(08-09-2012 01:12 PM)Karl Wrote:  What an outstanding piece. Thanks for posting.

Honestly, if Toledo has, or hired, a skilled attorney...they could probably blow the doors right off the APR ban.

All they would have to do is prove the APR requirements are biased towards schools with bigger budgets (ie-the rich) and the smaller budget schools (ie-the poor and minorities), and they would likely back off. It would be a PR nightmare for the NCAA if someone wanted to pursue it.

Judge: So let me get this straight, you created APR requirements that favored schools with bigger budgets that could afford to hire more people to monitor and help the progress of student athletes?

NCAA: Well, ummm....it seemed like a good idea at the time, but the results kind of blew up in our face.

(08-09-2012 01:36 PM)eastisbest Wrote:  

(08-09-2012 12:09 PM)EA3 Wrote:  http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/...e-ncaa-apr

Came across this article on ESPN. Sorry to bump this thread if it was something you guys would rather forget.

My previous posts would probably be described as the following - "everyone knew about the problem in advance, it sucks that Toledo didn't hit the APR, but now its time to serve the appropriate discipline....and, it sucks to be the current regime at Toledo who had nothing to do with the past problems, but the NCAA still needs to hold programs accountable." I didn't think it was fair, I sympathized with the issue, but I also recognized the NCAA for holding institutions accountable.

After reading this article, I would agree that the APR system is fatally flawed...and frankly, its a joke. The writer makes an excellent point about how it favors the BCS type schools with deep pockets. They pay multiple people to stay on top of students and monitor their progress. MAC schools probably have a fraction (1-4 would be my guess) of the number of people doing this. This measuring system would hardly be called "fair".

I'm officially in the boat of TOLEDO IS GETTING HOSED BY THE NCAA!

I haven't read the article yet (slow connection) but based upon your post, I don't think I agree with your logic. Smaller schools are to be held to lower standards because they cannot afford as many police? I don't think I follow. If a smaller school cannot self-police than maybe they need to downsize their NCAA participation? It stinks not having as much money as the next guy but I don't see how that would excuse violations?

How is it fair that schools like Michigan and Ohio St can afford to hire 8-11 people to work with their student athletes and make sure they are on the road to progress when smaller budget schools can only afford to have 1-3 people in the same dept?

Are we supposed to downsize our athletic departments?

We aren't supposed to be held to a different standard. Rather, the measurements and requirements need to be fair and consistent.

The APR is ill-conceived and flawed in its current form. The intent is good...the process is bad.

Without doing any research, MAC schools likely have 300-400 student athletes that participate in NCAA sanctioned sports. Michigan and Ohio St are probably between 400-500.

There are a certain number, or percentage, of student athletes that need more help than others. Those student athletes would be less likely to fail the system if they were given more attention.

The APR system favors schools with more resources....plain and simple.

(08-09-2012 01:51 PM)EA3 Wrote:  Without doing any research, MAC schools likely have 300-400 student athletes that participate in NCAA sanctioned sports. Michigan and Ohio St are probably between 400-500.

There are a certain number, or percentage, of student athletes that need more help than others. Those student athletes would be less likely to fail the system if they were given more attention.

The APR system favors schools with more resources....plain and simple.

are you accusing them of buying their way out of offenses or only being better at preventing them in the first place? If it's the latter, I don't see the complaint. Are they supposed to dumb down their system so that MAC schools can compete? That doesn't make sense.

If it is the latter that you're talking about, then the burden is ours and I doubt you'd get even one MAC AD to say otherwise. Besides, would our athletes be getting the terrific grades across nearly all-sports that they are, if it weren't for that rather severe shot we received?

I don't like the structure of punishments that not just punish but also make it harder to meet the standard, with that I'll agree with you. But the punishments were earned and quite honestly, the higher academic work ethic that has resulted has to have made the University as a whole better. Now, if they can only sustain it....

I don't disagree with you.

We are afforded plenty of disadvantages due to our budget constraints. There is no way around this and we will not be on equal footing with the big boys.

But when the system blatantly favors schools with deep pockets, that is a problem.

If Toledo, or any other school on the APR list other than UCONN, had 10 academic advisors that were in charge of student athletes, I'm willing to bet the farm they wouldn't be in this mess.

(08-09-2012 07:38 PM)EA3 Wrote:  I don't disagree with you.

We are afforded plenty of disadvantages due to our budget constraints. There is no way around this and we will not be on equal footing with the big boys.

But when the system blatantly favors schools with deep pockets, that is a problem.

If Toledo, or any other school on the APR list other than UCONN, had 10 academic advisors that were in charge of student athletes, I'm willing to bet the farm they wouldn't be in this mess.

Why isn't Kentucky in trouble for this they have had more players leave than us in this time though they do go to the NBA it should not be any different

(08-09-2012 08:18 PM)rocketpaul Wrote:  

(08-09-2012 07:38 PM)EA3 Wrote:  I don't disagree with you.

We are afforded plenty of disadvantages due to our budget constraints. There is no way around this and we will not be on equal footing with the big boys.

But when the system blatantly favors schools with deep pockets, that is a problem.

If Toledo, or any other school on the APR list other than UCONN, had 10 academic advisors that were in charge of student athletes, I'm willing to bet the farm they wouldn't be in this mess.

Why isn't Kentucky in trouble for this they have had more players leave than us in this time though they do go to the NBA it should not be any different

I am not an expert in the APR requirements, but as i understand them, a university or sports program is not penalized if the players leave school early as long as they are in good academic standing when they depart.

ie-if those one and done players all got 2.0 gpas, then that would hurt Kentucky...but they are not penalized for leaving early...just getting bad grades.