How disgraceful- Guilliani blamed the troops this morning, for not gaurding the explosives at
Al-QaQaa.

AND.......... an embedded Minnesota reporter's tapes shows massive stock piles of explosives on April 10, 2003. at Al-Qaqaa.



How pathetic, I certainly hope you show the same outrage for Guilliani as you have Kerry. Guilliani word for word blamed it on the TROOPS!!!!!!

How outraged are you right wingers that they have lied to you!!! If all that you watch is Fox News you won't see the tape from the Minnesota reporter. It was on Olberman's show on msnbc. They showed the GPS coordinates, the IAEA tape. The agency that warned the administration of the weapon's depot. I flipped over to fox news and O Reilly had on Newt who was talking about the outraged he had on the subject. THEY ARE LYING TO YOU GUYS!!!!

AND IF THAT WASN"T BAD ENOUGH, politically appointed FBI head Mueller let's an investigation proceed into Haliburton 5 days before the election. WHAT THE HELL?????? You talk about the perfect storm of bad news!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thank God for our country's sake!!!! Wooo Hoooo :roflol:

Come on GB. Where are you REB!! Where's the outrage!!!!! OHH little niner, calling little niner..

After Bush's failure to plan allowed 380 tons of explosives be stolen in Iraq, his campaign's strategy quickly turned to blaming John Kerry for "basing his attacks on the headlines he wakes up to each day." Now, after they've realized that it's rightfully been a headline for three days and they can't push it under the rug, the Republicans sent Rudy Giuliani to disgracefully shift the blame to our troops.

This morning he said: "No matter how you try to blame it on the president the actual responsibility for it really would be for the troops that were there. Did they search carefully enough? Didn't they search carefully enough?"

The implication that the troops were responsible for this mess is absurd. The troops weren't told to search al Qaqaa at all, and they weren't told to secure the area even though the Bush administration knew there were stockpiles of explosives there. It's unimaginable and sickening that they would try to pass the blame to our troops in Iraq, especially since they were sent there with a force so small it made their mission prohibitively and unnecessarily difficult.

I guess the Bush strategy has shifted from ignoring reality to blaming the American troops for their mistakes. Is the Bush campaign's slogan now "It's the Troops' Fault Iraq Is a Mess"? Might as well be.

To think about the dismembered troops that has resulted from this is just plain bull****!!!

Truth is out there..

<a href='http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/102904Y.shtml' target='_blank'>http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/102904Y.shtml</a>

It shows the weapons guys!!!

You aren't very good at lying. From the article you quoted:


Eyewitness News Video May Be Linked to Missing Explosives in Iraq
KSTP-TV, Minneapolis/St. Paul

<a href='http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/102904Y.shtml' target='_blank'>http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/102904Y.shtml</a>

Quote:On Wednesday, 5 EYEWITNESS NEWS e-mailed still images of the footage taken at the site to experts in Washington to see if the items captured on tape are the same kind of high explosives that went missing in Al Qaqaa. Those experts could not make that determination.&nbsp;

The footage is now in the hands of security experts to see if it is indeed the explosives in question.

Ok, now you're just starting to get ****ing annoying. You're one of the reasons why I stop posting in here. Cause I'm sick of all this anti-American, "America the Failure" rhetoric. I get enough of that at school, I don't need to come home and read it all over the message board. Obviously you enjoy celebrating failures of the US military, but why don't you just go off and enjoy it in your own little corner where no one has to listen to it. It would be surprising to see you near the end of WWII. "What? The army let Hitler commit suicide? What a bunch of failures!" :mad:

Dogger Wrote:After Bush's failure to plan allowed 380 tons of explosives be stolen in Iraq, his campaign's strategy quickly turned to blaming John Kerry for "basing his attacks on the headlines he wakes up to each day."

Discrepancy Found in Explosives Amounts
Documents Show Iraqis May Be Overstating Amount of Missing Material

<a href='http://www.abcnews.go.com/WNT/story?id=204304&page=1' target='_blank'>http://www.abcnews.go.com/WNT/story?id=204304&page=1</a>

Quote:The Iraqi interim government has told the United States and international weapons inspectors that 377 tons of conventional explosives are missing from the Al-Qaqaa installation, which was supposed to be under U.S. military control.

But International Atomic Energy Agency documents obtained by ABC News and first reported on "World News Tonight with Peter Jennings" indicate the amount of missing explosives may be substantially less than the Iraqis reported.

The information on which the Iraqi Science Ministry based an Oct. 10 memo in which it reported that 377 tons of RDX explosives were missing — presumably stolen due to a lack of security — was based on "declaration" from July 15, 2002. At that time, the Iraqis said there were 141 tons of RDX explosives at the facility.

But the confidential IAEA documents obtained by ABC News show that on Jan. 14, 2003, the agency's inspectors recorded that just over three tons of RDX were stored at the facility — a considerable discrepancy from what the Iraqis reported.

That's from ABC News. They're not exactly known as being "pro-Bush."

Dogger Wrote:Now, after they've realized that it's rightfully been a headline for three days and they can't push it under the rug, the Republicans sent Rudy Giuliani to disgracefully shift the blame to our troops.

This morning he said: "No matter how you try to blame it on the president the actual responsibility for it really would be for the troops that were there. Did they search carefully enough? Didn't they search carefully enough?"

The implication that the troops were responsible for this mess is absurd. The troops weren't told to search al Qaqaa at all, and they weren't told to secure the area even though the Bush administration knew there were stockpiles of explosives there. It's unimaginable and sickening that they would try to pass the blame to our troops in Iraq, especially since they were sent there with a force so small it made their mission prohibitively and unnecessarily difficult.

I guess the Bush strategy has shifted from ignoring reality to blaming the American troops for their mistakes. Is the Bush campaign's slogan now "It's the Troops' Fault Iraq Is a Mess"? Might as well be.

To think about the dismembered troops that has resulted from this is just plain bull****!!!

I'm not sure what you want me to say about Giuliani. I'm not a Republican and I don't feel the need to make excuses for what he said. I'm not voting for him, so I honestly don't care what he says. I didn't even bother listening to the speech he gave at the RNC.

Dern Doggy, what the hell are you barking about? Let me see, what you got there....Let's see, you got a little quote from Rudy...What a shill he is, listening to him after the debates made me sick. Well, I am not voting for him.

What else you got, oh the imbedded reporter report. Yeah, at face value it looks like something was photographed, but what was it and where were they? I think the jury is still out on that.

Ok, now that we got all that taken care of...what's that lil doggy? It's the President's fault? No, No, he did not go over there and give it away personally now did he?

Do you know how much "lose" explosive material there is floating around Iraq? Put it this way, this is just a small drop in the Ocean. Now our very competent Military personell are taking care of the majority of it.

Also, there is another report from ABC with some real interesting information about just how sealed up the bunkers really were..

Quote:Another Concern

The IAEA documents from January 2003 found no discrepancy in the amount of the more dangerous HMX explosives thought to be stored at Al-Qaqaa, but they do raise another disturbing possibility.

The documents show IAEA inspectors looked at nine bunkers containing more than 194 tons of HMX at the facility. Although these bunkers were still under IAEA seal, the inspectors said the seals may be potentially ineffective because they had ventilation slats on the sides. These slats could be easily removed to remove the materials inside the bunkers without breaking the seals, the inspectors noted.


<a href='http://www.abcnews.go.com/WNT/story?id=204304&page=1' target='_blank'>See the whole story here!</a>

There There lil doggy, you can go lay down now.

<span style='color:RED'>***by the way lil doggy...I merged your topics about the same stuff together because you evidently can't follow AUP.***</span>

So mods are going around now and calling people "little doggy" in their capacity as mods? Good job. Let me know the next time you decide to be "fair and balanced."

Let me see, first you get pissed off because Rudy says something about the explosives, and you rail him about blaming the troops, but then you say:

Quote:After Bush's failure to plan allowed 380 tons of explosives be stolen in Iraq, his campaign's strategy quickly turned to blaming John Kerry for "basing his attacks on the headlines he wakes up to each day."

Which is it? You and Kerry do it DAILY. Why do you think the military hates him(and they do)? I don't remember the duty of the President being that of GUARDING anything. I honestly don't remember Bush ever having guard duty in Iraq.

Fact is the munitions were gone before they GOT there.

Spin......it's a disease, ain't it?

About the military, trust me, they respect Bush. I'm right outside the most populous US Army post in the world, Ft. Hood. They do NOT respect Kerry......but you go ahead, as you will, and call us all sheep.

I plan on getting out of the defense contracting industry should he be elected....as many other people that contract or serve this country. (That's truth, not just an opinion)

FACT- THE WEAPONS WERE THERE!!!!! How incompetent!!

It's planning. And they have failed. Not the troops, DoD on up.

MAKO Wrote:So mods are going around now and calling people "little doggy" in their capacity as mods?&nbsp; Good job.&nbsp; Let me know the next time you decide to be "fair and balanced."

Let me tell you your problem Mako, your a whiner. Now look back and see who got called out on this thread first. If you want to complain Mako, take it to PM, otherwise don't! I thought you didn't post here anymore?

Dogger Wrote:FACT- THE WEAPONS WERE THERE!!!!! How incompetent!!

It's planning. And they have failed. Not the troops, DoD on up.

We have destroyed over 400,000 tons of explosives in Iraq so far. This was 3 tons. Like I said, it was just a drop in the ocean. Did that imbedded reporter ever figure out where he was and what he was looking at?

Have you seen the Satelite photos of the flat bed trucks "loading" at the bunkers before the war?

The jury is still out on this one.

Which leads me to another question. If they had sattelite photos of the explosives being stolen why in the H wouldn't we send a F-16 in there and make sure they were destroyed after the truck was down the road a couple of miles? And if they knew these high grade explosives were being taken why wouldn't we gaurd and protect it? Why was the ministry of oil a tier one facility and Al-Qaqaa a tier two. It makes absolutley no sense. Does anyone honestly believe we should have safegaurded the ministry of oil before this site. This could have been a place with WMD's. And now we have photos that things are being stolen from it and we do NOTHING. I can't believe every American is not totally pissed by this. And your facts about 400,000 tons of high grade explosives being destroyed is way off mark.

GrayBeard Wrote:We have destroyed over 400,000 tons of explosives in Iraq so far. This was 3 tons. Like I said, it was just a drop in the ocean.

I believe we are talking about 300 tons or so.

And these were advanced explosives, high tech stuff. stuff good enough for use in the trigger of a nuclear weapon. Less than a pound of it brought down the Pan Am flight over Scotland.

I doubt the same can be said for the explosives you cite.

Quote:Have you seen the Satelite photos of the flat bed trucks "loading" at the bunkers before the war?

You are stretching. The experts are still trying to figure out of these trucks were parked outside the right bunkers. No one is saying "loading."

Quote:The jury is still out on this one.

For you maybe. I think we can see which way the wind is blowing, here.

Dogger Wrote:And your facts about 400,000 tons of high grade explosives being destroyed is way off mark.

The 400,000 tons is a number being used in print and on TV. Now the total suspected amount of explosives in Iraq ranges from 600,000 tons to 1 million tons and more.

What # do you have for the amount rounded up and/or destroyed by the Americans? You do have a # don't you?


As far as why didn't we attack the trucks? I don't know for sure, as I am not involved in Military planning, but I would guess we were preparing for the innitial assualt, and we did not want to tip our hand and possibly start the war early. Like I said, I was not involved in the planning, so I am not sure.

But do you think we should have protected it once we knew it was being looted???

Schadenfreude Wrote:

GrayBeard Wrote:We have destroyed over 400,000 tons of explosives in Iraq so far.&nbsp; This was 3 tons.&nbsp; Like I said, it was just a drop in the ocean.

I believe we are talking about 300 tons or so.

Go back and read the ABC article that I linked above. The IAEA admits that there were only 3 tons of the high explosives at the Al Qaqaa facility.


Heck, I will link it again <a href='http://www.abcnews.go.com/WNT/story?id=204304&page=1' target='_blank'>RIIIIGGGGGHHHHTTTTT HHHHEEEEERRRRREEEEE!</a>