CSNbbs

As we all know, conference championship games have been one of the biggest changes to come out of realignment. Apparently, having two teams meet in the conference championship who already played earlier in the season, particularly when it was the week just before, is seen as a "disaster." Why?

1. Boring to see the same game 2 weeks in a row.
2. Screams mediocrity if they split (fair or not).

(08-07-2017 09:21 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote: [ -> ]1. Boring to see the same game 2 weeks in a row.
2. Screams mediocrity if they split (fair or not).

1. Does it actually drop TV ratings or attendance? If it's a rivalry game, I would think fans of the teams would be ecstatic over having a second game, one with even higher stakes. Plus this sort of thing can happen easily in other sports leagues, even the NFL, and no one says boo about that.

2. Very subjective. The outcome of many games between teams with similar talent levels is due in large part to chance. And upsets can happen between teams with widely disparate talent levels. A single game (or even two) is not a conclusive measure of how good a team is vs. the other or in general.

Let's imagine Tennessee beats Alabama in October, both come to Atlanta with 11-1 records the first week of December. I doubt that will be seen as mediocre.

Since the BCS era, how many CCG's have been rematches?

Ala - LSU rematch in NCCG was ratings disaster & ended with playoffs
this not the NFL
B-12 is a joke, projections show Okla knocking out Tex or OSU out of acceses bowls
conf are not even smart enough to play crossover games early

(08-08-2017 08:37 AM)templefootballfan Wrote: [ -> ]Ala - LSU rematch in NCCG was ratings disaster & ended with playoffs
this not the NFL
B-12 is a joke, projections show Okla knocking out Tex or OSU out of acceses bowls
conf are not even smart enough to play crossover games early

Alabama-LSU was not a Conference Championship game rematch. And, maybe it had poor ratings for some reason other than because it was a rematch. And this game was not the reason, or even a reason, for the CFP.

It's possible that fans outside the SEC weren't interested in this game because the first one was a 9-6 snoozefest (won by LSU) and the second was a blowout (21-0) won by Alabama.

(08-08-2017 09:06 AM)ken d Wrote: [ -> ]

(08-08-2017 08:37 AM)templefootballfan Wrote: [ -> ]Ala - LSU rematch in NCCG was ratings disaster & ended with playoffs
this not the NFL
B-12 is a joke, projections show Okla knocking out Tex or OSU out of acceses bowls
conf are not even smart enough to play crossover games early

Alabama-LSU was not a Conference Championship game rematch. And, maybe it had poor ratings for some reason other than because it was a rematch. And this game was not the reason, or even a reason, for the CFP.

It's possible that fans outside the SEC weren't interested in this game because the first one was a 9-6 snoozefest (won by LSU) and the second was a blowout (21-0) won by Alabama.

If they didn't watch the game, it means their decision not to watch was made prior to kickoff. They didn't know it would be a blow-out, but they did know it was a rematch.

(08-08-2017 10:00 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote: [ -> ]

(08-08-2017 09:06 AM)ken d Wrote: [ -> ]

(08-08-2017 08:37 AM)templefootballfan Wrote: [ -> ]Ala - LSU rematch in NCCG was ratings disaster & ended with playoffs
this not the NFL
B-12 is a joke, projections show Okla knocking out Tex or OSU out of acceses bowls
conf are not even smart enough to play crossover games early

Alabama-LSU was not a Conference Championship game rematch. And, maybe it had poor ratings for some reason other than because it was a rematch. And this game was not the reason, or even a reason, for the CFP.

It's possible that fans outside the SEC weren't interested in this game because the first one was a 9-6 snoozefest (won by LSU) and the second was a blowout (21-0) won by Alabama.

If they didn't watch the game, it means their decision not to watch was made prior to kickoff. They didn't know it would be a blow-out, but they did know it was a rematch.

That raises a question for me - I genuinely don't know the answer to this. What are the ratings measuring? How many tune in for the start of the game, how many are still watching at the end, how many watch the entire game? or some sort of average at various points throughout the game? Or something entirely different?

I believe Nielsen used to have individuals keep actual logs of whenever they changed channels, but I don't think they do that anymore. Presumably, technology lets them get that data electronically now.

Anybody know how it's done?

(08-07-2017 09:21 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote: [ -> ]1. Boring to see the same game 2 weeks in a row.
2. Screams mediocrity if they split (fair or not).

Whats more mediocre is if you have the undefeated or 1 loss school of Division A facing the 4 loss school of Division B who is actually ranked 4th overall in the conference. Even worse would be if that team wins and goes onto the playoffs or top bowl game. I'd much rather have the two schools with the top records in the conference face each other, even if they already faced each other before.

To answer my own question, for the Big Ten:

2011 - Mich St vs Wisconsin - REMATCH - Wisconsin played at Michigan St and lost a close one, but won the rematch in Indy
2012 - Nebraska vs Wisconsin - REMATCH - Wisconsin played at Nebraska and lost a close one, but won the rematch in Indy
2013 - Mich St vs Ohio St - NOT a rematch

2014 - Ohio St vs Wisconsin - NOT a rematch
2015 - Mich St vs Iowa - NOT a rematch
2016 - Penn St vs Wisconsin - - NOT a rematch


The break is for the switch from Leaders/Legends to East/West. Hasn't been too much of a problem since the switch.

There have been 105 FBS conference championship games, 33 of which were rematches of games played earlier in the season. In only 5 cases were the games played at the same venue, since most CCGs have been at neutral venues.

C-USA, 2007, Tulsa at UCF: 10/20 (UCF 44-32, att 45510) and 12/1 (UCF 44-25, att 44128)
C-USA, 2012, UCF at Tulsa: 11/17 (Tulsa 23-21, att 19725) and 12/1 (Tulsa 33-27, att 17635)
MAC, 2000, WMU at Marshall: 10/5 (WMU 30-10, att 27109) and 12/2 (Marshall 19-14, att 24816)
MWC, 2014, Fresno at Boise: 10/17 (Boise 37-27, att 35008) and 12/6 (Boise 28-14, att 26101)
MWC, 2016, SDSU at Wyoming: 11/19 (Wyoming 34-33, att 19112) and 12/3 (SDSU 27-24, att 24001)

The first three listed had marginal drops in attendance, the fourth had a huge drop, and the fifth had a significant increase. Weather may have been more of factor in the difference than the fact that the games were rematches.

Only one rematch actually occurred in consecutive games (Stanford/UCLA 2012), but the venues were split, so you can't really compare attendance.

Here's a list of all rematches. If anybody can find Nielsen data for these games, that might be more informative.

How about in just the last three seasons 14,15,16? Obviously Fresno at Boise and SDSU at Wyoming are two ... but how many total rematches have there been?

I just don't think it's that common of an occurrence.

(08-08-2017 12:11 PM)MplsBison Wrote: [ -> ]How about in just the last three seasons 14,15,16? Obviously Fresno at Boise and SDSU at Wyoming are two ... but how many total rematches have there been?

I just don't think it's that common of an occurrence.

In the ACC, I know the CCG was a rematch three straight years, 2007-2009. Don't know about since.

In the SEC, it's happened 6 times out of 25, a pretty high percentage, and yet that doesn't seem to have affected its popularity much. FWIW, it hasn't happened the last six years, since Mizzou and TAMU joined.

That's why I want to know about lately. With larger conferences, but still relatively fewer conf games ... it should statistically happen even less often.

(08-08-2017 12:50 PM)MplsBison Wrote: [ -> ]That's why I want to know about lately. With larger conferences, but still relatively fewer conf games ... it should statistically happen even less often.

Well, the PAC title game was a rematch four straight years, 2012-2015. This past year was the first time since 2011 it wasn't a rematch.

And in 2011, the first year of the CCG, it would have been a rematch had USC not been in probation and ineligible to play it.

PAC only has 12 and plays 9 conf games. Statistically much higher probability of a rematch. So that makes sense.

no rematches, loss u rotate out
CFB has always worked that way

So I was told in another thread that the Big Ten had actually changed its rules to prevent a rematch in the conference championship if the teams had played in the last game of the regular season. I'm not sure exactly what sort of rule change they could make. I also couldn't find a source for this, either. Has anyone heard about this?

Regardless of the reasoning for the supposed change, it would hardly seem worth the trouble, given that this situation has so far had less than a 1% chance of occurring, as indicated above.

(08-08-2017 12:44 PM)quo vadis Wrote: [ -> ]

(08-08-2017 12:11 PM)MplsBison Wrote: [ -> ]How about in just the last three seasons 14,15,16? Obviously Fresno at Boise and SDSU at Wyoming are two ... but how many total rematches have there been?

I just don't think it's that common of an occurrence.

In the ACC, I know the CCG was a rematch three straight years, 2007-2009. Don't know about since.

In the SEC, it's happened 6 times out of 25, a pretty high percentage, and yet that doesn't seem to have affected its popularity much. FWIW, it hasn't happened the last six years, since Mizzou and TAMU joined.

Just once, 2011. Clemson beat VT in Blacksburg and in Charlotte.

Ironically every ACCCG rematch has had either VT or Clemson involved, with VT being involved in 3 three of the five.