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+----- Thread: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU (/thread-813297.html)
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - CameramanJ - 03-27-2017 07:26 PM
I think the lack of a postseason for us this year needs to be a standard that we hold ourselves to from now on. NCAAT (C-USA champs or otherwise), NIT, or nothing. I used to like those crap third-tier tournaments just to watch the team play, but we need to re-establish standards and hold ourselves to them. Instill discipline, focus, and drive in the system. Once that pride is there, tap the passion behind it and use that raw force to win some important games. Then, and only then, do I see us playing loose, fun, and entertaining. And don't get me wrong, I hope that day is coming soon
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - ODU AGGIE - 03-27-2017 07:30 PM
(03-27-2017 02:55 PM)757ODU Wrote:(03-27-2017 02:55 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:(03-27-2017 01:01 PM)odu09 Wrote:(03-27-2017 12:24 PM)ODU BBALL Wrote:(03-27-2017 11:35 AM)monarx Wrote: And it stings that much more when two of our three arch-rivals have been to the F4 and we can't even get to the sweet 16.
Even worse ... we are ridiculed if we so much as aspire to reach that goal as our peers have done. You know, it's sort of like how former president Kennedy in the early 60's aspired for the United States to go to the moon before the end of the decade. Not because it was easy, but because it was hard.
Guess I am more of the Bobby Wilder mind set ... AIM HIGH!!!
I am not ridiculing you. You are correct that my original post was mostly sarcastic, as I am at this time of year. I'm hurting too. It hurts that we are where we are. There's nothing wrong with high aspirations, and I commend you for them.
The problem lies with those who think we are entitled to NCAAT victories or a trip to the Final 4 because our rival did it. Or that one time we lost by a put back bucket, that team went on to win the whole thing, so that was our chance... right? I don't agree with those statements. Just because Butler went on to keep winning doesn't mean that our ODU team would have done the same. We are stuck in our history of what ifs that we forget we have never done better than winning a game in the NCAAT.
I don't think anyone thinks we are entitled to anything, just that we are capable of much more than we are currently achieving. As long as we keep saying we just are who we are, and we should not expect to be anything better than the 120th best team in the nation on average, we will never get any better. I will never be ready to settle for what we have, because if you aren't striving to get better, you are settling.
+1
Does anyone doubt that JJ, his staff, and the team are striving to get better? I not only believe they are striving daily to get better, I also believe they will be better next year than they were this year.
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - EverRespect - 03-27-2017 07:33 PM
(03-27-2017 07:30 PM)ODU AGGIE Wrote:Are there any coaching staffs in the country not trying to get better? Alas, there are still going to be a lot of bad teams. Are you proposing participation trophies? Maybe a banner at the Ted that says "2018 - Improved from 140 to 128".(03-27-2017 02:55 PM)757ODU Wrote:(03-27-2017 02:55 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:(03-27-2017 01:01 PM)odu09 Wrote:(03-27-2017 12:24 PM)ODU BBALL Wrote: Even worse ... we are ridiculed if we so much as aspire to reach that goal as our peers have done. You know, it's sort of like how former president Kennedy in the early 60's aspired for the United States to go to the moon before the end of the decade. Not because it was easy, but because it was hard.
Guess I am more of the Bobby Wilder mind set ... AIM HIGH!!!
I am not ridiculing you. You are correct that my original post was mostly sarcastic, as I am at this time of year. I'm hurting too. It hurts that we are where we are. There's nothing wrong with high aspirations, and I commend you for them.
The problem lies with those who think we are entitled to NCAAT victories or a trip to the Final 4 because our rival did it. Or that one time we lost by a put back bucket, that team went on to win the whole thing, so that was our chance... right? I don't agree with those statements. Just because Butler went on to keep winning doesn't mean that our ODU team would have done the same. We are stuck in our history of what ifs that we forget we have never done better than winning a game in the NCAAT.
I don't think anyone thinks we are entitled to anything, just that we are capable of much more than we are currently achieving. As long as we keep saying we just are who we are, and we should not expect to be anything better than the 120th best team in the nation on average, we will never get any better. I will never be ready to settle for what we have, because if you aren't striving to get better, you are settling.
+1
Does anyone doubt that JJ, his staff, and the team are striving to get better? I not only believe they are striving daily to get better, I also believe they will be better next year than they were this year.
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RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - Monarchblue - 03-27-2017 07:53 PM
(03-27-2017 07:30 PM)ODU AGGIE Wrote:Yeah, I am not sure of the relevance here with regards to my post. Of course the coaches and team are working to get better. The post, however, was in reference to fans, boosters, and the athletic admin.(03-27-2017 02:55 PM)757ODU Wrote:(03-27-2017 02:55 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:(03-27-2017 01:01 PM)odu09 Wrote:(03-27-2017 12:24 PM)ODU BBALL Wrote: Even worse ... we are ridiculed if we so much as aspire to reach that goal as our peers have done. You know, it's sort of like how former president Kennedy in the early 60's aspired for the United States to go to the moon before the end of the decade. Not because it was easy, but because it was hard.
Guess I am more of the Bobby Wilder mind set ... AIM HIGH!!!
I am not ridiculing you. You are correct that my original post was mostly sarcastic, as I am at this time of year. I'm hurting too. It hurts that we are where we are. There's nothing wrong with high aspirations, and I commend you for them.
The problem lies with those who think we are entitled to NCAAT victories or a trip to the Final 4 because our rival did it. Or that one time we lost by a put back bucket, that team went on to win the whole thing, so that was our chance... right? I don't agree with those statements. Just because Butler went on to keep winning doesn't mean that our ODU team would have done the same. We are stuck in our history of what ifs that we forget we have never done better than winning a game in the NCAAT.
I don't think anyone thinks we are entitled to anything, just that we are capable of much more than we are currently achieving. As long as we keep saying we just are who we are, and we should not expect to be anything better than the 120th best team in the nation on average, we will never get any better. I will never be ready to settle for what we have, because if you aren't striving to get better, you are settling.
+1
Does anyone doubt that JJ, his staff, and the team are striving to get better? I not only believe they are striving daily to get better, I also believe they will be better next year than they were this year.
Sent from my Pixel C using Tapatalk
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - Gilesfan - 03-27-2017 08:09 PM
I think JJ was put in a tough position. People have hyped the "program" and ok, thats fine. But, the talent was almost non existent. I dont know this to be true, but people say it takes years to recruit guys and we see that Jones goes after high mid major talent. The fruits of that labor seem to be realized with hueitt and Godwin. That shows real improvement over the last decade.
Now, if the next two years are not good, i can certainly say this hire didnt work out. But I think people have been too harsh. Jones turned around the team in year 2. Year 3 was a disappointment losing in the conference finals. Year 4 was certainly a "rebuilding" year based on the circumstances of the roster.
I do like the makeup of the next 2 years. We'll see if that is false hope.
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - EverRespect - 03-27-2017 08:59 PM
My beef really isn't with Jones. I actually think he is a pretty good value for the low end of the pay scale. We are getting what we are paying for. My beef is with Wood for downgrading.
Can we just set the expectation as NCAA tournament next year? Is this not fair? Next year we make the tournament or the few remaining holdovers join the bandwagon?
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RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - mturn017 - 03-27-2017 09:10 PM
(03-27-2017 08:59 PM)EverRespect Wrote: My beef really isn't with Jones. I actually think he is a pretty good value for the low end of the pay scale. We are getting what we are paying for. My beef is with Wood for downgrading.
Can we just set the expectation as NCAA tournament next year? Is this not fair? Next year we make the tournament or the few remaining holdovers join the bandwagon?
Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk
I'm willing to give him 2 years but the NCAAT has to be the end result.
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - EverRespect - 03-28-2017 04:45 AM
(03-27-2017 09:10 PM)mturn017 Wrote:His contract ends next year. Giving him 2 years is going to cost a lot more.(03-27-2017 08:59 PM)EverRespect Wrote: My beef really isn't with Jones. I actually think he is a pretty good value for the low end of the pay scale. We are getting what we are paying for. My beef is with Wood for downgrading.
Can we just set the expectation as NCAA tournament next year? Is this not fair? Next year we make the tournament or the few remaining holdovers join the bandwagon?
Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk
I'm willing to give him 2 years but the NCAAT has to be the end result.
Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - AdoptedMonarch - 03-28-2017 06:02 AM
(03-27-2017 08:59 PM)EverRespect Wrote: My beef really isn't with Jones. I actually think he is a pretty good value for the low end of the pay scale. We are getting what we are paying for. My beef is with Wood for downgrading.
Can we just set the expectation as NCAA tournament next year? Is this not fair? Next year we make the tournament or the few remaining holdovers join the bandwagon?
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I'm not sure why you care what I think. No one else seems to. But since you are making room for me on the bandwagon, I will climb aboard when/if:
==> I get the sense that the players, as a group, have given up on Cosch Jones and on the program. I saw no indication whatsoever of that last season -- aside from a single reference to a semi-disgruntled tweet (or perhaps it was a Facebook post) from the mom of Khary Mauras.
==> I get the sense that students/fans/donors are giving up on the team. I know that we have seen lots of conclusory posts from many on this board that this is happening, but I've seen no real evidence of it. No, we are not at the level of excitement from the teams led by Loughton/Lee/Hassell/Bazemore. But neither are we in free fall, or anything like it. At least from what I see and hear, the local fans (and small-time donors), like me, are mostly pleased with the gradual development we are seeing with Coach Jones.
==> If I get the sense that the desire for athletic supremacy overrides the ethics of the program. We are not UNC We are not Memphis. We are not VCU. And thank God for that. Academics still matter. Recruiting needs to be clean. Stealing cellphones should not be a mere one-game suspension. Coach Jones, for all his lack of personality, is running a clean program. I appreciate that.
Thanks ER, sincerely, for the invitation to the bandwagon. I may join (and for the record I was an early protestor to the original hiring of Coach Jones). But, from my naive and ignorant perspective, he's doing okay. Not great. But okay.
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - Justanodufan - 03-28-2017 06:15 AM
(03-28-2017 04:45 AM)EverRespect Wrote:(03-27-2017 09:10 PM)mturn017 Wrote:His contract ends next year. Giving him 2 years is going to cost a lot more.(03-27-2017 08:59 PM)EverRespect Wrote: My beef really isn't with Jones. I actually think he is a pretty good value for the low end of the pay scale. We are getting what we are paying for. My beef is with Wood for downgrading.
Can we just set the expectation as NCAA tournament next year? Is this not fair? Next year we make the tournament or the few remaining holdovers join the bandwagon?
Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk
I'm willing to give him 2 years but the NCAAT has to be the end result.
Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk
His contract doesn't expire next year.
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - 757ODU - 03-28-2017 07:05 AM
(03-27-2017 08:09 PM)Gilesfan Wrote: I think JJ was put in a tough position. People have hyped the "program" and ok, thats fine. But, the talent was almost non existent. I dont know this to be true, but people say it takes years to recruit guys and we see that Jones goes after high mid major talent. The fruits of that labor seem to be realized with hueitt and Godwin. That shows real improvement over the last decade.
Now, if the next two years are not good, i can certainly say this hire didnt work out. But I think people have been too harsh. Jones turned around the team in year 2. Year 3 was a disappointment losing in the conference finals. Year 4 was certainly a "rebuilding" year based on the circumstances of the roster.
I do like the makeup of the next 2 years. We'll see if that is false hope.
Dude...You have the worst habit of forgetting about Xavier Green.
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - Gilesfan - 03-28-2017 07:17 AM
I like Green but those two are on a different level in terms of recruiting rankings.
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - EverRespect - 03-28-2017 07:25 AM
(03-28-2017 06:15 AM)Justanodufan Wrote:(03-28-2017 04:45 AM)EverRespect Wrote:(03-27-2017 09:10 PM)mturn017 Wrote:His contract ends next year. Giving him 2 years is going to cost a lot more.(03-27-2017 08:59 PM)EverRespect Wrote: My beef really isn't with Jones. I actually think he is a pretty good value for the low end of the pay scale. We are getting what we are paying for. My beef is with Wood for downgrading.
Can we just set the expectation as NCAA tournament next year? Is this not fair? Next year we make the tournament or the few remaining holdovers join the bandwagon?
Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk
I'm willing to give him 2 years but the NCAAT has to be the end result.
Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk
His contract doesn't expire next year.
Link?
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - 757ODU - 03-28-2017 07:26 AM
(03-28-2017 07:17 AM)Gilesfan Wrote: I like Green but those two are on a different level in terms of recruiting rankings.
Not according to ESPN. Also, Green had offers from Providence and Cincy.
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - ODUCoach - 03-28-2017 07:31 AM
(03-28-2017 07:17 AM)Gilesfan Wrote: I like Green but those two are on a different level in terms of recruiting rankings.
The two coming in were definitely higher ranked than Green. But, from people to whom I've talked who've seen them all play (but are not affiliated with the program), Green might have the highest ceiling of the three.
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - ODUalum78 - 03-28-2017 07:54 AM
(03-28-2017 07:25 AM)EverRespect Wrote:(03-28-2017 06:15 AM)Justanodufan Wrote:(03-28-2017 04:45 AM)EverRespect Wrote:(03-27-2017 09:10 PM)mturn017 Wrote:His contract ends next year. Giving him 2 years is going to cost a lot more.(03-27-2017 08:59 PM)EverRespect Wrote: My beef really isn't with Jones. I actually think he is a pretty good value for the low end of the pay scale. We are getting what we are paying for. My beef is with Wood for downgrading.
Can we just set the expectation as NCAA tournament next year? Is this not fair? Next year we make the tournament or the few remaining holdovers join the bandwagon?
Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk
I'm willing to give him 2 years but the NCAAT has to be the end result.
Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk
His contract doesn't expire next year.
Link?
Jones' base contract expires in 2018.
However, there is a dual rollover clause.
Jones himself could have extended the contract by one year in each of April of 2014 and 2015, and ODU's athletic director could/can exercise one-year rollovers thereafter.
If any of those has occurred, it has been kept quieter than any contract extension in history. That seems odd as I would think it would be strategically advantageous to publicize the extension(s) for the purpose of recruiting.
If the rollovers were not exercised, then it could be that the intent is a renegotiation of specifics of the original contract.
If no rollovers have been exercised, then the contract expires in 2018.
In any event, ODU should be forthcoming if queried, otherwise a FOIA request would guarantee the information.
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - Gilesfan - 03-28-2017 08:45 AM
(03-28-2017 07:31 AM)ODUCoach Wrote:(03-28-2017 07:17 AM)Gilesfan Wrote: I like Green but those two are on a different level in terms of recruiting rankings.
The two coming in were definitely higher ranked than Green. But, from people to whom I've talked who've seen them all play (but are not affiliated with the program), Green might have the highest ceiling of the three.
Yes and I've heard that from multiple people. I was just referring to strictly recruiting rankings when judging the level or recruiting Jones has done. Just pointing out that it has improved over the past couple years.
Green has the potential to have a better all around game than either due to his length and athleticism.
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - FearTheLion - 03-28-2017 09:32 AM
I really hope that potential goes kinetic before his senior year.
RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - EverRespect - 03-28-2017 07:20 PM
I just don't think we'll get significantly better next year. If we do it will have to be because Talley works his azz off and becomes all-CUSA and Caver gets the swagger back and holds it for the entire year and nobody gets suspended. We aren't going be better next year due to freshmen. It isn't a rebuilding year. Tallley, Caver, and the Stiths are JJ's guys and has had them for 2-3 years. If anyone can play his system it is them. Enough with the excuses.
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RE: Haynes and Fields leaving ODU - Gilesfan - 03-28-2017 07:31 PM
Its like people on this board dont expect players to get better throughout their career.