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cardinalempire69 Offline
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Once you've had a chance to digest your Thanksgiving dinner, prepare for a heaping helping of BCS Blues. Because to play on an old saying, what:

<a href='http://www.cardinalempire.com/Thanksgiving_Thanks.htm' target='_blank'><span style='color:red'>Thanksgiving, Thanks Taking Away</span></a>
11-25-2004 11:35 AM
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SF Husky Offline
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This is the reason why we need a playoff. BCS computer rating blows!
11-25-2004 12:27 PM
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L-yes Offline
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Entirely too pessimistic. With our OOC schedules being juiced up if a program from the BE goes undefeated it will play for a title or at least be in the top 3 which is all you can ask. One or 2 losses and we head to the BCS anyway. The Big East is fine.
11-25-2004 12:41 PM
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cardinalempire69 Offline
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I hate to bite the hand that will be feeding us millions, but I don't think the Big East is going to be the great difference between this year and next. The fact of the matter is that whatever goes into those computer formulas, it's not particularly fond of Big East programs. How will it help us to play teams who are not ranked amongst the computer Top 25... is that somehow different than what we're doing right now?

I remember someone saying that it was different when WVU was winning. That's just an optimist's poor memory talking. At their best week (Week 3), the Mountaineers only ranked 19th in the computers. Boston College is actually at their high point right now, coming in at T-23. Sure, having a team or two join you in the computer Top 25 will be nice (no C-USA team does), but will it be enough to crack the top 2 or 3 like people think?
11-25-2004 01:59 PM
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SF Husky Offline
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Win all of your games and you will be guranteed to play in a BCS bowl, whats wrong with that? If your team worries about computer ranking, then go schedule some big time programs outside the conference. Beside, BE is better than most people think. UCONN, WVU, Pitt are already bowl eligible. Cuse might join them on SAT.
11-25-2004 02:41 PM
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Cat's_Claw Offline
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cardinalempire69 Wrote:I hate to bite the hand that will be feeding us millions, but I don't think the Big East is going to be the great difference between this year and next. The fact of the matter is that whatever goes into those computer formulas, it's not particularly fond of Big East programs. How will it help us to play teams who are not ranked amongst the computer Top 25... is that somehow different than what we're doing right now?

I remember someone saying that it was different when WVU was winning. That's just an optimist's poor memory talking. At their best week (Week 3), the Mountaineers only ranked 19th in the computers. Boston College is actually at their high point right now, coming in at T-23. Sure, having a team or two join you in the computer Top 25 will be nice (no C-USA team does), but will it be enough to crack the top 2 or 3 like people think?

That's not an optimist's poor memory. West Virginia would have been in the BCS Top 10 if they had beaten Boston College. And that is just with one loss. If West Virginia had beaten Virginia Tech and Boston College they would be in the Top 6 right now. Period. They were high in the rankings even after the Virginia Tech loss. As for how not playing a ranked team is any different then what Louisville is doing now, take a look at the power rankings. The average power ranking in the Big East is stronger then in C-USA. Those are extra points that add up. There's no way you can convince me that you would get the same points and respect playing Army, Houston, and TCU then you would get playing West Virginia, Pitt, or UConn. When Rutgers is the worst power ranking point you would get (and they're still in the Top 90 or 100), then you don't have any bad points against you.
11-25-2004 08:10 PM
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Cat's_Claw Offline
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cardinalempire69 Wrote:I remember someone saying that it was different when WVU was winning. That's just an optimist's poor memory talking. At their best week (Week 3), the Mountaineers only ranked 19th in the computers. Boston College is actually at their high point right now, coming in at T-23. Sure, having a team or two join you in the computer Top 25 will be nice (no C-USA team does), but will it be enough to crack the top 2 or 3 like people think?

Actually you have a poor memory. West Virginia was ranked around #11 or #13 at the time of the Boston College loss. So how could their highest computer ranking only be #19? Unless you're talking about the Sagarins, which isn't important. The important part was the BCS, and West Virginia was in the Top 15 at the time they lost to BC. In fact, to clear up the talk that this was a optimist's "poor memory", here's showing that I have a pretty good memory. In week 4 West Virginia was 13th in the BCS rankings. Now imagine if West Virginia had beaten Virginia Tech? They're clearly in the Top 10 of the BCS as of that week instead of 13th. Teams ahead of them that had lost since there were Georgia, Michigan and Florida State. They're definitely ahead of Florida State, Boise State and Virginia if they had beaten Virginia Tech. Now, if they had beaten Boston College? They're EASILY in the Top 10 of the BCS. If Louisville is in the Top 10 of the BCS with one loss, and West Virginia was ahead of them before losing, then why would West Virginia NOT be in the BCS Top 25? So no, #19 was not West Virginia's peak week #13 was. And that was with one loss.
11-25-2004 08:12 PM
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cardinalempire69 Offline
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Cat's_Claw Wrote:Actually you have a poor memory.&nbsp; West Virginia was ranked around #11 or #13 at the time of the Boston College loss.&nbsp; So how could their highest computer ranking only be #19?&nbsp; Unless you're talking about the Sagarins, which isn't important.&nbsp; The important part was the BCS, and West Virginia was in the Top 15 at the time they lost to BC.&nbsp; In fact, to clear up the talk that this was a optimist's "poor memory", here's showing that I have a pretty good memory.&nbsp; In week 4 West Virginia was 13th in the BCS rankings.&nbsp; Now imagine if West Virginia had beaten Virginia Tech?&nbsp; They're clearly in the Top 10 of the BCS as of that week instead of 13th.&nbsp; Teams ahead of them that had lost since there were Georgia, Michigan and Florida State.&nbsp; They're definitely ahead of Florida State, Boise State and Virginia if they had beaten Virginia Tech.&nbsp; Now, if they had beaten Boston College?&nbsp; They're EASILY in the Top 10 of the BCS.&nbsp; If Louisville is in the Top 10 of the BCS with one loss, and West Virginia was ahead of them before losing, then why would West Virginia NOT be in the BCS Top 25?&nbsp; So no, #19 was not West Virginia's peak week #13 was.&nbsp; And that was with one loss.
I think we are arguing different areas here. You are 100% correct that West Virginia was high in the BCS polls (#13 is correct), but my argument is about the computer portion of the BCS rankings. What a lot of folks overlook is how the BCS is composed and where "glass ceilings" arise. Louisville hit the glass ceiling this season because they hit a stopping point in the human polls and the computer polls continued to undervalue the team.

West Virginia, very similarly during their peak week, were being most helped in the human polls. The COMPUTER polls are the area to which I am pointing out a continually low value. In the combined COMPUTER rankings, WVU topped out at #19. Feel free to check it.

And THAT'S what worries me. While the human polls are 2/3 (??) of the total BCS points now, that 1/3 that the computer polls account for will be the difference between a #1-6 finish and a #7 and below finish. If the Big East can collectively get no more respect from the COMPUTER polls than to be a #15-20 team, then there is a serious problem with ever getting to the championship game.

BCS bowls will not be a problem... the Big East champ is guaranteed that by winning the conference. What WILL be a problem is ever finishing high enough to make the championship game. As long as the computers continue spitting out BE teams as average or below, there's NO way that any Big East team finishes in the top 2 spots of the BCS.
11-25-2004 10:37 PM
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L-yes Offline
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cardinalempire69 Wrote:I hate to bite the hand that will be feeding us millions, but I don't think the Big East is going to be the great difference between this year and next. The fact of the matter is that whatever goes into those computer formulas, it's not particularly fond of Big East programs. How will it help us to play teams who are not ranked amongst the computer Top 25... is that somehow different than what we're doing right now?

I remember someone saying that it was different when WVU was winning. That's just an optimist's poor memory talking. At their best week (Week 3), the Mountaineers only ranked 19th in the computers. Boston College is actually at their high point right now, coming in at T-23. Sure, having a team or two join you in the computer Top 25 will be nice (no C-USA team does), but will it be enough to crack the top 2 or 3 like people think?
UofL playing a less than stellar CUSA schedule is in the top 10 and had UofL defeated Miami at the orange bowl would be in the top 3. The bottom line is unless your undefeated you don't have a shot at the title anyway but as a member of the BE we will have BCS access with a conference title. No need for hand wringing, it’s ridiculous considering the 5 other conferences are in the same boat we are.
11-26-2004 05:23 PM
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Cat's_Claw Offline
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L-yes Wrote:amongst the computer Top 25... is that somehow
UofL playing a less than stellar CUSA schedule is in the top 10 and had UofL defeated Miami at the orange bowl would be in the top 3. The bottom line is unless your undefeated you don't have a shot at the title anyway but as a member of the BE we will have BCS access with a conference title. No need for hand wringing, it’s ridiculous considering the 5 other conferences are in the same boat we are.
Exactly. Look at Texas. Texas has only one loss, just like Louisville, and they're possibly and probably on the outside looking in. With the Big East you have BCS access, better teams to play as far as Sagarin goes, and much more respect and prestige and media attention. There are some people ripping the Big East now, but would they have ripped the Big East if Louisville were in the Top 10 and West Virginia were #13? If WVU had beaten Boston College they could have been around the Top 12, assuming Louisville and West Virginia hadn't played each other yet, and even then the winner would be in the Top 10, the loser in the Top 15 or 20, and Pitt probably around #26. And with UC playing the way they are, and the great story with UConn, the Big East would be getting praised not ripped. So saying that the Big East wouldn't help Louisville is ridiculous.
11-26-2004 11:46 PM
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