(12-02-2017 08:28 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-02-2017 08:21 PM)NoDak Wrote:  

(12-02-2017 08:13 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-02-2017 07:49 PM)NoDak Wrote:  Weber St is able if EWU cant. They don't give great travel partners, but they are more than capable. Try again.

The point is that the Great Northern Conference makes sense as a grouping of Great Plains flagships-and-landgrants. The whole point is to leave behind the less prestigious "directional schools." Denver makes sense because it's a prestigious private. UN-Omaha and UMKC give you presences in some major nearby metro areas. Western Illinois, Fort Wayne and ORal Roberts--they don't bring anything to the table for the Great Northern League, but they're in the league you're taking over and you can't really kick them out.

I don't understand the point of the exercise if you're letting Eastern Washington tag along. (I understand you think this is about FBS. It's not. If it's a real thing, it's about UM and NDSU etc trying to look more like University of Minnesota and Oregon State University than like Northern Colorado and University of Minnesota at Minnetonka).

Could lecture you all day why Seton Hall isn't worthy of a Big East bid, but won't. The Hall got in because it was in Jersey, and filled a media need.

The original back-of-the-napkin plan had Rutgers and Temple. When they balked, as there was talk of an Eastern League including Penn State football, their spots went to Seton Hall and Villanova. IF we were building a league from scratch, which the Great Northern is doing (if it's actually a thing), I don't know if having a northern New Jersey presence is as important.

Eastern Washington in the Great Northern is not so much Seton Hall in the Big East as Virginia Commonwealth. Athletics-wise, they'd be a huge asset. But conferences aren't just about athletics, they're about perception of the schools in them.

Well Wyoming turned us down just as Penn St turned you guys down. It happens.

(12-02-2017 08:48 PM)NoDak Wrote:  

(12-02-2017 08:28 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-02-2017 08:21 PM)NoDak Wrote:  

(12-02-2017 08:13 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-02-2017 07:49 PM)NoDak Wrote:  Weber St is able if EWU cant. They don't give great travel partners, but they are more than capable. Try again.

The point is that the Great Northern Conference makes sense as a grouping of Great Plains flagships-and-landgrants. The whole point is to leave behind the less prestigious "directional schools." Denver makes sense because it's a prestigious private. UN-Omaha and UMKC give you presences in some major nearby metro areas. Western Illinois, Fort Wayne and ORal Roberts--they don't bring anything to the table for the Great Northern League, but they're in the league you're taking over and you can't really kick them out.

I don't understand the point of the exercise if you're letting Eastern Washington tag along. (I understand you think this is about FBS. It's not. If it's a real thing, it's about UM and NDSU etc trying to look more like University of Minnesota and Oregon State University than like Northern Colorado and University of Minnesota at Minnetonka).

Could lecture you all day why Seton Hall isn't worthy of a Big East bid, but won't. The Hall got in because it was in Jersey, and filled a media need.

The original back-of-the-napkin plan had Rutgers and Temple. When they balked, as there was talk of an Eastern League including Penn State football, their spots went to Seton Hall and Villanova. IF we were building a league from scratch, which the Great Northern is doing (if it's actually a thing), I don't know if having a northern New Jersey presence is as important.

Eastern Washington in the Great Northern is not so much Seton Hall in the Big East as Virginia Commonwealth. Athletics-wise, they'd be a huge asset. But conferences aren't just about athletics, they're about perception of the schools in them.

Well Wyoming turned us down just as Penn St turned you guys down. It happens.

We rejected Penn State, you dolt. IT's a pretty well known juncture in Big East history. First google hit.

(12-02-2017 08:52 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-02-2017 08:48 PM)NoDak Wrote:  

(12-02-2017 08:28 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(12-02-2017 08:21 PM)NoDak Wrote:  

(12-02-2017 08:13 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  The point is that the Great Northern Conference makes sense as a grouping of Great Plains flagships-and-landgrants. The whole point is to leave behind the less prestigious "directional schools." Denver makes sense because it's a prestigious private. UN-Omaha and UMKC give you presences in some major nearby metro areas. Western Illinois, Fort Wayne and ORal Roberts--they don't bring anything to the table for the Great Northern League, but they're in the league you're taking over and you can't really kick them out.

I don't understand the point of the exercise if you're letting Eastern Washington tag along. (I understand you think this is about FBS. It's not. If it's a real thing, it's about UM and NDSU etc trying to look more like University of Minnesota and Oregon State University than like Northern Colorado and University of Minnesota at Minnetonka).

Could lecture you all day why Seton Hall isn't worthy of a Big East bid, but won't. The Hall got in because it was in Jersey, and filled a media need.

The original back-of-the-napkin plan had Rutgers and Temple. When they balked, as there was talk of an Eastern League including Penn State football, their spots went to Seton Hall and Villanova. IF we were building a league from scratch, which the Great Northern is doing (if it's actually a thing), I don't know if having a northern New Jersey presence is as important.

Eastern Washington in the Great Northern is not so much Seton Hall in the Big East as Virginia Commonwealth. Athletics-wise, they'd be a huge asset. But conferences aren't just about athletics, they're about perception of the schools in them.

Well Wyoming turned us down just as Penn St turned you guys down. It happens.

We rejected Penn State, you dolt. IT's a pretty well known juncture in Big East history. First google hit.

And that is arguably the worst rejection in conference history.

NoDak weirdness aside, I do believe in the Great North concept and I wish it would get traction. Reasons:

1. The academic and marketing benefits, which have already been discussed.

2. There's a good chance that the relationship between the first, second and third tiers of college football will change dramatically in the next CFP contract. In those circumstances, it's in your best interest to be in the strongest group of schools you can be in when big changes are occurring. The Big Sky will get left in the 3rd tier no matter what. The Summit/MVFC likely would too. But there's a chance a Great North could get into the 2nd tier when the dust settles, and I'm all about giving my school the best chance possible.

(12-02-2017 07:49 PM)NoDak Wrote:  

(12-02-2017 05:02 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  

(12-02-2017 12:02 AM)LatahCounty Wrote:  I don't argue with the logic here, but you also say this has been in the works since the collapse of WAC football. I know, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that Idaho has not had anything to do with anything like this at least through 2016, I don't have any evidence that Idaho leadership has worked on this project in 2017, and there's plenty of evidence that they remain as clueless and frozen as ever.

Maybe the Dakotas and Montanas have been working on this secretly and plan to drag Idaho in at the last minute. I don't know. But I really doubt it.

By the way, if I'm going along with this I don't really understand why you're so sure EWU is in. They're not a particularly good school, don't have much money, and are an afterthought in their state. Doesn't really fit the profile if a big part of the selling point is an academic affiliation. I get the travel partner thing but if that's the need then why not Seattle U?

His Dakota conference dream falls apart every time EWU is brought into the discussion. If his conference wet dream really is about like minded schools banding together to go at it in FB, then EWU has no business in the discussion. FFS it take a 2.0 and pulse to get into that school...and as you pointed out they are broke AF.

Weber St is able if EWU cant. They don't give great travel partners, but they are more than capable. Try again.

Weber is another open enrollment school. Try again.

(12-02-2017 12:12 AM)NoDak Wrote:  

(12-02-2017 12:02 AM)LatahCounty Wrote:  

(12-01-2017 09:58 PM)NoDak Wrote:  There is no question that the Montana, Dakota, Denver and Idaho Presidents find it academically attractive. Think they see it as athletically attractive too.

UND and NDSU fans absolutely hate each other.
Same goes for the Montana's and South Dakota's too but maybe not so much.
The Montana / North Dakota rivalry has always been strong especially in western ND and eastern Montana.
UND ties in Denver and Omaha by way of hockey, as that is the centerpiece sport for each of them and they want and need that in other sports. Montana and NDSU fb fans always seem to be talking about each other.
UND and NDSU have built budgets that dwarf the Montana's and Idaho but not overpowering like the MWC budget.
The Montanas are bound to each other.
SDSU will follow NDSU like a little lambs or rather like good bunny rabbits, as they always have.
USD needs SDSU and Omaha.
Idaho knows it needs the Montana's after its experience with Boise St, which has renounced their former rivalry.
EWU needs Idaho and the Montana's for attendance and relevance. EWU without them is almost unthinkable. Portland St would be a booby prize in comparison.

The only school left in the Big Sky that could roll with this group is Weber St.

The league is would be one of the most stable ones out there except the P5 minus the B12 and the Ivy League. Its just a matter of time and only one of IPFW, ORU, or W Illinois needs to leave so the votes are there. Its a slam dunk easy prediction. Yet Jacksfan still complains because Sioux Falls won't host so much.

I don't argue with the logic here, but you also say this has been in the works since the collapse of WAC football. I know, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that Idaho has not had anything to do with anything like this at least through 2016, and I don't have any evidence that Idaho leadership has worked on this project in 2017, and plenty of evidence that they remain as clueless and frozen as ever.

Maybe the Dakotas and Montanas have been working on this secretly and plan to drag Idaho in at the last minute. I don't know. But I really doubt it.

By the way, if I'm going along with this I don't really understand why you're so sure EWU is in. They're not a particularly good school, don't have much money, and are an afterthought in their state. Doesn't really fit the profile if a big part of the selling point is an academic affiliation. I get the travel partner thing but if that's the need then why not Seattle U?

Idaho moved from the WAC to the Big Sky to be with the Montana's and EWU when they could have stayed in the WAC and been Seattle's travel partner. That move wasn't about the Big Sky but about a subset of it they need to associate with.

EWU is desperately trying to raise funds for an FBS minimum stadium. That tells me a lot.

All of the football schools have taken steps in which FBS is more probable, except Idaho of course but associating with the Montana's and EWU again will make FBS more financially viable.

Idaho moved back to the Big Sky because no one and I mean no one else wanted them. They were booted from the lowest rated FBS conference. They are a great fit in the Big Sky and will do well there.

Eastern Washington is a success story by doing more with less. Considering what they have to work with, they are to be commended.


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If four or two sets of travel partners are the plan for a Great Northern conference. Portland St would be a solid pick. Think Georgia St solid academics biggest school in Oregon. So a student fee goes a long way. Stadium is increasing to 24k. They are currently rebuilding their arena . Just like GSU no fan support . They also have no need for a right sized stadium .They would be better off in a MAC type conference facilities wise.

Rob Spear Idaho's AD and the former BSC chief have talked about a new Western FBS conference. The last time Rob talked about it I remember he switched his tune. The new message was research institutions coming together. He mentioned the Montana's and Dakota's. I believe NAU and PSU would qualify . With the Summit at nine UI, UM and MSU could join for twelve. That would increase the chances of W Illinois ,PUFW and ORU leaving. If one leaves the current Northern and Westernmost members could vote them in. Kicking people out will not happen.
ORU to the WAC does make sense. I guess Summit schools could take three game road trips for UI, UM and MSU.


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(12-03-2017 11:09 PM)MJG Wrote:  If four or two sets of travel partners are the plan for a Great Northern conference. Portland St would be a solid pick. Think Georgia St solid academics biggest school in Oregon. So a student fee goes a long way. Stadium is increasing to 24k. They are currently rebuilding their arena . Just like GSU no fan support . They also have no need for a right sized stadium .They would be better off in a MAC type conference facilities wise.

Rob Spear Idaho's AD and the former BSC chief have talked about a new Western FBS conference. The last time Rob talked about it I remember he switched his tune. The new message was research institutions coming together. He mentioned the Montana's and Dakota's. I believe NAU and PSU would qualify . With the Summit at nine UI, UM and MSU could join for twelve. That would increase the chances of W Illinois ,PUFW and ORU leaving. If one leaves the current Northern and Westernmost members could vote them in. Kicking people out will not happen.
ORU to the WAC does make sense. I guess Summit schools could take three game road trips for UI, UM and MSU.


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Don't get NoDak too excited. Spear never talked about the Dakotas. He may have mentioned UND since it was still in the Big Sky when he was saying this stuff, but definitely not any other Dakota school.

The Summit remake into a Great Northern conference is going to happen. Period.

Right now, SDSU and NDSU are in the FCS quarterfinals. After they are through their will be more news.

Sam Houston St is also in the quarters, which is holding up WAC expansion news.

The Dakotas and the Montanas/Idaho have never shared a conference. Why does anyone think there is a desire now?

(12-04-2017 01:31 AM)NoDak Wrote:  The Summit remake into a Great Northern conference is going to happen. Period.

Right now, SDSU and NDSU are in the FCS quarterfinals. After they are through their will be more news.

Sam Houston St is also in the quarters, which is holding up WAC expansion news.

Cool, the time frame has moved up. I can't wait. Hopefully the big announcement will wait until after SDSU and NDSU play for an FCS title in January.

(12-04-2017 12:58 PM)jacksfan29 Wrote:  

(12-04-2017 01:31 AM)NoDak Wrote:  The Summit remake into a Great Northern conference is going to happen. Period.

Right now, SDSU and NDSU are in the FCS quarterfinals. After they are through their will be more news.

Sam Houston St is also in the quarters, which is holding up WAC expansion news.

Cool, the time frame has moved up. I can't wait. Hopefully the big announcement will wait until after SDSU and NDSU play for an FCS title in January.

Kind of off topic here, but it's to bad they couldn't change the location of the game if that were to happen. I could see 35k or more showing up for that game. It would be awesome.

(12-04-2017 11:57 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  The Dakotas and the Montanas/Idaho have never shared a conference. Why does anyone think there is a desire now?

Because by gawd some way, some how, UND is going to be FBS.

(12-04-2017 01:18 PM)Bronco85 Wrote:  

(12-04-2017 11:57 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  The Dakotas and the Montanas/Idaho have never shared a conference. Why does anyone think there is a desire now?

Because by gawd some way, some how, UND is going to be FBS.

As we will be gifted an FBS stadium.

UND is the only common denominator in the new Great Northern, as we have shared conferences with every member.

(12-04-2017 01:29 PM)NoDak Wrote:  

(12-04-2017 01:18 PM)Bronco85 Wrote:  

(12-04-2017 11:57 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  The Dakotas and the Montanas/Idaho have never shared a conference. Why does anyone think there is a desire now?

Because by gawd some way, some how, UND is going to be FBS.

As we will be gifted an FBS stadium.

UND is the only common denominator in the new Great Northern, as we have shared conferences with every member.

Right, because the world revolves around Grand Forks. Those kids in Montana are doing somersaults at the prospect of trading trips to California, Arizona, Oregon, etc for winter in the Dakotas.

(12-04-2017 02:18 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  

(12-04-2017 01:29 PM)NoDak Wrote:  

(12-04-2017 01:18 PM)Bronco85 Wrote:  

(12-04-2017 11:57 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  The Dakotas and the Montanas/Idaho have never shared a conference. Why does anyone think there is a desire now?

Because by gawd some way, some how, UND is going to be FBS.

As we will be gifted an FBS stadium.

UND is the only common denominator in the new Great Northern, as we have shared conferences with every member.

Right, because the world revolves around Grand Forks. Those kids in Montana are doing somersaults at the prospect of trading trips to California, Arizona, Oregon, etc for winter in the Dakotas.

On the contrary, Grand ForksIan's know It isn't the center of the world, but are grateful and gracious in remembering what it brought into their lives.

(12-04-2017 01:07 PM)Shox Wrote:  

(12-04-2017 12:58 PM)jacksfan29 Wrote:  

(12-04-2017 01:31 AM)NoDak Wrote:  The Summit remake into a Great Northern conference is going to happen. Period.

Right now, SDSU and NDSU are in the FCS quarterfinals. After they are through their will be more news.

Sam Houston St is also in the quarters, which is holding up WAC expansion news.

Cool, the time frame has moved up. I can't wait. Hopefully the big announcement will wait until after SDSU and NDSU play for an FCS title in January.

Kind of off topic here, but it's to bad they couldn't change the location of the game if that were to happen. I could see 35k or more showing up for that game. It would be awesome.

The NCAA takes bids. It will be in Texas for a long time. But yes, move the game to Minneapolis and you would fill the new Gopher stadium. Although, in January that could be a pretty cold game.

SDSU has to go through James Madison (and New Hampshire). I'd put the odds at less then 50% that the game happens.

Western Illinois is playing both Montana and Montana State this year.
http://goleathernecks.com/schedule.aspx?path=football

Clearly Western Illinois is now a part of the Summit League transforming into the Great North Conference now.

(02-02-2018 09:56 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  Western Illinois is playing both Montana and Montana State this year.
http://goleathernecks.com/schedule.aspx?path=football

Clearly Western Illinois is now a part of the Summit League transforming into the Great North Conference now.

Know this is a joke post, but Montana scheduled a Home and Away series because their fans are tired of the Savannah St and Valpo out of conference games. W Ill has lost their last two fb coaches for bailing to richer institutions. Things are not well in Macomb, although their fb program has been the shining star of their athletic.

Western Illinois needs the MVFC but will chose the OVC because of their atrocious financials.

(02-03-2018 09:39 AM)NoDak Wrote:  

(02-02-2018 09:56 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  Western Illinois is playing both Montana and Montana State this year.
http://goleathernecks.com/schedule.aspx?path=football

Clearly Western Illinois is now a part of the Summit League transforming into the Great North Conference now.

Know this is a joke post, but Montana scheduled a Home and Away series because their fans are tired of the Savannah St and Valpo out of conference games. W Ill has lost their last two fb coaches for bailing to richer institutions. Things are not well in Macomb, although their fb program has been the shining star of their athletic.

Western Illinois needs the MVFC but will chose the OVC because of their atrocious financials.

So when Montana and MSU play Dakota schools OOC, it's a harbinger of the Summit's apotheosis into the FBS Great Northern Conference. But when they play Summit LEague member Western Illinois, it's just an OOC game with no greater significance.

Alrighty then.