East has answered the call

brista21 Wrote:Right now we have the least money do you really think in the next round of negotiations with budding fanbases and skyrocketing ratings (provided this continues) we're going to be the poorest? I don't think we will be. Additionally adding Penn State is an automatic boost in the money we receive, same goes with BC, UMD, or UCF. (Albeit Penn State is a big jump, BC and UMD are notable, and UCF isn't all that much.) I firmly believe we can and someday will see a 12 team conference consisting of the current BE 8 and PSU, BC, UMD, and UCF. That will prove to be the best conference in America all-around year in and year out.

Not gonna happen

Krocker Krapp Wrote:We do not need to entice anyone to join. The Big East has proven our mettle over the last two years and will continue to do so from here on out. I am of the crowd that thinks we might be able to get BC to rejoin by about 2014 or so, after the current administration is gone and the bitterness from what has transpired subsides enough, but I would not unnecessarily waste any time or effort bothering anyone else before then.

hmmm...BC is #4 right now...Matt Ryan is on the heisman radar....they're in a conference that is making good $$ and has great academics, why would they want to leave that?

Miami had everything BC now has, and more, when they were in the Big East but they still left. A big part of that, besides the bigger boatloads of booty that John Swofford falsely promised them, is the fact that they stuck out like a sore thumb in the Big East and their main rival, Florida State, was in the ACC.

BC, which will not finish the season ranked #4, is going to eventually come to the realization that they are not wanted and not appreciated in the ACC. They stick out like a sore thumb and their history and traditions lie with the Big East schools. Our league, ranked #2 by the BCS, long ago surpassed the ACC.

About five to seven more years of receiving constant redheaded stepchild treatment by the ACC, and the passing of their current administration, will be more than enough to make BC realize the error of their ways. The Big East football schools will have buried the ACC by then. BC will beg us to come back home.

Maryland and Notre Dame, however, will never have anything to do with Big East football. Maryland's history and traditions all lie with the ACC schools. Notre Dame's history and traditions are deeply steeped in their cherished independence. There will never be a 12 team Big East with either of those schools in it.

Of course there should never be a 12-team Big East anyway. Leave that to the SEC and Big 12. The ACC sucks at being a 12-team league and their precious title game is nothing but ridiculous rubbish. We, along with the Pac-10, need to be the upholders of normalcy and do our thing with 9 schools or 10 schools.

MichaelSavage Wrote:

brista21 Wrote:Right now we have the least money do you really think in the next round of negotiations with budding fanbases and skyrocketing ratings (provided this continues) we're going to be the poorest? I don't think we will be. Additionally adding Penn State is an automatic boost in the money we receive, same goes with BC, UMD, or UCF. (Albeit Penn State is a big jump, BC and UMD are notable, and UCF isn't all that much.) I firmly believe we can and someday will see a 12 team conference consisting of the current BE 8 and PSU, BC, UMD, and UCF. That will prove to be the best conference in America all-around year in and year out.

That conference still wouldn't be as good as the SEC.

Really we're already holding our own with them at 8. I think PSU would restrengthen itself back east, Maryland would benefit from better opponents, markets, exposure, rivalries, etc. BC is already a good add. UCF see USF and Cincy. We'd end up as good as the SEC without a doubt in my mind. The only states of overlap would be Kentucky and Florida.

Krocker Krapp Wrote:Miami had everything BC now has, and more, when they were in the Big East but they still left. A big part of that, besides the bigger boatloads of booty that John Swofford falsely promised them, is the fact that they stuck out like a sore thumb in the Big East and their main rival, Florida State, was in the ACC.

BC, which will not finish the season ranked #4, is going to eventually come to the realization that they are not wanted and not appreciated in the ACC. They stick out like a sore thumb and their history and traditions lie with the Big East schools. Our league, ranked #2 by the BCS, long ago surpassed the ACC.

About five to seven more years of receiving constant redheaded stepchild treatment by the ACC, and the passing of their current administration, will be more than enough to make BC realize the error of their ways. The Big East football schools will have buried the ACC by then. BC will beg us to come back home.

Maryland and Notre Dame, however, will never have anything to do with Big East football. Maryland's history and traditions all lie with the ACC schools. Notre Dame's history and traditions are deeply steeped in their cherished independence. There will never be a 12 team Big East with either of those schools in it.

Of course there should never be a 12-team Big East anyway. Leave that to the SEC and Big 12. The ACC sucks at being a 12-team league and their precious title game is nothing but ridiculous rubbish. We, along with the Pac-10, need to be the upholders of normalcy and do our thing with 9 schools or 10 schools.

I'm good with 12 if its the right 12. But if we went to 10 with BC and UCF then I think we're all set anyway. But let it be known that Penn State has a seat at the table if they decide to come home. In which case we will end up cherry picking Maryland.

I have no problem with leaving an 11th spot open for Penn State but I still do not know if that would be enough to get Maryland to leave the ACC. So if Temple replaced BC in the ACC, as one of my schemes would have happen, that means we could be stuck looking at a school like Buffalo, East Carolina, or Massachusetts to throw into the 12th spot. But then again, who knows, those options might turn out to be stunningly attractive by my target date of 2014.

Penn State is getting mega bucks in the Big Ten. They apparently like the academics. They are never leaving, they will be content to dwindle into permanent mediocrity while making a huge paycheck.

ND is close to joining the Big Ten, doesn't regard the Big East football conference at all and shouldn't be a part of this conference at all right now.

BC--if the BE were to act before the ACC creates it's own sports network, it might be financially possible to match the ACC situation for them (because they would add to the BE tv package financially) Academically something would have to happen.


The BE would need to create some sort of academic consortium in order to compete with some of these other conferences. This would likely boost the academics of some schools.--Either way all should try to upgrade their academic "prestige" to meet what the Big Ten and ACC are putting forth. I would think that with Rutgers, Syracuse, Pittsburgh, Georgetown, ND (if still there), and some of the other bb schools that the BE academically could improve itself with a conference wide sharing as other conferences have.

As for UCF, they are spending money and building facilities and are in Florida but they really aren't very good right now on the field and can't consistently beat good BCS teams. Don't know if that would change or not in a BCS conference.

Krocker Krapp Wrote:Miami had everything BC now has, and more, when they were in the Big East but they still left. A big part of that, besides the bigger boatloads of booty that John Swofford falsely promised them, is the fact that they stuck out like a sore thumb in the Big East and their main rival, Florida State, was in the ACC.

BC, which will not finish the season ranked #4, is going to eventually come to the realization that they are not wanted and not appreciated in the ACC. They stick out like a sore thumb and their history and traditions lie with the Big East schools. Our league, ranked #2 by the BCS, long ago surpassed the ACC.

About five to seven more years of receiving constant redheaded stepchild treatment by the ACC, and the passing of their current administration, will be more than enough to make BC realize the error of their ways. The Big East football schools will have buried the ACC by then. BC will beg us to come back home.

Maryland and Notre Dame, however, will never have anything to do with Big East football. Maryland's history and traditions all lie with the ACC schools. Notre Dame's history and traditions are deeply steeped in their cherished independence. There will never be a 12 team Big East with either of those schools in it.

Of course there should never be a 12-team Big East anyway. Leave that to the SEC and Big 12. The ACC sucks at being a 12-team league and their precious title game is nothing but ridiculous rubbish. We, along with the Pac-10, need to be the upholders of normalcy and do our thing with 9 schools or 10 schools.

Sorry, but this argument just starts to lose a sense of logic and starts to dwell in the realm of bias

buckaineer Wrote:As for UCF, they are spending money and building facilities and are in Florida but they really aren't very good right now on the field and can't consistently beat good BCS teams. Don't know if that would change or not in a BCS conference.

USF wasn't a world beater either until they got into the Big East and the letters BCS. UCF would have similar success to USF with a Big East invite.

buckaineer Wrote:The BE would need to create some sort of academic consortium in order to compete with some of these other conferences. This would likely boost the academics of some schools.--Either way all should try to upgrade their academic "prestige" to meet what the Big Ten and ACC are putting forth. I would think that with Rutgers, Syracuse, Pittsburgh, Georgetown, ND (if still there), and some of the other bb schools that the BE academically could improve itself with a conference wide sharing as other conferences have.

As for UCF, they are spending money and building facilities and are in Florida but they really aren't very good right now on the field and can't consistently beat good BCS teams. Don't know if that would change or not in a BCS conference.

Bingo, you hit the nail on the head perfectly...its about academics and $$$

You can talk about inviting BC and Penn State and whoever, but you've gotta have a sweeter deal...namely $$$ and academics...

EvilVodka1 Wrote:

buckaineer Wrote:The BE would need to create some sort of academic consortium in order to compete with some of these other conferences. This would likely boost the academics of some schools.--Either way all should try to upgrade their academic "prestige" to meet what the Big Ten and ACC are putting forth. I would think that with Rutgers, Syracuse, Pittsburgh, Georgetown, ND (if still there), and some of the other bb schools that the BE academically could improve itself with a conference wide sharing as other conferences have.

As for UCF, they are spending money and building facilities and are in Florida but they really aren't very good right now on the field and can't consistently beat good BCS teams. Don't know if that would change or not in a BCS conference.

Bingo, you hit the nail on the head perfectly...its about academics and $$$

You can talk about inviting BC and Penn State and whoever, but you've gotta have a sweeter deal...namely $$$ and academics...

That will be almost impossible to achieve. UCF/Memphis/ECU will not bring in enough $$ for the Big East to match the ACC/Big 10 just not going to happen. Its a catch 22 in order for the Big East to make "Big $" it going to have to grab a Penn State or Notre Dame first, but those program won't come until the money is there. Academic the big East has some great schools Notre Dame,Pittsburgh,Rutgers,Syracuse,G'town so I see no problem on that front


The Big East football programs should split and stay at 8 and do a study off how much extra money they can make with a ND/PSU in the league.Fatctoring in travel cost, and conference revenue sharing differences. Just with PSU and the Big East lock up the entire NorthEast sector

I agree that Penn State will never leave the Big Ten. It does no harm, however, to let them know that, if they ever change their mind, the 11th spot is theirs and they can choose any 12th team they like to bring with them. I see this as a perfect way to prevent a ridiculous expansion to 12 teams that the league simply should not have anything to do with. If the 11th and 12th spots are permanently reserved for Penn State and any partner of their choosing then there will never be any reason for anybody to speculate about a 12 team Big East ever again.

I disagree that Notre Dame is close to joining the Big Ten. Notre Dame has exactly what they want. They have their cherished football independence and a top-rated conference in which to play basketball and all their minor sports. Why would they give that up? It is the sweetheart deal of the century. As a hypothetical Big Ten member, Notre Dame would be seen as just another Midwestern school, kind of like a Northwestern but with better football. That is not their goal. Notre Dame wants to be known as an independent national university.

Why should Notre Dame not be part of the Big East right now? Because they do not play football in the Big East? Providence, St. John's, Seton Hall, Villanova, Georgetown, DePaul, and Marquette also do not play football in the Big East. Nothing has suddenly changed to warrant trying to force Notre Dame to join Big East football. Some people need to let this issue go until there is a Big East split a couple of years down the road. It does not bother me since we are in a hybrid league now. The future, after a split, will be a whole different story though.

Boston College will not be ready to return until about 2014 or so. Enough time has to pass to heal the wounds from a few years ago and their current administration has to either retire or die. They are a long range project and my choice for team #10 in about 2014 or so. I have no problem settling for a school like UCF as team #9 in 2010 to get things started in the meantime though. An academic consortium should have been initiated years ago and, hopefully, can be started in the future. BC will come back one day if enough people can bury their egos.

Boston College in the ACC is a marriage doomed to fail in the long run. I put forth a number of very good reasons why this will happen but some people want to believe otherwise. Do not confuse being biased with being honest. The ACC is not perfect and BC was merely a warm 12th body to stage their precious title game. Nobody down there was jumping for joy about their addition except, probably, Miami. As for that insulting dodge, whatever, everything I laid out is completely logical and will come to pass. Time will prove me right on this matter.

Krocker Krapp Wrote:I agree that Penn State will never leave the Big Ten. It does no harm, however, to let them know that, if they ever change their mind, the 11th spot is theirs and they can choose any 12th team they like to bring with them. I see this as a perfect way to prevent a ridiculous expansion to 12 teams that the league simply should not have anything to do with. If the 11th and 12th spots are permanently reserved for Penn State and any partner of their choosing then there will never be any reason for anybody to speculate about a 12 team Big East ever again.

I disagree that Notre Dame is close to joining the Big Ten. Notre Dame has exactly what they want. They have their cherished football independence and a top-rated conference in which to play basketball and all their minor sports. Why would they give that up? It is the sweetheart deal of the century. As a hypothetical Big Ten member, Notre Dame would be seen as just another Midwestern school, kind of like a Northwestern but with better football. That is not their goal. Notre Dame wants to be known as an independent national university.

Why should Notre Dame not be part of the Big East right now? Because they do not play football in the Big East? Providence, St. John's, Seton Hall, Villanova, Georgetown, DePaul, and Marquette also do not play football in the Big East. Nothing has suddenly changed to warrant trying to force Notre Dame to join Big East football. Some people need to let this issue go until there is a Big East split a couple of years down the road. It does not bother me since we are in a hybrid league now. The future, after a split, will be a whole different story though.

Boston College will not be ready to return until about 2014 or so. Enough time has to pass to heal the wounds from a few years ago and their current administration has to either retire or die. They are a long range project and my choice for team #10 in about 2014 or so. I have no problem settling for a school like UCF as team #9 in 2010 to get things started in the meantime though. An academic consortium should have been initiated years ago and, hopefully, can be started in the future. BC will come back one day if enough people can bury their egos.

Boston College in the ACC is a marriage doomed to fail in the long run. I put forth a number of very good reasons why this will happen but some people want to believe otherwise. Do not confuse being biased with being honest. The ACC is not perfect and BC was merely a warm 12th body to stage their precious title game. Nobody down there was jumping for joy about their addition except, probably, Miami. As for that insulting dodge, whatever, everything I laid out is completely logical and will come to pass. Time will prove me right on this matter.

Even if BC doesn't get treated right in the ACC they are making alot more $$ then if they stayed in Big East. The ACC has the ACC and Jefferson Poliet contracts. They also have more teams at 12 to offer ESPN/JP more more games equaling more $$. BC isn't coming to the Big East unless we can close the gap with the ACC in revenue

I totally agree with Krocker Krapp's statements about ND.

FACTS:

ND has zero plans and zero desire to ever join the Big Ten Conference.

They also have no plans to join the Big East in football. Their only desired and planned (or contemplated) course of action is to remain a football independent forever (or at least indefinitely).

OPINION:

If things were to so dramatically change that ND had no choice but to either give up football or join a conference, it would reject the BigTen, again, (like it has several times, lastly in 1999) and very reluctantly join either the Big East or the ACC (whichever would give it the best deal).

Stop being shortsighted. I am talking about getting BC back in 2014. Does anyone on this board have any vision? Things will not be the same in seven years as they are today. Some people always act like nothing will ever change from the way it is right now. The Big East era started in 2005 and we are a long way from finished! By 2014, the Big East will be head and shoulders above the ACC, and the Lying Eagles will be the ones begging for a piece of our action. Unbridled pessimism is for losers.

Krocker Krapp Wrote:I agree that Penn State will never leave the Big Ten. It does no harm, however, to let them know that, if they ever change their mind, the 11th spot is theirs and they can choose any 12th team they like to bring with them. I see this as a perfect way to prevent a ridiculous expansion to 12 teams that the league simply should not have anything to do with. If the 11th and 12th spots are permanently reserved for Penn State and any partner of their choosing then there will never be any reason for anybody to speculate about a 12 team Big East ever again.

This is the mentalitity of a non-BCS fan or former fan. BE BCS schools like WVU, Rutgers-even SU and Pitt with long histories and traditions playing major league schools are not going to "give" PSU anything. PSU is nothing of it's former self on the field. In games over the past 5 or so years they lost to BE Boston College twice (and BC only tied for the BE championship one of those years), Pittsburgh also beat them and I think even SU may have. It would be a benefit for them to play in the BE as it would be a benefit to have them, but not with some major priveleges as though they are king of the east, they lost that mantra more than a decade ago and aren't getting it back anytime soon if ever. Anyway, they are content to fall off into mediocrity and be the b*tches of OSU and Michigan forever in order to get the major green their commissioner has garnered.

Krocker Krapp Wrote:I disagree that Notre Dame is close to joining the Big Ten. Notre Dame has exactly what they want. They have their cherished football independence and a top-rated conference in which to play basketball and all their minor sports. Why would they give that up? It is the sweetheart deal of the century. As a hypothetical Big Ten member, Notre Dame would be seen as just another Midwestern school, kind of like a Northwestern but with better football. That is not their goal. Notre Dame wants to be known as an independent national university.

Why would they give that up? Money and academics. They can now make more money in the Big Ten than they can by themselves. Once their tv contract runs out they'll be in the Big Ten. They'll always be highly regarded-even as a losing team as they are now and all games will be televised in the Big Ten. Perhaps then Tranghese and all will see how much of a partner ND is to the BE.

Krocker Krapp Wrote:Why should Notre Dame not be part of the Big East right now? Because they do not play football in the Big East? Providence, St. John's, Seton Hall, Villanova, Georgetown, DePaul, and Marquette also do not play football in the Big East. Nothing has suddenly changed to warrant trying to force Notre Dame to join Big East football. Some people need to let this issue go until there is a Big East split a couple of years down the road. It does not bother me since we are in a hybrid league now. The future, after a split, will be a whole different story though.

The other schools you mentioned formed the BE. It was only a bb conference then. ND came in much later because they wanted a home for basketball and other sports in a major league and no one else would let them leach except for the catholic schools in the BE. I imagine football hoped forming an allegiance with them would one day lead to a football membership, instead it led to weakening the football schools in many ways.

Krocker Krapp Wrote:Boston College will not be ready to return until about 2014 or so. Enough time has to pass to heal the wounds from a few years ago and their current administration has to either retire or die. They are a long range project and my choice for team #10 in about 2014 or so. I have no problem settling for a school like UCF as team #9 in 2010 to get things started in the meantime though. An academic consortium should have been initiated years ago and, hopefully, can be started in the future. BC will come back one day if enough people can bury their egos.

I don't know if BC would ever be ready to return, but they'd be a target if I were in charge. Alot of history against the old BE teams and they were a founding member. But without an academic consortium and working out a financial package in advance with tv if they were to rejoin, not a possibility. They'd obviously (and the rest) have to get more money than now or forget it.

Krocker Krapp Wrote:Boston College in the ACC is a marriage doomed to fail in the long run. I put forth a number of very good reasons why this will happen but some people want to believe otherwise. Do not confuse being biased with being honest. The ACC is not perfect and BC was merely a warm 12th body to stage their precious title game. Nobody down there was jumping for joy about their addition except, probably, Miami. As for that insulting dodge, whatever, everything I laid out is completely logical and will come to pass. Time will prove me right on this matter.

The money and academics are still with them in the ACC, not the BE. They obviously didn't want to associate with academics at schools like UL, UC and USF. They didn't want UConn to be a major program in their area. None of this has changed or will change. In a few years the ACC will no doubt create it's own network ala the Big Ten, it makes too much sense and money not too. At that point the BE would be far poorer than all other conferences.

Buckineer:

People have been waiting (and predicting) that ND would lose its TV contract and have to join a conference since it first signed the NBC deal in 1991.

Even if you believe that ND will lose its TV deal with NBC and nobody will pick it up in that event, ND will not want to be part of the Big Ten.

I did not say give Penn State any special privileges. What I said was to leave them an open invitation to come back, with a school of their choosing if they like, as our 11th and 12th members. It will never happen anyway but I also see it as a perfect safeguard against foolhardy expansion to 12 teams which we do not need anyway. Furthermore, Penn State still has a longstanding history with the majority of Big East schools, their roots are with us and the door should never be completely closed on a school like that.

Terry D has adddressed the Notre Dame issue repeatedly and from an insider's perspective. Notre Dame is not going to join the Big Ten. The Big Ten needs to just settle for Nebraska and let the chips fall where they may. As for the Big East, our finances are going to shoot through the roof with the next TV contract, and the ratings clearly bear this out. Big East football and basketball are carrying ESPN right now. It will be more favorable to be here in a few years than with the ACC and BC will realize this by 2014.