(11-02-2017 12:08 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ] (11-02-2017 11:52 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote: [ -> ] (11-02-2017 09:10 AM)Lenvillecards Wrote: [ -> ]Couldn't you achieve that better with a partnership between 2 conferences (SEC & ACC) than an expansion? Combining the SECN & ACCN would help us each to get a larger rate in areas that we couldn't without a partnership, for example.
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I don't place much respect at the feet of either conference commissioner. It could happen that way I suppose. I just think Fuhrer Mickey's mouse accountants are more on the ball than either the ACC or SEC commish.
The Neo-Southern Conference:
East:
Auburn, Clemson, Florida, Florida State, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Miami, South Carolina
South:
Alabama, Kentucky, L.S.U., Louisville, Mississippi, Mississippi State, Tennessee, Vanderbilt
West:
Arkansas, Missouri, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Texas, Texas A&M, T.C.U., Texas Tech
North:
Duke, North Carolina, N.C. State, Pittsburgh, Virginia, Virginia Tech, Wake Forest, West Virgina
That's 4 Divisions of 8 each which are grouped Regionally and would permit the culture of each distinct region to stay intact and it groups essential rivals if you permitted 1 annual crossover rivalry game (in this case Auburn/Alabama)
I don't think you would get many arguments from any fans of any of those schools JR. There may need to be a tweak or two, but the concept is solid from a conference perspective.
ESPN may feel a little differently if they are trying to cozy up to the B1G or the PAC. The Neo-Southern would or could be self contained. Which is good for us but bad for the Mouse, as they lose leverage with the "other side" for broadcast opportunities.
(11-02-2017 03:29 PM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ] (11-02-2017 12:08 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ] (11-02-2017 11:52 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote: [ -> ] (11-02-2017 09:10 AM)Lenvillecards Wrote: [ -> ]Couldn't you achieve that better with a partnership between 2 conferences (SEC & ACC) than an expansion? Combining the SECN & ACCN would help us each to get a larger rate in areas that we couldn't without a partnership, for example.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I don't place much respect at the feet of either conference commissioner. It could happen that way I suppose. I just think Fuhrer Mickey's mouse accountants are more on the ball than either the ACC or SEC commish.
The Neo-Southern Conference:
East:
Auburn, Clemson, Florida, Florida State, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Miami, South Carolina
South:
Alabama, Kentucky, L.S.U., Louisville, Mississippi, Mississippi State, Tennessee, Vanderbilt
West:
Arkansas, Missouri, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Texas, Texas A&M, T.C.U., Texas Tech
North:
Duke, North Carolina, N.C. State, Pittsburgh, Virginia, Virginia Tech, Wake Forest, West Virgina
That's 4 Divisions of 8 each which are grouped Regionally and would permit the culture of each distinct region to stay intact and it groups essential rivals if you permitted 1 annual crossover rivalry game (in this case Auburn/Alabama)
I don't think you would get many arguments from any fans of any of those schools JR. There may need to be a tweak or two, but the concept is solid from a conference perspective.
ESPN may feel a little differently if they are trying to cozy up to the B1G or the PAC. The Neo-Southern would or could be self contained. Which is good for us but bad for the Mouse, as they lose leverage with the "other side" for broadcast opportunities.
That's true, but it could give them 50% of the top basketball brands, 75% of the top football brands, 75% of the top revenue producers, and 85% of the best baseball brands all for the price of 32 schools. If they can keep N.D. then sub them for Pitt. If not it works.
If they bought out the SEC T1 and bought the Big 12 elements total rights they would have 100% of this. That ought to be enough for the Mouse. Then if they get a 50% lease on the PAC they've got the night time covered. It's up to them if thy want a piece of the Big 10 or not.
Take the SECN, the two overflow SECN channels, and the LHN and you have 4 channels each of which could be dedicated to 1 eight school division. That way you have a package you can buy which includes all 4. That's a lot of savings in consolidation and network staff. Add a solid ACC guy with a program of his own to offset Finebaum and you have two sports programs a day that deliver.
I am interested in how you would work out cross-over games as well as maintaining some of the old rivalries. I like it. Let's take over.
(11-02-2017 11:22 PM)USAFMEDIC Wrote: [ -> ]I am interested in how you would work out cross-over games as well as maintaining some of the old rivalries. I like it. Let's take over.
Well you would have 7 divisional games of course. I figure 1 permanent rival and 1 OOC game. Then you would rotate 1 game from each other division. That's 12 games. Missouri could play Kansas OOC. Otherwise you've got a pretty solid division with some old and new friends and all close by.
You'll note that Alabama only has one rival they are missing Auburn, and vice versa. Otherwise both schools play all of their other historic rivals and play close to home. Tennessee could keep Florida because all of their other rivals are in division. L.S.U. could keep A&M because all of the Aggies other rivals are in division.
The conference semis would be great.
Basketball and Baseball could qualify the best 3 schools from each division and the best remaining 4 at large. The fact that 16 would get left out would add meaning to the regular season.
It would be pretty spectacular.
The Union Pacific Conference
East: Boston College, Indiana, Maryland, Notre Dame, Penn State, Purdue, Rutgers, Syracuse
Mid East: Illinois, Iowa, Michigan, Michigan State, Minnesota, Northwestern, Ohio State, Wisconsin
Mid West: Arizona, Arizona State, Colorado, Iowa State, Kansas, Kansas State, Nebraska, Utah
West: California, Cal Los Angeles, Oregon, Oregon State, Southern Cal, Stanford, Washington, Washington State
Conferences Semis replace the first round of the CFP and the champion of the Union Pacific meets the champion of the Neo Southern annually for the national championship. Everyone else heads to the bowls.
(11-03-2017 01:14 AM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ] (11-02-2017 11:22 PM)USAFMEDIC Wrote: [ -> ]I am interested in how you would work out cross-over games as well as maintaining some of the old rivalries. I like it. Let's take over.
Well you would have 7 divisional games of course. I figure 1 permanent rival and 1 OOC game. Then you would rotate 1 game from each other division. That's 12 games. Missouri could play Kansas OOC. Otherwise you've got a pretty solid division with some old and new friends and all close by.
You'll not that Alabama only has one rival they are missing Auburn, and vice versa. Otherwise both schools play all of their other historic rivals and play close to home. Tennessee could keep Florida because all of their other rivals are in division. L.S.U. could keep A&M because all of the Aggies other rivals are in division.
The conference semis would be great.
Basketball and Baseball could qualify the best 3 schools from each division and the best remaining 4 at large. The fact that 16 would get left out would add meaning to the regular season.
It would be pretty spectacular.
Lord knows we could use Kansas on the schedule. Their feelings are hurt though. lol
I would go full zipper on the North and East divisions:
Auburn....................................................Alabama
....................West Virginia........................Kentucky
Miami............Pitt
Florida State...Florida
Georgia Tech..Georgia
Clemson.........South Carolina
NC State.........Carolina
Wake Forest....Duke
Virginia Tech...UVa
(11-03-2017 06:56 AM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ]I would go full zipper on the North and East divisions:
Auburn....................................................Alabama
....................West Virginia........................Kentucky
Miami............Pitt
Florida State...Florida
Georgia Tech..Georgia
Clemson.........South Carolina
NC State.........Carolina
Wake Forest....Duke
Virginia Tech...UVa
I do think I would add a second crossover for several of these teams
Auburn...........Georgia
Virginia Tech...West Virginia
Georgia Tech...Duke
Wake Forest....Carolina
NC State.........South Carolina
Miami..............Florida
(11-03-2017 01:25 AM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]The Union Pacific Conference
East: Boston College, Indiana, Maryland, Notre Dame, Penn State, Purdue, Rutgers, Syracuse
Mid East: Illinois, Iowa, Michigan, Michigan State, Minnesota, Northwestern, Ohio State, Wisconsin
Mid West: Arizona, Arizona State, Colorado, Iowa State, Kansas, Kansas State, Nebraska, Utah
West: California, Cal Los Angeles, Oregon, Oregon State, Southern Cal, Stanford, Washington, Washington State
Conferences Semis replace the first round of the CFP and the champion of the Union Pacific meets the champion of the Neo Southern annually for the national championship. Everyone else heads to the bowls.
If the ACC is "giving" the B1G BC, Cuse, and ND ... I think we should ask for (and would receive) Nebraska in return.
(11-03-2017 07:13 AM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2017 06:56 AM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ]I would go full zipper on the North and East divisions:
Auburn....................................................Alabama
....................West Virginia........................Kentucky
Miami............Pitt
Florida State...Florida
Georgia Tech..Georgia
Clemson.........South Carolina
NC State.........Carolina
Wake Forest....Duke
Virginia Tech...UVa
I do think I would add a second crossover for several of these teams
Auburn...........Georgia
Virginia Tech...West Virginia
Georgia Tech...Duke
Wake Forest....Carolina
NC State.........South Carolina
Miami..............Florida
On the other hand you don't need a second crossover in the original set up. You can't zipper the Florida schools without having to do it. And if you split Auburn from Georgia & Georgia Tech you force them to need two.
Anyway for the cost of Baylor only you can move to 64 avoid anti-trust issues with two distinct entities (the conferences) and you now have under 2 rooves all of the schools that would have naturally scheduled one another either annually, or occasionally. It equalizes TV revenue for the most part and sets up enforcement that can be handled within the two conference structure.
(11-03-2017 12:40 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2017 01:25 AM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]The Union Pacific Conference
East: Boston College, Indiana, Maryland, Notre Dame, Penn State, Purdue, Rutgers, Syracuse
Mid East: Illinois, Iowa, Michigan, Michigan State, Minnesota, Northwestern, Ohio State, Wisconsin
Mid West: Arizona, Arizona State, Colorado, Iowa State, Kansas, Kansas State, Nebraska, Utah
West: California, Cal Los Angeles, Oregon, Oregon State, Southern Cal, Stanford, Washington, Washington State
Conferences Semis replace the first round of the CFP and the champion of the Union Pacific meets the champion of the Neo Southern annually for the national championship. Everyone else heads to the bowls.
If the ACC is "giving" the B1G BC, Cuse, and ND ... I think we should ask for (and would receive) Nebraska in return.
Nah, not really. Google a map of the U.S. and see how much of an outlier they truly are. Besides the Union Pacific is going to need both Nebraska and Colorado to bridge Westward.
This alignment essentially cedes the Old Big 8 minus the Oklahomas to the North and the Old SWC plus the Oklahomas to the South. Missouri excepted since they are already in the SEC.
(11-03-2017 12:44 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2017 07:13 AM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2017 06:56 AM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ]I would go full zipper on the North and East divisions:
Auburn....................................................Alabama
....................West Virginia........................Kentucky
Miami............Pitt
Florida State...Florida
Georgia Tech..Georgia
Clemson.........South Carolina
NC State.........Carolina
Wake Forest....Duke
Virginia Tech...UVa
I do think I would add a second crossover for several of these teams
Auburn...........Georgia
Virginia Tech...West Virginia
Georgia Tech...Duke
Wake Forest....Carolina
NC State.........South Carolina
Miami..............Florida
On the other hand you don't need a second crossover in the original set up. You can't zipper the Florida schools without having to do it. And if you split Auburn from Georgia & Georgia Tech you force them to need two.
Anyway for the cost of Baylor only you can move to 64 avoid anti-trust issues with two distinct entities (the conferences) and you now have under 2 rooves all of the schools that would have naturally scheduled one another either annually, or occasionally. It equalizes TV revenue for the most part and sets up enforcement that can be handled within the two conference structure.
What's not to like? That second crossover is the frosting on the cake and the zipper ties the entire region together.
Unless you are afraid of having to go back to Winston-Salem to play Wake Forest, for fear that Jay Venuto would return.
http://magazine.wfu.edu/2014/12/19/cinderella-deacs-79/
"Following back-to-back 1-10 seasons, Wake Forest put together an improbable run to the Tangerine Bowl in 1979, Wake’s first bowl appearance since 1949. Behind record-setting quarterback Jay Venuto (’81) and tailback James McDougald (’80) and a stellar defense led by James Parker (’80), Wake Forest pulled off a string of last-minute wins including upsets of 12th-ranked Georgia, 13th-ranked Auburn and 14th-ranked North Carolina to finish the regular season 8-3 and ranked 14th in the country. Venuto, the 1979 ACC Player of the Year who was named an ACC Legend last year, talks about his teammates who refused to ever give up, his memories of the big wins and the big hit on YouTube that’s a big hit with his family."
(11-03-2017 04:20 PM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2017 12:44 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2017 07:13 AM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2017 06:56 AM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ]I would go full zipper on the North and East divisions:
Auburn....................................................Alabama
....................West Virginia........................Kentucky
Miami............Pitt
Florida State...Florida
Georgia Tech..Georgia
Clemson.........South Carolina
NC State.........Carolina
Wake Forest....Duke
Virginia Tech...UVa
I do think I would add a second crossover for several of these teams
Auburn...........Georgia
Virginia Tech...West Virginia
Georgia Tech...Duke
Wake Forest....Carolina
NC State.........South Carolina
Miami..............Florida
On the other hand you don't need a second crossover in the original set up. You can't zipper the Florida schools without having to do it. And if you split Auburn from Georgia & Georgia Tech you force them to need two.
Anyway for the cost of Baylor only you can move to 64 avoid anti-trust issues with two distinct entities (the conferences) and you now have under 2 rooves all of the schools that would have naturally scheduled one another either annually, or occasionally. It equalizes TV revenue for the most part and sets up enforcement that can be handled within the two conference structure.
What's not to like? That second crossover is the frosting on the cake and the zipper ties the entire region together.
Unless you are afraid of having to go back to Winston-Salem to play Wake Forest, for fear that Jay Venuto would return.
http://magazine.wfu.edu/2014/12/19/cinderella-deacs-79/
"Following back-to-back 1-10 seasons, Wake Forest put together an improbable run to the Tangerine Bowl in 1979, Wake’s first bowl appearance since 1949. Behind record-setting quarterback Jay Venuto (’81) and tailback James McDougald (’80) and a stellar defense led by James Parker (’80), Wake Forest pulled off a string of last-minute wins including upsets of 12th-ranked Georgia, 13th-ranked Auburn and 14th-ranked North Carolina to finish the regular season 8-3 and ranked 14th in the country. Venuto, the 1979 ACC Player of the Year who was named an ACC Legend last year, talks about his teammates who refused to ever give up, his memories of the big wins and the big hit on YouTube that’s a big hit with his family."
Ugh! The Barfield years. Yuck!
(11-02-2017 12:08 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]The Neo-Southern Conference:
East:
Auburn, Clemson, Florida, Florida State, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Miami, South Carolina
South:
Alabama, Kentucky, L.S.U., Louisville, Mississippi, Mississippi State, Tennessee, Vanderbilt
West:
Arkansas, Missouri, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Texas, Texas A&M, T.C.U., Texas Tech
North:
Duke, North Carolina, N.C. State, Pittsburgh, Virginia, Virginia Tech, Wake Forest, West Virgina
That's 4 Divisions of 8 each which are grouped Regionally and would permit the culture of each distinct region to stay intact and it groups essential rivals if you permitted 1 annual crossover rivalry game (in this case Auburn/Alabama)
This would be the scenario that would cause me to support merging at least the PAC and Big Ten, not so much for economic power (I don't think both together could catch up even then) but for political power. Collectivizing at one end for purposes of directing research dollars would cause a reaction at the other end. 30 out of 100 senators (not counting Pennsylvania or private schools, not counting some quirk like splitting California into three states, but that's for a completely different discussion) is a huge block of senators that could exercise influence in the chamber. We all have different ideas on politics but 30 senators tasked with protecting the interests of their respective flagship state schools is another matter and is non-partisan. The presidents in the other regions would at least take notice of something like the above.
(11-03-2017 06:12 PM)Transic_nyc Wrote: [ -> ] (11-02-2017 12:08 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]The Neo-Southern Conference:
East:
Auburn, Clemson, Florida, Florida State, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Miami, South Carolina
South:
Alabama, Kentucky, L.S.U., Louisville, Mississippi, Mississippi State, Tennessee, Vanderbilt
West:
Arkansas, Missouri, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Texas, Texas A&M, T.C.U., Texas Tech
North:
Duke, North Carolina, N.C. State, Pittsburgh, Virginia, Virginia Tech, Wake Forest, West Virgina
That's 4 Divisions of 8 each which are grouped Regionally and would permit the culture of each distinct region to stay intact and it groups essential rivals if you permitted 1 annual crossover rivalry game (in this case Auburn/Alabama)
This would be the scenario that would cause me to support merging at least the PAC and Big Ten, not so much for economic power (I don't think both together could catch up even then) but for political power. Collectivizing at one end for purposes of directing research dollars would cause a reaction at the other end. 30 out of 100 senators (not counting Pennsylvania or private schools, not counting some quirk like splitting California into three states, but that's for a completely different discussion) is a huge block of senators that could exercise influence in the chamber. We all have different ideas on politics but 30 senators tasked with protecting the interests of their respective flagship state schools is another matter and is non-partisan. The presidents in the other regions would at least take notice of something like the above.
Well if both blocks had influence over Senators there would be an upside to at least form some across the aisle coalitions to push some proactive educational efforts through. It would at least force a bridge on some issues that perhaps they could use to assist in other non educationally based legislation. It's a far better way to build non partisan approaches to governance than the freak show we have now.
(11-03-2017 02:28 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]Nah, not really. Google a map of the U.S. and see how much of an outlier they truly are. Besides the Union Pacific is going to need both Nebraska and Colorado to bridge Westward.
This alignment essentially cedes the Old Big 8 minus the Oklahomas to the North and the Old SWC plus the Oklahomas to the South. Missouri excepted since they are already in the SEC.
Sadly Colorado does make a good bridge. But I think they are a better culture fit outside the Union Pacific.
(11-03-2017 08:07 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote: [ -> ] (11-03-2017 02:28 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]Nah, not really. Google a map of the U.S. and see how much of an outlier they truly are. Besides the Union Pacific is going to need both Nebraska and Colorado to bridge Westward.
This alignment essentially cedes the Old Big 8 minus the Oklahomas to the North and the Old SWC plus the Oklahomas to the South. Missouri excepted since they are already in the SEC.
Sadly Colorado does make a good bridge. But I think they are a better culture fit outside the Union Pacific.
Probably, but Tom Osborne should know by now that there are some mistakes you never quit paying for.
An attempt at crossovers...
Slam Dunk:
Alabama <--> Auburn
Georgia Tech <--> Duke
Vandy <--> Wake Forest
South Carolina <--> North Carolina
Clemson <--> NC State
Tennessee <--> Virginia Tech
Texas A&M <--> LSU
Texas <--> Arkansas
Sounds good:
Louisville <--> Missouri
Florida <--> Kentucky
Ole Miss <--> Georgia
Miami <--> Pitt
Leftovers:
(11-02-2017 12:08 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]Florida State,
Mississippi State
Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, T.C.U., Texas Tech
Virginia, West Virginia
My best shot at sorting the leftovers:
Florida State <--> Oklahoma
Oklahoma State <--> West Virginia
Texas Tech <--> Mississippi State ("BFE Bowl")
TCU <--> Virginia