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+---- Thread: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? (/thread-829120.html)
What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - EigenEagle - 10-05-2017 04:28 PM
The bill that has passed the House makes an exception for life endangerment of the mother.
Basically, we're joining the rest of the civilized world (including liberal Europe) and putting a restriction on how late in the pregnancy.
Of course, groups like Planned Parenthood (who insist late term abortions are rare) have no recourse except to claim some kind of slippery slope fallacy.
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - Claw - 10-05-2017 04:41 PM
(10-05-2017 04:28 PM)EigenEagle Wrote: The bill that has passed the House makes an exception for life endangerment of the mother.
Basically, we're joining the rest of the civilized world (including liberal Europe) and putting a restriction on how late in the pregnancy.
Of course, groups like Planned Parenthood (who insist late term abortions are rare) have no recourse except to claim some kind of slippery slope fallacy.
Most of those civilized countries don't allow their subjects to own guns either.
I don't think federal government has the right to do anything on this.
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - umbluegray - 10-05-2017 05:01 PM
(10-05-2017 04:41 PM)Claw Wrote:(10-05-2017 04:28 PM)EigenEagle Wrote: The bill that has passed the House makes an exception for life endangerment of the mother.
Basically, we're joining the rest of the civilized world (including liberal Europe) and putting a restriction on how late in the pregnancy.
Of course, groups like Planned Parenthood (who insist late term abortions are rare) have no recourse except to claim some kind of slippery slope fallacy.
Most of those civilized countries don't allow their subjects to own guns either.
I don't the federal government has the right to do anything on this.
If the federal government has no say on life & death then why do we have laws against murder?
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - Claw - 10-05-2017 05:03 PM
(10-05-2017 05:01 PM)umbluegray Wrote:(10-05-2017 04:41 PM)Claw Wrote:(10-05-2017 04:28 PM)EigenEagle Wrote: The bill that has passed the House makes an exception for life endangerment of the mother.
Basically, we're joining the rest of the civilized world (including liberal Europe) and putting a restriction on how late in the pregnancy.
Of course, groups like Planned Parenthood (who insist late term abortions are rare) have no recourse except to claim some kind of slippery slope fallacy.
Most of those civilized countries don't allow their subjects to own guns either.
I don't the federal government has the right to do anything on this.
If the federal government has no say on life & death then why do we have laws against murder?
I didn't say we couldn't have laws on this. I said I don't think the federal government has the authority to do anything on this. I fail to see where this power is granted to them.
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - mptnstr@44 - 10-05-2017 07:36 PM
The 5th Amendment offers protections to our "life, liberty, or property," noting we cannot be deprived of any of them without due process of law.
No one would argue that in an abortion a life is taken and there is no process of law before taking each life.
The question has always been when does an unborn qualify as an American citizen whose life is guaranteed protection via the Constitution.
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - Claw - 10-05-2017 08:22 PM
Do you really want the government making your wife's medical decisions?
That's where this ends. The state statistics say procedure a is more likely to keep your baby alive so your doctor will have no legal choice in treatment.
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - EigenEagle - 10-05-2017 09:17 PM
(10-05-2017 08:22 PM)Claw Wrote: Do you really want the government making your wife's medical decisions?
That's where this ends. The state statistics say procedure a is more likely to keep your baby alive so your doctor will have no legal choice in treatment.
I want the government to protect innocent life.
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - Claw - 10-05-2017 10:11 PM
(10-05-2017 09:17 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:(10-05-2017 08:22 PM)Claw Wrote: Do you really want the government making your wife's medical decisions?
That's where this ends. The state statistics say procedure a is more likely to keep your baby alive so your doctor will have no legal choice in treatment.
I want the government to protect innocent life.
Can they do it better than you? You need to really think about that.
Once you let them have that power, you will never regain control. Sure, today maybe it's no abortion past 20 weeks. But what will it be after that? Once you concede they have that power, they can change the rules. Then you are powerless.
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - umbluegray - 10-06-2017 12:13 AM
(10-05-2017 08:22 PM)Claw Wrote: Do you really want the government making your wife's medical decisions?
That's where this ends. The state statistics say procedure a is more likely to keep your baby alive so your doctor will have no legal choice in treatment.
Medical decision for personal convenience or for survival?
Big difference in the statistics when comparing the two.
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - umbluegray - 10-06-2017 12:15 AM
(10-05-2017 10:11 PM)Claw Wrote:(10-05-2017 09:17 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:(10-05-2017 08:22 PM)Claw Wrote: Do you really want the government making your wife's medical decisions?
That's where this ends. The state statistics say procedure a is more likely to keep your baby alive so your doctor will have no legal choice in treatment.
I want the government to protect innocent life.
Can they do it better than you? You need to really think about that.
Once you let them have that power, you will never regain control. Sure, today maybe it's no abortion past 20 weeks. But what will it be after that? Once you concede they have that power, they can change the rules. Then you are powerless.
The government already protects innocent life with laws against murder.
These laws have even been applied in some cases to protect unborn children, e.g. filing two counts of murder when a pregnant woman is killed.
The unborn baby is a living human being. Distinct DNA. Human DNA.
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - Machiavelli - 10-06-2017 05:46 AM
HIPPA laws....... enough said. You have zero right to tell someone how to live their lives. This is a decision between a Dr and the family. Only God can judge. Not you! 1 out of 4 pregnancies have some type of chromosomal issue. Most of these are miscarried.
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - Paul M - 10-06-2017 07:11 AM
Murder is a crime. Government now has power it shouldn't have telling women they can ignore a universal law and murder their own children. Who the **** gave that power to government. How is that not WAY overstepping the powers granted to them.
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - Hood-rich - 10-06-2017 07:20 AM
(10-06-2017 05:46 AM)Machiavelli Wrote: HIPPA laws....... enough said. You have zero right to tell someone how to live their lives. This is a decision between a Dr and the family. Only God can judge. Not you! 1 out of 4 pregnancies have some type of chromosomal issue. Most of these are miscarried.God WILL judge.
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What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - mptnstr@44 - 10-06-2017 08:18 AM
(10-05-2017 10:11 PM)Claw Wrote:(10-05-2017 09:17 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:(10-05-2017 08:22 PM)Claw Wrote: Do you really want the government making your wife's medical decisions?
That's where this ends. The state statistics say procedure a is more likely to keep your baby alive so your doctor will have no legal choice in treatment.
I want the government to protect innocent life.
Can they do it better than you? You need to really think about that.
Once you let them have that power, you will never regain control. Sure, today maybe it's no abortion past 20 weeks. But what will it be after that? Once you concede they have that power, they can change the rules. Then you are powerless.
are for universal healthcare?
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - Claw - 10-06-2017 09:15 AM
(10-06-2017 08:18 AM)mptnstr@44 Wrote:(10-05-2017 10:11 PM)Claw Wrote:(10-05-2017 09:17 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:(10-05-2017 08:22 PM)Claw Wrote: Do you really want the government making your wife's medical decisions?
That's where this ends. The state statistics say procedure a is more likely to keep your baby alive so your doctor will have no legal choice in treatment.
I want the government to protect innocent life.
Can they do it better than you? You need to really think about that.
Once you let them have that power, you will never regain control. Sure, today maybe it's no abortion past 20 weeks. But what will it be after that? Once you concede they have that power, they can change the rules. Then you are powerless.
are for universal healthcare?
Me? Hell no.
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - bullet - 10-06-2017 12:25 PM
(10-05-2017 10:11 PM)Claw Wrote:(10-05-2017 09:17 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:(10-05-2017 08:22 PM)Claw Wrote: Do you really want the government making your wife's medical decisions?
That's where this ends. The state statistics say procedure a is more likely to keep your baby alive so your doctor will have no legal choice in treatment.
I want the government to protect innocent life.
Can they do it better than you? You need to really think about that.
Once you let them have that power, you will never regain control. Sure, today maybe it's no abortion past 20 weeks. But what will it be after that? Once you concede they have that power, they can change the rules. Then you are powerless.
They already have that power. Abortion is generally banned in the 3rd trimester. Roe v. Wade was a "legislative" compromise that only limited laws on abortion prior to what was considered viability at that time. The time frame of "viability" has moved forward with technology.
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - geosnooker2000 - 10-06-2017 12:51 PM
(10-06-2017 12:25 PM)bullet Wrote:(10-05-2017 10:11 PM)Claw Wrote:(10-05-2017 09:17 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:(10-05-2017 08:22 PM)Claw Wrote: Do you really want the government making your wife's medical decisions?
That's where this ends. The state statistics say procedure a is more likely to keep your baby alive so your doctor will have no legal choice in treatment.
I want the government to protect innocent life.
Can they do it better than you? You need to really think about that.
Once you let them have that power, you will never regain control. Sure, today maybe it's no abortion past 20 weeks. But what will it be after that? Once you concede they have that power, they can change the rules. Then you are powerless.
They already have that power. Abortion is generally banned in the 3rd trimester. Roe v. Wade was a "legislative" compromise that only limited laws on abortion prior to what was considered viability at that time. The time frame of "viability" has moved forward with technology.
If that is true, how are doctors getting away with partial birth abortion?
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - bullet - 10-06-2017 02:06 PM
(10-06-2017 12:51 PM)geosnooker2000 Wrote:(10-06-2017 12:25 PM)bullet Wrote:(10-05-2017 10:11 PM)Claw Wrote:(10-05-2017 09:17 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:(10-05-2017 08:22 PM)Claw Wrote: Do you really want the government making your wife's medical decisions?
That's where this ends. The state statistics say procedure a is more likely to keep your baby alive so your doctor will have no legal choice in treatment.
I want the government to protect innocent life.
Can they do it better than you? You need to really think about that.
Once you let them have that power, you will never regain control. Sure, today maybe it's no abortion past 20 weeks. But what will it be after that? Once you concede they have that power, they can change the rules. Then you are powerless.
They already have that power. Abortion is generally banned in the 3rd trimester. Roe v. Wade was a "legislative" compromise that only limited laws on abortion prior to what was considered viability at that time. The time frame of "viability" has moved forward with technology.
If that is true, how are doctors getting away with partial birth abortion?
The laws aren't the same in every state.
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - Machiavelli - 10-06-2017 03:42 PM
Also boys sometimes chromosomal problems don’t pop up until after the 20th week. We didn’t even know there was an issue until the 5th month. They saw a bubble on the umbilical cord and then they ordered an ambioscentisis. Remember it like it was yesterday. We had a day to decide whether to terminate the pregnancy. That was a fun ride home. Just trust me. The govt and you have now business in telling a family what they should do with their lives. Can any of you pro lifers think for a second the hidden resentment you would have if you were forced to care for a child that needed 24-7 nursing care? That HAS to be a decision YOU made not anybody else.
RE: What's wrong with banning abortion after 20 weeks? - Paul M - 10-06-2017 04:25 PM
It's not an either or, murder/care for a baby you don't want. You don't want to care for a baby, no one is going to force you to. Leave the hospital without it. **** off and go have a wonderful life.
Jeez, it's none of my godamn business if a man tires of his wife and shoots her.
Most spouses would leave. The other option, murder, gets you life in prison, possibly death. Because, well, like snuffing out the life of your innocent child, it's MURDER.