right- but I would say that end of the day, the packages are going to be really close to the same. I mean, 2 years ago, the game the week before- Michigan St/Ohio St- was higher rated than the Michigan/Ohio St game.

(05-16-2017 09:29 AM)stever20 Wrote:  right- but I would say that end of the day, the packages are going to be really close to the same. I mean, 2 years ago, the game the week before- Michigan St/Ohio St- was higher rated than the Michigan/Ohio St game.

Agreed - there's going to be a variance from year-to-year depending upon records. It's more about the value of a guarantee - there's a premium associated with being able to lock in the "best" worst case scenario when you're picking broadcast weeks 6 months in advance.

so looking we know 5 weeks are off the board....

would look like the following weeks are open- with the top games with those weeks-
Sep 2- Ohio St @ Indiana(8/31), Bowling Green @ Mich St, Akron @ Penn St, Washington @ Rutgers(9/1), Ball St @ Illinois, Wyoming @ Iowa, Arkansas St @ NEbraska, Nevada @ Northwestern, Utah St @ Wisconisn
Sep 16- Air Force @ Michigan, Army @ Ohio St, No Illinois @ Nebraska
Sep 30- Indiana @ Penn St, Maryland @ Minnesota, Iowa @ Mich St, Ohio St @ Rutgers, Nebraska @ Illinois(9/29), Northwestern @ Wisconsin
Oct 7-Michigan St @ Michigan, Wisconsin @ Nebraska
Oct 14- Ohio St @ Nebraska (this will go fast as not a good 2nd game)
Nov 4- Penn St @ Mich St, Ohio St @ Iowa
Nov 11- Mich St @ Ohio St, Iowa @ Wisconsin
Nov 18- Michigan @ Wisconsin, Nebraska @ Penn St,

So if I was ESPN, I would take the Ohio St/Nebraska game instead of Mich St/Michigan- getting Wisconsin/Nebraska for Oct 7 week...

So draft for like 7 weeks...
1 Fox- Nov 25- Ohio St/Michigan (ESPN gets Iowa/Nebraska)
2 ESPN- Oct 21- Penn St/Michigan (Fox gets Iowa/Northwestern)
3 Fox- Oct 28- Penn St/Ohio St (ESPN gets Mich St/Northwestern)
4 ESPN- Sep 9 Oklahoma/Ohio St (Fox gets Pittsburgh/Penn St)
5 Fox- Sep 23- Notre Dame/Mich St(ESPN gets Penn St/Iowa)
6 ESPN- Oct 14 Ohio St/Nebraska(Fox gets Mich St/Minnesota?)
7 Fox- Oct 7 Michigan St/Michigan(ESPN gets Wisconsin/Nebraska)
ESPN gets next choice. Next 3 choices would be the 3 November weekends... Then Sep 16/30 would go next, and then Sep 2 weekend would be the fox extra choice...

(05-16-2017 08:07 AM)stever20 Wrote:  so lets look at the 2 packages based on these 1st 5 weeks....

Fox gets-
Ohio St/Michigan
Ohio St/Penn St
Michigan St/Notre Dame
Pittsburgh/Penn St
Iowa/Northwestern

ESPN gets
Penn St/Michigan
Ohio St/Oklahoma
Penn St/Iowa
Michigan St/Northwestern
Iowa/Nebraska

ESPN also gets next 1st choice and I would assume would take Michigan/Michigan St. Fox would get Wisconsin/Nebraska.

All in all, the packages are really close.

They are relatively close---except FOX paid 100 million more for thier package than ESPN did. I do think the FOX package includes the CCG, which would explain some of the price difference.

(05-16-2017 10:24 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 08:07 AM)stever20 Wrote:  so lets look at the 2 packages based on these 1st 5 weeks....

Fox gets-
Ohio St/Michigan
Ohio St/Penn St
Michigan St/Notre Dame
Pittsburgh/Penn St
Iowa/Northwestern

ESPN gets
Penn St/Michigan
Ohio St/Oklahoma
Penn St/Iowa
Michigan St/Northwestern
Iowa/Nebraska

ESPN also gets next 1st choice and I would assume would take Michigan/Michigan St. Fox would get Wisconsin/Nebraska.

All in all, the packages are really close.

They are relatively close---except FOX paid 100 million more for thier package than ESPN did. I do think the FOX package includes the CCG, which would explain some of the price difference.

it's only 50 million difference per year(240 vs 190). The CCG is a difference- but I'm not sure it and the Michigan/Ohio St game will wind up being worth 50 million dollars each year.

So, ESPN loses marquee games that they would have shown last year on ABC or ESPN, like Ohio St-Michigan, Michigan St.-Notre Dame, Pitt-Penn St., etc.

What games replace this inventory? Do ACC matchups just bump up a notch in the channel lineup?

(05-15-2017 10:57 PM)Wedge Wrote:  Wonder which of those marquee Fox games end up on FS1 - we know they didn't pay the big bucks to put all of the "A" games on Big Fox and only "B" and "C" games on FS1.

And Fox's Michigan-Ohio State rating will be a big test of Fox's ability to bring in ESPN/ABC-sized audiences for big games. Fox's rating for that game will be measured against the ABC broadcast for the same game last year, which drew 16.8 million viewers.

Now that Fox has so many of the biggest games, hopefully they can deliver comparable audience sizes on both Big Fox and FS1 and become a serious challenger. Personally, I'd like to someday be able to not cringe when I see that a game is on FS1, and be able to think that it's just as good as having the game on an ESPN channel.

Well thats not totally accurate. Those two teams were ranked 2 and 3. If one is top ten and the other top 20 or NR thats not really a fair comparison. People will tune in because it's the big game.

(05-16-2017 10:27 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:24 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 08:07 AM)stever20 Wrote:  so lets look at the 2 packages based on these 1st 5 weeks....

Fox gets-
Ohio St/Michigan
Ohio St/Penn St
Michigan St/Notre Dame
Pittsburgh/Penn St
Iowa/Northwestern

ESPN gets
Penn St/Michigan
Ohio St/Oklahoma
Penn St/Iowa
Michigan St/Northwestern
Iowa/Nebraska

ESPN also gets next 1st choice and I would assume would take Michigan/Michigan St. Fox would get Wisconsin/Nebraska.

All in all, the packages are really close.

They are relatively close---except FOX paid 100 million more for thier package than ESPN did. I do think the FOX package includes the CCG, which would explain some of the price difference.

it's only 50 million difference per year(240 vs 190). The CCG is a difference- but I'm not sure it and the Michigan/Ohio St game will wind up being worth 50 million dollars each year.

What is the basketball split of Big Ten games between Fox and ESPN?

(05-16-2017 10:32 AM)YNot Wrote:  So, ESPN loses marquee games that they would have shown last year on ABC or ESPN, like Ohio St-Michigan, Michigan St.-Notre Dame, Pitt-Penn St., etc.

What games replace this inventory? Do ACC matchups just bump up a notch in the channel lineup?

it'll depend on the individual weeks quite frankly. Some weeks it'll be ACC game upgraded. Other weeks- you'll see better Big Ten or Pac 12 games on ABC.

(05-16-2017 10:27 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:24 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 08:07 AM)stever20 Wrote:  so lets look at the 2 packages based on these 1st 5 weeks....

Fox gets-
Ohio St/Michigan
Ohio St/Penn St
Michigan St/Notre Dame
Pittsburgh/Penn St
Iowa/Northwestern

ESPN gets
Penn St/Michigan
Ohio St/Oklahoma
Penn St/Iowa
Michigan St/Northwestern
Iowa/Nebraska

ESPN also gets next 1st choice and I would assume would take Michigan/Michigan St. Fox would get Wisconsin/Nebraska.

All in all, the packages are really close.

They are relatively close---except FOX paid 100 million more for thier package than ESPN did. I do think the FOX package includes the CCG, which would explain some of the price difference.

it's only 50 million difference per year(240 vs 190). The CCG is a difference- but I'm not sure it and the Michigan/Ohio St game will wind up being worth 50 million dollars each year.

Stever, always towing the ESPN company line. Yes, they do get 2nd pick every year from those conferences.

(05-16-2017 10:27 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:24 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 08:07 AM)stever20 Wrote:  so lets look at the 2 packages based on these 1st 5 weeks....

Fox gets-
Ohio St/Michigan
Ohio St/Penn St
Michigan St/Notre Dame
Pittsburgh/Penn St
Iowa/Northwestern

ESPN gets
Penn St/Michigan
Ohio St/Oklahoma
Penn St/Iowa
Michigan St/Northwestern
Iowa/Nebraska

ESPN also gets next 1st choice and I would assume would take Michigan/Michigan St. Fox would get Wisconsin/Nebraska.

All in all, the packages are really close.

They are relatively close---except FOX paid 100 million more for thier package than ESPN did. I do think the FOX package includes the CCG, which would explain some of the price difference.

it's only 50 million difference per year(240 vs 190). The CCG is a difference- but I'm not sure it and the Michigan/Ohio St game will wind up being worth 50 million dollars each year.

B1G Championship game and Ohio St-/Michigan are worth $$$$$$.

2016 (viewers)
16.84M - Ohio St./Michigan
9.189M - B1G CCG

2015 (viewers)
10.84M - Ohio St./Michigan
9.818M - B1G CCG

These are easily the top 2 B1G games and almost double any other game. Over the last couple of seasons, most weeks topped out at 5-6M viewers and several B1G weekends were only in the 3-4M range.

(05-16-2017 10:38 AM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:27 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:24 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 08:07 AM)stever20 Wrote:  so lets look at the 2 packages based on these 1st 5 weeks....

Fox gets-
Ohio St/Michigan
Ohio St/Penn St
Michigan St/Notre Dame
Pittsburgh/Penn St
Iowa/Northwestern

ESPN gets
Penn St/Michigan
Ohio St/Oklahoma
Penn St/Iowa
Michigan St/Northwestern
Iowa/Nebraska

ESPN also gets next 1st choice and I would assume would take Michigan/Michigan St. Fox would get Wisconsin/Nebraska.

All in all, the packages are really close.

They are relatively close---except FOX paid 100 million more for thier package than ESPN did. I do think the FOX package includes the CCG, which would explain some of the price difference.

it's only 50 million difference per year(240 vs 190). The CCG is a difference- but I'm not sure it and the Michigan/Ohio St game will wind up being worth 50 million dollars each year.

Stever, always towing the ESPN company line. Yes, they do get 2nd pick every year from those conferences.

No they don't.
Big 12- they get 1st choice in odd years(like this year)
Pac 12- it's 50/50(see Wedge's post)
Big 10- they get 1st choice in half the weeks. They will get the best OOC game of the year in Oklahoma/Ohio St.

Nice try though.

(05-16-2017 10:40 AM)YNot Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:27 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:24 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 08:07 AM)stever20 Wrote:  so lets look at the 2 packages based on these 1st 5 weeks....

Fox gets-
Ohio St/Michigan
Ohio St/Penn St
Michigan St/Notre Dame
Pittsburgh/Penn St
Iowa/Northwestern

ESPN gets
Penn St/Michigan
Ohio St/Oklahoma
Penn St/Iowa
Michigan St/Northwestern
Iowa/Nebraska

ESPN also gets next 1st choice and I would assume would take Michigan/Michigan St. Fox would get Wisconsin/Nebraska.

All in all, the packages are really close.

They are relatively close---except FOX paid 100 million more for thier package than ESPN did. I do think the FOX package includes the CCG, which would explain some of the price difference.

it's only 50 million difference per year(240 vs 190). The CCG is a difference- but I'm not sure it and the Michigan/Ohio St game will wind up being worth 50 million dollars each year.

B1G Championship game and Ohio St-/Michigan are worth $$$$$$.

2016 (viewers)
16.84M - Ohio St./Michigan
9.189M - B1G CCG

2015 (viewers)
10.84M - Ohio St./Michigan
9.818M - B1G CCG

These are easily the top 2 B1G games and almost double any other game. Over the last couple of seasons, most weeks topped out at 5-6M viewers and several B1G weekends were only in the 3-4M range.

except in 2015-
Michigan St/Ohio St- got 11.05M viewers- or more than either Ohio St/Michigan or the CCG.

While the Ohio St/Michigan game is a guaranteed good draw, end of the day, the packages are going to look remarkably similar. You look at the ratings end of the year and watch and see.

(05-16-2017 10:42 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:38 AM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:27 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:24 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 08:07 AM)stever20 Wrote:  so lets look at the 2 packages based on these 1st 5 weeks....

Fox gets-
Ohio St/Michigan
Ohio St/Penn St
Michigan St/Notre Dame
Pittsburgh/Penn St
Iowa/Northwestern

ESPN gets
Penn St/Michigan
Ohio St/Oklahoma
Penn St/Iowa
Michigan St/Northwestern
Iowa/Nebraska

ESPN also gets next 1st choice and I would assume would take Michigan/Michigan St. Fox would get Wisconsin/Nebraska.

All in all, the packages are really close.

They are relatively close---except FOX paid 100 million more for thier package than ESPN did. I do think the FOX package includes the CCG, which would explain some of the price difference.

it's only 50 million difference per year(240 vs 190). The CCG is a difference- but I'm not sure it and the Michigan/Ohio St game will wind up being worth 50 million dollars each year.

Stever, always towing the ESPN company line. Yes, they do get 2nd pick every year from those conferences.

No they don't.
Big 12- they get 1st choice in odd years(like this year)
Pac 12- it's 50/50(see Wedge's post)
Big 10- they get 1st choice in half the weeks. They will get the best OOC game of the year in Oklahoma/Ohio St.

Nice try though.

Do they ever get first pick of B1G game in any season? They always pick AFTER Fox. Hence they get the second pick. Stop spinning this Stever Spicer.

(05-16-2017 10:46 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:40 AM)YNot Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:27 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:24 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 08:07 AM)stever20 Wrote:  so lets look at the 2 packages based on these 1st 5 weeks....

Fox gets-
Ohio St/Michigan
Ohio St/Penn St
Michigan St/Notre Dame
Pittsburgh/Penn St
Iowa/Northwestern

ESPN gets
Penn St/Michigan
Ohio St/Oklahoma
Penn St/Iowa
Michigan St/Northwestern
Iowa/Nebraska

ESPN also gets next 1st choice and I would assume would take Michigan/Michigan St. Fox would get Wisconsin/Nebraska.

All in all, the packages are really close.

They are relatively close---except FOX paid 100 million more for thier package than ESPN did. I do think the FOX package includes the CCG, which would explain some of the price difference.

it's only 50 million difference per year(240 vs 190). The CCG is a difference- but I'm not sure it and the Michigan/Ohio St game will wind up being worth 50 million dollars each year.

B1G Championship game and Ohio St-/Michigan are worth $$$$$$.

2016 (viewers)
16.84M - Ohio St./Michigan
9.189M - B1G CCG

2015 (viewers)
10.84M - Ohio St./Michigan
9.818M - B1G CCG

These are easily the top 2 B1G games and almost double any other game. Over the last couple of seasons, most weeks topped out at 5-6M viewers and several B1G weekends were only in the 3-4M range.

except in 2015-
Michigan St/Ohio St- got 11.05M viewers- or more than either Ohio St/Michigan or the CCG.

While the Ohio St/Michigan game is a guaranteed good draw, end of the day, the packages are going to look remarkably similar. You look at the ratings end of the year and watch and see.

http://www.pennlive.com/pennstatefootbal...en_mo.html

Yup, MSU-OSU beat Mich-OSU in total viewers in 2015.

(05-16-2017 10:52 AM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:42 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:38 AM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:27 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:24 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  They are relatively close---except FOX paid 100 million more for thier package than ESPN did. I do think the FOX package includes the CCG, which would explain some of the price difference.

it's only 50 million difference per year(240 vs 190). The CCG is a difference- but I'm not sure it and the Michigan/Ohio St game will wind up being worth 50 million dollars each year.

Stever, always towing the ESPN company line. Yes, they do get 2nd pick every year from those conferences.

No they don't.
Big 12- they get 1st choice in odd years(like this year)
Pac 12- it's 50/50(see Wedge's post)
Big 10- they get 1st choice in half the weeks. They will get the best OOC game of the year in Oklahoma/Ohio St.

Nice try though.

Do they ever get first pick of B1G game in any season? They always pick AFTER Fox. Hence they get the second pick. Stop spinning this Stever Spicer.

Right, but it's not like some folks are spinning it saying that ESPN gets 2nd picks all year long. Just face the fact that the packages are pretty damn close to the same. ESPN haters would make you think that Fox will get to pick and choose what games they get from Big Ten before ESPN gets anything. You look at the top 6 week picks(if ESPN drafts the Ohio St/Nebraska game).

Fox gets-
Ohio St/Michigan
Ohio St/Penn St
Michigan St/Notre Dame
Pittsburgh/Penn St
Iowa/Northwestern
Michigan St/Minnesota

ESPN gets
Penn St/Michigan
Ohio St/Oklahoma
Penn St/Iowa
Michigan St/Northwestern
Iowa/Nebraska
Ohio St/Nebraska

I'm sorry- but any objective person would say that's pretty damn close to equal.

oh I looked-
2014 wasn't posted....
Ohio St/Michigan only got 8.23M viewers.....
CCG got only 6.13M viewers.....

2013-
Ohio St/Michigan 9.50M viewers.
CCG got 13.90M viewers.

so 4 year averages....
Ohio St/Michigan 11.35M viewers
CCG 9.76M viewers

(05-16-2017 08:33 AM)stever20 Wrote:  we're not trying to correct you. We ARE correcting you. Your chart was wrong, wrong, dead ******* wrong.

ESPN gets this year-
Big Ten- 6 weeks with the #1 choice, 7 weeks with #2 choice
Big 12- #1 choice each week
Pac 12- 50% choices
SEC- #2 game
ACC- all games

far better than your chart was.

I'm not sure the Big 12 is correct. I think it is similar to the Big 10 in they get their first choice of week. I'm assuming they picked Oklahoma/Texas, and with their 2nd pick FOX took Bedlam.

If ESPN had the first choice each week, there's no reason FOX would be showing Bedlam as one of their premier games this season.

(05-16-2017 10:27 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:24 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 08:07 AM)stever20 Wrote:  so lets look at the 2 packages based on these 1st 5 weeks....

Fox gets-
Ohio St/Michigan
Ohio St/Penn St
Michigan St/Notre Dame
Pittsburgh/Penn St
Iowa/Northwestern

ESPN gets
Penn St/Michigan
Ohio St/Oklahoma
Penn St/Iowa
Michigan St/Northwestern
Iowa/Nebraska

ESPN also gets next 1st choice and I would assume would take Michigan/Michigan St. Fox would get Wisconsin/Nebraska.

All in all, the packages are really close.

They are relatively close---except FOX paid 100 million more for thier package than ESPN did. I do think the FOX package includes the CCG, which would explain some of the price difference.

it's only 50 million difference per year(240 vs 190). The CCG is a difference- but I'm not sure it and the Michigan/Ohio St game will wind up being worth 50 million dollars each year.

The Big Ten CCG alone was already worth over $23 million per year under the just-expired Fox contract that was signed in the BCS era. It's reasonable to assume that the CCG value received an increase from inflation/competitive bidding/higher ratings in the CFP era and then there's the extra carrot of the #1 overall game pick of the year. That $50 million difference sounds about right considering everything in play here.

(05-16-2017 11:53 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:27 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 10:24 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(05-16-2017 08:07 AM)stever20 Wrote:  so lets look at the 2 packages based on these 1st 5 weeks....

Fox gets-
Ohio St/Michigan
Ohio St/Penn St
Michigan St/Notre Dame
Pittsburgh/Penn St
Iowa/Northwestern

ESPN gets
Penn St/Michigan
Ohio St/Oklahoma
Penn St/Iowa
Michigan St/Northwestern
Iowa/Nebraska

ESPN also gets next 1st choice and I would assume would take Michigan/Michigan St. Fox would get Wisconsin/Nebraska.

All in all, the packages are really close.

They are relatively close---except FOX paid 100 million more for thier package than ESPN did. I do think the FOX package includes the CCG, which would explain some of the price difference.

it's only 50 million difference per year(240 vs 190). The CCG is a difference- but I'm not sure it and the Michigan/Ohio St game will wind up being worth 50 million dollars each year.

The Big Ten CCG alone was already worth over $23 million per year under the just-expired Fox contract that was signed in the BCS era. It's reasonable to assume that the CCG value received an increase from inflation/competitive bidding/higher ratings in the CFP era and then there's the extra carrot of the #1 overall game pick of the year. That $50 million difference sounds about right considering everything in play here.

The problem is that The #1 overall game pick may not be the #1 game of the year. ABC getting Oklahoma/Ohio St is huge. End of the day, the regular season package between Fox and ABC/ESPN will be almost equal ratings wise. Very possible some years ABC/ESPN will actually beat Fox. You look at the packages I showed, and they're pretty much equal when you look at all the weeks.