(04-24-2017 12:11 PM)TiminMem23 Wrote:  We all love Conley. But when someone says he's underrated, I would want to know exactly what he/she means by that. I think most bball fans respect his game and know how good he is. But at the same time, he's not better than Kyrie, CP3, Steph, Russ, Harden or Dame Lillard. I'm sure many would argue that he's not better than Isaiah Thomas or John (to the Window to the) Wall, either. He's a top 10 PG for sure. But he's not in the top 5.

(04-24-2017 12:31 PM)tiger1016 Wrote:  

(04-24-2017 12:11 PM)TiminMem23 Wrote:  We all love Conley. But when someone says he's underrated, I would want to know exactly what he/she means by that. I think most bball fans respect his game and know how good he is. But at the same time, he's not better than Kyrie, CP3, Steph, Russ, Harden or Dame Lillard. I'm sure many would argue that he's not better than Isaiah Thomas or John (to the Window to the) Wall, either. He's a top 10 PG for sure. But he's not in the top 5.

Dame Lillard is debatable...he's a terrible defender and seems awesome cuz of his offense only.

(04-24-2017 12:35 PM)TiminMem23 Wrote:  

(04-24-2017 12:31 PM)tiger1016 Wrote:  

(04-24-2017 12:11 PM)TiminMem23 Wrote:  We all love Conley. But when someone says he's underrated, I would want to know exactly what he/she means by that. I think most bball fans respect his game and know how good he is. But at the same time, he's not better than Kyrie, CP3, Steph, Russ, Harden or Dame Lillard. I'm sure many would argue that he's not better than Isaiah Thomas or John (to the Window to the) Wall, either. He's a top 10 PG for sure. But he's not in the top 5.

Dame Lillard is debatable...he's a terrible defender and seems awesome cuz of his offense only.

A case can definitely be made for Conley in the 6-7 range in terms of best PGs. You can't put him in the top 5 though.

Unfortunately for Conley, most of those guys are in the West. That's what's prevented him from being an All Star.

(04-24-2017 12:42 PM)Tigx Wrote:  Just two years ago, when we demolished Portland 4-1, if you had asked anyone at the end of that series who the better PG was, they would have taken Mike for sure.

And Kyrie is a worse defender than Dame. Kyrie was on the bench while the Cavs erased the 25 point 2nd half deficit against Indiana a few days ago. Can one imagine Mike being on the bench in a similar circumstance for the Grizz?

Mike is never going to put up the regular season numbers guys like Dame or Kyrie do. We initiate a lot of the offense through Marc, and except for ZBo don't run a lot of ISO.
But today, if Mike is healthy, in a playoff series, I would take him over Dame or Kyrie.

(04-24-2017 12:49 PM)TiminMem23 Wrote:  

(04-24-2017 12:42 PM)Tigx Wrote:  Just two years ago, when we demolished Portland 4-1, if you had asked anyone at the end of that series who the better PG was, they would have taken Mike for sure.

And Kyrie is a worse defender than Dame. Kyrie was on the bench while the Cavs erased the 25 point 2nd half deficit against Indiana a few days ago. Can one imagine Mike being on the bench in a similar circumstance for the Grizz?

Mike is never going to put up the regular season numbers guys like Dame or Kyrie do. We initiate a lot of the offense through Marc, and except for ZBo don't run a lot of ISO.
But today, if Mike is healthy, in a playoff series, I would take him over Dame or Kyrie.

And you would be the only person on the planet who is not a Grizzlies fan who would say that. Not trying to argue or belittle your opinion, but that is the truth. Saying you'd take Conley over Kyrie is crazy talk.

(04-24-2017 12:49 PM)TiminMem23 Wrote:  

(04-24-2017 12:42 PM)Tigx Wrote:  Just two years ago, when we demolished Portland 4-1, if you had asked anyone at the end of that series who the better PG was, they would have taken Mike for sure.

And Kyrie is a worse defender than Dame. Kyrie was on the bench while the Cavs erased the 25 point 2nd half deficit against Indiana a few days ago. Can one imagine Mike being on the bench in a similar circumstance for the Grizz?

Mike is never going to put up the regular season numbers guys like Dame or Kyrie do. We initiate a lot of the offense through Marc, and except for ZBo don't run a lot of ISO.
But today, if Mike is healthy, in a playoff series, I would take him over Dame or Kyrie.

And you would be the only person on the planet who is not a Grizzlies fan who would say that. Not trying to argue or belittle your opinion, but that is the truth. Saying you'd take Conley over Kyrie is crazy talk.

(04-24-2017 01:01 PM)Tigx Wrote:  

(04-24-2017 12:49 PM)TiminMem23 Wrote:  

(04-24-2017 12:42 PM)Tigx Wrote:  Just two years ago, when we demolished Portland 4-1, if you had asked anyone at the end of that series who the better PG was, they would have taken Mike for sure.

And Kyrie is a worse defender than Dame. Kyrie was on the bench while the Cavs erased the 25 point 2nd half deficit against Indiana a few days ago. Can one imagine Mike being on the bench in a similar circumstance for the Grizz?

Mike is never going to put up the regular season numbers guys like Dame or Kyrie do. We initiate a lot of the offense through Marc, and except for ZBo don't run a lot of ISO.
But today, if Mike is healthy, in a playoff series, I would take him over Dame or Kyrie.

And you would be the only person on the planet who is not a Grizzlies fan who would say that. Not trying to argue or belittle your opinion, but that is the truth. Saying you'd take Conley over Kyrie is crazy talk.

Not really Tinmen. If you listen to a lot of the NBA podcast guys like Woj or Zach Lowe or Mike Duncan or even Bill Simmons, Kyrie is not held in near as a high esteem by them as the fans.

Kyrie is a splashy ISO scorer, so he gets the highlight plays, but he's pretty average in everything else he does. And he's a minus defender, really bad. When Lebron takes a rest day, or is off the court and Kryie's is playing, the Cavs net number tanks. Which is why Lebron still has to play 40 MPG in the playoffs. Lebron makes a lot of guys look better than they are. If Lebron were to ever miss a month of the season, IMO we would see that Love and Kyrie are not all that.

I would take John Wall all day over Kyrie. As well as the normal West top 4 - Curry, Westbrook, Harden and CP3. I'd have Conley 6th.

(04-24-2017 01:07 PM)TiminMem23 Wrote:  

(04-24-2017 01:01 PM)Tigx Wrote:  

(04-24-2017 12:49 PM)TiminMem23 Wrote:  

(04-24-2017 12:42 PM)Tigx Wrote:  Just two years ago, when we demolished Portland 4-1, if you had asked anyone at the end of that series who the better PG was, they would have taken Mike for sure.

And Kyrie is a worse defender than Dame. Kyrie was on the bench while the Cavs erased the 25 point 2nd half deficit against Indiana a few days ago. Can one imagine Mike being on the bench in a similar circumstance for the Grizz?

Mike is never going to put up the regular season numbers guys like Dame or Kyrie do. We initiate a lot of the offense through Marc, and except for ZBo don't run a lot of ISO.
But today, if Mike is healthy, in a playoff series, I would take him over Dame or Kyrie.

And you would be the only person on the planet who is not a Grizzlies fan who would say that. Not trying to argue or belittle your opinion, but that is the truth. Saying you'd take Conley over Kyrie is crazy talk.

Not really Tinmen. If you listen to a lot of the NBA podcast guys like Woj or Zach Lowe or Mike Duncan or even Bill Simmons, Kyrie is not held in near as a high esteem by them as the fans.

Kyrie is a splashy ISO scorer, so he gets the highlight plays, but he's pretty average in everything else he does. And he's a minus defender, really bad. When Lebron takes a rest day, or is off the court and Kryie's is playing, the Cavs net number tanks. Which is why Lebron still has to play 40 MPG in the playoffs. Lebron makes a lot of guys look better than they are. If Lebron were to ever miss a month of the season, IMO we would see that Love and Kyrie are not all that.

I would take John Wall all day over Kyrie. As well as the normal West top 4 - Curry, Westbrook, Harden and CP3. I'd have Conley 6th.

Agree to disagree on Conley vs. Kyrie. Regardless, point remains that Conley is not a top 5 PG and is a 0 time all star.

I like Conley. Everyone does. But he's not elite. I define elite is a top 5 guy at your position. He's close, just not quite there.

(04-24-2017 01:24 PM)Tigx Wrote:  # of All Star games is not a big ranking criteria for me, but if it is for others, that's OK.

Not really Mike's fault that he's in a conference with Curry, Westbrook, Harden and CP3. If Memphis was in the East, he'd be the same player and have multiple All Star berths.

(04-24-2017 01:16 PM)cscottl1981 Wrote:  Conley has turned out way better than people originally thought based upon his first few years. All Star or not, I'm glad to see the progression he has made. He was a very good college basketball player and has developed into a solid pro as well.

(04-24-2017 11:08 AM)mempho_to_diego Wrote:  here you go: you're welcome.

https://twitter.com/NBAonTNT/status/856364678045356032/video/1

(04-24-2017 01:52 PM)TiminMem23 Wrote:  

(04-24-2017 01:16 PM)cscottl1981 Wrote:  Conley has turned out way better than people originally thought based upon his first few years. All Star or not, I'm glad to see the progression he has made. He was a very good college basketball player and has developed into a solid pro as well.

Yes, 100%. There was a time early in his NBA career when lots of people were saying you can't win with him at PG. He proved that argument wrong and then some.

I'd say he's more than a solid pro. He's really, really good. Maybe not elite, but he's just a notch below that level.